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Wednesday, August 08, 2007
Brent Bozell :: Townhall.com Columnist
Humanizing Hillary, Canonizing Chelsea
by Brent Bozell
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Here's one sign that Hillary Clinton is the Democratic presidential frontrunner. Reporters are tripping over themselves to convince us how likable and human she is -- strong and yet nurturing. It's the same playbook the media used for Al Gore and John Kerry, both just as stiff, robotic and unlikable then as Hillary is now. So they're portraying Hillary not only as strong and invincible, but also as warm as a down comforter and as sweet as Mrs. Butterworth.

The New York Times stands out as a primary transmission belt for the Clinton campaign's effort to melt the ice-queen image. On the July 29 front page, Times political writer Mark Leibovich lavished his awe on personal correspondence Hillary wrote as a Wellesley co-ed to her high school friend John Peavoy at Princeton. The headline was, "In the '60s, a Future Candidate Poured Her Heart Out in Letters."

Leibovich stressed how missives from this "unformed and vulnerable striver" were a revelation. Young Hillary was "by turns angst-ridden and prosaic, glib and brooding, anguished and ebullient," her letters a "rare unfiltered look" into her head and heart. But how do we know this correspondence is "unfiltered"? The letters are intact, but can we be sure they are the only letters Hillary sent to Peavoy? Did Hillary instruct Peavoy to share some, and not all? We don't know. Peavoy says he hasn't talked to Hillary for years, but the Clinton campaign declined comment when asked. That's its usual way of wiping away fingerprints.

As for "rare," The New York Times takes a while to admit the letters are actually nothing of the sort. As the Clintons always say, this is old news, if ever it was news. In paragraph 21, Leibovich acknowledges that Peavoy shared the letters with author Gail Sheehy, who quoted a number of the same passages in her 1999 biography, "Hillary's Choice." So these "rare" letters have been in the public domain for eight years now.

Included in that pile is the line that perfectly encapsulates Hillary's smug brand of nanny-statism. "Can you be a misanthrope and still love or enjoy some individuals. ... How about a compassionate misanthrope?" If the media loved Hillary less, those telltale words would ring through the campaign like George W. Bush's insulting "compassionate conservative" mantra in 2000.

But most of Leibovich's quotes from the Peavoy letters focused on her uncertainty about her destiny and her inspiring evolution away from her "rigid conservative" father to the (liberated) role of a "liberal antiwar activist." The letters show a young Hillary who "skates earnestly on the surface of life, raising more questions than answers."

So what was the political effect of this exercise? Liberals quickly promised to make their daughters read them. Joan Walsh of Salon.com said they were "intensely humanizing," a "net gain" for the Clinton camp.

Two days later, Hillary's enablers at the Times were back at the task. At the top of the front page was a story on "Chelsea Clinton, Primed for a Second Stint as First Daughter." In a big color photo, Chelsea stood between two Hillarys, a smiling real one and a regal official painting. Reporter Jodi Kantor played them as two clones of Mary Poppins, practically perfect in every way.

Both mother and daughter were favorably described by ever-present "friends" of Hillary: Like her mother, Chelsea has the habit of "pre-empting questions by asking lots of them," the "passionate interest" in health care and the tendency to sound scripted. Both mother and daughter have used White House contacts to build careers, but "won over skeptical colleagues with their diligence and enthusiasm." Even now, Kantor rhapsodized, Chelsea is still "playing a more glamorous version of her lifelong role: model daughter."

Kantor betrayed a Clinton lover's romance with the idea of a Clinton dynasty that passes from Bill, to Hillary, to even President Chelsea. The story ends with a friend hearing Chelsea speak and thinking she's "going to go all the way." If so, she sure can count on The New York Times to deliver a complimentary verbal gift basket.

Chelsea's "a focus of public fascination," but co-workers find she has a "deeply admirable ability to yield focus." We're told that "people seem delighted just to watch her lips move and hear sound emerge." As Kantor described her Jewish boyfriend, she identifies Chelsea as "a Christmas-cookie-baking, churchgoing Methodist."

At least Kantor makes it perfectly clear that her piece gibes with the Clinton campaign, "which seeks to portray Sen. Clinton as a strong yet nurturing force, a friend to women and children, and a symbol of progress from one generation to the next."

With their reliably progressive palette of one color -- whitewash -- The Times could be easily described as Hillary's official Portrait Partner.

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About The Author
Founder and President of the Media Research Center, Brent Bozell runs the largest media watchdog organization in America.
 
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©Creators Syndicate
Give it a rest
When you have something worth writing about, please
do so. There was not once ounce of substance to
this column.

so you don't like her. so what! She's still
going to win.

lemonade
There was plenty of substance in the column, but
considering your a liberal lackey(moron)standard,
--well we understand.
If there are enough morons like you, she might
win. Then we all lose.
Hillary is a mean vile "person" and the media should tell the truth about her.
But--getting the truth from the NYTs uh uh.

lemonade
you may be right but she will still be one of the most mean spirited,supercilious and arrogant bitches on the planet! Her only agenda is and always has been to turn turn things to her own ends and she is willing to do or say anything to achieve that goal. If you think she's compassionate and caring you are in for a very rude awakening.

Hillary Is America's Nightmare
What can you say about a woman who resolutely stands by her man even though he has betrayed her multiple times and perhaps is even a rapist? A deluded, loyal, loving wife or perhaps a fanatical power-mad politician who will do anything to become president? Based on this resume, can Americans really expect an ethical, honorable presidential term from another dysfunctional, dishonest Clinton? Dream on, you Clinton toadies, this is a real-time nightmare right in front of us now!

Jerseyvet is right
BUSH, CLINTON,CLINTON,BUSH,BUSH, America is not a monarchy NO POLITICAL DYNASTIES!!!

How wonderful to read
another article that reveals the slickness of the Clinton machine. Slickness, machine, slickness, machine,slickness, machine

Save the sanctamonious crap for Oprah
Hillary married Bill as a vehicle to political power.

Hillary is a socialist (Communist)therefore she doesn't believe in god.

Hillary will make our business as her business as President.

Please someone hand me a tissue. This woman is so stone-cold she can singlehandedly re-freeze the North & South Pole.

Hillary
Hillary sucks anyway... We don't need anymore Dem's in the White House. I look at the Democrats and Liberals and see nothing more than more enemies of America. These Democrats care nothing for our country, just their stupid agendas. And who really gives a crap about Chelsea??? HUH???

missus clinton
in spite of tghe love affair those on the left have with this robot they cannot maske her human. If she had the slightest degreee of warmth and personality there were be no need for the continued flow of puff pieces hailing her as warm and cuddley. Those on the left refuse to believe any stories of her quest for power at all costs, her treatment of those who disagree or betray her or who she sees as enemies. Her wacko statedments how we sdhould sacrifice for the common good and that we shouldn't mind paying extra taxes to help all those who have decided life is better living off the govt than taking care of oneself. SDhe claims she would like to take the profits from companies to enact new policies. The left hates bush mored than the like missus clinton. The left still loves bubba and know that electing missus clinton will return bubba to the presidentcy. They however will not see that dream occur. the missus clinton will self destruct once her past catches up with her

No one attacks because she's
a woman. People can't stand Hillary because she is a clinger, and a climber, and most of all, a LIAR.

Hillary will say ANYTHING to get elected, and if you believed anything she said to get there, you're a fool.

I would much prefer to vote for someone who disagrees honestly with me, than for someone who dishonestly agrees with everything I say. Hillary is the latter, as was her husband.

She most definitely is a Socialist, and she has proved that, at the first opportunity in the White House - when she wasn't even elected. PLEASE, go back and research her plans and actions from when she first laid her hands on power.

Then, see if you still want her to be POTUS. Note what she DOES, NOT what she SAYS. They are two completely different things.

Warren Small
Brent Bozell is probably the most well-known media critic in America. The fact that you don't know who he is isn't really surprising - you're a liberal Democrat! To be thoroughly uninformed is consistent with left-wing political views.

Brent's columns and commentary are always about the media's coverage of a given issue, candidate, or story. Therefore, this column is perfectly in keeping with Brent's insightful ability to point out the embarassing bias in the media. You see nothing wrong with reporters slavishly praising people they like, without an ounce of criticism or even one hard question? Yet, those same reporters would attack and vilify President Bush or another conservative Republican, and you'd see nothing wrong with that either. Are you that dull, to believe that the media's job is to promote liberalism and bash conservatism, and somehow call that 'news'?

It's childish of you to call him "bozo", but again, that's liberalism on parade. Given that your name is "Small" it's difficult for me to avoid making a comment about your name, because your entire post was exactly that - small.

Nurturing?
I'm no rabid republican fanboy, but Hillary Clinton is about as warm and nurturing as a tiger tank rolling through the Ardenne Forest in winter '44.

My vote is up for grabs, but if the Democrats put up Hillary I'll vote for any Republican that is above room temperature, just to beat her. Who'm I kidding, they could even be room temperature.

My ancestors escaped Europe to avoid this Royal family BS. Who do they think we are, French?

No more Clinton
No more Bush
No more Kennedy
No more Gore

Another
pathetic article, just another right-wing hitjob on Hilary. People who come here (the few) come here when the National Enquirer website is down. Hate-filled rants like this are common on the websites like this one, that get very little traffic. What traffic they do get is from small-minded bigots and ignorant people who are simply unamerican in their views and their extremeness - people who support Tancredo and Rudy and the like.
So carry on with your hate, bitterness, and constant whining and moaning and foaming at the mouth. It's really quite hilarious at times.
Btw, wipe that drool off of your chins, folks. You're screeching hate-filled rants at Hilary only make America like her more.
Thanks
-
Peace my naive little foolish right wing buddies. I love you all, just as Allah asked us to! Allah Bless!

Big Black Dog
Ok, ok. You've convinced me. Hillary dined with dignitaries. Wow. She sat down and ate with them. That sure constitutes amazing foreign policy credentials.

I'm not sure why you liberals can't seem to express yourselves without calling people names like 'moron', but I guess it says a lot about the lack of substance in your arguments, to say nothing of the lack of maturity in your character.

As to her other 'accomplishments'....please. What a laugh. Heading up a left-wing organization like the CDF is a credential? What, exactly, has she done as Senator? That's right - nothing. Her only real accomplishment (if you can call it an accomplishment) is being married to a former President - without that, she'd be unknown and relatively powerless.

She has stayed with Bill for purely political reasons - in fact, every word she writes or utters is calculated for maximum political advantage - just like her impeached, disbarred, philandering husband.

Yankee
I know this is a little deep for you, being as you are a liberal. But the column isn't about Hillary or Chelsea. It's about media coverage.

Why are you liberals so dull?

Te OpEd Wasn't About Hillary,
but it was about the MSM and thier fawning sycophant reporting. You libs need to at least read the OpEd. Bozell's point is that the NYTs -the paper of record- is giving Hillary hundreds of thousands or maybe even millions of dollars in free campagin press. This feature story is the is equal to a 4 page campagin spread -which is worth about $1-2 million dollars. Not one negative thing written about her and her family. Not a peep about Cattle Futures, WH Travel Office, missing billing records, Web Hubbel, Hillary Care, or her bizzare comments about the Right Wing Conspiracy. Contrast this with another New York Mag's (Vanity Fair) attack on Guilliani's wife.


Pandm Radlad Omni etc
WHO IS CALLING WHOM NAMES!!! a liberal lackey(moron) - that's for me.

The rest of the statements are for Hillary:

"one of the most mean spirited,supercilious and arrogant bitches on the planet"

"she is willing to do or say anything to achieve that goal"

"Personally I don't believe she can handle excrement."

"Hillary married Bill as a vehicle to political power...Hillary is a socialist (Communist)therefore she doesn't believe in god."

No need to go on. You get the picture. All these definitions (most are outright lies) written by sweet little old ladies during a Sunday School picnic. Who is calling the kettle
black here?

CARE TO BACK ANY OF THESE STATEMENTS UP WITH FACTS, FOLKS. And quoting Rush Limbaugh does
not count.

A previous poster answered the statement
brilliantly about her skills and experience, and
also about standing by her man. (Big
Black Dog, you are a breath of very fresh air
around here).

I have a suggestion. Read the books that Hillary
wrote (at which time you will discover among
other things that Village does not Equal Government), and then read a book about her that
is not driven by right-wing idealogues with a huge agenda.

And then see if you can write those same words
about her. I am not expecting you to change your
ideology, but I would hope that you would be a
little more careful about the language you use
when you speak of other people's character and
abilities.

B




UGH!
It’s bad enough that Hitlery gets constant, fawning, coverage in The MSM. Now, they are going to start shoving her Buck-Toothed, Horse-Faced, Spoiled Brat of a Daughter down America’s Throat!

annfan
"Why are you liberals so dull?"

Why are you so vicious. Have you never found
another way to express yourself?

Georgetwin
"UGH! Now, they are going to start shoving her Buck-Toothed, Horse-Faced, Spoiled Brat of a Daughter down America’s Throat!"

Why are you so vicious. Have you never found another way to express yourself?

and...
where or where are any of the pictures of Chelsea that the British tabloids captured during her stay in their country?

And...no mention of her spouse's ability to "use the pole" as our yet-to-be-announced Republican candidate's wife was disgustingly compared to.

Oops, I forgot, RULE #1 - the msm will only show/report negative stories of wives/children of Republicans! RULE #2, see Rule #1

JPK
Oh, no. The world is coming to an end. A newspaper wrote a complimentary column about Hillary. That mean, evil, award-winning newspaper.
How could they.

What does that make Fox News, Rush Limbaugh, and
TownHall. Candidates for newspaper Sainthood?

lemonade
which books are yoiu referring to. The ones that have her listed as author but were in fact written by others. Or are these other books she has personally written. It takes a village to groom the image of this wannabe. The msm media continues to print puff pieces in a vain attempt to prove she is something she is not. There is the possibility she is not the witch portrayed by the right, that however is very remote. But even more ridiculous is that she is truly warm and fuzzy. Even bubba couldn't stand spending personal time with her as his philandering proved. However all agree she is driven to achieve power and that does demand close inspection of her statements and what she envisions for america's future. Why should anyone believe her vision is what is best for america when she comes closer to being nothing more than a socialist eager to change the fabric of our nation

georgetwin
you are not kind. Chelsea got her position at a company run by clinton's supporters the same way mommy got to be senator. Neither had any proven creds but they were related by marriage and birth to bubba. Without bubba the missus would be no more than an anonymous backroom operative and the daughter wouldn't be making a 6 figure income from the day she was hired. Buit I thought those hedge funds were evil money making tools of rich repubs. I guess the daughter has to hold her nose while working for the enemy

big black dog
you can paint as much lipstick on this pig as you want but she is still a pig. Defending a flimsy resume that was earned only because she was married to a govenor and later was first lady and then elected senator against weak opponents in a heavily dimocrat voting state really took a lot of work. Glomming on to children as her main issue is particularly galling as she became a supposed advocate but accomplished nothing. She was going to improve the quality of education in arkansas but achieved that by lowering the standards for teachers in a vain attempt to show arkansas schools were being run by quality educators. She wants to take credit for the supposed accomplishments that occurred under bubba's presidentcy but at the same time deny she had any knowledge of his mis-deeds. But then again as you are a member of one of the dims favorite victim groups, and are used to all the govt assistance programs you probably welcome the coming socialism that missus clinton promises to promote. Keep telling yourself she is warm and fuzzy, but don't forget she tosses everyone aside once they are no longer useful to her push for power

big black dog
what's youir point. That still is nothing more than the resume for getting into a law firm. Her lack of personality would have been the death knell without assiciation with bubba

U.S.S.N.A. is not a Joke
Hillary says the is a Progressive, but in reality she is Socialist, Liberal, Communist, Fascist, and Marxist supporter. The U.S.A. will become the U.S.S.N.A. (United Socialist States of North America) with Hillary or any Demonrat in office.
Hillary made $100,000 with only $1,000.00 investment with a stock broker and no paper trail within a very short time period. This is impossible. This was a Political Payoff Period. Hillary destroyed innocent hard working people of the Travel Office for no reason other then she wanted her people(Democrats)in these positions. These two incidents that are undeniable alone provide enough reasons that Hillary should be ran out of Public Office for good. What about the Secret files that was found in Hillary's Office, and the Demonrats are screaming about the Patriot Act giving the President to much power. I could go on and on and on. When will Democrats become honorable, loyal, ethical, morale, and dependable. By the rate of decline over the last 30 years, my guess would be never.

big black dog
get your facts straight. Betsy wright was a clinton operative. Rudy dropped out of the senate race for medical reasons. Pirro was a very weak candidate. Missus clinton was going to get re-elected and the repubs had to find anyone they could just to fit a space on the ticket. So your her rabid supporter. That's your option but then she always had your vote just like the dims can always count on your support. Should she get elected, the rest of us will be anxious to hear you sing her praises when your tax bill skyrockets and her govt programs remove free choice. Buit then again you may be a low wage earner who doesn't pay taxes but still sits at the public trough taking benefits that you can't earn.

Lemonade
Why are you so dim? Do you ever write anything different? If you don't like what you read on TownHall, go back to DailyCommunist/CommunistUnderGround/PeterPuffington or any other Hate America website!

WildWest
Sorry if I offended you. Usually, if someone/anyone is touting a child THAT MUCH, they either are a Dim Bulb or were helped by Mommy & Mommy...(oops!) Daddy ;).

To wildwest
So Senator Clinton would still be at home baking cookies if not for her connections via Bill? And I heard on TV the other day that Rush Limbaugh said that Condoleeza Rice is an affirmative action appointee.

Let me guess: if a woman where you work gets a promotion, you start a rumor that she got it by sleeping with the boss?

The male factor
Mrs Bill Clinton's main problem, aside from the fact that she has very little in the way of credentials to hold the office of President, is that she reminds most men of their ex wives or their worst blind date. Run, Hillary,Run! It would be sweet to see her lose all 50 states in the "08 election.

Comrade Rodhamova Klintonskaya

"...warm as a down comforter, sweet as Mrs, Butterworth....nurturing"? That just goes to show the utter contempt the New York Times and other MSM have for the citizens of this country! In all likelyhood the aforementioned press organs consider those of us who are not liberal/socialists "the great unwashed."

Warren Small

I agree -- leave Chelsea alone, she can't help who her parents are, and, in any case, they are her Mom and Dad; she loves them and they love her.

To wildwest
Chelsea Clinton had no proven credentials for a job in economic consulting? Check Wikipedia for her bio. She got her undergraduate degree ("With Distinction") in International Relations from Stanford University in 2001. She then got a Master's degree in International Relations from Oxford University (note to wildwest: that's in England) and since then has worked for private firms consulting in the areas of international relations and economics.

BTW, somebody on this thread said that Chelsea Clinton is "a spoiled brat". That's interesting: how can you tell? She took advantage of a good education, got two degrees, is gainfully employed in her professional field, maintains an apartment in New York, serves responsibly on a couple of boards commensurate with her wealth and position, and dates members of the opposite sex. What else should a privileged young woman do?

While on the other hand, Bush's daughters have to be kept out of the public eye because they have been seen getting drunk in bars and sticking their tongues out at reporters. Very mature.

Warren Small

I agree -- leave Chelsea alone, she can't help who her parents are, and, in any case, they are her Mom and Dad; she loves them and they love her.

Big Black Dog and Lemonade

I think the anger you see here on this board and others that lean right is that republicans get held to a different standard. The point of this article is that Hillary and the democrats seem to get these glowing articles written about them without any of the hard questions being asked. Even the debates that are hosted by the MSM have a different tone for democrats than republicans.

I hear a lot from liberals about Fox News and its right lean, but I have never seen a good defense from liberals on the left lean of ABC, NBC, CBS, NYT, BBC, PBS, CNN. It exists as evidenced by the article in the NYT that is the focalpoint of this column.

Lemonade, I think you posted above that a quote from Rush doesn't count as a source...well, I could easily tell you that a quote from the NYT doesn't count as a source to prove the legitamacy of a democratic candidate for the same reason.

There is one difference though...Rush isn't anchoring the evening news or writing a front page news storie...the NYT is supposed to stand for news not opinion.

Wildwest
"which books are yoiu referring to."

Well, for starts I would suggest "It Takes A Village." That is, if you still believe like most right-wingers and others who haven't read the book that she equates Village with the Government. She does not.

Second: "Living History" her autobiography. Until I read that book, I was planning to support Obama in the primaries. I have also read his two books and one other one about him. And I admire him greatly.

But after reading Hillary's book, I knew she had what it takes to be great. So will Obama some day, but he needs to earn his stripes first. Anyone who believes Hillary hasn't earned hers legitimately is one of the dumber people in this world or is one who spends all his time listening to liars.

The third book I would suggest is Carl Bernstein's "A Woman in Charge." As far as I can
tell, this is no fan letter to Hillary. It is
an honest appraisal of her, warts and all.

You cannot and will not assume that Hillary is
not a devoted mother, that Hillary has never
loved that rascal Bill, that she has stayed with
him for political reasons, that she married Bill
to reach her own political objectives, that she
was instrumental in Foster's demise, that she
manipulated the outcome of Whitewater, etc. etc.
if you have one brain cell that remains open to
the truth rather than hearsay.

Besides reading the books, why don't you look at
a few pictures. They say so much. When she was
hurt and angry with Bill, you knew it. The pictures said all. But how many times have you
seen her with a tremendous whooping belly laugh.
I have seen it many times, and that says to me
that I would like her, being a belly laugher
myself.


Big Black Dog

Didn't Bill make the SAME vows to God? You know the ones: "forsaking all others...keep only unto her" -- never mind "comfort" and "honor."

Just wonering.

TYPO ALERT

...wondering.

big black dog
this is the land of opportunity. It is the dims who tell those on the dim plantation they cannot achieve without help from the govt. 11 trillion dollars (11,000,000,000,000.00) has been spent to fight the effects of poverty. At what point does society get a break from funding failed programs. If the dims cared about advancing people from poverty they wouldn't keep them locked into failed schools that don't prepare students to face a productive future, but then the dims are in bed with teachers unions and thus will not change that status quo

Georgetwin
"Why are you so dim? Do you ever write anything different? If you don't like what you read on TownHall, go back to DailyCommunist/CommunistUnderGround/PeterPuffington or any other Hate America website!"

At the risk of repeating myself - Why are you so vicious. Have you never found another way to express yourself?

I am here on Town Hall to give the other side of
the aisle point of view. A scarce commodity here.
I am not here because I want you to like me. In
fact, the idea is somewhat repulsive to me.

lilly
i don't require old hippie socialists like you to provide geography lessons. My point about the daughter was that she got her job through politcal connections. Perhaps she is qualified, that I didn't question.

lemonade
"You cannot and will not assume that Hillary is
not a devoted mother, that Hillary has never
loved that rascal Bill, that she has stayed with
him for political reasons, that she married Bill"

Why can you assume the positive but we cannot/will not assume the negative. There IS evidence to suggest that she stayed with Bill for purely political reasons?

You are reading HER books, or at the very least books that SHE would like you to read.

Per my prior post, read "Biased" by Bernard Goldberg...Also, since you are asking us to read about your candidate, maybe pick up a book written by/about one of the republican candidates that THEY would like you to read.

lilly 2
i have never stated anywhere that women are not capable of doing any job. History has shown that when the west incorporated women into the work force that was the spark that ignited the great economic engine. Any society that denies opportunities for woman loses 1/2 of that societies potential. For your information my wife has a PhD, the only drawback is the job reqires work weeks of of 50 plus hours. I always encouraged her to follow whatever career path and opportunity came her way. I don't know of any educated people who are threatened by someone's accomplishments. In fact conservs celebrate people who do accomplish things. Only shallow minded people feel threatened when people succeed

wildwest
"11 trillion dollars (11,000,000,000,000.00) has been spent to fight the effects of poverty. At what point does society get a break from funding failed programs."

That is a pretty broad statement! What is a
failed program? Feeding hungry kids a breakfast
at school. Is that a failed program if the same kids are hungry again the next morning? Providing housing so that they don't have to live on the streets? Drug programs? DCFS intervention in abusive situations?

What should we leave out here. Which kids shall
we throw away today? We, of course, have to make sure they are born, but then we have done our job
and they must fend for themselves, no matter how
appalling the situation.

Is there something in your hallowed Republican
agenda that is going to make a paradise here on
earth? If so, I have failed to see it. Every
man for himself is not a motto I wish either
myself or my country to adhere to. It sounds like a complete disaster to me. It sounds like
a bunch of me-first people wanting to wash their
hands of a group of other people who haven't
been as fortunate as they.

The Poor You Shall Always Have With You. Expect to be judged how you treat the poor.

And if you are going to give me the typical RWR response of how handouts don't work then you might share with us just one instance of how you
have made life better for a disadvantaged person
that wasn't wrenched out of your back pocket by
the government.

Repub/Con jealously of the Clintons..
I have said it before and will say it again.
Repub/Con hatred of the Clintons is grounded
in jealousy and envy.

Face it, the Clintons have fame, fortune, and political power. They are highly ambitious and
have had remarkable success reaching and accomplishing their goals.

If Hillary Clinton is elected President of the U.S. in 08 she will be making first time U.S. history by becoming the countries first female president and also the first husband and wife to occupy the office. She was also the first first lady to be elected to the Senate.

Is she ruthless? Yes. Can you tell me a politician that isnt? its part of the political game because politics isnt for softies or pushovers.

Lets get real..repubs/cons dispise the Clintons because they dont have anyone within their ranks
that come close to their political accomplishments. and thats what sticks in their craws..they would change places with them in new york minute.

One more thing on the Clintons
What you ask is their biggest talent of all?

They have an extraordinary talent for fighting back against repub/con intransigence:

kicking repub/cons arse and defeating them in the process..

a highly admirable trait.
and defeating

wildwest
"My point about the daughter was that she got her job through politcal connections. Perhaps she is qualified, that I didn't question."

Oh god no. My son got his job in his dad's place
of business because his dad is the owner of the
place. Shall I insist that he be fired? P.S. He
was top salesman last year.

P.S. What were these political connections, by
the way?

No exec. experience
Hillary has no executive, leadership exp. She hasn't even been pres. of a coll. frat. Her exp. as Bill's wife is all vicarious.

Her senate exp. is collegial, not exec.

She has NEVER had an open forum with the press. They've NEVER dared ask her real questions, but they will if she's elected. And I don't think she has the guts it takes to be pres. She hasn't had the guts to separate formally, certainly a more honest position, let alone divorce, Bill.

She already supports the "Fairness Doctrine" which is designed to attack cons. talk radio. She cannot stand any opposition, and she's going to have opposition.

If she were a man, she wouldn't get the "feminist Hillary,"Bill's poor wife Hillary," "focused and determined Hillary," or the "loving mom Hillary" that she and her handlers have constructed and enforce. She would at some point have to face the reality all other candidates confront.

And she has lied on record so often and so many times, it seems really anachronistic that Bill was elected because Bush I "lied" about taxes. As regards Chelsea, Hillary has written and spoken about how distressed Hillary was that Chelsea was directly under threat during 911. Chelsea has published her OWN story of being uptown in NYC and watching tv of the Twin Towers on 911.

Who is Hillary ever going to be able to do foreign policy business with--which is one of the pres.' prime functions--when the entire world knows nothing she ever says is factual?

JMind
Why indeed didn't I mention Goldberg's book? Well, let me see. I believe that when I first suggested the reading of some books to find out what Hillary was all about I said that the last place to go was to some right wing idealogue who had both a political agenda and a grudge.

Maybe that is why I didn't suggest Goldberg's book! Duh!

If Bernstein's book had either, I missed it.
He did not come off as a either a fan or a nay-sayer. He liked somethings; didn't like others. But what he did say in the end was that
absolutely she had earned her stripes and was
fully capable of being an effective President.

Suggesting reading Hillary's own books is a
perfectly reasonable suggestion. In fact, I can't imagine making pronouncements about somebody without first reading their books or papers.

Is Bernard Goldberg any relative of Jonah Goldberg? I read a column by Jonah in USA Today
yesterday that was all about Hillary and it was
absolutely clear that he had never read her
books. He did not have one clue about her
concept of a village or what her health care
program in the 1990's was all about. He said she
was calling for nationalization. What a joke.
What a jerk.

lemonade
the hedge fund that employed chelsea are supporters and contributors to missus clinton's campaigns. The war on overty should have improved things, they have made them worse. If these govt programs had been successful there would be fewewr people relying on govt aid in order to survive. Inner cities schools are a disaster, the drop out rates exceed 40%. Children born out of wedlock in some cities exceed 70%. Most of those living in poverty are mothers without husbands. Certainly some program could have been devised that help to strengthen family bonds and encouraged the family unit. Education should have been emphasized as a way to prepare for your future. But after 40 plus years the impoverished as still here with no end in sight. It is past time to scrap failed programs and try new approaches. Continued funding of failed programs is no answer. It is not a qyestion of lack of compassion, in fact it is more heartless to keep people locked into an endless cycle of poverty.

lemonade
Bernard Goldberg worked for CBS for 25 years and was a life-long democrat. He can hardly be called a right wing idealogue, however, you seem to be saying that he is an idealogue simply because someone on this blog suggested you read his book. What evidence do you have to suggest that he is even right wing, the fact that he happens to have witnessed first hand the left wing leaning of the media?

I have no idea whether he is related to Jonah Goldberg, but I can tell you that his book has nothing to do with any of the candidates, but simply exposes how the left wing biased in media works.

Lemonade
Why would you do something of your own free will that you find repulsive? If you don't care for my opinion, that is your privilege. Just like it is my privilege to have/voice my opinion!

left angle
The only people that i know who would envy the clintons is Bonnie & Clyde--they paid for their
crimes. And the clinton GANG got off free.

Georgetwin
Everyone has the right to their own opinion.
And I guess everyone has a right to state their
own opinion in the most obnoxious way possible.

But that obnoxious way says a whole lot more about you than it does about the one you are trying to denigrate.

Maybe you should keep that in mind, if you should
ever attempt to change someone's mind to your side.
Of course, on Town Hall approximately 95% of the
people are with you already. You don't need to
convince them. You only excite them to get as nasty as you are being.

Well, go ahead. As I said before, I am not looking for your approval. I am only giving my
side of the political opinions here.

I remember

...the the awful way Hillary treated her Secret Service detail when she was FLOTUS(not allowed to come within so many feet of her, referred to in a derogatory manner, etc. etc. etc.) -- I wonder if her attitude has mellowed somewhat over the intervening years, after all, these people have to "take the bullet" for her.

I realize that as former FLOTUS she probably STILL has a Secreet Service detail. All I can say is: LOTSA LUCK GUYS -- you're going to need it!

Lemonade
Fair Enough :)! I welcome debate & I admit I go overboard sometimes. I look forward to debating you & I WILL HONESTLY TRY to reign in my (for lack of a better term) enthusiasm.

Big Black Dog
The key with Reagan is he got the governorship first. He held a leadership role prior to becoming president. Senators and Congressmen aren't leaders, they are "voters". I know you have to start somewhere, but I wouldn't suggest the presidency as a place to get on the job training.

The left keeps holding Bush up as the reason to vote democrat because he is such a screwup -- on that at least we agree.

They haven't caught on yet that Bush, based on his policies is more liberal than conservative, so that argument doesn't hold water.


lemonade
First you have to admit that 11 trillion dollars
is a lot of money spent to 'fix' poverty.
2. government keeps 33% percent of the money paid
in taxes(overhead?)
3.the number in the poverty ranks has increased every single year.
4.food stamps are sold(75cts on the dollar) as regular as you and i fill our gas tank. This i have seen many times while the parent sits in a
bar all day etc.
5.people are like pigeons, you feed a couple and
soon there are many.
6 the fraud in these entitlements and others cost
the working people like you & me 100s of billions
of dollars each year.
7.the money for the poor should go beyond local.

If Chelsea becomes First Daughter again

...I wonder if she has ever heard a song from the 1962 Irving Berlin musical "Mr. President"? It's title? "The Secret Service/makes me nervous."

Gretchen
Maybe when Hillary becomes President she will
get some Secret Service Men who have Leftist
leanings, unlike the previous time.

Have you ever noticed that these gutless wonders
all remained anonymous.

Viruddh
Did you just honestly call the secret service gutless wonders?

JMind
Bernard Goldberg a lifelong Democrat!!!!

Where do you get your information? Perhaps
in the same place where you were told that
CBS is a leftist institution.

You need to find some new sources.

pandm: On envying the Clintons..
the point I was trying to make is that while repub/cons might destest the Clinton on a personal basis, they do without a doubt envy them for what they have which is:

fame, fortune, political power and influence,
not to mention the fact that they are both
consummate politicians.

JMind
Did you just honestly call the secret service gutless wonders?

YES. These particular no-name secret service men
who will denigrate the person they are supposed
to be protecting but make snide remarks behind
her back. I could call them worse too.

Yes, I know that they put their lives on the
line everyday, etc. etc. etc. How many of them
thought they might honestly have to take a bullet
for Hillary?

Last I remember no one has been shot at except
presidents themselves, but maybe I am wrong.

A Bush/Clinton Prez Dynasty?
has anyone else noticed that if Sen. Hillary Clinton wins the Presidency that a Bush or Clinton will have occupied that office for last
20 years and with H.Clintons potential to occupy it for the next eight that would total 28 consecutive years of the Bush/Clinton presidential dynasty?

Lemonade
You wrote:

"Oh, no. The world is coming to an end. A newspaper wrote a complimentary column about Hillary."

Its called free campaign contributions. The Hillary For President staff didn't have to fork over a nickle. The NYTs and other Newspapers of record pride themselves on thier "apoltical reporting". This puff piece goes beyond "positive", and enters the realm of sychopancy. Too bad Guilliani didn't enjoy such "positive" reporting during his years as mayor. Vanity Fair just printed a real hatchet job on his wife no less.

The New York Times forgets all about Hillary's past "problems" as White House Insider (Missing FBI Records, missing billing records, Webster Hubbel, Travelgate, and Cattle Futures to name a few), but is willing to drudge up Bush's drinking habits from 28 years ago, or McCain's part in the Keating scandal from 1987. The New York Times should rename itself Pravda, and the Treasury should bill Hillary for the tens of millions of dollars in free advertisment she enjoys.

viruddh
It is your opinion and you are welcome to it, but I don't agree. I think there is a reason agents names are not released. It is called the *Secret* Service.

The comments made about Clinton came out after she was not the first lady anymore. These agents may still protect her, but they may have just as well moved on to protect the current first lady and there names should not be released.

I understand that makes validating these claims difficult, so you can discount them at your discretion. Since a source is not provided it is easy to do that and it may even be valid to do that. But to suggest that the reason they didn't come forward is because they are cowards is ridiculous and distasteful.

Left Angle
Left Angle writes

"fame, fortune, political power and influence,
not to mention the fact that they are both
consummate politicians"

http://prorev.com/legacy.htm

The only president ever impeached on grounds of personal malfeasance
- Most number of convictions and guilty pleas by friends and associates*
- Most number of cabinet officials to come under criminal investigation
- Most number of witnesses to flee country or refuse to testify
- Most number of witnesses to die suddenly
- First president sued for sexual harassment.
- First president accused of rape.
- First first lady to come under criminal investigation
- Largest criminal plea agreement in an illegal campaign contribution case
- First president to establish a legal defense fund.
- First president to be held in contempt of court
- Greatest amount of illegal campaign contributions
- Greatest amount of illegal campaign contributions from abroad
- First president disbarred from the US Supreme Court and a state court

Yea I would call that real consumate alright.

OMG I forgot "IT'S ALL A RIGHT WING CONSPIRACY"


viruddh
To clarify...he is NOT a democrat now, but he grew up a democrat. Did you read the book?

I get it...don't take things at face value, but if you read the book you will see that he does't lambaste the democrats, he does lambaste the media coverage.

If you read the book it wouldn't be a matter of believing him...he simply points out things that are easily observed in the media.

left angle
the clintons were sly--and yes smart enough to get by without spending 25yrs in prison.
They were involved in bribery & theft and that bothers me as it should you.

Left Angle
You wrote:

"the point I was trying to make is that while repub/cons might destest the Clinton on a personal basis, they do without a doubt envy them for what they have which is:

fame, fortune, political power and influence,
not to mention the fact that they are both
consummate politicians."

Most people in the GOP do not envy the Clintons. If spending a lifetime on the public dole, dumpster diving for campagin funds (a la the 1990s), and receiving 8 figure advances on ghost written material is called success, than I think most Conservatives would take a pass. Hillary didn't earn her fame, nor did she earn her Senate Seat. She inherited the same way Trust Fund babies earn thier fortunes.

I will admit that Bill Clinton is the consumate politican, but Hillary is a poltical dude. Not even the grass roots liberals like or trust her.

Thanks JMind

...for for pinning viruddh's ears well and truly back back!

One can't help but wonder if viruddh is a contraction of "virulent" and "duh".

JPK
"The New York Times forgets all about Hillary's past "problems" as White House Insider (Missing FBI Records, missing billing records, Webster Hubbel, Travelgate, and Cattle Futures to name a few), but is willing to drudge up Bush's drinking habits from 28 years ago, or McCain's part in the Keating scandal from 1987."

But you haven't forgotten, have you? You are still treating these items as though these were proven crimes, when in fact McCarthy (oops, Ken Starr) spent darn near a lifetime and the National Treasury to find the two of them guilty and all he came up with is that a president got caught with his pants down.

Wow. Talk about money well spent. But then maybe it was, because it garnered many a sympathy
vote. Not everyone admires such tactics. Go
figure. Bill Clinton is still popular today.
Maybe more popular than he deserves. Thank you
Kenneth Starr. Starr is the creep here, not
the Clintons, and not the NYT.

I have a suggestion. Read "Living History" and
find out just what happened with the FBI files and the billing records and Foster and Whitewater? Or is getting all your information
from Right-Wing idealogues all that you need to
be a well informed citizen who can then spread
all the slander you want.

Or hasn't it occurred to you to even examine the
explanations of the First Lady because everyone
"Knows" she is a liar.

On the Clintons et al...
Same ole bs baseless toothless conspiracy theories different day.. put them all together they dont add up to a hill of beans...

what it really added up to was a massive right wing vendetta against the Clintons in which $30-50 MILLION$$$ was spent investigating EVERYONE in the Clinton administration with the exception of BUDDY the white house dog and rumor has it that repubs/cons had hired a "dog whisperer" trying to get info on out of him..lmao

talk all the bs you want about the clintons they do have fame, fortune and political power and the ability to kick republican arse and defeat them non paralell.

and one thing that must stick in your craw...

If hillary is elected prez next year you got a possible 8 more years of the Clinton co-presidency..rotflmao

Lemonade
The average president gets a grace period of 3 months when they come into office from being assailed with negative press. Bush got 11 days.

You said we don't forget the past trangressions of Bill and Hillary. But to a large degree (not always) these are at least historically accurate.

How tired do you think we are of hearing that the 2000 election was stolen? In the end both sides had arguments about who got disenfranchised, however, although the supreme court did vote to end the re-counts, they did not decide the election.

All the votes (as in all elections) got counted...it just takes months to do and we can't wait that long. In the end, Bush won the election. It doesn't matter whether Gore won the popular vote as that is not the way elections are decided in the United States.

lemonade: what I find amazing
is all these righwingers including the right wing press and the foot soldiers making all these "intimately personal" comments the Clintons as if they actually "KNOW" these people.

I'm more than willing to bet you that 95% of them have never once met or sat down and talked to the Clintons and yet the "know" their innermost thoughts and motivations...go figure..

Left Angle
I think it is safe to say that the fact that Bush is in office and got elected twice sticks pretty darn good in your craw.

I am not a Bush supporter but I will say this...he has fame, fortune, and polical power (Clinton's have more fame, but less fortune and about the same political power); but does that make him the guy you want in office.

You are rotflyao...but why...because Clinton is a crook, but he has gotten away with it and we are faced with 8 more years?

I don't get why you are so amused. Again, if she gets elected, fine, but see, the thing is...you all SAY Bush lied about this and that, but Clinton DID lie under oath and later had to admit it. So what you are saying is that is what you WANT in the oval office.

Left Wing
Right Wing Press: Fox News

Left Wing Press: CNN, ABC News, NBC News, PBS, BBC, NYT, CBS News

J. Mind..a response..
Bush got into office by way of a partisan USSC the first time (check out who appointed them) and by fearmogering against the "islamofascist threat" and impugning the patriotism of any "leftist" who dared disagree with jim the second time...by midterms 04 the gig was up..now even repubs/cons are talking about "impeaching bush for not upholding the law."

simply put i dont see the Clintons the way you do. I think the country did amazinly well while
Clinton was in office..In stark contrast to any republican..EVERYONE got a piece of the pie..not just the rich.

what clinton "lied" about was a personal matter that had no business being in the courts in the first place..it says a hell of a lot about repub/cons that you would actually go into a mans personal sex life in an attempt to bring him down...thats totally disgusting and weakminded at that.

Left Angle
The USSC comment is an outright lie. It didn't happen. Yes, they ended the counts that were underway (which Gore only wanted to count some counties that were heavily democrat), but in the end...again with ALL elections...every vote is counted and in the end Bush still won.

It doesn't matter what Clinton lied about...he is the POTUS, and in front of the Grand Jury he lied. That is his crime.

The country was doing well, but no better than it is now. Unemployment is at 4.5 percent, the stock market is booming. You just don't hear about it in the media.

Also, while the country was doing well during most of his presidency it was on the decline when he left office, largely due to the internet bubble bursting. Then the left comes along and blames Bush for the year or so when things were on the slide even though it started while Clinton was still in office.

Bush is not a great president, but neither was Clinton and he didn't have 9/11 to contend with. I am not saying he was awful, but he shouldn't be held on a pedistal. What were his foreign policy acheivements? You guys say that Bush has made America hated, but Clinton made us a laughing stock...We were hated then too, World Trade Center bombing, embassy bombings, the USS Cole. 9/11 wasn't the beginning of our terrorist whoas, it was happening during the Clinton years too.

Jmind...a response..
Obviously you hate the Clintons and it taints your view of history about them...

My point of view is very different on them and I'll stick to that.

I dont hate Bush, I just think that he was and is in a job thats far over his head and too big for him.

We agree to disagree.


Left Angle
I don't hate the Clinton's, but I don't support their policies.

If you asked me to choose between GWB and Bill Clinton, I would be hard pressed to give you an honest answer. Hillary is an easy answer.

However, by way of full disclosure, I do tend to vote republican at least on the national level...but that is because I believe the following:

The US is a sovereign nation and can unilaterally defend itself without UN permission. If you think we should go to the UN for approval, look up its voting record and how often it sided with the US (During the Clinton years)

I believe in small government and that social programs don't typically work. Look at the track record of most social programs. It is not a very compelling case to throw more money at them.

I believe I can manage my savings better than the government can and if there is going to be any government involved in my day to day life it should be the government closest to me (local and state).

I believe that the laws of the country should be upheld...including immigration laws. Illegal should not be substituted for "undocumented" just because it doesn't sound nice to call someone who has broken the law and illegal.

There are more beliefs, but I don't want to run on any longer. Now, have the republicans always supported me in these beliefs, not always. That is where the term RINO comes from...but they do tend to do this more than the democrats.

liberal website
I swear. TH is starting to look like a liberal web-site. There's more postings from the left then there are from the right. This notion of the viciousness of conservatives whenever they hear an opposing viewpoint is silly. If I went on the Daily Kos and talked about, for instance, the evils of abortion I'm sure that the Kos crew would be ever so polite and considerate. My fundamental disagreement with Hillary is that she's a democrat. Democrats cannot exist without discord. Their politics begins with: there's something wrong with you that needs to be fixed by me. Lemonade has this view that if you don't address poverty with government then you're not addressing poverty. From what I've seen, government has not only not diminished or alleviated poverty but has in fact created other problems associated with governmental and individual abuses of such programs. When you are poor and someone gives you something you are still poor but now you've got someone to get stuff from. One incentive not to be poor is taken away. As those who work support the poor the number of poor people increase while the number of workers diminish. This is all theory, mind you, but when you consider that there are generations on welfare then you've got to wonder what the government is really up to. I support republicans because republicans are one of the 2 parties who will be elected in general elections who at least say they are for less government.

Chelsea Clinton and [ho hum] Parents
Few times in my 76 years have I found an article mirroring my own thoughts, Mr. Bozell, but this current one regarding this disfunctional family is so true. Just yesterday while reading a tiny blurb regarding Chelsea Clinton's fondness for Harry Potter a light seemed to burst open in my dim consciousness: "Ah HAH! Why THIS? Of course! "They" are prepping Chelsea for an important reason! She is to follow her Marxist mother into the upper echelons of the Clinton Politburo!"

Keep up your clear sightedness, Mr. Bozell. It's always a joy to catch your appearances on Fox News programs!

HappyPick
Misfit in California [I'm a Republican Conservative!]

To wildwest
GW Bush also got his job through political connections. And I don't find it surprising that a Democratic organization would hire Chelsea Clinton---do you think The Heritage Foundation would have hired her? And does a Democratic firm hiring her prove that she is incompetent and would not have been hired otherwise? Your logic falls apart. Not for the first time.

The Marxist Clintons
Few times in my 76 years have I found an article mirroring my own thoughts, Mr. Bozell, but this current one regarding this disfunctional family is so true. Just yesterday while reading a tiny blurb regarding Chelsea Clinton's fondness for Harry Potter a light seemed to burst open in my dim consciousness: "Ah HAH! Why THIS? Of course! "They" are prepping Chelsea for an important reason! She is to follow her Marxist mother into the upper echelons of the Clinton Politburo!"

Keep up your clear sightedness, Mr. Bozell. It's always a joy to catch your appearances on Fox News programs!

HappyPick
Misfit in California [I'm a Republican Conservative!]

JMind
You can subscribe free online to "Media Matters" which will fill your mailbox several times a day. What they do is report MSM coverage that kisses up to the Bush administration, the GOP, and White House talking points. And their format is always the same: after they state the item, they publish verbatim transcript covering the item---you can read this and make up your own mind.

These MSM that are supposed to be so left-leaning, in fact, aren't. The best comment on this I've heard since 2000 was made by Mark Crispin Miller, a Media professor at NYU: "The mainstream media are on their knees to the Bush administration providing a blow job far more important than anything that took place between Bill Clinton and Monica Lewinsky."

You have HEARD that the MSM are left-biased, and you've heard it from people you admire or trust. Consequently, you assume it to be true, so you repeat what they say. But do you subscribe to the New York Times or the Los Angeles Times and read it every day at your breakfast table? Do you read the Washington Post online every day? How do you actually KNOW from your personal experience that these media outlets are left-biased?

If your measure is "all good news about Bush is true and all bad news about Bush is a lie", you are a sitting duck to receive propaganda.

lilly
the clintons do nothing without purpose. The hedge fund bribed the clintons by hiring their daughter so that the missus won't join the bandwagon to raise profits made at the hedge fund from their pitiful 15%, while the rest of us pay excess of 35% But in your socialist world your heroine can do no wrong. Just because the rest of us conservs believe the low life clintons are the most conniving scumbags on this planet don't make us wrong. That you view life with you blinders on doesn't make you right. We are both products of the 60's. I just didn't take the hippie route as you did. That is our difference. I understand the value of capitolism. You extoll the virtues of socialism and more govt interference in everyone lives

To those who think Hillary is great
I say just one thing "I would hate to be out on the desert with her if she was charge of the water" she is and always has been a Machiavellian schemer; face it she didn't run for the US Senate to help New Yorkers! she did it to position herself exactly where she is now and that's not what she said at the time now is it??

lilly
But Fox is right leaning?

I have not "heard it from people" that I trust or otherwise, I listen myself and form my opinion thusly.

Yes, I read "Biased" and it did open my eyes to the way that the media presents a biased point of view, but since then I listen on my own.

See, kissing up in your POV is when anything is reported that would be seen as good news about the Bush administration because in your view (I have read your posts from time to time) there is nothing good to be said about the Bush administration.

If there was an equivelent to "Media Matters" that sent all NEGATIVE GWB articles to my inbox from the MSM it would kill my mail server. The fact that there are positive articles about the administration isn't dispositive of my position. The MSM couldn't even fake being unbiased if they NEVER wrote anything positive.


Big Black Dog, et.al,
Hillary has done absolutely nothing for New York State in two terms other than ponder her run for president. Secondly, the ran virtually unopposed in 2006. No one can even remember the name of her opponent. I think he was the mayor of Yonkers.

Please don't add her senatorial experience or her position as First Lady to her resume. Both mean nothing.

For the liberal lackies: Bozell's column was an indictment of the water-carrying paper of record, not Mrs. Clinton.

black dog
you are dumber than a bag of rocks. The cole was bombed on oct.12, 2000. Clinton was still the president. Bush did not take office until jan. 2001. pointing out facts to you is a useless activity. On 9/11 the president was visiting a school in fla. Bill is looking for momnica's replacement. You seem like the perfect replacement

big dog 2
clinton was impeached for surborning perjury. There was no acquittal. The house vote to impeach and the trial moved to the senate. The senate had the power then to remove clinton from office. Had they done so, alldull would have become president. The senate did not vote to remove him from office. Again you put your ignorance on stage for all to see. Your buddy bill is calling you for his monica

wildwest
I couldn't have said it better.

Big Dogg, I know they are pesky little things, but facts are still important to an argument.

Pure Evil...
Hillary if amoral, as in without morals. She is evil in the classical sense, in that she has turned from God. Her moral compass is subjective: if something aids her is is good, if not it is bad.

I have trouble taking her seriously because she is so obviously flawed and vulnerable to facts from her past. However, I remember how shocked I was when her husband was re-elected.

I truly beleive the Democratic electorate is proof of the fact that at least half of the electorate has a below average IQ. However, she is probably the best Democratic candidate from a Republican point of view. What other Democratic candidate has had a library of books published documenting their foibles, the NYT not withstanding

Robert
"Clinton never testified before a Grand Jury"

Well, you reached new levels of stupid on that one, AND managed to do the usual insult without fact checking.

Just for giggles, google "Clinton AND Grand Jury testimony".

The following link is only one of the references you will get back from the search. It is from the Washington Post and has the full text of...wait...what's that...oh yeah...Clinton's Grand Jury testimony.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/politics/special/clinton/stories/docs092198.htm

Denying something doesn't make it not so.

big dogg
go blow clinton

Big Black Dog
Two things: "He was acquitted"...so? He still lied and was impeached for it. Being acquitted doesn't make him not quilty of the underlying crime. So your argument seems to be that he got away with it?

Okay I see your point on the Cole to a degree, maybe Bush could have done more...but Clinton still had 60 days to do something...what exactly did he do? And further, what about the 1993 World Trade Center bombing?


jmind
clinton was not aquitted. The senate did not vote to remove him from office. He was still impeached.

wildwest
That is not the point of my post. My point is it doesn't matter.

Big Black Dog
Sir --- as you say so condescendingly, you miss the point. Once it all came out (for political gain or otherwise), what did it say about his character? Forget the aftermath...what he was doing in the oval office is a disgrace.

You are right it is politics, but it cuts both ways. The Democrats have been on a witch hunt since day one with Bush, including the much hyped "stolen election", which was not stolen. It is the way Washington works unfortunately. If Hillary or Obama get in office, the republicans will go after them too.

You will simply deny anything said about Clinton as the "Vast Right Wing" conspiracy. One of Clinton's close friends and advisors, Dick Morris, noted that Clinton asked how terrorism polled (19% of American's were interested in it). Since it wasn't in the hearts and minds of the American people, it wasn't on his mind.

Bush should have been zealously combatting terrorism pre-9/11? He was in office for 9 months. His budget wasn't even finalized, but he was supposed to actively pursue it while Clinton didn't do much of anything about it for 8 years?

black dog/ aka clinton's catamite
posting stupidity don't equate to truth. You bozo's still think that somehow he will get rehabilitated if enough people post defenses of his indefensible acts. Clinton is gone, his presidentcy is history. His misdeeds cannot be written of hostoric fact. His shameful conduct and cowardice is a matter of public record. But like the clinton's you think that we should have a socialist/marxist society that purges unpleasant facts about misdeeds of the leaders. If you want to go down on clinton, that is your businness. Just don't bore us with the details of how much you enjoyed it and how good it tasted

Big Black Dog
In your eyes:

Clinton: Not responsible for World Trade Center bombing which he had 7 full years to deal with (not to mention embassy bombings). Who cares if the WTC bomming was Bin Laden or not...it was definitely terrorists and he did next to nothing about it. This was a much larger event than the Cole and could have been 9/11 if it had worked entirely...as it is 6 civilians lost their lives.

Bush: Responsible of the Cole?

Sure Bush has *some* responsibility, but 9/11 took 5 to 6 years to plan, most of which took place on Clinton's watch because he wasn't interested in terrorism...lob a cruise missle, back to other stuff. To suggest that there was nothing going on during Clinton years is laughable.

You say you would have been angry if it happened on Clinton's watch, but it DID happen on Clinton's watch. So by your own admission, Clinton had 54 days to find out who did it and do something about it, but failed leaving it to Bush. Look at the National Security Archive and you will see that Bush first started looking strongly at Al Queda on January 21st.

Clinton had 54 days and did nothing...Bush given the 6 days you presented after 15 days started to move on Al Queda. We can't just go in an wipe them out since they are an elusive enemy, but at least he was taking them seriously.
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