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Friday, January 26, 2007
David Limbaugh :: Townhall.com Columnist
Can Democrats Square the Circle with Webb?
by David Limbaugh
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Democrats have a new rock star, and I'm not talking about Barack Obama -- the most recent victim of the Clinton smear machine. I refer to Virginia senator James Webb, who delivered the Democrats' response to the president's State of the Union address.

Ever since 9-11, Democrats have been searching for that magical formula (or politician) that would restore their foreign policy credentials during this time of war. Given their well-earned reputation for weakness on defense, this is no small order.

You will recall the pathetically forced military imagery accompanying Sen. John Kerry's acceptance speech at the 2004 Democratic Convention. Kerry's speech, from the bogus opening line: "Reporting for Duty," was a calculated sales pitch aimed at convincing TV viewers they should disregard his and his party's antiwar record and listen, instead, to their empty promises to be tough on terror.

For liberals, there was nothing contradictory in this picture. Kerry was a decorated war vet, and those credentials -- putting aside the credible challenges against them -- would trump all anti-military behavior in which he had engaged from the time he returned from Vietnam.

In the end, neither Kerry nor his party were able to pull that off -- not just because of the Swift Boat Vets, but because even the "erudite" John Kerry himself could not square the many dovish circles he'd drawn in the past.

Since Kerry's defeat, Democrats have further ratcheted up their criticism of President Bush and the war. They finally hit pay dirt, having regained control of Congress, even without offering any alternative plan for Iraq.

The closest thing to a plan they have is their uniform agreement that the Iraq war is unwinnable and that we should withdraw our troops in short order. But we are not allowed to accuse them of calling for a precipitous withdrawal (which they are), nor to suggest they have abandoned victory as a goal (which they have). Even their liberal friends in the mainstream media grudgingly concede they haven't quite gotten their act together yet on Iraq.

But the Democrats must sense they won't be able to prolong this charade forever. Electing a wartime commander in chief in 2008 will be tougher than electing a majority of congressmen whose campaigns also involved local issues. Democrats still have to prove that despite their history of softness on terror they can be trusted as primary guardians of our national security.

Enter James Webb. Who better to square a circle than a man whose resume contains at least two oxymorons: He's a "conservative Democrat" and a "muscular liberal"?

No less a liberal than Newsweek's Jonathan Alter gushed over Webb's SOTU rebuttal, writing, "Virginia Sen. James Webb … managed to convey a muscular liberalism -- with personal touches -- that left President Bush's ordinary address in the dust."

It matters not to Alter that Webb is advocating our near-immediate withdrawal from Iraq (how muscular will Osama bin Laden find that?). What counts is that Webb's dad was a vet, he's a vet, and his son's currently serving in Iraq. And like a good liberal, Alter invoked the chickenhawk mantra, saying that unlike Bush and Cheney, Webb served in Vietnam.

Oh, yes, and "unlike fellow veteran John Kerry, he has a military bearing and nonelitist tone that is appealing." By "military bearing," Alter means that Webb doesn't look like a perfectly coiffed "wussie," but a tough military guy, whose appearance also trumps his dovish policies.

Another liberal columnist, the Washington Post's E.J. Dionne, was similarly ecstatic about Webb's speech and the apparent toughness he displayed. Dionne wrote, "Webb's performance was a salutary sign that Democrats might just be getting over the battered party syndrome that has left so many of them terrified of saying exactly what is on their minds."

Sorry, E.J., but to call a party that has been mercilessly bludgeoning President Bush for six years running "battered," is like, well, calling liberals "muscular." Democrats can't have it both ways. Either they're going to join us in the war on terror, or they aren't. Either they're going to put teeth in their antiwar Senate resolutions, or they're not. It's one thing to shadowbox and talk tough. It's another to get in the ring and start swinging.

Democrats must know deep down that their candidates' combat credentials and tough demeanor -- not to mention personal nastiness -- are not going to serve as substitutes for offering policies promoting the national interest, for which they can be held to account. Even the irascible, ex-Republican Jim Webb is not the Democrats' foreign policy panacea.

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About The Author
David Limbaugh, brother of radio talk-show host Rush Limbaugh, is an expert in law and politics and author of Bankrupt: The Intellectual and Moral Bankruptcy of Today's Democratic Party.
 
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Great !
Mr. Webb won though. So what does that say about the state of politics in America today ?
Reality is just something to be (re)defined and packaged in a nice glossy suit,fit for television.

If President Bush just mentioned the web addresses of 3 milbloggers writing from the front lines, he could have made a major impact on public opinion. Nope.Not gonna do it. Wouldn't be sufficiently half a**ed enough to represent as an attempt to communicate with the American public about THE CENTRAL ISSUE OF OUR TIME by THIS administration.

My God! Will he ever figure out how to use the very power of his own office ?

Oh well,here's some fun.Inspire a bunch of gloomy old senators to "make" on themselves:
SIGN THE PLEDGE !!!

http://truthlaidbear.com/thenrscpledge/

Democrats
This past six years to me has been a replay of the Democrats sublimial message they were giving the American people during George Bush senior's administration. That being the nation is sick and the Republicans are to blame. Everyday for eight years they opened their collective mouths and told us this nation was sick and must do something about it. something did happen, they convinced enough people that the nation was sick and got a Liberal Democrat elected. Now that really in itself was SICK!
Then when the Republicans started using the same tactics the Democrats used against Bush senior, the Democrats yelled "Foul!" How can grown people act that way?
Now they are up to it again, leading the nation down a path that is saying we've lost in Iraq. How? Where were American troops massacred and forced to withdrawl. Where did the Iraqis launch a major offensive and recapture lost ground. I haven't seen any of this. Its just like Vietnam and telling the nation we're sick, say it enough and the patient WILL be sick.
There are NO Democratic officials who are qualified to run for president. Look at them, you have a delusional woman senator who wants to dictator, a Black senator who was the only one in the area of his state that had no corruption and got the nomination by default. He believes he has the answers in his freshman approach to things. What pitiful bunch of losers and we may elect one of them! God help the United States!!!

Weirdo Webb
Ever notice that that's all the democrats are - all show and no substance. Whenever Clinton got in trouble they surrounded him with kids in wheelchairs and such - coming out of the funeral for Ron Brown (?) all laughing and cheerful until he saw the TV cameras on him and then he was all sad and teary. This congress, the charade with the "children" being their focus (even though they'd abort them in a heartbeat). Everything they do plays to the most vulnerable and gullible voting blocs - look at the african-americans, how they seem to keep them poor, ignorant and angry so they keep voting for more democrats. As for Webb, when will the reasons for his demise as Secretary of the Navy under Reagan become public knowledge? There's something definitely not right (pardon the pun) about this guy. So far he's seems like a rude, obnoxious boob. What a change from a fine statesman like George Allen. Virginia has taken a nose dive in my opinion by electing a governor like Tim Kaine and now this boob.

jmadison: Catapulting the propaganda
You said:

"The only significant difference I see between the liberal media and O'Reilly/Hannity/Boortz/Limbaugh is not one of bias versus balance--but admission of bias versus denial of bias. "

You couldn't be more wrong. O'Reilly/Hannity broadcast on Fox whose main slogan is "Fair and Balanced", though it's safe to say they are the MOST biased of any of the major networks. This is "denial of bias" which you accuse the left of, but you don't call Fox on - the argument is obliterated in a blast of hypocrisy.

Similarly, Limbaugh denies his bias everywhere I've heard, saying he is "the great truth detector" though he won't as much as accept a call from a 5th grader who disagrees with him - nice detection, sherlock.

All these guys claim to be telling "the truth" or "the real truth". The very name Swift Boat Veterans For Truth implies they are not biased, but have already been fined $300,000 for violating electoral politicking rules, and have been widely criticized not just for falsehoods and misleading statements but hiding that the "true" source of their funding was Texas GOP interests and in part, Alice Walton of Wal-Mart.

Propaganda
Say what you will about Fox, et al. What's refreshing is that it's a contrast to the rest of the mainstream media. Views by the conservative radio talk shows and this one cable news station are what's needed in an industry that's saturated by liberal views and propaganda. Look at NPR, FRONTLINE, etc. and they're publicly funded! All left-leaning, democrat hacks along with CBS, NBC, ABC, and even the movie industry and HBO et al get in on the act. Biased or not, it's a refreshing change to have republican view points debated without being sandwiched between shouting liberal democrats - and the republicans can get the last word in on FOX - not the case on CNN.

But I play one on TV
There used to be a commercial in which an actor dressed up as a doctor said "I am not a doctor, but I play one on TV." I have always thought that this should be the motto of the Democrats: "We're not [What The Country Is Crying Out For] but we play it on TV."

For an actor, nothing has to BE true; it only has to SOUND/LOOK true. Therefore, if you can dress somebody up like a Military Man, make him walk and talk and ACT (and I stress the word "act" in the Hollyweird sense of the word) what people in Hollywood imagine Military Men do, then the Great Unwashed will accept them as the real thing. In point of fact, the majority of the Great Unwashed don't even recognize reality when they see it anymore -- with the increasing sophistication of Photoshop and CGI, they instinctively trust that nothing they see or hear is "real". How many people during 9/11 did you hear saying "It looks just like a movie!" or even "It reminds me of 'Independence Day'" (a 1996 movie in which Alien Spacecraft did a 9/11 on all the major tourist attractions of the world that the GU were likely to recognize). It's easy to convince people that something never happened because in many cases what the MSM tell them happened, didn't -- it was photoshopped.

So watch out for this jerk who "looks" authentic because for most of the Great Unwashed, that's good enough.

But I play one on TV
There used to be a commercial in which an actor dressed up as a doctor said "I am not a doctor, but I play one on TV." I have always thought that this should be the motto of the Democrats: "We're not [What The Country Is Crying Out For] but we play it on TV."

For an actor, nothing has to BE true; it only has to SOUND/LOOK true. Therefore, if you can dress somebody up like a Military Man, make him walk and talk and ACT (and I stress the word "act" in the Hollyweird sense of the word) the way people in Hollywood imagine Military Men do, then the Great Unwashed will accept them as the real thing. In point of fact, the majority of the Great Unwashed don't even recognize reality when they see it anymore -- with the increasing sophistication of Photoshop and CGI, they instinctively trust that nothing they see or hear is "real". How many people during 9/11 did you hear saying "It looks just like a movie!" or even "It reminds me of 'Independence Day'" (a 1996 movie in which Alien Spacecraft did a 9/11 on all the major tourist attractions of the world that the GU were likely to recognize). It's easy to convince people that something never happened because in many cases what the MSM tell them happened, didn't -- it was photoshopped.

So watch out for this jerk who "looks" authentic because for most of the Great Unwashed, that's good enough.

WWJD :Must be on the talking points

To quote you: "Similarly, Limbaugh denies his bias everywhere I've heard, saying he is "the great truth detector" though he won't as much as accept a call from a 5th grader who disagrees with him - nice detection, sherlock. "
Keeping digging Watson-- Limbaugh usually puts liberal callers to the front of the caller list, so he can argue with them and even berate them. You must be reading from the Air America" talking points

and "All these guys claim to be telling "the truth" or "the real truth". The very name Swift Boat Veterans For Truth implies they are not biased, but have already been fined $300,000 for violating electoral politicking "

As I remember that law; NRA can't have ads, Moveon.org can near election time. If you read the book written by one of them or just looked at the titl"Unfit for Command", they freely admit their bias: THEY DON'T LIKE KERRY.

wwjd
You state that the Swifties have been fined for "violating electoral politicking rules". Could we have a time and place for that statement?
IOW - Source.

They have been "widely criticized for falsehoods and misleading statements". Once again I would ask you for particulars, please - not generalities.
IOW - What 'falsehoods' and what 'misleading statements'.

Hiding the fact that The "true source of their funding was Texas GOP interests". They never hid that fact. It is as well known who funds moveon.org, as it is well known who funds the Swifties. And let us NOT forget that the Swifties are people who were in combat with John Kerry.

That someone from The Walton family contributed: As long as it wasn't John-Boy or Jim-Bob what's the problem?

wwjd 2
In reference to the Fox/Hannity broadcast you state that "it's safe to say they are the most biased of any of the major networks."

(I disagree with that but I would ask you this): are you implying that CBS, NBC and ABC present fair and balanced coverage?

whoops
I should have said "The O'Reilly/Hannity broadcast on Fox" in that last post.

Sorry

Al
Good post. I just remembered a show from one of the last two years of "West Wing" in which Frontline did a piece on C.J. Cregg as part of the series. It was beautifully done, as was most of their stuff.

Yes I am a "West Wing" fan - I have all 7 seasons on DVD. My favorite episode is "In Excelsis Deo" from the first season.

No I didn't take them seriously. Escapist entertainment well done.

NPR is too absurd to be taken seriously, Frontline the same and the fact that - after a long-running gig on 'Good Morning America' - katie couric is sitting in the seat once occupied by Edward R. Murrow says all that need to be said about the big 3.

Sour grapes
Are you dipping into your brother's stash Davey?
You and the rest of the rightwing noise machine make your own straw men so that you can take them down. James Webb made your "president" look like the moron he is by showing what a real leader looks like. Now the burning question is "why did he leave his post as Secretary of the Navy under Raygun?". How pathetic you are.
As for Hannity, he, a college dropout, was "explaining" the president's plan (?) to Wesley Clark, a 4 star General and a Rhodes scholar.
Iraq is already lost. It was inevitable from its misbegotten start. There is no plan, there has never been a plan and there will never be a plan.
I am a lifelong Democrat and I would never vote for Clinton and I think Obama is too inexperienced for the complex problems we now face due to the lies, incompetence and malfeasance of your president. Bush and his cohorts have broken laws, shredded the Constitution and lost the respect, not only of the world, but the citizens of this country. All of this was aided and abetted by the Fox News talking heads and radio personalities (what a misnomer) like your degenerate brother. If this war is not ended immediately and our troops brought home because the Republicans are too out of touch with their constituents and continue to put party over country, the '08 elections will a tsunami compared to the tidal wave of last November. Iraq needs a political and diplomatic solution. And if you think that Sen. Webb did not touch the American people, think again. He was looking pretty presidential to me.

Rush,His Brother, O'Reily are Pundits
and not news anchors. They never claimed to be unbiased. WWJD, would you please cut the crap. To this day, the NYT, WaPo, NBC,CBS,PBS, and CNN all purport to be unbiased. Fox says, they are "Fair and Balanced". They are referring to thier "generic news broadcasrs", which are fairly middle of the road. The nightly pundit shows are pure entertainment. Fox airs them because they are popular and make Fox lots of money. Please, realize there is a huge difference between what Limbaugh does and what the MSM claims they do.

WWJD, it appears you are simply a propogandist who cannot tell the difference between news entertainment and reporting; to you they are one and the same. Like all liberals, you are certainly non-democratic in your thinking. You have no respect nor use for the 1st Amendment. Implementing an agenda is all you care about.

Pack, Uncle &WWJD
Packrat & Uncle Max, well said. Let me add for WWJD, has John Kerry signed the form yet to release his military records? As promised several times??? It is not the SBV who are hiding anything. They despise Kerry. It is Kerry who has been caught in lies and who refuses to release his records. Remember "Cambodia on Christmas?"

As to Fox. What a bunch of Crybabies you liberals are. We get one cable station in the whole spectrum of cable and over the air television that actually gives Republicans a chance to speak without sneering, and you just CANNOT TAKE IT. Grow up. We've had to take it for years and you still have the majority of the the print and television media. The Fox slogan applies to the whole station, not the individuals commentators, moron. My 10 year old is better at distinguishing issues than you. Did you notice the tall, thin liberal sitting next to Hannity? Balance! Tell me, who is the conservative co-host on any CCC show? I won't hold my breath.

A liberal writes a conservative-bashing book and they get free reign on the liberal shows. Might even get a couple of days. If a conservative even gets on one of these shows to promote a book, they often have to appear with a guest liberal to counter-attack (as if the host wasn't enough to fight the liberal side). Yeah, WWJD, no bias. I ahve about 4 dozen examples off the top of my head. Want a few more?

Kimberly
HRC's camp leaked to the WaPo last weekend that Obama was raised a Muslim. Need I see more.


What in Webbs blatherspeak did you find so appealing. If anger and vitriol has an agenda, then I suppose it was brilliant. Even the NYTs thought it was lame.

All the Dems have to do is cut off spending for the war; this is something they refuse to do. It would cost them 2008 elections. Instead, these gutless wonders issue vacuous, lame, non-binding resolutions from the safety of thier chambers. These cowards are YOUR LEADERS. I would have more repsect for them if they acutally acted out of conviction and not calculation.

Kimberly
Yeah, those Clintons would never smear a political opponent. Think for a minute rather than wear your emotions on your sleeve. Who, currently, has the most to gain by going after Obama? It's not the Republicans-yet. It is his potential primary opponents.

Kimberly & Betty
I am currently listening to an editor from Insight Magazine on a radio staion in Chicago right now. He is refuting everything you are saying.

Biased my Butt
"In reference to the Fox/Hannity broadcast you state that "it's safe to say they are the most biased of any of the major networks." "

This just shows how ridiculous the "Fox bias" argument is. They pull 2 guys from a network of dozens to prove that the network is biased, lol.

Obviously, criticism from yet another quack job who doesn't actually watch the network, for if they did, they would know that Hannity's show is actually the Hannity and Colmes show, Colmes being the Democrat balance to Hannity's Conservative views. I'm not sure how much more balanced you can get than having one Dem and one Republican.

And as for Rush, he never denies his bias. He'll tell you straight up that he's a Conservative.

The only reason libs see Fox News as "the most biased" is because they actually are fair and balanced for the most part, which is a shock to the system of the typical lib who is only comfortable residing in an echo chamber of ideas. So, in a way, Fox News is biased, to libs anyway, because they don't only present one side.

Blatherspeak
sums up just about everything I read on this site. Vitriol and anger are your stock in trade. The Democrats haven't been in office for a month yet. And, if you recall, Bush had already started his escalation before the Congress had time to do anything about it. What an honorable man, he is.

Betty on Crack
"Jim Webb,He was looking pretty presidential to me."

You obviously don't look for much in a President then if you feel that attacking the Pres. at every turn instead of actually coming up with solutions to problems makes you look presidential.

"There is no plan, there has never been a plan and there will never be a plan."

Right. And you don't live in the land of make believe either.

"If this war is not ended immediately and our troops brought home because the Republicans are too out of touch with their constituents "

It's naive, crazy talk like this that makes me thank God every day that we have only one commander-in-chief, and not 300 million. People like Betty actually believe just bringing the troops home will end the war, and no more troop lives will be lost. I guess she believes in Santa Claus and the Easter Bunny too.

"and lost the respect, not only of the world,"

Oh no, somebody doesn't like us. If only we could go back to 9/10/2001 when we were loved and respected by the rest of the world. Yeah, that worked out pretty well for us on 9/11/2001, didn't it?

Ugly Betty
Read your first post. In it is more vitriol than any other post. Stash, mosron, pathetic, lies, incompetence, malfeasance, shredded the Constitution, aided and abetted, degenerate. Your solution, let's sit down and talk. That has always worked so well. Ugly AND Naive. Time to go back to the minors until your ready to come up to the major leagues.

honorable laughable coming from a dem
"And, if you recall, Bush had already started his escalation before the Congress had time to do anything about it. What an honorable man, he is."

Yep, the more honorable thing to do would be to make decisions important to our troops in the field based on politics and the Dems timetable.

The Congress has time to something about it. Write or call your congressman and tell him to cut off funding for the war. Tell them to actually do something about it instead of playing politics and wasting taxpayer time and money with BS non-binding resolutions.Tell them to walk the walk instead of just talking the talk.

But they won't do that, and you know why? Votes. Yeah, that's honorable, isn't it?

Are libs credible on anything other than stupidity? Nope....

Hey, like, you don't get it!

"Democrats must know deep down that their candidates' combat credentials and tough demeanor -- not to mention personal nastiness -- are not going to serve as substitutes for offering policies promoting the national interest, for which they can be held to account."

But that doesn't matter man, the great thing is you could really tell how much he hated Bush, I mean did you see it man, wow, it seemed he wanted to haul off and belt him - oh yeah, he even said something like that once too, didn't he? Enough of all this crap about "foreign policy" and "war on terror" and "Osama bin Laden: and all that - Webb really tore into Bush! Who cares if what he said doesn't "hold up to scrutiny" like the Right Wing Fascists are saying - all that matters is that when a politician addresses Bush, I can sit back and say: 'Ooooo BURRRRRRRN!! MAN he really told him off ! He just really HATES Bush, you can just see it! I love it!'
And he has a son in Iraq too, so the Right Wing Fascists can't say a damn thing about it (Hopefully his son feels the same way, but if he doesn’t, well, a lot of soldiers are like that) But MAN! Stick to George Bush, Webb, YEAH!

That's What I'M looking for in a politician!

(Dem/MSM-button off now.)

maybe because
"The Democrats offered a war plan. Realign troops out of the Civil War to training Iraqi troops and fighting insurgents.Bush Rejected it"

Maybe because recommending we redeploy/realign to Okinawa raises suspicians on how credible a plan it is.

Maybe we could realign/redeploy to Darfur, a Civil War that libs have no problem with us getting involved in.

Empty promises...
Limbaugh ought to know a bit about those. This administration offered them by the barrel load when persuading the nation that Iraq would be a walk in the park. Besides, an empty promise is one that you fail to deliver on isn't it?? In that case John Kerry made no empty promises - he lost the election and didn't get the chance to let anyone down. In order to make empty promises you have to at least have a chance to keep your word. Limbaugh is making this up.

Critical Bill
Kerry could sign the release for his military records-as promised.

Cookie
Fair point. Although Viagraman's kid brother was in fact referring to "their" empty promises, which I am taking to mean the entire Democrat party rather than just Kerry. Maybe he'll release those when GWB finally releases the full details of his "service".

Webb's son
I wonder to what extent Webb's defeatist and cowardly position is influenced by personal considerations (his son) - or if his son is embarrassed by his father's position.

John Kerry
"John Kerry made no empty promises"

Except for having a secret plan to end the war in Iraq. And his partner in 2004, John Edwards, said elect Kerry and Christopher Reeves would walk again. But the people didn't and so he died. Apparently.

Critical Bill
That dog don't hunt.

Bush's full military records are openly available and he fly MORE HOURS than was required.

So what now? His flying MORE hours than required was just him and Rove working to make Global Warming a reality?

BTW, Hanoi John REFUSES to release any information on his DISCHARGE that he had to get upgraded by Carter.

That tells me that Hanoi John got an OTH. Other than Honorable or a General Discharge. (Given to minimum achievers.)

Wow! So much drivel, so little time...
While it's certainly nice to have a few resident libs around to make things interesting, couldn't you please try to come up with something that at least passes the laugh test?

So far on this thread, we've learned that the Democrats have a plan for Iraq other than abject surrender (who knew?), that the MSM is not left-biased, that Yale grad and Harvard MBA Bush is a moron (unlike the libs here, whose credentials are undoubtedly much more impressive), that Jim Webb looked presidential, that there was no congressional vote prior to the liberation of Iraq and that Republicans are the hate-America-first party. I can't wait for the next sparkling gem--maybe that Democrats favor low taxes and free market capitalism, or that they are strong on defense? Come on guys, surprise me!

Critical Bill, I think I read on some other thread that you are a Brit, so I'll forgive your ignorance of the fact that in the States, National Guard service is considered honorable and doesn't merit scare quotes. You are probably also unaware that Bush's service was examined under a microscope in 2 Texas gubenatorial races and 2 presidential campaigns, with no evidence of anything other than honorable service except the forged documents peddled by Uncle Dan and the rest of the "unbiased" crew at CBS. You are also probably unaware that the Left's current fascination with who served where is a recent phenomena, certainly post dating draft dodger Bill.

Donaldd's confusion....
Donaldd wrote: Friday, January, 26, 2007 11:33 AM

"George didn't need permission to invade Iraq as C in C he did it without Congress or UN approval."

Im sure Ive misread this comment, but something is off about it. "He did it without UN approval" sounds like someone doesnt remember 17 resolutions to include UNSCRes 1769 (I think) that authorized the direct use of force in Iraq. And Congress approved the use of force also (read "I voted for it before I voted against it).

"You Republicans say it's Congress' fault; Well, that Congress 107-9th was Republican controlled.

It's Republicans who have become the Obstructionist Party with their filibuster."

Again, Im completely confused. What is congress' fault, and what filibuster?

Jim Webb, a Democrat Elite
The fact that senator/pornographer Jim Webb was selected by the Democratic leadership to speak on their behalf to deliver the response to the state of the union address speaks volumes about the current majority party in congress. This man is an author of filth. One example, from his book Lost Soldiers, graphically describes a man having oral sex with his infant son. And this the man Nancy Pelosi and her crew choose to represent them.

Jim Webb's base literary contributions to the world aren't something out of his distant past. His books filled with graphic sexual violence and perversity are still being promoted on his web site.

Kimbat
Yep, nothing like attacking the subject w/o a shred of proof.

I found out where you get your talking points from.

http://thepeoplescube.com/red/viewtopic.php?t=297

Just type in a word and BINGO! out comes the talking points, suitable for cut and paste kimmy!

setting the matter straight
on a few things flung about by our left leaning posters.

National Guard service, even during Vietnam, was no "ticket stateside" and Air Guard units served in SEA along with reserve and Army Guard units. The fact that Kerry served in SEA is only minimalized by his abhorrent behaivor once he returned and his conduct earning him a DD (dishonerable discharge) and as GunnyG has pointed out necessitating the change in his official record by Carter.

Iraq lost? Only if your view is predisposed to defeatist thought and talk. You want peace? A lasting peace? Peace is purchased through blood, not paper or talk. Europe is at peace because National Socialisim was rooted out of Germany and the Facists in Italy. That was purchased with blood. Korea is the poster child of diplomatic abortion. The DMZ is still held by US divisions and along it is always a cease fire, not peace. South Korea is free but our work there is unfished as long as North Korea still has as its goal to re-unite the two under communisim.

No plan? The Baathist regime is gone. Iraq has an elected government. Al Queda is being engaged. Iranians supporting the death squads and the Sadr militias will be targeted. It is not for Congress to give any input towards how the CinC conducts operations. They can defund the war and that is it. If Teddy "what's that sign up ahead say ..." Kennedy, John "I voted for something before I knew that I was against it" Kerry, and any other over-bloated-full-of-their-own-voice senator does not like it they are powerless (by design) to do anything about it and the one thing they can do will only serve to serve thier collective heads upon a platter come '08.

Webb presidential? Only if you prefer your men to be loud, borish, uncouth, and overall disrespectfull towards anyone whom one disagrees with. He's a political puppet now regardless of what he used to think or really thinks. As far as his son, who knows. As a military man he should at least know of the importance of the mission. Supporting our troops and not supporting thier mission is an oxymoron for that is why they are there, the mission. You cannot support them and denigrate the CinC and the reason they are there in the same breath. For Webb to demand the troops be pulled out before the mission is finished is disingenuous at least and selling them all short at worst.

The other stuff was just nonsense and needs no clarification.

what?
I have no idea from what left field you just brought that from.

Are there troops who want to come home? Sure there are. They all want to come home. I don't bash anyone over there regardless of what they want. So, some have written a letter. Many other s have written blogs, letters, and given interviews to the contrary about thier mission as well. They are in the military and the military is not a democracy, never has been and never will be so your point is moot.

And by AWOL I'm assuming you are referring to John "my fellow soldiers are murderers, thieves, bandits, and overall nasty killers" Kerry who got his DD the old fashioned way, he earned it.

You'll get very little traction here attempting to use epiteths.

Poor Deluded Kimberly
Ask all those women who were part of the bimbo eruption how ruthless the Clintons can be. Hillary headed up the team and then was allowed by the MSM to pretend she was surprised upon hearing about Monica. What the editor of Insight was saying is that it was the Hillary camp that was digging up this information for future use. Seeing as the Clintons illegally obtained 1000 FBI files on their poitical opponents, it isn't much of a stretch that they would start early opposition research on their most formidable roadblock in their quest for a return to the White House.

Just go on thinking Hillary is a saint and not the driving force behind all the lies and corruption that came out of party central-the Clinton White House. My logical thinking is just fine. I can't be mad at you though. I was young, stupid, and was driven by emotions when I was younger. You'll grow up. Just keep your legs shut and you'll have a chance.

Shameless plug
When you all get done arguing come up to my blog for some chuckles, Chat with Hillary and Chat with Obama.
All you left wing nuts know your demo party is just that a demo for destruction and defeat.

Kim
Crudity knows no party.

Witness all the questions to Cheney about his daughter, her partner, and the expected grandchild. He answers and the questioners push more. (Wolf Blitzer , CNN for one)

The Democrat supporters seem eager to attack her lifestyle, while lecturing the rest of us about tolerance.


Kim

I was a vet in the same war as Gore and Kerry. I have my opinions about them, shaped by my experience.

I had classmates that joined the Coast Guard to avoid VietNam, didn't bother me, they served in their own way.

What bothered me in people running off to Canada. They ensured that some poor guy who didn't have the money to run away got drafted in his place, and may have been killed in his place.

What bothers me is Clinton running off to England until the draft was over.

Kimmie
Typical lib. Call names and insult people.

pitbull
Tell bro thank you and thanks for helping to straighten things out around here.
We could use more of this.
Maybe he has a buddy who will help?

Executive Cheerleader
Bush is not CinC of the country just the military. Yale and Harvard-his main accomplishment was being a cheerleader. He must have been absent for an awful lot of courses as he has zero understanding of history and geography. His command of the english language and speaking skills are laughable. He is the Cliff notes version of a president. Why is it so crucial to you people to smear veterans who have served their country and been wounded in that service. How many of the illustrious contributors on this site have worn the uniform and put themselves in harm's way? What a bunch of turds.

Delusional Kimberly
I assume you can't keep your legs shut and the STD is effecting your brain. I must say you gave me a great laugh pulling out the "Richard Mellon Schaife Card." Priceless. Soros makes him look like an amateur as does the Clinton mafia vs. any Republican dirty tricks group. Like I said, I used to think (emote) like you. Then I grew up. Got my law degree and began living in the real world. I have faith you'll grow up as soon as Daddy stops paying your bills or your Sugar Daddy moves on.

Ugly Betty
There you go again raising the level of discourse. Thank goodness you don't bring the "vitriol" and "hate" you accuse others of.

Betty
His grades were better than I voted....Kerry.
You are right, he's not the CIC of the country, he is the Chief Executive. You must be confusing Bush with his SNL alter-egos.

Among the "you people" that you are make comments about have served the country, have sons and daughters serving.
Before you make negative comments about posters on this site, have you served? If not, why not.


Muscle-headed "conservatism"
For conservatives to accuse liberal Democrats of not being credible on Iraq is, well, about as credible as "muscular liberalism." The same poltical leaders that the Limbaughs have been lionizing are the ones who got us into this debacle with their "Operation Watch Our Cakewalk." So now the alleged conservatives of the neo-nuthouse persuasion have come up with the incredible claim that the reason it isn't working is that the liberals (mostly Democrats) have been criticizing it. ("Waaaah!") So much for "muscular" conservatism.

Packrat
You'll find that trying to reason with libs is a wasted effort--they live in a world of churning, dark emotions in which logic and reason play no roll. Their opinions and feelings always trump facts. Of course she did not serve in the military, or have a ghost of a chance of being accepted at Yale or Harvard B School, much less graduating. And given her supposed deep respect for those who served in the military, and her mindless theory that only those who have can comment on foreign affairs, you might expect that she voted for war heroes GHW Bush and Dole over Clinton. Whoops, just another hypocritcal lib buffoon.

No shirt, no shoes, no service
Just to put your teeny little minds at ease. I am well over the age limit to serve. During Vietnam I was married with 2 children. My father served in WWII, my uncle in Korea and both my brothers in Vietnam, one of whom was wounded and still suffers from chronic pain. I realize that Daddy Bush served honorably as did Dole. What does any of that have to do with the nimrod in chief today? Now I have to go to work in the Trauma Center of the County hospital. Friday night-good times. I am an RN and have a BS and made the Dean's List every time. So your assumptions are as erroneous as your thought processes. I have actually read Shakespeare and Camus and if the Chimp did indeed read as much as he claims, he is certainly hiding his light under a barrel. So, rant on folks, you are in the minority.
Goodnight.

Give em a break Dave
To those who would support a cut and run policy, Webb must look like the Terminator. In reality, he looks to those of us who want to win this battle in the war on terror like a scrawny wimp who looks at himself in a funhouse mirror and sees Mr. Olympia.

Look its real simple. We are in a war that was declared on us. On the one side, there are those who want to kill us wherever we infidels happen to be breathing Islamo Nazi air. It doesn't matter where we are, they still want to kill us as they have been telling us for decades.
On the other side are our soldiers (friends, neighbors, or relatives) This is the real simple part. You either want the Islamo Nazis to win, or you want our brave soldiers to win. Hint: our soldiers are the ones keeping the Islamo Nazis from coming here AGAIN to kill you, your friends, your neighbors, or relatives. You can't split the baby. If you bad mouth our soldiers, they AND our enemies are listening. The words of dissent have opposite effects on combatants of both sides in the war. Our soldiers are discouraged by them; our enemies (for you libs that would be the Islamo Nazis) take GREAT comfort from them and are able to continue recruiting on the weak willed words from America's "left".

Hey Betty
Have any of your patients survived?

Hey Ralph
Only the Democrats.

Betty

What hospital is it?

I don't want to have to go there.

Thanks

Betty - a typical lib
Her statements are perfectly emblematic of the churning emotions that liberals substitute for logic and reason. She hates Bush, therefore he must be stupid. This feeling is reenforced by the fact that other liberals say he is stupid, and by instances in which Bush stumbles over his words (as if articulation were equivalent to intelligence). As a liberal, she FEELS that she must of course be both morally and intellectually superior, not only to Bush but to all conservatives. This emotional fog obscures the rather obvious fact that a nursing education at a local community college is hardly the intellectual equivalent of an Ivy leage degree or a top-tier MBA. The fog allows her to hide from the inconvenient reality that when it comes to intellectual horsepower, she cannot hold a candle to GWB. It also allows her to dismiss the fact that Bush's academic record was superior to John Kerry's, and the glaring inconsistency of an alleged moron who is able to concoct and execute a scheme that fooled all of the worlds major intelligence agencies. It is the same swirling emotional fog that allows her (and all liberals) to believe that socialism works, that terrorists will leave us alone if we surrender, or any of their countless other delusions.
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