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Friday, June 13, 2008
Charles Krauthammer :: Townhall.com Columnist
Obama's Plan for Defeat
by Charles Krauthammer
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WASHINGTON -- In his St. Paul victory speech, Barack Obama pledged again to pull out of Iraq. Rather than "continue a policy in Iraq that asks everything of our brave men and women in uniform and nothing of Iraqi politicians. ... It's time for Iraqis to take responsibility for their future."

We know Obama hasn't been to Iraq in more than two years, but does he not read the papers? Does he not know anything about developments on the ground? Here is the "nothing" that Iraqis have been doing in the last few months:

1. Prime Minister Nouri al-Maliki sent the Iraqi army into Basra. It achieved in a few weeks what the British had failed to do in four years: take the city, drive out the Mahdi Army and seize the ports from Iranian-backed militias.

2. When Mahdi fighters rose up in support of their Basra brethren, the Iraqi army at Maliki's direction confronted them and prevailed in every town -- Najaf, Karbala, Hilla, Kut, Nasiriyah and Diwaniyah -- from Basra to Baghdad.

3. Without any American ground forces, the Iraqi army entered and occupied Sadr City, the Mahdi Army stronghold.

4. Maliki flew to Mosul, directing a joint Iraqi-U.S. offensive against the last redoubt of al-Qaeda, which had already been driven out of Anbar, Baghdad and Diyala provinces.

5. The Iraqi parliament enacted a de-Baathification law, a major Democratic benchmark for political reconciliation.

6. Parliament also passed the other reconciliation benchmarks -- a pension law, an amnesty law, and a provincial elections and powers law. Oil revenues are being distributed to the provinces through the annual budget.

7. With Maliki having demonstrated that he would fight not just Sunni insurgents (e.g., in Mosul) but Shiite militias (e.g., the Mahdi Army), the Sunni parliamentary bloc began negotiations to join the Shiite-led government. (The final sticking point is a squabble over a sixth Cabinet position.)

The disconnect between what Democrats are saying about Iraq and what is actually happening there has reached grotesque proportions. Democrats won an exhilarating electoral victory in 2006 pledging withdrawal at a time when conditions in Iraq were dire and we were indeed losing the war. Two years later, when everything is changed, they continue to reflexively repeat their "narrative of defeat and retreat" (as Joe Lieberman so memorably called it) as if nothing has changed.

It is a position so utterly untenable that John McCain must seize the opportunity and, contrary to conventional wisdom, make the Iraq War the central winning plank of his campaign. Yes, Americans are war-weary. Yes, most think we should not have engaged in the first place. Yes, Obama will keep pulling out his 2002 speech opposing the war.

But McCain's case is simple. Is not Obama's central mantra that this election is about the future not the past? It is about 2009, not 2002. Obama promises that upon his inauguration, he will order the Joint Chiefs to bring him a plan for withdrawal from Iraq within 16 months. McCain says that upon his inauguration, he'll ask the Joint Chiefs for a plan for continued and ultimate success.

The choice could not be more clearly drawn. The Democrats' one objective in Iraq is withdrawal. McCain's one objective is victory.

McCain's case is not hard to make. Iraq is a three-front war -- against Sunni al-Qaeda, against Shiite militias and against Iranian hegemony -- and we are winning on every front:

-- We did not go into Iraq to fight al-Qaeda. The war had other purposes. But al-Qaeda chose to turn it into the central front in its war against America. That choice turned into an al-Qaeda fiasco: al-Qaeda in Iraq is now on the run and in the midst of stunning and humiliating defeat.

-- As for the Shiite extremists, the Mahdi Army is isolated and at its weakest point in years.

-- Its sponsor, Iran, has suffered major setbacks, not just in Basra, but in Iraqi public opinion, which has rallied to the Maliki government and against Iranian interference through its Sadrist proxy.

Even the most expansive American objective -- establishing a representative government that is an ally against jihadists, both Sunni and Shiite -- is within sight.

Obama and the Democrats would forfeit every one of these successes to a declared policy of fixed and unconditional withdrawal. If McCain cannot take to the American people the case for the folly of that policy, he will not be president. Nor should he be.

Give the speech, senator. Give it now.

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About The Author

Charles Krauthammer is a 1987 Pulitzer Prize winner, 1984 National Magazine Award winner, and a columnist for The Washington Post since 1985.

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Why Hasn't Bush Given The Speech?
Krauthammer says: "If McCain cannot take to the American people the case for the folly of [Obama's] policy, [McCain] will not be president. Nor should he be. Give the speech, senator. Give it now."

Shouldn't Bush be making this speech?

Shouldn't Bush be making this speech every day?

The President's shocking inability to communicate with the American people about the Iraq War has inspired our enemies abroad and inspired our political opponents at home.

Thousands have died needlessly, and billions have been squandered because our President lacks the most basic requirement for political leadership: the ability to frame and defend an argument.

At his popularity levels the American
people have stopped listening to Bush...

Robert

As Usual...
Charles is the smartest guy in the room. Obama's "retreat and defeat" attutude carries over into so many different facets of his life. He couldn't stand to the Rev Wright. How does he expect to stand to the likes of Ahmadinenutjob in Iran?

Make no mistake; that situation is coming to a head. The Iranians believe that the US is impotent to hold them accountable for anything.

They're developing nuclear weapons.

We need a POTUS with a steel spine. BO isn't it.

many more than 160,000
anyone who talks about iraq and the number of our troops ther and doesnt say anything about the over 200,000 private contractor employees who are there performing military duties, is going to lie.about what he is writing about. then add the 100,000 iraqi men whom
we have enlisted into their army by paying them more then they have ever been paid and you have some idea of the commitment we have made to iraq. now all this may be a good thing or a bad thing, but to talk about the surge as if it was entirely responsibkle for what you beilieve is the success of american mkilitry is nonsense. start with the wrong figures and all your stats from them on are autiomatically worng. did mccain see any of these private contractors the times he was over there? if yes why doesnt he mention them, they may be many things, but they are certainly important when it comes to talkinmg about the possible winninmg of the war and our withdrawel. does anyone know what the contract for these mercenaroies says about their withdrewel. . can you really ever talk about how we are going to get out of iraq withouy knowing that fact. when and if we leave will they stay. how do you know.

POTUS
The 'problem' is not Pres Bush...the Dems & the 'Prostitute Press' {I date myself} want the United States to look bad so that they can look 'good'...well, needless to say, it's going to bite them in the as- because the SURGE is working & it really hurts to admit the fact. The KRAUTHAMMER is right & his insight should be heeded and acted upon at every level...he probably should be our next Vice President...on either side!

Obama
Obama has never worked for anything that was not an Alinski based organisation. He is a communist, hard-core and very serious about it.

He is endlessly talking about change, but without any indication of what change he is in favour of.

He is keen on change, but his change can be found in the writings of Saul Alinski and well, Nicki Lenin.

His plan, and that of the rest of the Democratic Party's current leadership is simply the overthrow of the American way of life and the freedoms it represents.

Hilary Clinton wrote here thesis on Alinski, she too has done little outside of be a left-wing agitator.

Together with Howard Dean and the rest of the party elite, they have started a war on America on two fronts.

They want a replay of the Vietnam war and the loss of America's prestige that represented. Ther result will be significantly worse than the three million that died as a result of a Democratic Congress that reneged on its agreements and America's promise to South Vietnam. The result this time will be continued chaos in the Middle East and the likely death of tens of millions of people there and elsewhere.

To whose advantage is this; China's. It can use American dollars to buy more and more American technology. It will give China the ability to adventure militarily more aggressively in the region.

China bought and paid for Bill Clinton with the acquiescence of the rest of the Democratic Party who gave him and out and out pass to sell all sorts of secrets to them. One can only imagine where he and Hillary hid the money. Of course none of this is provable at a court level, but logical nonetheless.

The second front was started decades ago and first attracted most of the current leadership to politics. That is the environmental movement.

Here is the massive transfer of American wealth to third-world leftist fellow travelers that they hunger for.

Krauthammer
Since 'victory' is the goal, doesn't it seem imperative that 'victory' be defined in detail? Neither Bush nor McCain nor Krauthammer has ever given us that definition.
Also, Krauthammer doesn't mention that the vast majority of Americans want us out of there, regardless of whatever speech McCain can give. Also, a large majority of Iraqis want us out of there.
Does Krauthammer have any thoughts on the outrageous sums of money being spent in Iraq? Is it worth the expense to him? How about the 4100 dead Americans? Is that worth the expense to him?
Since he is mentioning all the sparkling things that are happening, then that is great! Can we please leave now?

Continued
The promulgation of the global warming, er it’s cooling, so I mean global climate change that allows them to make this transfer. The result is the bankruptcy of American business, and with it all American influence globally.

In the resulting chaos they will seize power and take away all of our freedoms in the model of Alinski and Lenin.

Obama is keen on defeat on every front for America. He wants it on its knees and it turning to him for solutions.

There is no reason in the world that America cannot be defeated from within.

Cheers,

Bloefeld

Bloefeld
OK.
So, any thoughts on the subject at hand (Krauthammer's article)?

victory
Victory has been stated many times. It is Iraq becoming a stable democracy. Being able to defend their citizens. They showed an example of being capable of this in Basra and Mosul.

sammer
I think Americans need a more detailed definition. Can you help? What is the definition of a 'stable democracy'?

obama
sounds like obama will give al quaida the victory it seeks.
he will be very popular in the middle east, (not israel).
on a lighter note,
at least the world will like america once more...(note: sarcasm)

We need press to tell us we are winning
WWII the press announed all victories. Korea, same. Nam, they were there but we were not winning and they told us that. No one is reporting the things like this fine news Charles just reported.

If the world could know the facts BO would show up as the out of touch hit the high spots guy that he really is.
Don Jones
MyManJohn.com

mojobebop
Can you elaborate on your comment? Al Qaeda is a small group of Sunni extremists who are not popular with Sunnis or Shiites. How exactly do they get a victory if America leaves?

Dreamer
Public policy should not be set by polls. Government by poll has been the American way since Clinton and since Clinton America has been lost to the ignorance of the average American.

One has only to look at the conflicting opinions within almost any poll to see that the average American has no idea what is going on in his own neighbourhood worthwhile how the market determines the price of gasoline, which by the way is much lower in the USA than it is in Canada, Mexico, and all of Europe. Yet the moronic idea that somehow the American Government can control the price of oil is going to go a long way to determining the election in November.

The American public also believes that some sort of alternative energy like ethanol is the answer to the price of gas.

This just in, for America to replace its gasoline requirements with Ethanol would take 500,000 more square miles of arable land than it has. You can either eat or drive your call with Ethanol, you can’t do both.

Besides, it will take longer for America to bring up ethanol capacity than it will to simply drill in ANWAR (go see it, it is an Arctic crap hole) or by starting to exploit oil shale. This just in, you currently buy 1.5 million barrels of ‘synthetic crude’ from Alberta Canada, the exact same oil found in shale.

You would get it, like Canada will be getting about 4,000,000 barrels a day, through SAGD (steam assisted gravity-flow drilling) and not by mining it.

Continued
The American Public may want out, but they certainly overwhelmingly wanted 'in' in the first place.

After 9/11 someone was going to get invaded and invaded good.

You seem to forget that Saddam was a psycho who has used WMD's and who had a very active program of WMD's and goals of nuclear weaponry far in advance of Iran's.

He had coined the French, the Germans, the Russian's and China for a few hundred million bucks.

They were all members at the time of the UN Security Council and they had sold that organization for chicken feed.

Within months the Security Council would have voted to take the sanctions off. Then Saddam could quite easily have simply bought a bomb from North Korea or use the German technology that Daufler found he was ready to implement to start to build the cascade centrifuges that he was within mere months of having built, and using Niger’s Uranium would have been on the road to a bomb. Probably would have one by now.

So typical for America, they get into a war and simply want to run away as soon as they can.

The got into both World Wars late because of ignorant public opinion supplanting good policy and good world citizenship.

By the way, Russia won World War II not America.

Cheers,

Bloefeld

"Mercenaries"
Regarding Post#9

This 'mercenary' business is yet another standard line of BS from the leftists. The vast vast vast majority of these 200,000 'mercenaries' are either: 1. Big fat unarmed middle-aged men who work for some company on some system; or 2. Big fat unarmed middle-aged women who serve meals in the mess hall. In both cases, they do what they do cheaper and better than Uncle Sugar could.

Dreamer
The article seems to point out that the only defeat Obama is interested in is in Iraq.

I wanted to try to make the point that all of America seems to be missing, he is a hard-left ideologue who truly wishes to see total defeat for America and the replacement of its government but a more 'socialist' replacement led by him and the rest of the hard-left that he hangs out with. William Ayers is no accident, he is Obama and Obama is he.

Cheers,

Bloefeld

Errata
Bad Ref on my post - comment directed to MRCMRC - sorry...

dreamer
You keep asking the same question. Pay closer attention.

And if you can't imagine how Al Qaeda benefits by our withdrawal, then no answer will ever suffice: you're just willfully thick.


Bloefeld
Sure, while sustaining staggering casualties, the USSR inflicted greater harm on the Wehrmacht than we did, and gained more territory and subjects as a result, I don't see how you can say we didn't win WW2.

Or did the war in the Pacific not count?

The only war this country ever lost, we chose to lose. Let's not allow Barack Hussein Obama's sympathies for his Muslim brothers to force us to lose another.




I'm an American
and it's not withdrawal at any price. Losing is not an option because it unites the Middle East under radical Muslim rule. That does set us up for WW III. With Europe being re-settled by Muslims, low birth rate, etc. say goodbye to any allies there except maybe England in 10 years. So it's hit Israel, we move to defend?...we face a world against us.
We cannot lose ... sometimes the right thing has to be done, and it costs a price.

Charles Martel
Humor me. Tell me how Al Qaeda wins if we leave.

Thank you Charles Krauthammer....
for an article about the good news in Iraq. I don't get my new about Iraq from the MSM, it's worthless. I go directly to the Military websites. There are many wonderful stories of success to be read there.

Thank you for the great article. I have taken you off of my "list" (after my disappointment in your last article), and you are my Hero again. ;-)

Does Krauthammer follow the events
He mentions the months old passage of the de-Baathification law, the amnesty law, and the pension law. He doesn't mention that the laws were passed by barely a third of the Parliment without Sunnis participation. They are unhappy with the laws and are holding up their implementation while their re-entry into the gov't, suspended yet again last week, is negotitated.

He notes the provincial authortity law and the oil sharing, yet makes no mention of Kirkuk, where these issues are in fact the basis of an impending crisis. The once delayed referendum is likely to be delayed again in a couple of weeks. The Kurds, heretofore the beacon of stability in all this, are threatening violence if it doesn't go ahead sometime this year. The Arabs likewise if it does. The situation is very serious, with thousands of Peshmerga deployed to the area and increased Turkish sorties to the east in defense of the Turkmans.

Most absurdly he talks about Iran being squeezed. Give me a break. Whose interests is Al-Maliki defending in the controversy over the longterm security pact with the US, ours or Iran's?

Nor does he mention the 100,000 Iraqis turning out weekly to protest the agreement, and the US presence in general.

He says that Al-Sadr has been shunted aside, yet fails to point out that last weekend Al-Jaafari formally broke with Al-Maliki and has formed a 90 seat coalition with Sadrists compromising 30 of those seats.

I could countinue but the point is that all of the sectarian fissures which cause still exist and are in fact worsening with the approach of the provincial and parlimentary election.

The current gains have yet to be institutionalized, and neither the lull in violence, nor the passage of minor laws that don't get implimented are the true measures of success.

No War for Oil
Yes, the Democrats said in 2006 that they would end the war. Guess what they also said... They have a plan to bring down the price of gasoline at the pump. What was that Plan and when are they planning to initiate it??? It doesn't exist any more than anything but socialism exists behind the words of "Hope & Change" that Obama routinely says in between how he's going to end the war and gut the Defense Department.

Democrats can't be trusted
If Democrats can't put the finishing touches on a war that has already been won, instead declaring the same a defeat and retreating, then they can't be trusted with America's security. Therefore, if Americans hand the Democrats the White House and both houses of Congress, then they will have earned what follows three times over, and I will have no pity on them. Wisdom does not pity fools who have earned their own demise.

On another topic, it does seem at first blush that Sen. Obama is just the kind of politician who can work with both parties to find and implement policies that both can support. However, Sen. Obama won't have to do so if the Democrats control Congress. Instead, he will have to provide common ground between the extreme left and moderate wings of his own party. Regardless, Republicans will be left out in the cold, and every new policy the Democrats ram down America's throat will infuriate at least half of the voters (25% left, 25% right). It therefore follows that the new dawn of political reconciliation and unity Sen. Obama is promising will not come; there will be no Morning in America during an Obama administration.

dreamer
What do you dream about up there in MN? I think Americans need a detailed definition. Can you elaborate? Humor me.

Carter on steroids...
cut-and-run... malaise... then down to the real business of wealth redistibution.

A Definition of Victory....
....We (America) WIN....They (Islamofascists, MSM, Lefties Everywhere) LOSE!

dreamer
Please define how in depth you would like the details to go. We can either start with their judicial system, legislative system, economy, executive branch, organized crime, military, etc.....

ApollaSpeaks..
....has something here...OUT OF IRAQ AND INTO IRAN! When do we start???

Shutting down Iran...
....would solve a slew of problems starting with Syria, Hesbollah, Hamas, Lebanon, and ending with Afghanistan, Iraq, and Pakistan....

Know when to fold 'em
As a result of this five-year Iraqi quagmire, the Army is stretched to the limit. It has no capacity left if called upon to fight a big war in another theater. Reluctant National Guard units and profiteering civilian mercenaries are having to do jobs soldiers once did, and recruitment is focusing on criminals and illegal immigrants while junior officers are resigning in droves.

Morale among vets is terrible, with record levels of suicide and addictions. There will be a big crime problem from them in future.

Australia is out of Iraq and Britain set to follow. We are on our own. McCain's dream of a League of Democracies sending troops to relieve us is fantasy. We are stuck, and the insurgents have home advantage, a militant martial tradition and encouragement from their previously cautious spiritual leader, Sistani. The odds against a clearcut "victory" are rapidly widening.

We further degraded our capacities through the Surge, which was merely a cosmetic exercise to buy GWB face-saving time before he retires. For all Krauthammer's neocon spin, there has been no real political progress in uniting Iraq. The oil biz there is chaotic, so we cannot draw on revenues to pay for the stalemate now costing us five thousand bucks a second.

All Dr K can think of is attacking Iran for an encore. He is one of the siren voices that beguiled us into this mess in the first place.

The American people don't respond to chickenhawks' attempts to blackmail them by saying we cannot let ouselves be "defeated". We stood it in Vietnam, and nothing very terrible happened.

Time to quit.


frantic to turn sow's ear to silk purse
To begin with, I am against precipitous withdrawal from Iraq(within one year).

We broke it(like Colin Powell said), and should withdraw over the course of two years, during which we can work with the Iraqis on improving infrastructure.

But Krauthammer may be imbibing a bit too freely from the neocon koolaid.

Just today the A.P. reports Iraq's government has AGAIN rejected the Bush administration security scheme with it.

And we have Al-Maliki again traveling to Iran, being feted by his fellow Shia brethren.

Iraqis correctly understand that we will leave at some point, and they will have to live in harmony with their neighbors, of whom Iran is one.

Will's 5:56 post contains some valid points.

Bush promised in 2000 our nation was not into "nation-building". He even campaigned on that theme, criticizing the Clinton administration(Kosovo). Yet now that is PRECISELY what Bush is doing in Iraq: Nationbuilding.

BHO promised to immediately begin withdrawing our forces from Iraq, if elected.

But once president, BHO may renege on his promise to immediately pull out of Iraq, JUST as Bush reneged on his(abhorrence of nationbuilding).

Krauthammer and fellow neocons are delirious.. FRANTIC..to wrest Bush's tattered legacy from the ashheap of history.

But you can't turn a sow'e ear into a silk purse, my clueless neocon friends.

At the end of the day, after all this sacrifice, this huge debt Bush has saddled future generations of Americcans with, a Shia-based Iraqi government, allied with Iran, will be the outcome.



dreamer
exactly which article did you read before you posted your drivel, crack-head?

WLL speaks but not through the mouth.
Rewriting history does not alter the fact that millions were killed after we pulled out of Viet Nam.
“We will go after terrorists and States that sponsor terrorism.”
Is there something so complex about this statement that ie escapes WLL's comprehension?

Stick his head in the sand and pretend .
Obama is sticking his head in the sand and pretending no terrorist problems exist. Wonder what he will do when some terrorst stick a bomb in his behind and sets it off? Wishing or thinking there are no world-wide and very serious terrorist threats, is scary! It can get us killed and some day be ruled by the radicals. Hum!!! Makes one wonder if that is not Obama'a BIG plan? This is an even scarier thought!!! But what other explanation exists?

WLL
Time to quit.


Spoken like a true blue spineless coward! Thanks for you input!

Charles -correct again!
Obama is an empty shell, an absolute arrogant ultra-leftist (there are no other kind) whose stupidity (57 states??????), naivety, greed for power, and ignorance of America and our economic and political system will destroy the USA.
As Democrats have explained - Obama has NO credentials to even run - he's a naked swimmer.
McCain is a leader and has the expertise to guide the USA in this era - he's tough and he's smart and he has more foreign policy knowledge in his big toe than BO has in his entire Rezko mansion.
NO BO!

MDogggggggggggggggggggggg
(find a Craphammer column that ever criticized the war)


And what will you poney up when I produce it?
Silence???

impeachbush
how is your devine leaders articles of impeachment going there?

BWAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

I hear Dennis likes you alot and wants you to play on his spaceship today. I told him you were too high on crack to play today!

Folks
"-- We did not go into Iraq to fight al-Qaeda. The war had other purposes. But al-Qaeda chose to turn it into the central front in its war against America. That choice turned into an al-Qaeda fiasco: al-Qaeda in Iraq is now on the run and in the midst of stunning and humiliating defeat."

The above statement is a simple lie. Al Q never did much more than encourage the insurgents in Iraq with words and very limited support. Al Q in Iraq is not the Al Q that attacked us. Those folks are thriving in Afghanistan and nuclear Pakistan. Iraq does seem to be getting its act together and they want us out of there and have said so. Obama isn't abandoning Iraq; he is doing what we promised freeing it. As far as McCain staying in Iraq, I ask only two questions. First where do the troops come from for Iraq and Afghanistan. Second, how is he going to pay for the continued wars? Will he continue to run us into debt like the Bush Regime devaluing our currency to the point even Budweiser is going to foreign owners?

THE KRAUTMEISTER
I love this guy...he's spot on every time.

And for all the liberal rantings and ravings and Bush Derangement Syndrome-afflicted leftist drool, one cannot refute a single line of that article.

For your average lib, truth is not a defense.

SSGT
Date: Jun 13, 2008 - 7:52 AM EST WLL
"...Spoken like a true blue spineless coward! Thanks for you input! "

Little frightened ssgt and gunnyg spewing their fear and bullying namecalling yet again. YAWN...

Remember 1932. Study what happened in 1932. This extreme conservatism (it was called Hooverism back then) is over, finished. So I guess I can sort of understand your frantic ranting even if I do not condone it

scarlettsnow
Date: Jun 13, 2008 - 7:54 AM EST Subject: "...Obama is an empty shell, an absolute arrogant ultra-leftist (there are no other kind) whose stupidity (57 states??????), naivety, greed for power, and ignorance of America and our economic and political system will destroy the USA."

You don't get it do you? The old left/right is done over. It is about change and competency now. Obama offers both. McCain went along with the Bush Regime's rape of America. 66 senate seats on the way

Dr. K
While I don't always agree with Dr. Krauthammer, the fact is he has more intellectual power in his little finger than all the dreamers, MDoggies, wobbies and all the rest of the leftie Kool-Aid drinking morons who have posted on this thread combined.

I'd love to see a situation where any of the usual suspects here sat down face to face with Dr. K and watch him logically mop the floor with 'em. Yes, I'd pay good money to see that.


This Hurts
Charles K is one of my favorites and I want to win in Iraq. That said, I must point out the Iraq army has not won in Basra, Najaf, or Sadr City, they are playing map games. I will use one city to make my point---Basra---the others are the same. When Maliki took the Iraq army into Basra, he did it without coordination with the US. The battle situation immediately turned sour, the Iraqis had no air cover, some refused to fight and Maliki was "holed up" in a building he could not move out of. Emergency calls were made to the US Army for help, we sent in the Apache's to suppress the enemy forces and we extricated Maliki to a safe area by Black-hawk. Arrangements were made between Maliki and Iran to create a zone in Basra that the Iraqi Army could occupy and give the illusion of victory. The rest of Basra was to be off-limits for combat operations. Peace had been achieved in our time and Maliki had wiped the egg from his face, the forces that had refused to fight were safe in the Iraq area and all was ready to be reported as a job well done. It was; it has been; Charles K has been "snookered". Imagine a 2x2 mile square of peace in the middle of Atlanta and the rest of the city left to "thugs" to do as they please and you have the picture.

scarlett says
"McCain is a leader and has the expertise to guide the USA in this era -"

He couldn't even guide a jet over Vietnamese peasants without crashing and finding himself prisoner - and that's who you want to lead? he was a flop in the military, he signed documents admitting he was a war criminal - under torture - but since he approves of torture, there must be something to it - right? I mean if we use torture to get at the truth, then the NVA must've got at the truth as well.

or do we get the truth from torture and they got lies?

MDoggggg

I didn't know there was a Manhattan in Kentucky.

Huh...

Punkahue
I told you not to address me in these Posts. You are a traitor and a coward and not worthy to claim the uniform that you disgrace.

On a more notable point, we could just jump on I76 and meet halfway at a rest stop. Then I can show you how much I fear you!! :-)

Hal Donahue writes:
"The old left/right is done over. It is about change and competency now. Obama offers both."
-----

Yep - Obama is all about change.

But how would Hal (or anyone for that matter) know if Obama really offers competency?

Where's the years of proven track records and legislative accomplishments?

His resume fits on a matchbook - yet enlightened liberals like Hal would give this guy the keys to the nuclear arsenal?

And 66 Senate seats???

It's a little early for Happy Hour, Hal.

Warrior's 8:23
Informative and interesting.

I knew Iraq forces went off "half cocked", and that we had to rescue them in Basra.

And I knew lots of al Maliki's forces refused to fight against al-Sadr's Shia militias there.

But I did not know al-Maliki himself was basically holed up, almost a hostage, unable to extricate himself.

I suppose alot of this whole enterprise is "smoke and mirrors", and yes, I place in that category those who want to irresponsibly walk away from Iraq, AND Bush administration cheerleaders such as Krauthammer.

SSGT
Date: Jun 13, 2008 - 8:38 AM EST Punkahue
"...I told you not to address me in these Posts. ...On a more notable point, we could just jump on I76 and meet halfway at a rest stop. Then I can show you how much I fear you!! :-) "

LMAO if you fear me you are dumb. No, you fear the future. You fear change. You fear nameless threats. Basicly you fear life

Yes it is time for change.
Time to change your speech Obama, and start telling the truth, your change is all about lies, you tell one group one thing and another group an entirely different thing the next day. Yes, that is change, but I don't think that is the change I am looking for. One day your grandmother was a typical white woman who made you cringe when she saw a black man, but when you needed the white vote, she became the white woman you owe everything that you are today to. Rev Wright was also someone you could never deny till he cost you votes, then he was quickly tossed under the bus. Just like you did with Israel your best friend, until Hamas didn't like it. Who are you, and when are you going to stop changing?

Hope and Change
You bet, Obama wants no guns for the Americans because there is going to be a war here, the people are tired of the governments s**t.

Also it will be easy for the Muslims to take over. You people that think Obama is so great are just plain nuts and can't see the writing on the wall.

zeestephen & skywalker
President Bush has made the case plenty of times. He is drowned out by the screeches from the left (purposely on the part of those in the media, who decide what and how to report news).

Primus54
"...But how would Hal (or anyone for that matter) know if Obama really offers competency?"

The competency issue is more about the incompetency of the conservative/Republican Party. They people figure that any change will result in more competency - they are right

"Where's the years of proven track records and legislative accomplishments?"

Look at the accomplishments of his whole life. Besides Bush had none so that matters not to you folks

"His resume fits on a matchbook - yet enlightened liberals like Hal would give this guy the keys to the nuclear arsenal?"

His resume is impressive have you read it? As far as the nuclear arsenal goes after Bush the torturer anything is an improvement

"And 66 Senate seats???"

A reach but doable. You really have no idea how badly conservatism is discredited with the American people do you? WOW but ok please stay that way

calling on Obama supporters
This is a sincere request for Obama's supporters. I would like to see a list of things you truly believe Mr. Obama will accomplish as President.

Gee Byrce
I didn't know you were more knowledgable than Krauthammer and had more access to facts and figures than you. Very impressive even for a closed minded lib.

Curious about Darfur
When Obama wins what are his intentions regarding this war? It seems to be a pet project among liberals.

Obama's Plan For Defeat
Good article,as usual,Mr.Krauthammer,but you are beating a dead horse. Barack Hussein and the left,who support him,do not want to win.

They have been trying to lose this war since a few weeks after it started. Cut and run...their mantra.

They don't have the nerve to really end it,they,and the MSM just use it as a sledgehammer to beat GW Bush with. They get so much mileage with it.

You McCain and Bush haters,vote for Obama. He will set everything right. His plans are so superior to what we have now. Bullfeathers!!!






Democrats and Success
If the Democrats were put in charge of the Sahara desert - there would be a shortage of sand within 5 years.

Democrats would then declare sand as an endangered vital natural 'resource' and demand that the sand be returned to its natural habitat - spending trillions replacing it.

The Democrats would issue 'sand subsidies' to all Democratic officials and 'sand welfare stamps' to all Democrat voters.

The Democrats exhibiting the same assertive, self-involved shallowness of liberals would declare 'We saved sand' while conservatives just stood by and ignored the crisis.

Democrats would then say "Ask not what your country can do for your wallet, ask what your wallet can do for the country."

Want $10 a gallon gas?
Keep electing Democrats!

ANWR Exploration
House Republicans:91%Supported
House Democrats: 86% Opposed

Coal-to-Liquid
House Republicans: 97% Supported
House Democrats: 78% Opposed

Oil Shale Exploration
House Republicans: 90% Supported
House Democrats: 86% Opposed

Outer Continental Shelf (OCS) Exploration
House Republicans: 81% Supported
House Democrats: 83% Opposed

Refinery Increased Capacity
House Republicans: 97% Supported
House Democrats: 96% Opposed

Poetic justice.

To watch all the lefties flailing about as Iraq marches toward victory... how truly sweet it is.

And how absolutely just.

Democrat Bumper Stickers
"Obama, no substance; what's not to like?"

"Victims for Obama - 08"

"Obama - Hope for Hamas - 08"

"Vote Obama or you’re a racist!"

"Obama 08 Because you will feel guilty if you don't!"

"Make your last vote count! Vote Obama!"

"vote with your heart, not with your head -- vote Obama"

"Nine out of ten racist preachers agree -- Obama in '08"

"Ask not what your Country needs -- just vote Obama"

"Tired of too much money and success? Then vote for CHANGE -- Obama '08"

NEWS FLASH Democrats voter rights 08
Democrats announced today that they will institute a "Leave No Voter Behind!" campaign.

*Not available in Florida and Michigan

Hal Donahue
It is not "conservatism" that is discredited - it is "RINOism". Politicians preaching a good game, but shifting to the left out of expediency or wanting to be "liked" by the inside-the-beltway MSM.

If liberalism were so great - liberals would state proudly, "I am a liberal!"

Instead, they have to manufacture new code word labels, such as "Progressive".

Even you label yourself a "moderate", when any reasonable review of your many opinions clearly show you to be a liberal.

Real conservatism is not dead - and it succeeds every time it's tried.

Now you are stuck with Obama - and I've got a "Ben Franklin" I'd be willing to wager with you over the presidential election.

But I suspect "fear" will prevent you from putting your money where your mouth is.

Dreamer-How does AQ win if we leave?
Seems like you should have been able to work this out if you were thinking instead of dreaming.

3 quick ways they win:

1) They get to go in and lop off the heads of any Iraqi who was seen to be an American sympathizer.
2) They get to say to the rest of the oppressed in the region: "see, America wil not finish the job. They will strand you. So forget about rising up in your own defense."
3) They get a safe haven and lots of recruits who might otherwise fight for their own freedoms.

MDogggggggg
glad to see the pup is out and about. On all the other stuff, Its futal to try to talk to you about it. If you think that what and how you say things does not affect the troops, and the people who support whats best for this country, then you are not taking a good look at what and how you're sending your message.
By the way, my pup is doing pretty well also!

Impeach Al Gore!
Al Gore "The number of fires has gone up since we started fighting fire."

Al Gore "big fires are getting bigger, small fires are getting smaller because of Global warming!"
================================================

STOP GULLIBLE WARMING!

STOP CLIMATE CHANGE, DEMAND EQUAL TEMPERATURES FOR ALL SEASONS!


Obama..hear no good..see no good...speak
Obama never heard a sermon by Rev Wright, never read the Trinity magazine and never spoke of politics to his mentors. Why should he start hearing, reading and speaking now on a topic he has no experience with?

America in full insult to the Founders!
George Washington said this: "Overgrown military establishments are under any form of governments inauspicious to liberty, and are to be reagrded as particularly hostile to Republican liberty". What would this greatest of man say were he to rise and find America's horrendous and inhumane war machinery circling the globe and with the Commander in Chief finger on the trigger threatening every other nation that does now bow quickly or els you are history?

James Madison said this: "Of all enemies to public liberty, war is, perhaps, the most to be dreaded, because it comprises and develops the germ of every other. War is the parent of armies; from these proceed debts and taxes; and armies, and debts, and taxes are the known instrument for bringing the many under the domination of the the few". What would he also say were he to rise while America is in debt foreign nations, as every child now born has actually a bill attached to be paid at the tune of $30,000.00?

Thomas Jefferson said this: "The principle of spending money to be paid by posterity, under the name of funding, is but the swindling of futurity on a large scale".

It's the economy stupid
To counter the media, there needs to be a simple, common message.

It is the economy. Here is a start.

1-Helping Iraq establishes a strong central government gives political stability and increased oil production. The Mideast becomes better able to eliminate terrorists and becomes more financially independent of US economic aid. Losing in Iraq has the opposite result.

The bottom line is that continuing the present strategy results in improving the US economy. Quitting in Iraq costs the US more in higher oil prices and a bigger drain on the economy by having to fight an expanded worldwide terrorist presence that will happen if Iraq is destabilized.

2- We need change in our energy plan. Expanding our domestic production of oil results in the US being less dependent on foreign oil. This will take up to ten years so we must start now.

Not starting now will create increasing and disastrous problems on the economy. This hurts the middle and lower income families that can least afford it.

3- We need to have a crash program to develop alternative forms of energy, including wind, solar, nuclear and future technology that we only dream of today. This will take decades to complete.

Not having a broad based program means we will not be prepared when the world supply of oil finally is exhausted. This would create a worldwide catastrophe.

4- We need to protect our borders.

Not doing this will result in further drains on our economy in ways that are too complex to cover here.

So you see, it ALL comes back to the economy. And there are other factors that either positively or negatively affect our economy.

We need change; change in our foreign policy that affects our economy; change in our energy plans that affect our economy; change in our border security that affects our economy; change in how congress spends your tax money that affects our economy.

If your congressman supports this plan, vote them in. If they don't vote them out.



Obama will examine Global Warming!
Obama insiders announced today that when Obama becomes POTUS - he will demand that NASA send a spacecraft to the Sun to examine 'sunspots'.

Future Secretary of Commerce and 'Obama Advisor' Maxime Waters suggested "the craft should land at night so it will not be damaged by heat."

Victory????????????
How can anyone talk about victory and not define it. I recall for a long time the Bush Montra was we can stand down when they stand up. So if they are standing up where is the plan for our withdrawl.

If we are winning our brave me and women should be able to return home, I am glad that things in Iraw are looking better than before but what is the plan for victory and what are the benchmarks that indicate success?

Here is how I see it. We are occupying Iraq and as long as we do we will be a target for Al Qaeda. Saddam ran his coutry without our help, how long will it take for Iraq to be able to govern and handle its own secruity. Five years, ten years, a century. In the meantime what does being in Iraq doing to our Military and what are we not accomplishing the other more important war. Osama is still at larage.

If I had a nickel for everytime a Conservative commentator has said we are winning in Iraq, I would be in the tax brakets that most benefit from the tax cuts. Remember the VP saying the insurgency was in its last throws or McCain coming back from Bagdad and talk about how safe its streets were. You could fill a ledger with all of the process told to us by administration Reps and their supports. This war has lasted longer than WWII and we still have no idea how close we are to this so called victory.

Vietnam should have taught us that you don't go into a war with out a clear mission. We has a mission to overthrow Saddam, now that has been accomplished we have had a confusing and shifting mission.

It doesn't depend just on Congress
it depends on whether anything Obama says isn't a lie and whether he can appoint anyone who isn't corrupt or a racist or an anti-American or all three.

He has abandoned his church of 20 years, abandoned his adviser and spiritual inspiration of 20 years, the weatherpeople who started his pol. career, the Chicago wheeler dealer who got his home for him, and so far one member of his veep search staff.

He has no loyalty, no friendship, no consistency that isn't politically correct and politically conveniant.

He probably has no position he would defend steadfastly or belief he would die for.

He is a nothing. And if people who support him would start thinking with their cerebral cortexes instead of their lower reptilian brains that produces hatred and fear, they would see Obama offers really nothing except empty words and promises,defeat, recession, and decline.

See my blog on Conservative Battleline on 5/25.

NEWS FLASH to Liberals
HOPE IS NOT A FOREIGN POLICY

SURRENDER IS NOT A DEFENSE POLICY

CHANGE IS NOT AN ECONOMIC POLICY


*"Free tinfoil hat fitting with your vote for Obama"

A house divided against its self
The frustrating thing about using our military to influence other cultures and nations,is the country politically and philosophicaly is always divided.This means our military must fight with two hands tied behind their backs.Think about any subject and if the people involved are always divided nothing gets finished.My point is this,if we have no intention of finishing why do we as a country keep getting invovled.Iraq is probably a test for the USA in the coming war of Israel verses the muslim nations,what will we do ??

JMO51
this is exactly why you are a lying idiot!

NRO:
"Reality over Appearance
The wealthy pay more in taxes when tax rates fall. Period!

A few weeks ago, the Internal Revenue Service released data on tax year 2003. The data show that the top 1 percent of taxpayers, ranked by adjusted gross income, paid 34.3 percent of all federal income taxes that year. The top 5 percent paid 54.4 percent, the top 10 percent paid 65.8 percent, and the top 25 percent paid 83.9 percent."



Obama and Reality
If Obama becomes POTUS and has to face the reality of war and give direction.

He will probably say "This is not the Iraq War that I remember".

Obama will say "Troop presence in New Jersey is creating more terrorists".

*Free tinfoil hat fitting with your vote for Obama

Mdoggie at 10:12
.....I expect middle class tax cuts - and the death of the Bush tax cuts - which means the rich will have to pay more.





Taxes and Income
December 17, 2007

Every Democrat running for President wants to raise taxes on "the rich," but they will have to do something miraculous to outtax President Bush. Based on the latest available tax data, no Administration in modern history has done more to pry tax revenue from the wealthy.

Last week the Congressional Budget Office joined the IRS in releasing tax numbers for 2005, and part of the news is that the richest 1% paid about 39% of all income taxes that year. The richest 5% paid a tad less than 60%, and the richest 10% paid 70%. These tax shares are all up substantially since 1990, and even somewhat since 2000. Meanwhile, Americans with an income below the median -- half of all households -- paid a mere 3% of all income taxes in 2005. The richest 1.3 million tax-filers -- those Americans with adjusted gross incomes of more than $365,000 in 2005 -- paid more income tax than all of the 66 million American tax filers below the median in income. Ten times more.

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB119786208643933077.html



timing
Krauthammer's columns are always funny for their warped sense of reality. A debaathification law that has angered the Sunnis is given as a sign of progress even though the point of a debaathification law is to reach a reconciliation with the Sunnis.

But the timing of this one is funny as it comes on the same day that Townhall's big World news story is Malikis speaking out about the unacceptability of the US not recognizing Iraqi sovereignty. This is a position that Maliki was no doubt hardened to during his recent consultations with the Iranians. And yet Krauthammer is trying to paint the Maliki government as a blow to the Iranians, because Maliki stood up to the less Iran associated Mahdi Army. (And even there there are limits. The reason no US troops went in to Sadr city is that Sadr agreed there would be no resistance to the Iraqi army as long as no US troops went in. Hardly a devestating blow to him in advance of elections).

So Krauthamer's article about how Obama is not keeping up with news in Iraq comes off as silly because it does not keep up with news in Iraq. But then Krauthammer seems to have a weird cognitive filter that erases everything from his consciousness that does not fit with his preconceived notions.

Power Outage In D.C.
Drudge says power outage in D.C.,running on generators...why don't they shut it down and go home,before they make more trouble for the rest of us?

Obama and 'Patriot Credits'
Obama will demand 'Patriot Credits' from Anerican Patriots to be given to Democrats so that there will be a level playing field.

Obama says "Patriots have an unfair advantage over Democrats when it comes to 'Patriotism' so this 'Affirmative Patriot Action and Credits' will help Democrats have self esteem when they are called Unpatriotic citizens."

Obama says "This new program will replace the 'Patriot Act' and calling any Democrat 'unpatriotic' will now be hate speech subject to legal damages and prison terms."

*Free tinfoil hat fitting with your vote for Obama

ex-W/BmanIII
its completely amazing how utterly stupid the left is. The top 25% income earners in this country pay over 80% of the taxes, and it ain't enough for the left. Go figure!


JMO51, want some more FACTS to choose from, dummy?

Excellent post Goof's Mom (#7)
Unfortunately, it looks like McLame is as much an invertebrate as Oblahma.

Democrats invested in Defeat
In a nutshell, Obama and the Democrats are undeniably invested in defeat vis-vis the Iraq war while McCain and the republicans are invested in success. (success meaning a self-sustaining, democratic nation which is an American ally in an histoically unprecedented war -- freedom & democracy vs. Islamic extremism executed by means of guerilla-esq acts of terror & chaos).

Can you imagine the Revolutionary War generation or the WWI generation of Americans having a political party whose platform and means for political success is American wartime defeat? This is precisely the level to which today's Democratic party and its liberal backers have stooped.

Now that is truly unprecedented, tragic and shameful.

Retired Geek.

Hey, bro... your posts absolutely kill me.

This would all be hilarious... but so much is at stake, and for so many.

Anyway, keep up the good work. I still have a few bills to pay.

SSGT
It gets better, wait til the whole "Windfall Tax" is put in place...

Obama Myopia
Senator Obama is out of touch on many fronts, including the Iraq war. His moronic "we should not have gone" mantra is not only backward looking, it demonstrates how utterly devoid he is of substance on every issue. How can one look backward while walking forward? Bumped shins from walking into walls or falling down stairs would be one's fate. America WILL NOT elect this man.

Sarah from Bellevue, NE

SSGT writes:
ex-W/BmanIII
its completely amazing how utterly stupid the left is. The top 25% income earners in this country pay over 80% of the taxes, and it ain't enough for the left. Go figure!


JMO51, want some more FACTS to choose from, dummy?

They want the top 25% to pay 100+%

Primus54
"It is not "conservatism" that is discredited - it is "RINOism". Politicians preaching a good game, but shifting to the left out of expediency or wanting to be "liked" by the inside-the-beltway MSM."

See here is where you are dead wrong. It is conservatism - look how your candidates did for president.

"If liberalism were so great - liberals would state proudly, "I am a liberal!"

Instead, they have to manufacture new code word labels, such as "Progressive"."

No argument there but those terms are old failed school. I keep telling you I am a moderate I mean heck I even have had death threats from the left LOL.

"Even you label yourself a "moderate", when any reasonable review of your many opinions clearly show you to be a liberal."

I am a moderate the liberals think I am way too far right

"Real conservatism is not dead - and it succeeds every time it's tried."

Oh really when was that? Don't say Reagan he would be labeled a RINO in these times - raised taxes, withdrew troops from Lebanon, negotiated with enemies....

"Now you are stuck with Obama - and I've got a "Ben Franklin" I'd be willing to wager with you over the presidential election.

But I suspect "fear" will prevent you from putting your money where your mouth is. "

not at all cheapness does LOL I never wager more than a token dollar

SO MCCAIN IS BETTER THAN BUSH?

.....If that is your arguement then maybe we should have elected McCain in 2000 .....COLOSSUS

Hank/Lumberjack
Did you see that RED Nancy wants to implement a windfall tax on 401K's now? I'll never be able to retire!

Mr. Krauthammer
Based on the title of the column, I expected to read about Obama's plan to lose in November. I am not sure whose plan is better in that regard. They both appear to have exceptionally well designed plans to do that.

You are absolutely correct and spot on with your analysis. However, I dislike the following statement: "Democrats won an exhilarating electoral victory in 2006 pledging withdrawal at a time when conditions in Iraq were dire and we were indeed losing the war."

Don't feed the trolls. It is misguided correlations such as this that are the bane of our politics. The democrats did not retake congress based on anti war sentiment. They won based on republican corruptness and mismanagement in congress, same as it ever was. If Obama wins in November, he will have a slimmer majority, not a larger one, and the republicans will win huge in 2010 and 2012.

The majority of Americans want to win in Iraq and most would correctly poll to support it if presented with honest facts. Thank the Lord for a stubborn president. I think the lefty wingnuts' days may be numbered. Obama could be their last big hurrah convincing a new generation of the idiocy of socialism. If McCain wins, we can expect steady progress in the wrong direction for a while.

Imo, the phrase, it's the economy, stupid, always applies because the balance of government nanny state vs. rugged individualism will always be the primary and deciding factor in the well being of this great nation. Iraq is a distraction and one that is being handled rather well.

HAL BABY - IT DOESN'T MATTER
EITHER WAY AMERICA LOSES

.....Obama or McCain it really doesn't matter ....American Soverneignty is being sold out to World Globalism ...with McCain it might just take a little longer to get there ...

.....America's best days are behind us as we drift inexorably toward Socialism and the new One World Order ...at some point in the future America will become just another province in a World Government controlled through the U.N. by multinational billionaires ...Take a look into your crystal ball HAL ...can you see a different scenario? .....COLOSSUS

Give the speech
Me likey! Charles thank you for this article,you'll not see this side on the news(maybe fox). This could push McCain over the top.And finally quiet the liberals on the war effort. We can only HOPE. ha ha

SSGT
I'm telling you, the people that elected these monsters should be ashamed of themselves.

All those years of hard work and saving money to retire will have been for nothing.

Hey Retired Geek...
..."Patriot credits"....another good one....

....do guys like me and you....who probably have a big surplus....get to sell them to the treasonous little cretins?

...if so, how much do you figure we could charge them?

...or maybe we could trade them for some "compassion" credits or some other such nonsense?

Your Obedient Servant,

George Washington


No, Geek, wait...
...I've got it!

For each "Patriotism credit" we give to a liberal, we get to gag them for a period of one year.

Geez, as many of those guys who are in need of the credits, we might actually get some peace and quiet for a change!

Your Most Humble, etc.

George Washington

name stealing
This is off topic a bit, but as I read through all the comments, I noted that once again "Robert" using a new screen name to get past being blocked. This time however he took my name with a different number on the end. This tactic pisses me off. I don't want his loonie rantings to be mistakenly associated with me. I have really felt that attacking him and responding to him only feeds his ego and desire to post his crap. Just ignore him and make your posts directed to the article. Ignore the trolls and hopefully they will get bored and go away. If they don't, then the Nuclear option may have to be used.

Oh and to the leftists that don't understand how money works, those that pay the most taxes should get the most benefit from tax cuts. If you pay little or nothing into the system, you should not expect to be paid back anything.

Taking the numbers provided by SSGT which I am attching below:
The Internal Revenue Service data show that the top 1 percent of taxpayers, ranked by adjusted gross income, paid 34.3 percent of all federal income taxes that year. The top 5 percent paid 54.4 percent, the top 10 percent paid 65.8 percent, and the top 25 percent paid 83.9 percent.
That means that the other 75% paid only 16.1% of all the taxes collected. If there is a tax break, who do you think should get the most benefit? And who do you think provides the jobs that feed and clothe everyone? Ever been hired by a "poor" man? Tax breaks help the economy and the government has always actually taken in more revenue after the tax reductions because that money is used to expand business not government.


Funny, Hal:
"Don't say Reagan he would be labeled a RINO in these times - raised taxes, withdrew troops from Lebanon, negotiated with enemies..."
-----

B.S. Pure & simple.

Reagan WAS the epitome of conservatism.

But even HE had to make some compromises to get what he wanted from a large Dem house majority.

By the end of his two terms - the overall tax burden on ALL classes was lower than when he took over Carter's malaise.

Sure - he negotiated with the enemy - but from a position of strength. And he negotiated with enemies that at least didn't want to commit suicide.

Pretty sure history shows who won those negotiations.

As to Lebanon - no argument from me there.

Reagan was greatness - but still a fallible human being.

You lefties think Obama is the next coming of the Messiah.

As to the wager, being "cheap" just means you aren't very confident in your predictions. If you were so sure of your judgment - a "cheap" guy would look at this as the easiest "hundo" he ever made.

Of course, your prediction of an official, full-fledged recession by July wasn't so hot - so maybe it is best you not take the risk.

Sen. Obama & the North American Union?
Barack Obama YOU HAVE SAID NOTHING about the N A U (SPP.GOV). You MUST know this “business deal” was done by Pres. Bush with his friend, confidant & past Pres. of Mexico, V. Fox. This quietly done "deal" was ORALLY solidified at the Bush ranch. It was never debated by the legislature or told to American citizens. We now see plans for a Super Highway, where thousands of acres of tax payer property will be confiscated through (the Kelo vs New London Court rule) eminent domain process. PRIVATE PROPERTY IS CENTRAL TO THE FREEDOM AMERICANS ENJOY. The N A U- “NAFTA Super Highway” deal negates this basic, American right to own, retain, safeguard and preserve property owned by families, in many cases, for generations. The NAU, surreptitiously done by President Bush in 2005, with NO debate or vetting by the legislature, completely disenfranchised Americans of any knowledge of or say in the matter. It is the equal of a virtual coup in surrendering U.S. sovereignty to a trilateral entity that, in the form of a N A U, could equal the European Union that dictates to the citizens of 27 European states. Senator, you need to tell American your position on preserving U.S. Sovereignty. The N.A.U., if actively denounced in your campaign, could win you the presidency. Your opponents have never talked of this vital issue - - meanwhile the Bush admin. is proceeding as thought this private scheme is a “done deal”. America is watching, listening & waiting to see how you stand on this critical matter. P.S. House Concurrent Resolution 40 states Congressional DISAPPROVAL of the NAFTA Highway & N A U. You are NOT among the 48 COSPONSORS of the bill. Why? Ron Paul introduced H.R. 5191, prohibiting use of federal funds for N A U highway projects. Back this bill & show you support the sovereignty, independence & freedom of America.

SunThe1
Reply # 28
Date: Jun 13, 2008 - 9:54 AM EST Dreamer-How "...3 quick ways they win:

1) They get to go in and lop off the heads of any Iraqi who was seen to be an American sympathizer."

Really you think the Iraqis will allow Al Q free rein or the Kurds?

"2) They get to say to the rest of the oppressed in the region: "see, America wil not finish the job. They will strand you. So forget about rising up in your own defense."

We did not come to the Iraqis defense we invaded and occupied Iraq and Iraq Gov wants us out

"3) They get a safe haven and lots of recruits who might otherwise fight for their own freedoms. "

You really think Iran will allow that? Then you do not know the area at all.

skywalker81
Have no fear about the "nuclear option" being used on "Robert".

Townhall has already decided on that - it is just taking time for their IT people to plug all the holes in the system.

As to the rest of your 11:30 post - spot on.

Count on the leftist/liberals not understanding a word you wrote. They were victims of the "new math" taught in our schools.

Cheers.

Chet

One has to wonder, other than BrianR, are there ANY Californians who aren't complete, leftist, conspiracy theory kooks?

Have you heard about the latest UFO abductions?

If
If Obama gets his way all you folks crying "get out" will see its affect and who will you cry to then ? When Iran take over Iraq and her oil fields and holds the rest of the ME hostage with her nuclear bomb and gas in the US goes up to $9-10 a gallon you will get your reward. Not thinking beyond the nose on ones face is childish and immature. The old saying one does not appreciate what one has until it's gone will be proven true when these leftists so change American and your freedoms you will feel like you are in Cuba. Terrorists now have rights as US citizens, the government can take your house under "imminent domain", your guns will be next.
California text books can't refer to marriage as a a man and woman. Reading certain passages out of the Bible will be a hate crime just like in Canada.
Excuse me but what did our fore fathers fight and spill their blood for ?

Oh Lord
"-- We did not go into Iraq to fight al-Qaeda. The war had other purposes. But al-Qaeda chose to turn it into the central front in its war against America. That choice turned into an al-Qaeda fiasco: al-Qaeda in Iraq is now on the run and in the midst of stunning and humiliating defeat"

Riiiiight, we have been hearing that BS from Republican Chickenhawks for 4 years. The war had other purposes? Oh, please tell us Charles.
The removal of Saddam is the greatest gift anyone could have given Bin Laden. He is still alive and laughing at what an idiot Bush is. McCain will continue Bush's failed policies and that is reason enought to not vote for him. Just wait till the campaign gets into full swing - we will be hearing about how McCain cheated on his first wife, dumped her after her disfiguring car accident to marry that creepy (and wealthy) drug addict Cindy. I remeber how Repubs were going after Kerry for marrying a wealthy woman. Well, what comes around goes around.

You would think someone who served in combat would support Webb's vets bill. But no, to republicans, supporting the troops is just a slogan to be tacked onto their SUVs (how ironic) with magnetic stickers made in China. Magnetic, so they can be easily removed.


GW scottK et al
Debates with Democrats are almost pointless beacause everything they know is wrong.

GW you can't measure a Democrats 'Patriot Footprint' without an electron microscope.

GW I would rather gag a different orifice on them than the mouth because that is where there most sensible comments come from.

Democrats are dangerous because all of their opinions are formed by someone else - those types will defend nonsense to death.

Primus54/skywalker81
Primus54:
Don't forget about Lolo!!!!

skywalker81:
notice that JMO51 won't respond to the facts presented here. Bman's post was 2005, vice my post, which was 2003 numbers. The question is, why won't the dummies come out and defend their losing positions on this issue!

Thats what I thought lugheads!

Skywalker81...
...whew, for a minute there I thought you had moved from Alabama (the Western province of God's country with Georgia comprising the East) to Santa Monica, California or something.

When I started posting here a few weeks ago, Robert was flying USN jets off carriers on secret mission or something.

What's he up to these days?

Your 11:30 post on the distribution of who pays taxes should be reduced to business card size so it could be whipped out whenever the Dummocrats start yammering their incessant "tax cuts for the rich" nonsense.

Better yet tape record, strap the idiotic devils down to a gurney, and play it at high volume through a headset for 72 hours straight.

Then remove the headset and ask them a couple of questions about tax policy. If they start saying "tax cuts for poor Americans" or other such idiocy, repeat the process until the strange behavior stops.

Your Humble and Most Obedient Servant,

George Washington

How about this for a winning strategy
McCain comes out and says he will veto any and all global warming related legislation during his first, and hopefully last, term of office. State that due to conflicting evidence and the current state of knowledge, we must wait for more data before committing headlong into a rush to return to horses and buggies. Hell, if he suggested a new global warming commission to waste a few years wining and dining the issue, it would be better then passing anything now. Show me one little conservative bone in your body John. I am begging for a reason to vote for you but, you keep denying me. The state of Iraq is such that whoever wins will be able to claim victory and watch troops coming home on tv.

Your last column correctly stated the changes people are making with $4 gasoline. I am praying for $6 gasoline so that we can make some more much needed political changes that are absolutely necessary for our economic survival. Let's see how much clout Greenpeace has at $6 a gallon. I would pay good money for seats to watch Pelosi and Reid trying to manage that. $4 changes people's behavior. What number will it take to get them to vote people into office to change our current energy policy?

Charles
do me a big favor! Stand in the middle of the street. I have a magnetic symbol on the front of my (Pick-up truck), made in America. I want you to get a real close look at it. Just keep standing there, I'm doing 90mph and will be there soooooon. Don't move now!

Democrats argue to and from Ignorance
The argument from ignorance, also known as argumentum ad ignorantiam ("appeal to ignorance") or argument by lack of imagination, is a logical fallacy in which it is claimed that a premise is true only because it has not been proven false or is only false because it has not been proven true.

Obamaunism is the classic example of this fallacy by claiming the American taxpayer is not contributing enough to the ObamaSociety.

* A vote for Obama Brings Hope and Change to ALL 57 States!



Obama's Plan
Obama is in a very good position with respect to Iraq. It is a safe position. It is safe because, with recent developments in Iraq and assuming the trend continues, by the time BHO is inaugurated in January (assuming he is elected), orders the Joint Chiefs to develop a withdrawal plan, and the plan is completed, the war will be over and we will have won.

And when the troops come home guess who will be there welcoming them and claiming Victory.

SSGT
Thanks for the correction - I don't know how I forgot her.

And there is another fairly new "CA" poster, whose name escapes me, who also seems to still have all their brain cells.

That makes three.

Wasn't it Reagan who said, "If you are a conservative in Hollywood, you have a one out of three chance of becoming President"?

I'll admit...
I wasn't a big fan of going in to begin with as I thought we would be better served at the time putting more energy into Afghanistan and maybe ridding oursleves of the little spectacled one in N Korea or even Mr. Dinner Jacket, but now that we're there, I can't justify immediate withdrawal either. Now Mr. Krauthammer points out many of the successes achieved in Iraq, both militarily and politically. So if we handed over sovereignty and things are undeniably going better, why should it even be Obama's or McCain's decision to make? Someone recently point out the Chapman article I linked to below as I (and apparently many others as it has only 30 or so comments) had missed it when it was originally posted on TH. I think this makes sense. Why not let the Iraqis decide? How can we claim to have liberated Iraq and helped them establish a democracy and then not let them determine their own fate?


http://www.townhall.com/columnists/SteveChapman/2008/06/05/ whose_iraq_is_it,_anyway

Got to run, Hal
Seems my 11:31 left you speechless.

I've got to run - do the "capitalist" thing for a few hours - save up some extra dollars to pay for the tax increases Obama will enact if he wins.

Hey! That's another good reason to take my bet, Hal.

Since you're "cheap" and all - if your boy wins, at least you'd have a few extra bucks for your tax increase!

"LMAO" © 2008 Hal Donahue

The "Hammer" gives Johnny Mac ...
... some good advice, forgetting that Mac doesn't listen to anyone (as his record for sponsoring ill conceived legislation shows).

So fare he has agreed with Obama on global warming, and last night he sounded like he supports taking over the oil companies, so he can't be listening to rational political advisers.

I just keep repeating, "I'm not voting for McCain, I'm voting against Obama! I'm not voting for McCain, I'm voting against Obama! I'm not voting for McCain, I'm voting against Obama! I'm not voting for McCain, I'm voting against Obama!"

Hey Primus, didn't you hear??????
Thought you might appreciated this little known bit of knowledge. Many
of you will recall that on July 8, 1947, almost exactly 60 years ago,
witnesses claim that an unidentified flying object (UFO) with five
aliens aboard, crashed onto a sheep and cattle ranch just outside
Roswell, New Mexico .

This is a well-known incident that many say has long been covered up
By the U.S. Air Force and other federal Agencies and organizations.

However, what you may NOT know, is that in the month of March 1948,
(nine months after that historic day), the following people were born:

Albert A. Gore, Jr.
Hillary Rodham
John F. Kerry
William J. Clinton
Howard Dean
Nancy Pelosi
Dianne Feinstein
Charles E. Schumer
Barbara Boxer

See what happens when aliens breed with sheep?

Don't forget tomorrow is FLAG day. Lets have a contest tween the left & RIGHTS to see who can fly the most flags.

With her own hands
Michelle Obama is probably sewing a surrender flag as we speak.

-Ray
NRA Life Member

SSGT
So you support the troops by driving your pickup truck 90 miles an hour at pedestrians?

Was your pickup truck made in America too?

Our troops are over there dying so you can waste gas by being an idiot. Nice!!!

Seems like the more logical thing to do would be to support politicians who support the troops instead of ones who merely support them with a stupid magnetic sticker and send them off to a war run by war profiteers.

"The negligence of former Halliburton subsidiary KBR lead to the death of Staff Sergeant Ryan Maseth. He stepped in the shower and died by electrocution. He’s one among a dozen who died this way.
KBR had been given 3 million dollars to fix the problem with the water pump. The pump was a substandard product from China, but KBR knew about problem and did not fix it."

Yes, that's A DOZEN troops that you claim to support getting electrocuted due to KBRs negligence.

Typical crap from a Republican Chickenhawk

Krauthammer -- an idiot to the last
Maliki has control over Sunnis militias?

Maliki was able to execute a military operation in Basra? (The U.S. had to bail him out.)

These legislative innitiatives, like lulls in the violence, occure every 6 months or so. They never get implimented.

I can understand the Krauthammer's ego won't aloow him to acknowledge he doesn't know what he's talking about.

But the least he could is to quite embarrassing himself on a weekly basis.

Lawrence Korb, Assistant Secretary of Defense for Ronald Reagan, has the true conservative analysis on this debacle at "The American Conservative."

http://www.amconmag.com/2008/2008_05_19/article3.html

When the Republican hacks are ready to kick the neocons out of the Republican Party, the Party can return to winning elections.


Black dogg, NYC dogg, whatever
"I expect middle class tax cuts - and the death of the Bush tax cuts - which means the rich will have to pay more."

So the people who have the capital to open more businesses and therefore create more jobs should have their profits taken from them, is that idea?

Excuse me, but if people are not allowed to keep what they make, then why should they work at all?

If their money is stolen from them, who will create the new jobs? How will America grow if her revenue is cut off?

Oh! I see. That IS the plan.

How despicable.

Geminiguy
I think you are projecting. It seems that it is the Republicans who have sex with animals:

"Neal Horsley is a political figure of the far right, and the author of a website devoted to his advocacy of militant pro-life, secessionist, and anti-gay views. He has called for the arrest of all homosexuals. He admitted on the Fox News Radio's The Alan Colmes Show, that he's had sex with mules. He put photographs on his Web site of naked men engaging in homosexual acts and a nude woman engaging in bestiality amid shots of grotesquely maimed fetuses. Drug dealer convicted of possession of hashish with intent to sell. He calls for "the establishment of a new government, one that can obey God's plan for government."

Geminiguy
I think you are projecting. It appears that it is the Repubs who have sex with animals:

Neal Horsley is a political figure of the far right, and the author of a website devoted to his advocacy of militant pro-life, secessionist, and anti-gay views. He has called for the arrest of all homosexuals. He admitted on the Fox News Radio's The Alan Colmes Show, that he's had sex with mules. He put photographs on his Web site of naked men engaging in homosexual acts and a nude woman engaging in bestiality amid shots of grotesquely maimed fetuses. Drug dealer convicted of possession of hashish with intent to sell. He calls for "the establishment of a new government, one that can obey God's plan for government."

John
I don't think Iraq is wheelchair friendly.


Hal
1) Really you think the Iraqis will allow Al Q free rein or the Kurds?
Once they are able to mount a defense for themselves, no they won't. That's the point. leaving before they can would lead to just what I said.
2)We did not come to the Iraqis defense we invaded and occupied Iraq and Iraq Gov wants us out
30 people in the Iraqi parliament want us out. That's a lower percentage than we have in our own congress. And we certainly are helping Iraqi's defend themselves.
3)Safe Haven: You really think Iran will allow that?
Iran IS a safe haven. Where did Sadr go?

My fellow conservatives - re liberalism
Several years ago I received a list of things under the title "To Be a Liberal". It's an excerpt from a work entitled "A Philosophy for Liars and Lawyers", by Trey Garrison. I'll share some of them here.

To be a liberal:

- you have to believe that gender roles are artificial while being gay is natural.

- you have to believe that conservatives are racists but that blacks couldn't make it without you.

- you have to believe that standardized tests are racist but racial quotas and set-asides aren't.

- you have to believe that trial lawyers are selfless heroes and doctors are overpaid.

- you have to believe that businesses create oppression and governments create prosperity.

- you have to believe that guns in the hand of law-abiding Americans are more of a threat than nuclear weapons in the hands of the Red Chinese.

- you have to believe that self-esteem is more important than actually doing something to earn it.

- you have to believe that there was no art before federal funding.

I posted this list on John Hawkins' current thread earlier today. Just thought you might enjoy it (as long as you're not a lib, that is).

mdogg
Thanks for your response. A couple of comments/questions/issues:

1. "economic policies that strengthen the dollar"
Which ones has he proposed?

2. "respect for the American brand".
'Hammering canada and mexico' is a start I suppose. What is your evidence that such respect has gone away (or ever existed as you deem it?), and when did it go away?

3. "middle class tax cuts"
75% of the folks he wants to RAISE taxes on are small businessmen (who create jobs). People under that won't need tax cuts as they'll be on unemployment, I guess.

Finally: "be fair, it's up to congress"
Now you're right about that, and I applaud you. I have found that many of his supporters think he will do things that are not the purview of the president at all, but that of congress. He himself seems to slip up there from time to time (as in "I'll MAKE oil companies spend part of their profits on alternate energy...")
So you're way ahead of most of your compatriots there.

How Obama will save Iraq
Despite his recent statements in support of Israel, I fear that, when push comes to shove, Barack Obama will ‘turn a blind eye’ toward the fate of the Jewish State allowing America’s historical ally to ‘twist in the wind’; not because his middle name is Hussein, not because his Illinois church published anti-Semitic rants by Nation of Islam founder Louis Farrakhan, not because he told 60 Minutes that, as President he would negotiate unconditionally with Syria and Iran and not because of growing uncertainty about those advising the candidate on Israeli-Arab affairs. Barack Obama would acquiesce into abandoning Israel, because Iran and Syria will demand he do so, in exchange for Ahmadinejad and Assad agreeing to stay out of Iraq, in the aftermath of Obama’s immediate and unilateral withdrawal from Mesopotamia.
Regardless of what else might ‘change’ during his administration, Obama knows that, he will be considered a total disaster, if after his precipitous departure from Iraq; Iran, Syria and Al Qaeda overrun that country, execute all who fought for their freedom and turn that oil rich land into a launching pad for Islamic Fundamentalism and international terrorism. What price, would Obama be willing to pay, for the promise (by our enemies) to postpone outside interference in Iraq, once he fulfills his campaign promise of withdrawing American troops?
In order to satisfy his ‘Anti-War’ supporters but not ‘snatch defeat from the jaws of victory’, I’m afraid Obama would cut such a deal with Israel’s sworn enemies.
Obama mistakes ‘respect’ for ‘appeasement’ in a headlong rush to his ‘can‘t we all just get along’ world. Despite his lack of experience and Pollyannaish naiveté, America might survive Obama’s kumbaya presidency, but it could come at the expense of Israel’s existence.

retired geek- your "sand" post
(9:53am)

Priceless! Honestly, that's a keeper.

Along those lines, I heard someone comment today about hydrogen power (made from water). When it's fully developed, the enviro outcry will be that it wastes a precious resource for fuel.
I also enjoyed your energy vote post.
Dems vowed to bring oil prices down in 2006. I'm so glad they got in power, aren't you?
They will do whatver it takes to drive it up until after the election, you can be sure of that.

Charlie
Maybe he prefers mules (projecting it as a dem) over sheep. Even so, it's still sick/peverted. I think that I'll Google sick/perverted dumbacrats and see what comes up. Just out of curiosity mind you. Flying any flags in Tx tomorrow Charlie¿

It Ain't the War
I am NOT nearly as concerned about what Obama will do in Iraq, because it doesn'matter who is President, we are going to begin withdrawing our troops in an orderly fashion over the next 2-3 years. This has to happen because our military knows we can no longer suppoet the existing level of activity without totally destroying our future capacity to fight. Even McCain will follow the consultation of our military leaders. Also, the Iraqi government appears to be in a position to coperate with our orderly wihdrawl. And, the Iraqi govenment, Shia or Sunni will NOT bend to Iran regardless of the recent visits and joint discussions. Mahmoud Imanutjob is on a short leash and probably will be replaced within the next 2 years. We, nor our allies can stop heir acquisition of nukes, we can only hope they do not give themto terrorists, and it doesn't appear they will do that regardless of the nut job's oratory.

Don't fear Obma's position on this un-popular war. What we should fear is Obama's economic plans and far leftisit view of the role of an exceedingy strong central Government. His ideas, if implemented by a willing Dem controlled Congress, can damage this great republic more seriously than any terrorist attacks. We can recover from an enemy attack, we may not recover from an internally driven lurch to the left and abandonment of our free market economy. If we cannot stop an Obama Presidency (which I don't believe we can), we had better hope we have a Congress that can slow down or stop his plans to turn this country into a socialist state. Read his writings, listen to his speeches - his philosophy makes Europe loke like a model of capitalism and cponservative economic principles. HE IS A RADICAL LEFTIST, FOLKS, and our country will not easiy surrender to his socialist ideals, it will be a rough ride with no good ending.

destinybender
Your (1:05pm) post- brilliant.

I think you are exactly right. He will have to pay the devil in order to fulfill his promises.
Things will "look good" for a time, which is what dems care about.
Israel should be very afraid for our upcoming elections.

standhisground
Your (1:00pm) post- a good one. Thanks for the laugh. It's a really good list.

If I had a nickel
If I had a nickle for every time a conservative commentator said things were goig well in Iraq when things were generally a mess or when we had a momentary lull. I would be able to take advantage of those Bush tax cuts for the mega wealthy.

We hear a lot of talk about victory and defeat. I challenge the author or any of the posters to define victory without moving the goal post each day. Didn't learn in Vietnam that it is unwise to fight a war without a clear mission.

If things are going so well I guess it must be time for us to redeploy to the other front on this war on terror and capture Osama.

How close or far away from victory are we?


Christians
One of the saddest things, that one can experience is to find out, that you have been "Lied" to by your parents.The young people of America, are having to endure that harsh reality right now.GOD is is charge of this world and if Israel is to be "Harmed" it will be at his hand."US" read the Bible but we don't really believe in GOD.We are People who pretend to be "Holy", but live in a secular order.No one is going to do anything to Israel!Israel is a little country, that is in the hearts and minds of the world.In fact I would venture to say, that Israel is safer than America.Christians,we should stop telling that "LIE"!

Destiny
In case you haven't heard, Israel has nukes along with the best equipped and trained army in the Middle East - they can defend themselves.

Bush's policies have hurt Israel by turning Iraq into a Fundamentalist Muslim Theocracy.

Removing Saddam, who was secular, has emboldened Iran.

You write "Obama knows that, he will be considered a total disaster, if after his precipitous departure from Iraq; Iran, Syria and Al Qaeda overrun that country, execute all who fought for their freedom and turn that oil rich land into a launching pad for Islamic Fundamentalism and international terrorism"

What a bunch of nonsense. Iran, Syria and Al Qaeda would not be a threat if Saddam (as bad as he was) were still in power.


John
Good luck with your economic memories. Don't hand that in to the teacher or you'll get an "F".

The economy at the end of 2000 was reeling. The Clinton stock market crash had made five trillion dollars in American's assets evaporate. Recession was imminent had not Bush acted swiftly and decisively with the tax cuts. Many economists have credited him with staving off economic disaster.

Similarly, now is not the time to repeal the Bush tax cuts (i.e. massively raise taxes) because the economy is somewhat fragile and that could push it over the edge.

The Cardinal rule of economics is: tax increases always reduce economic activity.

John
The problem for Conservatives is that they have so few tools in their tool box. When times are good give a tax cut, when we are at war- give a tax cut, when the economy is doing badly give a tax cut.

The difference between Dems and Reps is that Dems are tax and spend. Reps are spend but don't tax, borrow from China.


thoughtfulman
The biggest lie every told was the Bush Inheritaed a Clinton recession.


The biggest truth the next president will inherit a recession because of the failed policies of the Bush administration.



ssgt and missing meds
almost every word you say about taxes is wrong or or misleading . where are your citations where can i find soutrces. shold i take your word for their accuracy? not unless you asssure me that you have taken your meds. wheres your co conspirator amme. she run out of meds. do you know how to say somwething without being crude. or did all those years( ?????) in the service brain damage you. we are not buck privates out here ssgt we can hear you although we might not want to without your playing soldier.

JMO51
...and some Democrat presidents trade nuclear secrets to China for campaign cash. Wonder what the president's name is...hint,nickname is BUBBA.

What a liar
This is what we have come to expect from Krauthammer:

On Fox News' Special Report, Charles Krauthammer claimed that Sen. Barack Obama's policy regarding Iran's purported nuclear weapons program "takes all aggression, all threats, everything serious off the table in advance." But in an interview with The New York Times that formed the basis for an article Krauthammer cited, Obama did not take military action against Iran "off the table." When asked whether he would "retain a military option for striking Iran's nuclear facilities," Obama said, "I don't think the president of the United States takes military options off the table, but I think that we obviously have to measure costs and benefits in all the decisions that we make"

Gee, doesn't sound like a plan for defeat to me. Charles Krauthammer is just a liar and Fox News Stooge plain and simple.

Nothing But The Facts
Obama is capitalizing upon the idea that Americans do not believe it is worth the cost to stay in Iraq. To argue that it is to maintain a balance of power which we, ourselves disrupted, is a tough argument to make. There is not enough distance between McCain and Bush for voters not to associate McCain with our invasion of Iraq. Most Americans believe that Iraq is delighted to receive our money and support indefinitely. McCain needs to propose some viable controls as well as reasons for our occupation in Iraq.

Charles
"In case you haven't heard, Israel has nukes along with the best equipped and trained army in the Middle East - they can defend themselves."

Agreed, so why don't we let them?

"Bush's policies have hurt Israel by turning Iraq into a Fundamentalist Muslim Theocracy."

This is completely false. Iraq holds regular elections now. Fundamentalist Islamic Theocracies don't do this. This is an intellectually dishonest thing to say, and nothing but a partisan spin, and you know it.
Also, Iraq has nothing to do with Palestinians firing rockets into civilian cities.

"What a bunch of nonsense. Iran, Syria and Al Qaeda would not be a threat if Saddam (as bad as he was) were still in power."

They still aren't a threat, I mean according to liberals, right? I mean why even discuss Iran? They don't pose an immediate threat to the USA, right? Or do you now see Iran as a threat because it supports your argument?

I will agree that we shouldn't have invaded Iraq when we did and how we did it. But to say that Saddam was "protecting" us from Iran and Syria is foolish.


john
Spoken like a true communist...

Also, you obviously have no idea what the stock market is and how it relates to anything.

Here's some advice:
It is better to remain silent and have everyone think you're an idiot, than to open your mouth and remove all doubt...

Put up or shut up scorpio
Don't just attack people and not offer evidence for your assertions. Many people feel the way the writer does regarding working people and the stock market.Warren Buffet likens it to a beggar sitting down at a poker table with a millionaire (the rich guy will just "buy" the game). If you have an opinion great,but back it up or be an idiot - no doubt.

Hank
How many elections have they held in Iraq? Every election they have produces another leader we don't like. Theocracies DO have elections - look at Israel.

I will agree that Syria and Iran are not an immediate threat to the US, but Saddam kept their power in check in the region.

MRCMRC
NRO
NRO
NRO

What about NRO did you MISS MORON!!!!!!!
How about Bman's also!!!!!!!!! Are you completely IGNORANT??????????

Blanco
What wasn't I clear in explaining? My post to Charles dealt with each of his statements.

"Many people feel the way the writer does regarding working people and the stock market."

Exactly, they "feel" things, and just because they "feel" things, doesn't make them right. For example, people are blaming the oil companies for gas prices because it "feels" good to blame large faceless corporations. They "feel" that a windfall tax would not only save them, but "strike a blow for the common man". What nonsense.

Oil companies are publicly held, right? Did you know that the vast majority of stockholders are the middle class? The Working man that you and john seem to champion? So who do you think that "feel good windfall tax" would really be hurting??

Here's some advice for you too:
Remove head from buttocks BEFORE posting.

and another thing MRCMRC
I am like this because you leftist turd come here with your lying fingertips spewing your BS for all to see.
Oh, I'm sorry, MRCMRC, if you want me to play little nicey boy for ya, QUIT LYING YOUR AZZZ OFF TO ME!!!!!!!!

Boy this is Surge Success!!!!!!
And this is from Fox News Online !!!

"BAGHDAD — Iraq's prime minister said Friday that talks with the U.S. on proposals for a long-term security pact have reached an impasse over objections that Iraq's sovereignty is at stake, but held out hope that negotiators could still reach a compromise plan.

In his strongest comments yet on the debate, Nouri al-Maliki echoed concern by Iraqi lawmakers that the U.S. proposals would give Washington too much political and military leverage on Iraqi affairs.

"The first drafts presented left us at a dead end and deadlock," he told reporters in Amman, Jordan. "So, we left these first drafts and the negotiations will continue with new ideas until the sides reach a formula that preserves Iraq's sovereignty."

The security agreement would provide a legal basis for the presence of U.S. forces in Iraq after the U.N. mandate expires at the end of this year. Failure to strike a deal would leave the future of the American military presence here to the next administration.

U.S. negotiators offered new proposals this week after Iraqi lawmakers expressed outrage over the direction of the negotiations, claiming that accepting the U.S. position would cement American military, political and economic domination of this country"

Bush has no intention of turning power over to the supposed Iraqi government. Again, Bush, Krauthammer and others of their ilk are LIARS



Oh, and one last thing MRCMRC
AMME is ANNE I assume. What the military taught me was how to use bambi. Do you know who bambi is? Bambi is my K-bar! Twinky is another friend of mine. I'll tell ya about twinky some other time!

Charles
"How many elections have they held in Iraq? Every election they have produces another leader we don't like."

How many do they have to have to qualify in your mind? Also, your buddy Blanco screeched at me to provide evidence, I'll ask you to provide some to back up your claim that everyone they elect we don't like. Deal?

Saddam kept their power in check? How exactly did he do that? Was it by feeding Iraqis into a shredder?

I think we agree that Iraq was not a good idea, and it was run by that a-hole Rumsfeld very poorly.

You're right theocracies DO have elections, just not Fundamental Islamic ones like you said in your earlier post. Let's stay on track here, ok?

Charles
Also, Israel is NOT a theocracy, it is run by a Prime Minister, NOT a rabbi....

"Bush has no intention of turning power over to the supposed Iraqi government. Again, Bush, Krauthammer and others of their ilk are LIARS"

You're foaming at the mouth, perhaps you should take a break, walk away from your computer for a while. Go grab a smoke or a beer or something. You're gonna stroke out if you continue with this rabid nonsense...

You're dreaming
"John McCain must seize the opportunity and, contrary to conventional wisdom, make the Iraq War the central winning plank of his campaign."

It won't happen. Why? Because John McCain is no leader. He continues to regurgitate liberal platitudes on everything from free speech to global warming. It doesn't matter what the fact are.

Bacack Obama will win the White House because the GOP long ago lost their ba--s.

OPEN UP ANWAR TO DRILLING
ATTN: All conservatives ...send an email to President@whitehouse.gov and ask him to open up Anwar by Executive Order ...this would drop the price of oil by $30/40 a barrel as speculators would bail out ...neither McCain or Obama will open Anwar so this might be Bush's last chance to show some leadership and regain the respect of the American people .....COLOSSUS

To MRCMRC
You know, your posts might possibly be interesting if I could just decipher all the misspelled words, absent punctuation and sentence runons. Good grief, Charlie Brown, didn't you ever study in your English class?

baseballdoc
right on!
I'm sending mine now!
thanks


See MRCMRC, up front, honest and to the point. See how nice I was. : - )

baseballdoc
Drilling in ANWAR would do nothing to the price of oil. That oil would just be sold on the open world market just like all of the other oil is and the Saudis would just cut production to adjust. Drilling there is about the stupidest idea since, well, invading Iraq.

I recall gasoline was about $1.75 before Bush took office.

Let's see, if Colonel Sanders were elected President and the price of chicken quadrupled, I would have some serious questions.

And the lies just keep piling up
WASHINGTON — As Congress has debated energy policy over the past several days, an unusual argument keeps surfacing in support of drilling off the U.S. coastline and in Alaska's Arctic National Wildlife Refuge.

Why, ask some Republicans, should the United States be thwarted from drilling in its own territory when just 50 miles off the Florida coastline the Chinese government is drilling for oil under Cuban leases?

Yet no one can prove that the Chinese are drilling anywhere off Cuba's shoreline. The China-Cuba connection is "akin to urban legend," said Sen. Mel Martinez, a Republican from Florida who opposes drilling off the coast of his state but who backs exploration in ANWR.

"China is not drilling in Cuba's Gulf of Mexico waters, period," said Jorge Pinon, an energy fellow with the Center for Hemispheric Policy at the University of Miami and an expert in oil exploration in the Gulf of Mexico. Martinez cited Pinon's research when he took to the Senate floor Wednesday to set the record straight.

Even so, the Chinese-drilling-in-Cuba legend has gained momentum and has been swept up in Republican arguments to open up more U.S. territory to domestic production.

Vice President Dick Cheney, in a speech Wednesday to the U.S. Chamber of Commerce, picked up the refrain. Cheney quoted a column by George Will, who wrote last week that "drilling is under way 60 miles off Florida. The drilling is being done by China, in cooperation with Cuba, which is drilling closer to South Florida than U.S. companies are."

You see, if you have to lie to make your point, maybe your point is complete BS.

Dumb John
I thought I had finally read the dumbest post I ever stumbled upon, that 1:51pm post from JOHN. But, then I looked at some of his other posts, they were even more ridiculous. As a retiree who depends upon my savings and investments for my very livlihood, I resent JOHN's ignorant comments that only the rich benefit from the stock market. Since ol'JOHN has evidently NEVER WORKED IN HIS LIFE and has never invested in an IRA or a 401K, he probably doesn't understand the theory of balanced portfolio investments or the laws of compound interest and historical equity returns. I worked my entire life from age 12 to well beyond my minimum retirement age. I followed a rather conservative investment philosophy throughout my "hard-working" life so I would not be a burden to my family in my old age. I have no idea who will take care of ol'JOHN in his old age, but I expect he is looking for the government to give him all of the "free stuff" he seeks. He will support Obama because he thinks that Obama and his ilk will take care of ol'JOHN by transferring those rich people's ill gotten gains to him.

JOHN: You and you kind first anger me, but then I fell sorry for you. Your obvious lack of education and naive acceptance of that left wing hogwash makes me sad. Your life will continue to be a life of frustration and resultant hate for the "better-off" because you fail to strive to better yourself and obviously blame others for your failings. I am also sad for the relatives who will need to take care of you in your old age, the government ain't going to do it because they don't give a damn about you; even Obama doesn't really care, he only wants your vote. And, I fear Obama because he may very well seriously damage our economy and, therefore, probably wipeout many hard-working people's savings! Of course, parasites from JOHN have little at risk.

ApolloSpeak
Did you slip out of the "Psyche" unit at the VA, again?No one in America is so "Stupid" as to believe the scenario you have put forth.Unless you are one of those "Murdering" private contractors trying to get another job.The world wants "Peace" and we are going to give it to them.There is a need for a "New World Order" and war is not in their "Tool Box".If you want to support America,support the young who have died for someone's "Blunder".Fighting Iran would be a Bigger Blunder and the world will not stand for it.VOTE OBAMA!!!!

I have joined...
...baseballdoc and SSGT in e-mailing the White House to urge action on opening ANWR and the outer continental shelf to oil production.

I call on all conversvative TH posters to take a few minute to do the same.

...and if you haven't signed Gingrich's petition to do the same, as I have, I urge you to do that also....(www.americansolutions.com).

By the way, you go SSGT...I don't think that Charles guy would want to go hand-to-hand with you.

Death to the terrorists!

Your Most Humble and Obedient, etc.

George Washington

War on terror policy...
...in fifty words or less.

...simplified specifically for killer, Charles, MRCMRC, et al.

1. No murdering Americans.
2. No solicitation of the murder of Americans.
3. No aiding or abetting, or harboring of persons engaging in 1 or 2 above.

Violation of 1,2,or 3 above will most assuredly and promply cause fire to descend upon you from the sky.

Kindly govern your actions accordingly.


Your Most Humble, etc.,

George Washington

tsk tsk
tsk tsk i keeep reminding you about what would happen if you missed your meds for more than one day, and now you see the results. you are starting to get confused about the nature of reality. please take them as soon as possible, bbefore you not only start calling the typewriter space bar the name of a popular hildrens book by felix salten but soon youll start acting toward then as if thy really were that thing. by the way i know what a space bar is, i choose not to use it, how about that. you choose to grunt and curse and be vile. i choose to not use the space bar. which is the .worse., you still havent sent me the =citattions for the tax figures you tried to slip by us. please do if you can.
meanwhile hold on as tight to rality as you ccan until you can get at your meds

MRCMRC...
...you might want to pick on somebody your own size. While I don't know SSGT personally, my guess is you should be glad you are insulting him over then Internet and not in person.

Tomorrow is Flag Day, by the way, and there are a number of veterans, and non-veterans as well, on this website, who frankly don't appreciate your anti-military insults.

You may not have the humility to appreciate much about your country, but the fact is that your right to sign on to this website and spout your nonsense comes to you courtesy of the sacrifices of the brave men and women of the United States armed forces.

Your Most Humble and Obedient Servant,

George Washington


Slick Charlie
Obama's Plan For Defeat?
Wow, what a clever talking point. Here is a good idea; lose the catchy phrases and take your opponent seriously. In case you haven't noticed, spinning to win is not in. We are getting our brains beat out this coming election. All these failed policies were preceded by catchy, think-tank spin doctors like slick Charlie. Nobody is buying it anymore.
And another thing, your talking points are lame. Voters have lost their buying power, good jobs are hard to find and wages are stagnant. We could be dancing in Al Qaeda's streets and Americans would still want to know how they have benefited? If we want to take on liberals, let voters know how occupying Iraq enriches their lives. And it is not by keeping us safe. That talking point is overripe as well.