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Wednesday, March 18, 2009
Ben Shapiro :: Townhall.com Columnist
Is Obama Designing the End of Capitalism?
by Ben Shapiro
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Amid all of the mixed messages on the strength of the economy coming from the White House, one theme has emerged loudly, clearly, and unvaryingly: The American economic system is about to undergo a profound shift. “Never allow a crisis to go to waste,” President Obama’s chief of staff Rahm Emanuel famously stated. “Never waste a good crisis,” concurred Secretary of State Hillary Clinton. Americans, said Obama, should “discover great opportunity in great crisis.” What kind of opportunity? “Capitalism,” Secretary of the Treasury Tim Geithner said last week, “will be different.”

All of Obama’s economic policies thus far are designed to drive America into full embrace of socialism. His chief means for this transformation: inflation. He is attempting to inflate the currency through two primary means: intense deficit spending, and pushing up production costs through union subsidization. In order to make these measures politically palatable, he cites FDR as an example of good deficit spending; he cites the credit crunch as an excuse for inflationary monetary policy; and he recommends unionization in order to boost wages.

It’s a beautiful strategy for purposefully trashing capitalism, all the while blaming capitalism for its own downfall. John Maynard Keynes, the liberal economist who championed government intervention during recessions, recognized Obama’s inflationary strategy for what it is: “Lenin is said to have declared that the best way to destroy the capitalist system was to debauch the currency,” said Keynes. “Lenin was certainly right. The process engages all the hidden forces of economic law on the side of destruction, and does it in a manner which not one man in a million is able to diagnose.”

Obama pursues inflation -- government devaluation of the currency -- with the zeal of the newly converted. His deficit spending will be financed either through higher taxes or through inflation. Obama says he will push higher taxes -- after all, he wants to appease the Chinese, who don’t want their U.S. securities paid off with inflated dollars. But covertly, Obama fully intends on inflating the currency to pay of the massive deficit he has shoved through Congress. Meanwhile, he uses the increased prices produced by inflation to justify continuing unionization -- he backs “card check” legislation -- forcing up the cost of doing business and throwing people out of work. He then blames unemployment on the failure of the free market and states that the government must step in to hire more Americans.

It’s the same tried and true policy that created the Great Depression. During the inflationary period following the institution of the Federal Reserve in 1913, the purchasing power of the dollar fell rapidly -- 56 percent by 1929. The easy availability of credit led to the same sort of economic bubble mirrored during the recent real estate boom.

The government’s response was the same, too. According to economist Murray Rothbard, within a week after the stock market crash of 1929, the Federal Reserve pumped cash into the system: it added $300 million to the private bank reserves; it doubled its holdings of government securities, adding $150 million to the reserves, and discounting $200 million for member banks. Writes Rothbard, “As a result, the weekly reporting member banks expanded their deposits during the fateful last week of October by $1.8 billion (a monetary expansion of nearly 10 percent in one week).” The Federal Reserve lowered its discount rate from 6 percent to 4.5 percent.

This, of course, did not stave off the Great Depression. Similarly, Germany, Britain and many other European countries moved off the gold standard in the early 1930s; this merely heightened the sense of urgency in the United States, where the gold standard was still in place, leading to runs on gold. FDR countered by dramatically inflating the currency in 1933, when he made it unlawful for private persons to hold gold; in 1934, he reset the value of the dollar at $35 per ounce of gold rather than the previous $20.67.

Without financial stability ensured by the free market gold standard, banks became even less willing to lend. FDR attempted to push up wage rates by backing labor against business; the result was prolonged unemployment, because prices were already too high.

And all of this justified more and more governmental intrusion.

Now Obama wants to pursue the same inflationary policies. He’s pushing the deficit beyond the breaking point. He’s using “card check” to inflate wages, producing unemployment. He’s destroying savings.

And he’s loving every minute of it. When it comes to inflation, very few people can identify its pernicious effects; it’s far easier to cite the dangers of laissez-faire capitalism. Which, of course, is Obama’s plan. Capitalism will be different when Obama finishes with it -- it will be another name for socialism, purposefully brought on by governmental measures.

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About The Author
Ben Shapiro is a regular guest on dozens of radio shows around the United States and Canada and author of Project President: Bad Hair and Botox on the Road to the White House.
 
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©Creators Syndicate
What A Sick sOb!

The day that this m.f. leaves office cannot come to soon. Go to hell Barack Mugabe and Lady Macbeth.

Yes,He Is !!!!
Senator Barack Obama received a $101,332 bonus from American International Group in the form of political contributions according to Opensecrets.org. The two biggest Congressional recipients of bonuses from the A.I.G. are - Senators Chris Dodd and Senator Barack Obama.

HE DID:: Deliberately !

STOP walking on eggshells:

OBAMA was raised and trained as an extreme radical:
Saul Alinski
William Ayers
Karl Marx
etc.
Study his entire circle of influence beginning with is mother !

put everything he has said, written, done, not done, not said on a spread sheet: SHOCKING

OBAMA is the enemy within:

SOROS
PUTIN
HUGO
Castro
etc. are all celebrating:

Obama has destroyed the USA in less than 100 days without one bomb!

THE NEXT SHOE to drop will be a lead foot!

HOW can anyone be surprised ?

Excuse Me, Tammy

It is my opinion. Do you want to live thru another inflationary Great Depression? I don't. And, what Shapiro says about the GD is true. How the hell do you think that we are going to pay for a national debt that is over $12T, unfunded obligations in SS and medicare of anywhere from $56T-$75T, $2T for bank stabilization, $2T/yr. for cap-n-tax, UHC, and a budget of $4.6T? It is insanity. It is unsustainable. Can you not see that?

ROME is burning GOP fiddling!

As the USA is being destroyed, the GOP is still trying to SUCK up to druggie, Dictator for life, radical extremist OBAMA!

Obama's useful idiots are:
33% illiterates, parasites, radicals, extremists, Hollywood slime and sleaze, brain fried druggies, criminals, enemies of the state:

the entire democrat leadership in all branches are the ENEMY WITHIN! (legislative, judicial, executive)

every day a new saga
madoff
stanford
AIG
the banks
blowing off GB (UK)
the Auto industry
Acorn
the Unions
Hollywood
the illegals
tearing up the constitution
eliminating our rights
rationing
the drug cartel
foreign enemies
and NOW PELOSI wants to bail out the liberal newspapers!

TOMORROW it will be:_______ and so on

grow up:

PRIVATE CITIZENS: like Rush et al. both sides of the "ENTERTAINMENT" industry have zero "control" over the disaster that:

"SENATOR OBAMA" leader of the democrat controlled congress for 2 years has created:

NOW as POTUS he is finishing us off:

SOROS
PUTIN
HUGO
CASTRO
BIN LADEN

are dancing in the streets and wetting with glee:
their guy has DONE IT! in less than 100 days!

ORGANIZE for the REVOLT !

SO far:
US BANK
WELLS FARGO

have given OBAMA the finger!

Do the citizens with character, spine, standards, principles have the guts to organize, resist, and fight to salvage what is left?

Grassley deserves a medal of HONOR: except
he was too "KIND" he failed to include:

Obamam and his corrupt criminal cabinet, circle of influence and power brokersk!
Pelosi the wicked ____ of the world
Reid, the useful idiot
Geinther the corrupt criminal who sold out the USA to enemies
Barney
Dodd
and their entire circle of corrupt criminal power brokers.

AIG was "SENATOR" OBAMA"S design:
HE: Barney: Dodd: PElosi: Geinther planned and executed this entire financial disaster to destroy the USA!

NOW as POTUS he is moving at warp speed to finish us off:

2012 is the END OF THE USA

As Germany went under HITLER
SO GOES THE USA under OBAMA,

" THE RED DAWN"

"THE RED DAWN" a movie to show you what
the USA will look like in less than 12 months!

HINT "TAMMY"

1. get an education
2. get a job
3. show up on time
4. earn promotions and rise to the top
5. save and invest
6. live within your means
7. stop having kids you cannot afford
8. stop leading a high risk lifestyle
9. stop standing in line for every handout

then U TOO can become OPRAH or MADOFF, OR Geinther, Daschle, Stanford, Rockefeller, KENNEDY etc.

HMHMM Tammy from IL

a "community" organizer ? you think
one of Obama's trained radicals? you think
one of William Ayers' students? you think
ACORN ? you think

All of those IL democrats have interesting history:

they follow the teachings of Saul Alinsky to the letter.


SO Tammy, U gonna do what ?

be the top "brown shirt" for Obama

have us eliminated?

Most of us are prepared to die to save this great nation from the Obama destruction, for our kids, for our grandchildren, as our parents and grandparents gave their lives for an incredible opportunity, incredible freedom, and incredible conveniences.

YOU and Obama are taking it all away from us and for all future generations with that evil smirk and razzle dazzle!

Brave New World has arrived under OBAMA !
The RED DAWN has arrived under OBAMA!

PS: History is an amazing mirror:

Shapiro - dishonest as usual
I'm no economist but you can just tell from the rhetorical style (and past experience) that Shapiro's blowing a bunch of smoke. This string of sentences at the end is truly remarkable:

"Now Obama wants to pursue the same inflationary policies. He’s pushing the deficit beyond the breaking point. He’s using “card check” to inflate wages, producing unemployment. He’s destroying savings.

And he’s loving every minute of it."

NO. What's happening here is this: Shapiro is imagining the worst possible outcome, which is highly unlikely, and is using it to smear Obama. And he's loving every minute of it.

B2slim
"1. get an education
2. get a job
3. show up on time
4. earn promotions and rise to the top
5. save and invest
6. live within your means
7. stop having kids you cannot afford
8. stop leading a high risk lifestyle
9. stop standing in line for every handout


Been there, done that.

Go Obama

And for the record, the dialogue has ended.

Ben....
I think AIG and Citigroup and all those other "too big to fail" global corporations have engineered the end of capitalism. Obama's just trying his damndest in a recession he inherited.

Capitalism is a joke as long as AIG remains "too big to fail".

Bridge the gap betw have's & have-nots
I worked all my life and lived prudently. I now have $200,000 in savings. By comparison, Julie, my coworker who has similar salary as mine, lives beyond her means and is $200,000 in debt.

After a 100% inflation, our difference will be $200,000 instead of $400,000.

Yes. This is liberals' plan. They want equal outcome. They cannot stand anyone to be more successful than others. Each of us was born with both virtues and evils in his nature. The liberals appeal to evils, e.g., greed, envy, indulgence, laziness; because it's so much easier, and more enjoyable to be evil than to be virtuous. This is why so many Americans are buying the liberal crap.

the days b/4 communists take-over
My parents fled Chinese communists to Taiwan. They told me about the days before China fell into communists. I also read stories about it.

We are in a similar situation. Many Americans are deeply in debt (although they do live quite well). University professors, students and media are all supporting punishing the rich, as if those who made more than $250k a year have wronged the rest of the nation. Anger and class-envy are a popular theme.

The day that we stand in line for a loaf of bread is not too far away. Liberals have succeeded. First they ruined education. Second, they got everyone in deep debt. (Although I must say business supported by Rep is equally guilty). Now we are on our way to communism.

Just wait and see. Someday no one will own personal properties. We will be living in houses assigned by the government. We will be truly equal - except the elite, like the politicians, or government officials, of course.


B2slim

Great posts.
And pay no attention to Tammy the moonbat. The price of cucumbers has gone up and she's a wee bit cranky.

Its more Like King Bernenke
Obama is the pupet and nothing more. The government is taking ownership positions in giant financial institutions, restructuring the banking system and running demand for short term treasuries up so high that it has a 0% ROI. If you factor in inflation with the short term yeilds it is a net loss to purchase them, so why are they being bought? The US Government is running the greatest scam I have ever seen, they are convincing you that buying their debt for a loss is a good deal while they are financing this rediculous bail out with the interest cost they are saving by taking your money for nothing. This makes Hitler look like a nice guy. I am totaly amazed that the American people are falling for this but it goes to prove the masses are sheep and they will walk up to the cliff's edge and take that next step all by themselves. If the American people don't wise up they will find themselves with the first American King and the President will become the court jester. Obama does make a good clown though, he is well suited to the job.

Tammy's probably 1 of Soros' paid goons
Think of Tammy this way:
She's probably not here to engage in the conversation.
She's here to disrupt it and spread leftist disinformation.
I expect her typical week goes like this:
She sits at a computer all day.
She reads the leftist talking points that Soros e-mails her every morning.
Then she visits every conservative blog that Soros assigned her to, and leaves her trail of approved propaganda everywhere.
Often, she's the first to post on new threads.
Throughout the day she tracks each thread and follows up with more posts until the thread's been effectively interrupted.
She does the same thing the next day, and every day after that.
At the end of the week, she collects a check.

Moreover: There are probably thousands of Tammys out there.
Their purpose is to demoralize conservative bloggers, disrupt the conservative conversation, and spread leftist propaganda and disinformation.
Although they come off as fools (or worse), in fact, they're highly effective.
That's why conservative blogs that don't ban stooges like Tammy are making a huge mistake.
Until conservative blogs wake up and start banning these stooges, the rest of us should ignore their comments.
Just don't respond to them.
Why help the enemy?

So
Tammy...you're rich. Since you paid off your mortgate, the gubbermint should quadruple your property taxes. Its only fair

Get a new
photo, Ben. Looks like you're in junior high school.

Where Is the American Casandra?
Ben Shapiro's column should be required reading for every American who voted for Obama. I realize many of the aforementioned can't read but we can provide people who can read and explain his column to them.

We're headed literally over the cliff. Obama is the biggest disaster to our economy since Carter. The Democrat leaders are certifiably insane, in addition to being very, very corrupt, because they try the same thing over and over again and expect different results. Socialism destroys wealth and creates misery everywhere it is tried.

It is all about power--power corrupts and absolute power corrupts absolutely. Do-gooders always end up killing people either indirectly or directly. If you don't believe this read the history of Mao's China and Stalin's USSR. They are prologues to, and predictions of, Obama's America.


Google this:
Cloward-Piven Strategy.

Socialism -via- Bankruptcy!

That's exactly the plan!

Anyone with a functional brain cell could see this coming...

Even last fall, the libs flatly refused to allow the auto industry to file Chapt. 11, which would have been the only prudent and financially responsible thing to do.

Pushing through this Shamulus Pkg. in days is exactly a Marxist move....


And it's NOT that this is anything Bozo didn't tell us he had every intention of doing!

Obviously the Obama voters were clueless!

Tammy opines:
"I cannot tell you how many
people I have seen write here on Town Hall
that it is perfectly OK to embrace greed."

Fully 99% of the rich people I work for in NYC happen to be Liberal Democrats, Tammy.


Bob Hope went on the road to Morocco
Barack No Hope went on the road to socialism.
Hugo Chavez; "come Obama, ally with us on the path to socialism, it's the only road" ...
And the Obama Administration responds here, http://stopthepresses2.blogspot.com/search/label/Socialist

Dr Thoughtless
"I'm no economist..."

No need to belabor the obvious.

"...but you can just tell from the rhetorical style (and past experience) that Shapiro's blowing a bunch of smoke."

See, when you are going to make absurd statements like that, no one will ever mistake you for an economist.

"What's happening here is this: Shapiro is imagining the worst possible outcome..."

See, if you were an economist, you might grasp that it is, in fact, the ONLY possible outcoem and the only outcoem actually consistent with actual history, economic theory and practical precedent.

Don't let that stop you for demonstarteing such economic ignorance. Court jesters are always entertaining. Just don't fall into the trap of believing they are taken seriously.

Everyone should read ...

"FDR's Folly: How Roosevelt and His New Deal Prolonged the Great Depression" by Jim Powell.

As Yogi Berra famously said: "It's deja vu all over again."

Tammy
Is a really bitter person who is either lying about living within her means and hating the nasty, greedy people out there while foraging in her mother's basement, or she doesn't get what capitalism really is.

Letter From Obama
Dear Sirs;
I got my teleprompter just like you said. I learned to use it so you could give me instructions I could read to the masses.

I sold this plan you had and you helped me get elected. I have followed orders every day. But you didn't tell me I would be blamed when the people found out what we were doing.

I wanted the people to love me. Now they are turning on me,when I am just following your orders. I will not take the blame alone.If I go down,you go down.

You were supposed to make this thing run smoothly so it would all be over before the masses wised up to 'The Plan'. Now,every day,you are giving me another problem to solve. It's not fair.

To: The New World Order Advocates.

Congress should give back
The biggest socialist joke in the US is Congress itself which is a leech on the body politic and the entire electorate.

I want my money back, too. The AIG bonuses were previous contractual obligations that CONGRESS specifically allowed in the “stimulus” law that Senator Christopher Dodd (D-Conn) specifically added in an executive-compensation restriction to the bill. That amendment provides an “exception for contractually obligated bonuses agreed on before Feb. 11, 2009” — which exempts the very AIG bonuses Dodd and others are now seeking to tax.

But Dodd and the rest of the pack in DC get “free” limos and town cars for $2.56 BILLION a year (Citizens Against Government Waste), get “free” Air Force flights—while demanding crews standby for hours and days (Nancy Pelosi-let her ride coach), free haircuts, free US mail, cheap meals (let them eat at McDonald’s), and live like little kings and queens at our expense while castigating business which is what makes the wealth of this country.

Send President Obama a tea bag on April 1 to let Washington know that NOTHING is free and more debt to an enemy like China will help turn the US into another third world country begging continuously for aid and support.

Insanity
As defined by Albert Einstein - Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results.

Are you listening Pres. Obama? Are you listening House Of Representatives? Are you listening Senate?

What is being done now in hope of "saving" our economy will destroy Capitalism...Or was that the plan all along?

What Libs Don't Understand...

Is that our GDP (in a good year) is ~$14T. Now, look at the figures that I posted below and add at least $2T over 10 years for UHC and, dear god, would SOMEONE PLEASE tell me how we DO NOT end up bankrupt?

The GOOBERMINT could confiscate (if it wasn't prohibited by that piece of paper that Dems love to HATE, the Constitution) every dime Americans earn in a year and we STILL WOULD BE UNABLE to pay for Otopia.

THIS IS INSANITY AND UNSUSTAINABLE!

Tammy
1. Get in line for food Stamps
2. Get in line for Welfare
3. Turn over your 401K
4. Go to your government Job and work as little as possible.
5. Go to the clinic and wait in line to see if your illness is not too expensive to treat.
6. Collect your Social Security which will be the same as everyone else even if they never paid any contribution.

This is the Obama way. Life will be great won't it. None of us will have to think anymore. The government will take over everything for us.

Puppet and His Handlers
Rush calls Obama the Teleprompter President so I broke out laughing when I read on the Drudge Report today that he ended up thanking himself because he was reading the wrong teleprompter message.

Rush is right on but when does the media start identifying the puppeteers who are pulling the strings on this whole Obama Magical Mystery Tour in the highest office in the land?

Tea Party at Ind. Hall Phila
April 18th.

Get out and show these leeches and frauds that Boston isn't the only place that has tea parties.

If we just blog here and don't take to the streets, no one will ever listen.

Keep emailing Reps. in the Sen. to hold every line that they can, because the fall of the market and the coming inflation is meant to wipe out the middle class. You have to break a lot of eggs to make a socialist omlette (Leon Trotsky).

Jerseyvet
Rush is right on but when does the media start identifying the puppeteers who are pulling the strings on this whole Obama Magical Mystery Tour in the highest office in the land?

*********************
On the 12th of Never.

You calling me a Socialist?

Hey Tammy from corrupt IL
I hear you and acorn are going to be counting heads for the census. I wonder why that would be, hmm, I bet so they can use their less than average math skills to count all the stones equal votes in the cemetary's there, HUH!! I would have to say that O is trying darn hard to turn this country into South Africa. isnt that what Mendela did. And saying South Africa is not racist yet, but saying 9/11 was terrorism, is. Whats that new webster/obama definition call it, oh yeah, "Man Caused Disaster". WTF !!!

Chuck
"Fully 99% of the rich people I work for in NYC happen to be Liberal Democrats, Tammy."

****
Your location suggests that you live in Maine.
You must have one heck of a commute.

Other than that, what does my sentence have to
do with your sentence.

Inflation
When you face the prospect of deflation, inflation is a good thing. Just ask Japan how deflation worked out for them in the 1990s. And the US problems started the same way Japan's did--a real estate bubble.

Mussolini Designed His Own End
Benito Mussolini and his mistress, Clara Petacci, were riding high for five years while Italy fought with the Axis of Hitler and Japan against the US and the Allies during WW II.

Mussolini and Petacci's end was a firing squad, being thrown in the street to be mutilated and finally being hung up by their heels in the public square.

Google "mussolini death" to see YouTube videos of what happens to tinhorn fascists like Mussolini who try to bring a country to its knees in order to be another Caesar.

Nancy Pelosi hopped on a plane (US military?) to fly to Rome immediately after she succeeded in ramming through the so-called Recovery Act.

Who was she visiting in Rome? Her mother was born in Italy, so it could have been family she was visiting. Who knows?

Mussolini pulled the Italians into a living hell during WW II, but when the Italian people turned on him and his henchmen, it was bullets to the head and the end of a rope.

What Obama, Pelosi, et al. are designing for the American people is not necessarily what they are going to get in the end.

When all of the gullible Obamaites like his ACORN supporters find out they have been betrayed, when the people turn on the Obama administration for having destroyed this nation, it could be as ugly as Mussolini and Clara Petacci's end.

"Sic Semper Tyrannus"...Thus Always to Tyrants (Virginia's State motto)

Denise
" Do you want to live thru another inflationary Great Depression?"

The Great Depression wasn't inflationary, it was the opposite it was deflationary! The US deflation rate in the US during the worse years of the Great Depression was 10% a year. The current inflation rate is 0.24% (which is down from January). A year ago it was 4%. There is no inflation. The danger is deflation.




Tammy
"Your location suggests that you live in Maine.
You must have one heck of a commute."

Yes, about 320 miles, 5-1/2 hours. I make it about 3 to 4 times a month.

------

"Other than that, what does my sentence have to
do with your sentence."

It goes to the obvious implication that fiscal and monetary hypocrisy is the domain of TH contributors, who are largely conservatives.


Denise-CLPKY-Rowly-Nee-F1etch-Others
I saw this coming from a mile away once Liberals used Affirmative Action to select their candidate. The Leftover Hippies WILL start dying off soon and this is their LAST CHANCE to enact their Communal Socialist Utopia Nonsense as public policy. HOWEVE, let not your hear be troubled. The Sail Eared Simpleton’s Approval Rating is in a Vertical Dive and he WILL drag Congress down with him. The Libtards have overreached and judging by the reaction of the folks, are engaged in the equivalent of hunting a bear with a Super Soaker. Backlash WILL be coming SOON!

BTW, have you seen the last from Plastic Surgery Piglosi?

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2009/03/18/pelosi-tells-ill egal-immigrants-work-site-raids-american/


Tammy bloviates continually
"Capitalism that is not closely regulated is
one of the earth's greatest tyrannies."

That depends on how one defines both "closely regulated" and "tyranny", doesn't it? If one views things only through the prism of class envy, it is understandable how one would come up with such a statement of indefensible historical absurdity.

Akagi - correction
"When you face the prospect of deflation, inflation is a good thing."

Never. Never. Never. Never.

"Just ask Japan how deflation worked out for them in the 1990s. And the US problems started the same way Japan's did--a real estate bubble."

Not exactly. The Great Depression, this latest economic fiasco and the Japanese crisis of the 1990s all began as the result of vastly INFLATIONARY government policies. In Japan and in this latest crisis, it was merely symptomatic that the excess liquidity being firefosed into the economy manifested itself as a bubble in real estate (just as similar - though not as large - excess liquidity was pumped into equities in the late 1990s here).

The market can only respond by removing the excess liquidity, but often matters are worsened by equally wrong-headed governmnt policies, such as the Fed swinging too far the other way (in both the 1930s and 2000s) and irresponsible government spending (in all three cases - Japan is now saddled with a national debt larger than its entire economy).

The problem was NEVER deflation. Deflation was the result of the market trying to correct for GOVERNMENT FAILURE.

Red Dawn
"THE RED DAWN" a movie to show you what
the USA will look like in less than 12 months!"

The Soviet Union and her allies will invade the US and a small group of high school football players will become partisan rangers? I thought the Soviet Union was dead? How can it invade in 12 months?

The movie was stupid. First, if the USSR had invaded the US would have responded with nukes and the Soviets would have responded and the world would have for the most part been over.

Second, even if it had happened, going and building camp fires and the like out in the woods, they would have easily been found by IMINT and the invaders would have easily wiped them out. Not only that but the fact that they were walking into town, allowed to go to the fence line of internment camps to talk to prisoners, and the like was plain idiotic. One of the worst movies ever made. Did like Ron O'Neal's character--Col. Bella.

It wouldn't matter if...
...Barrack Obama came to his next press conference wearing a "Che" T-Shirt and carrying the Communist Manifesto under his arm. As long as he doesn't call himself a Marxist, he can be one all he wants. And the people who voted for him will keep buying his rhetoric, Democrats will keep defending him and Republicans will criticize Rush Limbaugh for pointing-out that he had the Communist Manifesto under his arm.

There's only one possible outcome from spending us into oblivion and raising taxes: disaster. But there are those who see it coming and are afraid to say it, those who believe it will be a disaster but hope otherwise and those are simply incapable of seeing it.

And then there's a few like Shapiro who see the elephant in the room and are willing to call it what it is. But they're so few, they don't matter.

Delusional Tammy
"Trust me, I get what capitalism is."

Demonstrably false.

"Capitalism that is not closely regulated is
one of the earth's greatest tyrannies."

Quite the contrary, capitalism has been the greatest engine of individual liberty and prosperity (especially for the poor) that has ever been conceived by the mind of Man. History yields no other conclusion.

"It can create slavery faster than any Southern
Plantation every dreamed of."

The concept of "wage slavery" is the purvey of imbecilic Marxists who can't grasp the simple ditinction that capitalism is, by definition, VOLUNTARY, and coercison requires the intervention of the government (the real source of slavey in every case it has ever existed).

"On the Plantation they had to take care of their darkies."

Yeah, and the benevolent government protecting those darkies from the evils of capitalism by enforcing their bondage with the power if law, was for ther own good? That is, after all, the logical result of your position.

F1etch
But the problem once the bubble burst was deflation not inflation. Denise claimed the Great Depression was inflationary when it fact it was the opposite. The issue now is stopping deflation, not inflation. Inflation as the current inflation rate shows (nearly at zero) is not the problem. Deflation (especially in the real estate market) is.


F1etch
"Quite the contrary, capitalism has been the greatest engine of individual liberty and prosperity..."

Economic liberty, but this doesn't equate to personal liberty. Hong Kong and Singapore as the freest economies on earth, but individual liberties are much more restrictive than in the US.

Terry
Once Obama moves to form a one-party state, have government ownership of the means of production, the army as an organ of the party, government ownership of the means of communications and the eventual goal of the whitering of the state, then I'd say he was a Marxist, but since he has done none of these things, he can't be considered a Marxist now can he?

Sweden's top marginal rate was 89% in 1976 and the US was 70%--Obama wants to go to 39% which is lower than it was for most of Reagan's tenure. Was Ford a Marxist then? Reagan? Was Sweden a Marxist state?


HE MUST GO
So, instead of just griping about what "will be", why don't you help change it, by getting rid of him NOW!
Don't dismiss those who believe he is not eligible to be POTUS. Get informed- it's the truth.
Check out the dozen lawsuits insisting that he show proof that he was born in the US of citizen parents. He wasn't- his own websites admit that he was born a British subject through his Kenyan father.
He refuses to release his original, long-form, "vault" birth certificate or college records. WHY? Clearly it's because they would prove he is not a "natural born citizen of the US" as required by the Constitution.
There's a great legal summary at http://paralegalnm.wordpress.com/2009/02/27/barack-hussein -obama-a-natural-born-subject-of-great-britain/

Look at the website of Dr Taitz, the lawyer who's handling some of the lawsuits to force him to prove he is eligible- defendourfreedoms.us. Or read the info on theobamafile.com.

If you have a better idea for getting rid of him before he can completely destroy the US, let's hear it. Otherwise, join those who are taking action.

Tammy Reply #8
If what you say about your life and finance handling is true I applaud you. I don't understand why you support Obama's policies then. Don't you understand that his actions will make it much harder for people to succeed as you have?

What is it with you financially successful liberals? Is it a case of as long as I got mine I can experiment with everyone else? And I can talk compassion all day long about the less fortunate as long as it doesn't cost me anything?

This is what rags me about you libs. You want to control other people's lives as long as it doesn't inconvenience you. How many of Obama's appointees didn't pay their taxes or at least not on time and correctly? Yet they would have no trouble raising our taxes and Lord help us if we do like they did come April 15th.

Akagi
"But the problem once the bubble burst was deflation not inflation."

Yes and no. In the wake of the initial bubble burst, deflation did occur, but it was not a "problem" to be solved; it was the inevitable price for the inflationary policies that had preceded it. Further, the attempts to prevent deflation instead lead to further inflationary disasters in the mid-thirties (before those policies created the Roosevelt recession) and in the early 1940s (look at the rate for 1942 alone). The success of the economy during the 1940s (with shortages, rationing, wage and price freezes, etc.) is largely a popular mythbased on a misunderstanding of GDP data.

"Economic liberty, but this doesn't equate to personal liberty."

Certainly, economic liberty is not the only liberty, but it is no less essential than the others and, while it is possible, as in the examples you cite, to preserve economic liberty without preserving other liberties, it is impossible to significantly curtail economic liberty without also curtailing all the others.

Georgetwin
"I saw this coming from a mile away once Liberals used Affirmative Action to select their candidate."

And the GOP and conservatives used nepotism. George W. Bush the American and less competent version of Chiang Ching Kuo. Plenty of Affirmative Action in the GOP too--Colin Powell ring a bell?


Akagi
Either way, you and the rest of us little guys obviously have only the illusion of having a say in the matter, wouldn't you say?

Meanwhile you busy yourself tilting at conservative windmills and think yourself informed and profound.

Denise
Taiwan spends 6% of its GDP on healthcare which is universal--the UHI. That is about $900 per person. The US? 16% of its GDP, almost $7,000 per person and 47 million uninsured. Compare that to 70% satisfaction with the UHI to the US under 50% with its healthcare system.

Due to competence issues, I have my doubts if the US could run a competent UHI, but the current system is a failure too.




Chuck
"Meanwhile you busy yourself tilting at conservative windmills and think yourself informed and profound."

Perhaps you should be specific so I'd have a clue what you are talking about. Informed? Yes. Profound? Accurate as well. Tilting at windmills? No. Combating ideological incest.

Akagi
Is a Neo-Nazi not a Neo-Nazi because he doesn't have his own country, SS protection and a labor camp at Auschwitz? I didn't say that Obama was Vladimir Lenin, I said he was a "Marxist".

Using the top marginal tax rate of Reagan, Ford, Sweden, Obama or anyone else..is totally irrelevant.

When you have a move to nationalize banks, businesses, energy, health care, education and property (via stricter environmental controls)...your "marginal tax rates" will become inconsequential. In other words, when the government owns everything, tax rates are of no concern. Do you think former Soviet citizens were ever concerned about tax rates? What about the Cubans or North Korean...think they're worried about tax rates?

Obama's raising of taxes is not the ultimate goal...it will just help get to the ultimate goal.

Remember Obama's pledge not to raise taxes on anyone making less than $250,000.00? What difference does it make if your income tax is left the same, but you have to pay more in energy costs, taxes at the gas pumps, etc. and you pay more for the goods and services that you purchase from the wealthy that are having their taxes raised...what difference does it make in real money, that your "income taxes" were not raised?

Georgetwin
The Sail Eared Simpleton’s Approval Rating is in a Vertical Dive and he WILL drag Congress down with him. The Libtards have overreached and judging by the reaction of the folks, are engaged in the equivalent of hunting a bear with a Super Soaker. Backlash WILL be coming SOON!
********************
I think that very reason is why he and his teleprompter are cramming all this down our throats as fast as he can. By the time the mindnumb robots wake up,it'll all be over.

Nice try
"Sweden's top marginal rate..."

...is hardly relevant without taking into consideration at what point that the rate becomes effective, which, BTW, completely dismantles the argument suggesting Obama is less socialistic than Reagan Moreover, that is not the only example. The initial TARP plan did not involve exercising ownership and management of the companies receiving fuinds but has now become so - which is, by definition, socialistic.

BTW, it is also no accident that the Scandinavian miracle was a fiction and Sweden, et al have fallen farther and farter behind economically. Only Norway looks good and they are rapidly moving to a less socialist system because they realize that the oil revenues that add more than $11,000 to the living standards of eery man, woman and child in the country (it sure isn't the "success" of socialism) cannot last forever.

God Bless Texas!!
The Sail Eared Simpleton’s Approval Rating is in a Vertical Dive and he WILL drag Congress down with him. The Libtards have overreached and judging by the reaction of the folks, are engaged in the equivalent of hunting a bear with a Super Soaker. Backlash WILL be coming SOON!
*******
That is probably why he is cramming all this stuff down our throats at breakneck speed. By the time the mindnumbed robots wake up it'll all be over.

On health care
Studies (actual data) indicate that:

a) the chief determinant of the pecentage of DGP spent on healthcare is ... prosperity.

b) if you contract a serious illness, you had better pray that you are in the US where the chances of survival are vastly higher than anywhere else.

c) the WHO rankings are bogus, deliberately putting uindue weight on items that have nothing to do with the quality of care and/or are calculated differently by different countries.

d) As many people die per capita due to rationing of care as die in the US from "delay receiving care" - inaccurately used as a de facto measure of lack of insurance. Health Canada's statistics are particularly revealing. In Ontario alone, 170 people are condemned to death every year waiting for emergecy herat surgery. That's one province and one procedure.

e) the only thing "universal" about universal health care is rationing (and that it fails to live up to the hype).

f) the 47 million uninsured figure is entirely bogus. The Census Bureau performs two studies. The one that is LEAST accurate is the one that yields the 47 million figure. The one they CONCEDE is more accurate yields a figure roughly half that and 15 million people are eligible for Medicare but have simply not enrolled.

Satisfatcion surveys are meaningless since they do not reflect actual care - only expectations - and are subject to the (inaccurate) rhetoric about health care in the US.

Rowly
Mind-numbed robots...don't wake up. It's the fourth quarter and they haven't seen the ball since kick-off!

Obama
Cannot change anything the people do not allow.

He is hardly a king, he is nothing more than a hired hand for the Office.

He may bring war right here in America if he wants to think and act like a king, but that is all he will do.

This man will continue to operate with deceit and fraud in all he works for, its who he is and the scam of it all is going to bring about the opposite of happiness or its pursuit.
He is actually a criminal already

Obama is a criminal
He ignores all the Laws that criminalize Marxism.
He is not an American at heart, let alone in citizenship.
He is a complete fraud and is going to bring lawlessness in all he does

terry
Slept through the whole 'thang',didn't they?

Lunacy
No proof Obama was ever in Kenya as a child nor proof his mom was--and never in 1961. There has never been seen a Kenya birth certificate, no Kenyan passport, no American visa, no naturalization application, no naturalization certificate. He was born in Hawai'i of a Kenya father and American mother and due to jus soli (as well as jus sanguinis) a US citizen by birth. Note being born outside the US doesn't in itself make you a non-natural born US citizen (See George Romney). His birth was announced in Hawai'i on August 13, 1961, 9 days after he was born. He was smuggled in from Kenya in 9 days? Don't you think the whereabouts of Barack Obama, Sr. in the summer of 1961 was looked into by McCain, Clinton among others? Did Anne Dunham go to Kenya on her own? Don't you bet her passport file and contacts in Kenya by the Clintons were looked into either.

But say you are right. How did he get from Kenya to Washington State within weeks of his birth? There are Kenyan illegal aliens, but they to a man almost all overstay a legal visa--not smuggled in. And even if she did not live in the US for 5 years since she was 14 (the law at the time to pass on US citizenship), she could have still brought him in legally as a child of a US citizen. You don't smuggle people in you can bring in legally.

"Otherwise, join those who are taking action."

Sorry. I rather not join collection of fools. Hopefully at some point, Orin Hatch's amendment will be passed and ratified and we won't be bothered by this arachic nonsense in the first place. To quote from 'Good as it Gets' "Sell crazy someplace else, we're all stocked up here."



TS
"e is not an American at heart, let alone in citizenship."

Proof please. Thank you.

Obama
Should be brought up on charges for his crimes, and Congress right along with him if they do not stop this madman and wicked liar.

I want law and order from government, and if government breaks the law, the laws of nature will bring him and all of us in America to the one Justice System men do not control.
The Laws of nature and nature's God our Declaration of Independence declares this nation is Founded in.

Go get screwed
akagi

Akagi combating ideological incest
"Perhaps you should be specific so I'd have a clue what you are talking about."

Can't tell the players without a program, Akagi. If you think the Democrats are guilt-free in all this, I'd say it's you who are engaged in ideological incest.

Barky does it to the Dems...
Rasmussen Reports:
"Support for the Democratic Congressional candidates fell to a new low over the past week, allowing the GOP to move slightly head for the first time in recent years in the Generic Congressional Ballot.

"Democrats began the year holding a six or seven point lead over the GOP for the first several weeks of 2009."

Barky is going to be the best thing to happen to the conservative movement since Jimmy Carter, if we can keep him and his toads from destroying the country before we can get them out of town.

F1etch
Sweden still has a higher standard of living than does the US--as does Japan and Canda I might add. There is no rationing in Taiwan except for example the time doctors spend on you and the wait times to see one. But that is an aspect of the US system too. I will also add the health proviers in Taiwan are often open much later than US providers. I've seen dentist offices open at 8:00 at night.

TS
and diu nie lo mo to you too.




TS
Care to outline the exact crimes Obama has engaged in?


Shapiro is correct.
Ben Shapiro is correct. President Obama's goal is for Democrats to win. For them to gain and retain power over others. If he has to dismantle capitalism, hey the ends justify the means. Yes, we are in a Second Civil War with the left and they are eating our lunches. They are winning. The left, like all dictators, will control our lives. In time completely. President Obama knows exactly how we should live our lives. He will become the Plantation Overseer. Doubt not.

http://www.periodictablet.com

Standard of Living Corrections
"Sweden still has a higher standard of living than does the US..."

Not even close.

"...as does Japan and Canda I might add."

Also completely wrong. What measure are you using? Please, please, PLEASE don't tell me you are using the entirely bogus HDI figures, which was specifically designed by socialists because a measure that looks only at economic conditions makes them look bad.

The most reliable measure of living standards (subject to certain adjustments almost entirely related to oil exports) is GDP per capitaThe US has a GDP per capita of $48,000. Norway, as mentioned earlier, comes in at $57,500, ut after adjusting for the oil exports (as opposed to socialist "success", the figure is about $46,000 - not bad, but not better either.

Japan has been in the midst of a decades long economic crisis. Their GDP per capita comes in at #35,300. Canada's comes in at $40,200.

Liberals always assume that they can provide talking points that are unchallenged.

"There is no rationing in Taiwan except for example the time doctors spend on you and the wait times to see one."

That is rationing and socialized medical systems embed that into multiple layers of approval before critical needs are actually met. With the exception of a single study (by a UHC advocacy group) a couple of years ago, the evidence is universal that Americans see their doctors more quickly, more frequently and for longer periods of time (even factoring in the uninsured) than in countries with socialized medicine.

I am not personally familiar with the Taiwanese system but I regularly meet my doctor (or one of his collegaues at times ranging between 6:00 AM and 9:00 PM for bloodwork (every other month), tests every month), etc.

Terry--Part I
A neo-Nazi shares the same views as Nazis. Obama doesn't share the goals of real Marxists--he doesn't support a one-party state, the public ownership of the means of production, state ownership of the media, the army as an organ of the party, abolishment of private property and the eventual whitering of the state. He believes none of this. What he is is a left-liberal who so far is governing from the center--he first judical appointment is a moderate and has support of the GOP Senator from Indiana.

"When you have a move to nationalize banks, businesses..."

Which George W. Bush did too--I guess he is a Marxist.

"health care..."

Japan? Taiwan? Canada are Marxist then?

"environmental controls..."

The PRC which you people claim is Marxist has some of the worst environmental regulations on earth. Go take a stroll in Linfen in Shanxi some time...if you want to get black lung disease.

"...when the government owns everything, tax rates are of no concern. Do you think former Soviet citizens were ever concerned about tax rates? What about the Cubans or North Korean...think they're worried about tax rates?"

Any evidence that the government will own everything under Obama or move to a DPRK-type system?

"Obama's raising of taxes is not the ultimate goal...it will just help get to the ultimate goal."

Okay. Sure. So when George Bush did it, he was a closet Marxist too?


Forgot to mention
Sweden GDP per capita: $39,600

Last time I checked that was somewhat less than $48,000.

Terry--Part II
"Remember Obama's pledge not to raise taxes on anyone making less than $250,000.00? What difference does it make if your income tax is left the same, but you have to pay more in energy costs, taxes at the gas pumps, etc."

My gas is $1.70, under Bush last year it was $4.09.

"... and you pay more for the goods and services that you purchase from the wealthy that are having their taxes raised."

Is China going to raise its prices too? I don't fall for economic lunacy of buying only American products. I buy the cheapest products with similar quality. If the US wealthy rose their prices for their goods to pay for their increased taxes, I'd simply buy from a non-US supplier out to take US market share.


F1etch
GDP is not the measure of Standard of Living and even using GDP, the US still ranks only 12th.


Akagi demands:
"Proof please. Thank you"

But denies the same to others.

Correction
The US is #8 in GDP, but again GDP doesn't equal Standard of Living--only one element of it.


Marxist/Socialist/Centrist
"Obama doesn't share the goals of real Marxists--he doesn't support a one-party state, the public ownership of the means of production, state ownership of the media, the army as an organ of the party, abolishment of private property and the eventual whitering of the state."

Oops. The one-party state and the army as an organ of the state are aspects of applied communism to be sure, but are not aspects of Marxism. The eventual withering of the state is an aspect of the result of applied Marxism not something evidenced at the outset (and actually impossible). The distribution of bailout funds coupled with a demand that, as a result, the government has a say in the running of the resipient is, by definintion, government control of the means of production (that's overt). It is also possible to undertake the same policy indirectly (as under National Socialism - which, to be sure, contains aspects that Obama has not adopted) wherein overt ownership is disdained in favor of de facto ownership via governmen intervention with regard to wages, prices, production, etc.

I'll concede that "Marxist" is a bit much, albeit "socialist" which does not require full centralized control is inarguable.

Nothing about his governance can be described as centrist (unless the Socialist Party) is now magically, "centrist". A centrist would, by definition, either adopt positions that are neither left nor right (and there are countless leftist positions to point to) or would adopt conservative positions to offset the leftist positions (none exist).

"Which George W. Bush did too--I guess he is a Marxist."

No. He took a hard turn toward socialism, too. In fact, the whole list can be responded to with: "Marxist? Perhaps not. Socialist? Without question. Centrist? Even less defensible than the Marxist label.

Chuck
Provide proof for what exactly? Yes. When people claim Obama is not a US citizen (or not a naturally born citizen), I demand proof.

The CIA has the US at 10th in GDP--others have it at 8 others at 6. I'll accept the CIA as its year is more recent. It is ahead of Sweden (but I claimed the Standard of Living of Sweden was higher not its GDP).

Using the CIA, Liechtenstein, Qatar, Luxembourg, Bermuda, Kuwait, Norway, Jersey, Brunei and Singapore. And Singapore is freer economically as well as well as being safer, better access to medical care, education and a host of other standrd of living issues.



Standard of Living Reality
"GDP is not the measure of Standard of Living..."

GDP PER CAPITA IS. That's the economic reality. Your choice to use unreliable data instead is not my problem. Deal with it.

"...and even using GDP, the US still ranks only 12th."

Try 10th. Adjust for the imapact of oil exports (*) and we're 5th. Then consider which of those remaining leaders are TINT by comparison to the US.

1 Liechtenstein $ 118,000 2007 est.
* 2 Qatar $ 101,000 2008 est.
3 Luxembourg $ 85,100 2008 est.
4 Bermuda $ 69,900 2004 est.
* 5 Kuwait $ 60,800 2008 est.
* 6 Norway $ 57,500 2008 est.
* 7 Jersey $ 57,000 2005 est.
* 8 Brunei $ 54,100 2008 est.
9 Singapore $ 52,000 2008 est.
10 United States $ 48,000 2008 est.

Source: CIA World Factbook (before anyone says it, the World Factbook collects official data from the countries themselves so the argument that the CIA is an unreliable source that would make the US look good by comparison is compleely without merit)

Oops
"TINT?"

Sorry, "TINY".

Akagi
"Provide proof for what exactly? Yes. When people claim Obama is not a US citizen (or not a naturally born citizen), I demand proof."

___________

Your skills in Orwellian Newspeak are impressive.



F1etch
Centrist--like all labels is in the eye of the beholder. One a New Zealander told me that George Bush (41) was a right-wing b*stard and to him he probably was. To many Europeans, Clinton was right of center and Reagan the rebirth of Hitler. To those on the right, Obama is in the same camp as Kim Jong-Il.

So far, in the context of American politics, Obama has governed from the center (so did Bill Clinton by the way). As I said his first judicial nominee is a moderate not someone from the hard left.

Socialism? Depends on the eye of the beholder again. Singapore has a universal healthcare system yet in economic freedom is ranked ahead of the US (#2 against #6). Is Singapore Socialist?

F1etch
"GDP PER CAPITA IS. That's the economic reality."

It is NOT!!!!!'

It is simply one measure that makes up an overall standard of living and in many of these areas the US is wholly inadequate. I did correct the 12th to 10th as if you read my correction you would have known--perhaps it did not yet appear.

Chuck
"Your skills in Orwellian Newspeak are impressive."

No Orwellian Newspeak from me. That sentence is pretty clear--if you claim Obama is not a natural born citizen (pretty Newspeaky itself--aren't most of us born naturally?), provide proof--none has been produced.

The Newspeak is from those that suffer from ODS--calling him a Marxist when he is not and comparing him to Robert Mugabe. Disclosure: I didn't vote for Obama, but not supportive of all the insane rhetoric and charges thrown against him either.

f1etch
"Adjust for the imapact of oil exports."

Why? Mindless. The US produces more than any country except Russia and Saudi Arabia. The US simply uses more than it produces and thus it is a net importer, but those BPD still add to the US GDP--it has no effect on US GDP only on the trade deficit and balance of payments. To discount the oil producers on the list is mindless.

Also, Jersey is off the coast of France and has no oil--it's economy is based on financial and legal services. Care to show us how many BPD Jersey produces and how many it exports?


Nice try
"Centrist--like all labels is in the eye of the beholder."

I'll grant you that one.

"So far, in the context of American politics, Obama has governed from the center (so did Bill Clinton by the way)."

The statement about Clinton is defensible. The statement about Obama is not. A judicial nominee of supposed moderation does not policy make. If Obama can be classified as a centrist, there must be a policy of some kind that can be described as conservative or a collection of policies that can be described as centrist in the context of American politics. They do not exist.

"Socialism?"

I did not label countries as either socialist or not. All are hybrids by nature. I stated that the US fared better in relation to MORE socialist economies.

"It is NOT!!!!!"

Sorry. Yes it is. Standard of Living is a specific ECONOMIC measure. It cannot be modified to include other aspects (i.e., education). It is certainly true that the US is imperfect in many ways, but the supposed superiority "in many measures" of other countriesis largely mythological. Whn examined in context, for example, most of the measures that are so frequently forwarded (life expectancy, literacy, infant mortalty, healthcare adequacy), one finds that the arguments of US inadequcy do't bear much scrutiny. The conditions of the "poor" in the US, for example, are much better than much of the middle class elsewhere - including much of Europe.

You did catch the correction of the error. Your post apparently appeared while I was drafting the response.

Knowing that there are certainly areas in drastic need of improvement, in what areas do you fing the US "inadequate".

This is why...
"Why [adjust for the imapact of oil exports]?"

Because NET EXPORTS of a valuable commodity reap enormous benefits when they are measured against a small population. It is only exports that matter in this instance because production used domestically is simply economic sustenance and has no distortion effect. This is expressly why I did not say oil PRODUCERS, but rather oil EXPORTERS. It's a basic economic concept. Oil is also particulaly distortive in that many of the chief oil exporters simply have no middle class (which is the test on whether the Gini coefficient is of use or not) because all of that oil wealth falls into a few hands (typically the monarchy). In the absence of the oil export distortion, GDP per capita remains the cleanest (albeit imperfect) measure of economic conditions of the populace - that is, living standards.

"Also, Jersey is off the coast of France and has no oil..."

Congratulations. You caught me in a real error. I should not have added the asterisk to Jersey (so my count was off). It should have merely been included among the list of "tiny" examples on the list.

Is This The Beginning ????
Army Investigating How and Why Troops Were Sent Into Alabama Town After Murder Spree
Wednesday, March 18, 2009
By Pete Winn, Senior Writer/Editor




U.S. Army soldiers from Ft. Rucker patrol the downtown area of Samson, Alabama after a shooting spree March 10, 2009. (Photo: Reuters/Mark Wallheiser. Used by permission. )(CNSNews.com) - The U.S. Army has launched an inquiry into how and why active duty troops from Fort Rucker, Ala., came to be placed on the streets of Samson, Ala., during last week's murder spree in that tiny South Alabama community. The use of the troops was a possible violation of federal law.

“On March 10, after a report of an apparent mass murder in Samson, Ala., 22 military police soldiers from Fort Rucker, Ala., along with the provost marshal, were sent to the city of Samson,” Harvey Perritt, spokesman for the U.S. Army Training and Doctrine Command (TRADOC) at Fort Monroe, Va., told CNSNews.com on Monday.

f1etch
Oil has no more effect than does anything else of value--say gold. Oil produced by the US has no less impact on GDP than does oil produced in say Nigeria. Eliminating a state as on oil producer makes no more sense than eliminating a banking center like Jersey or Singapore (which you tried to do anyway).

And even if you through your Al Gore supporter like tactics, get the US as #1 in world GDP per capita, the US still lags at 12th or so in standard of living. On YOUR list the US may be #1 in standard of living, but in reality a number of countries are ahead of it.

America is falling apart as the Moochers
........seize control.
The Libertarian Slant has a good blog on this today.
Sorry but those bonuses were promised before AIG fell. They shouldn't have been bailed out at all but since they were shouldn't the individuals who did hit their goals be compensated?
http://jasonfalter.wordpress.com/2009/03/18/america-is-fall ing-apart-as-the-moochers-seize-control/

Akagi
"No Orwellian Newspeak from me. That sentence is pretty clear--if you claim Obama is not a natural born citizen (pretty Newspeaky itself--aren't most of us born naturally?), provide proof--none has been produced."

How about the obverse?

The controversy has arisen due to his inability or his unwillingness to provide proof of his credentials, not due to an inability or unwillingness of his critics to provide proof of their charges.

Only someone intellectually dishonest would attempt to turn the controversy around like you just tried to do and make the plaintiff the defendant.

Akagi
You are using the same debate tactics that are common practice by those on the Left.

I make statements about the totality of Obama's goals and you come back parsing each and every claim as an independent object.

Let me give you an analogy as it pertains to your "Terry Part I".

Just because a guy might drink too much, doesn't mean he's a bad guy.

Just because a guy gambles too much, doesn't mean he's a bad guy.

Just because a guy can't hold a steady job, doesn't necessarily mean he's a bad guy.

Just because a guy smokes some dope, doesn't mean he's a bad guy.

Just because a guy has had three divorces, doesn't mean he's a bad person.

And just because a guy is fat and lazy doesn't make him a bad guy either.

But if a guy is fat and lazy, smokes dope, drinks too much, gambles too much and can't hold a steady job and has had three failed marriages...he's a screw-up!

Obama wants to nationalize health care. Obama wants to nationalize education. Obama wants to nationalize energy. Obama wants to nationalize the banking system. Obama wants to redistribute wealth, admittedly so.

I take the totality of what Obama is doing, then add to it his background and associates, his so-called "community organizing",his relationship with ACORN, Jeremiah Wright, Bill Ayers and his studies of Saul Alinsky and yes, I conclude: Marxist.


f1etch
Standard of living is not just an economic measure as they say Man doesn't live by bread alone. The US health system ranks below Costa Rica's and dead last of industralized nations, access to education, quality of education, levels of violence, and on and on--all impact the standard of living and in these areas the US lags well behind its industrialized and even NIC peers.


Terry
"Obama wants to nationalize education."

Too late--done by George W. Bush.

"Obama wants to nationalize the banking system."

Too late--done by George W. Bush

"Obama wants to redistribute wealth, admittedly so."

Yes. So does every other president. That is the US system using a progressive tax code. a 4% rise in the tax rate is not exactly a march to Marxism.

You called him a Marxist that is a very narrow definition of what a Marxist is and he is not one.

Nationalize energy? Really? When does Exxon become government owned?



standard of living
But Akagi, who cares about health care, education, gun violence, etc. when you have money! That's all that matters to most conservatives...as long as I have more money than everyone else, it's all good.

Chuck
"The controversy has arisen due to his inability or his unwillingness to provide proof of his credentials, not due to an inability or unwillingness of his critics to provide proof of their charges."

Overwhelming proof has been offered. A certificate of live birth which is what Hawai'i (and a host of other states call their birth certificate)and pointed out by Factcheck.org looks exactly like the one of a staff member of factcheck who was born in Hawai'i about the same time, birth announcements in two Hawai'i newspapers, witnesses in Washington State (who say Obama a few weeks after his birth).

No a single thread of proof. It is up to fools like you to prove Obama was born outside the US--and there is none. This is as crazy as the Clinton Chronicles. The plaintiffs in this case are a bunch of loons who aren't playing with a full deck as it were.


Jason
It is true that these people were promised these bonuses before AIG fell and many of them continued to do their jobs as they were instructed. I am watching as the likes of Barney Franks are grilling Liddy about these bonuses. Liddy clear said that Geithner knew of these bonuses well ahead of time. You can be sure that Obama and his crew are now ranting about what they will do to the people who got the bonuses to take the attention away from them. Mr. Liddy just read some of the threats that the employees of AIG are getting. This is disgraceful. Obama knew what was going on, Geithner knew what was going on and Certainly Dodd knew when he slipped that amendment into the stimulus bill. This administration is so busy trying to shift focus away from what they are and are not doing. I just read that many of Obama's proposals will cost far more than they have stated. Won't it be great if we get universal healthcare that costs 4 times more than we expect. Where will the money come from. This government is out of control and to worry about some bonuses that some people probably deserved and were promised is taking focus from the real problems. The country is going further and further into debt for the Pelosi, Reid, Obama socialism plan.

Continuing
"Oil has no more effect than does anything else of value--say gold."

I never argued otherwise. If the GDP per capita figures were materially altered by gold exports (because it is only the export function that has a distortion effect), then a similar adjustment would be warranted. The fact remains that no other commodity has anywhere near the export impact than does oil.

Again, standard of living is ENTIRELY an economic calculation; "quality of life" is certainly another matter, but the realtaive ranking of such a measure is extremely difficut due to the subjetive nature of the standards.

The WHO health rankings have been LONG debunked as utter and complete nonsense. It presumes as a matter of course that socialized medicine provides better care, it compares life expectancy and infant mortality as if a) these things were not more dependent upon genetics and behavior than care quality and b) there are huge differences in the collection of this data (most countries do not use the official standard for determining whether or not to include an infant in the mortality statistics excluding deaths that occur as much as a week after birth.

The US higher eductaion system is the envy of the world (only the public schools lag behind and, in fact, many Europeans have school choice). The lieracy levels in the US are comparable or better than elsewhere in the world, particularly when looking at the native population. Secondary language speakers are included in the data so some countries have an advantage (no one's clamoring to get into Cuba).

Levels of violence is a legitimate point but how much of that is cultural as opposed to subject to societal redress?

In sum, much of the comparisons are based on factual inaccuracies or incompatible data and the non-economic figures reate to quality of life rather than standard of living.

Akagi
"Overwhelming proof has been offered."

If that is the case, then why didn't you appeal to that, instead of relying on a logical fallacy?

Akagi
How do you make the claim that George Bush wanted to nationalize banks? Although I disagreed with his bailout, where did George Bush want to further regulate the banks? The complaint by Democrats was that the Bush Administration wanted to further "deregulate" the banks, remember?

Bush wanted to nationalize education? George Bush supported "vouchers" and in eight years, I don't recall President Bush being an advocate of everyone being "entitled" to a college education at taxpayers expense...as Obama has already advocated?

A 4% tax increase...you think that is the sum of Obama's plan? A 4% increase on the wealthy won't even pay for his so-called "stimulus bill". Then add to it the mortgage bailouts, health care, education, Cap and Trade, the Omnibus Bill and every other little social program that he comes out with seemingly every other day...where is the money for this going to come from?

And no doubt, you'll be out here a few months from now defending Obama, after he has regretfully announced to the nation, that because of the "hard times we face" (or some such pablum), that we all have to "sacrifice" and "pitch-in" and that we have no choice but to raise taxes across the board.

So not only will his actions cost us more jobs, increased prices on what we pay for good services (to cover the tax increases on the wealthy), but we too will have our taxes raised as well.

You have to add-up the sum of all the parts, Akagi. You can't just look at each thing he does as if it is in a vaccum by itself.

terry you are correct
You have listed a number of policy items that Obama has undertaken that are unabashedly liberal. I am still waiting for that list of policies that can be characterized as either conservative (as an offset) or centrist/moderate.

f1etch
Some US universities are and they do have 3 of the top 5 (which include the top 2), 6 of the top 10, 14 of the top 20, 20 of the top 50, 36 of the top 100, and 57 of the top 200.

But most of the US universities are no better than what you'd find say in I don't know Eastern Europe or Africa. Again, Standard of Living is not simply an economic measure not withstanding your desire to make it so.

Using the Economist's Quality of Life Index the US ranks 13 and this publication is hardly a left-wing rag. As for quality of living of cities a US city doesn't make the list until #27 (Honolulu) and then #28 (SF) neither very popular cities with conservatives.




Terry
I'm not a pitch in and sacrifice sorta guy. I am not defending Obama per se. I am demanding you use accurate terms is all.

NCLB? How was that not a Federal take over of the US K-12 system?

Chuck:

Care to explain which logical fallacy I am accused of?

Denise
Don't bother with answers to Tammy. It is obvious she cannot grasp the economic principles in the article. The greatest travesty of public education in gubmint schools is the lack of instruction in basic economic principles. Of course, I wouldn't trust gubmint schools to teach the factual concepts so we're all screwed. I, like you, cannot wait until Oblahma and ALL of Congress leave office.

Akagi
You said, "Care to outline the exact crimes Obama has engaged in?"

My answer:

Obama is sworn to protect and defend the constitution. That means his PRIMARY and most important job is to watch over Congress to insure that they act according to the enumerated powers vested in them. (That's why he is an "executive".) He has allowed this Congress, as well as other Presidents before him who have allowed theirs, to create laws and taxes that fly in the face of their power to act. What's worse is he not only supports their actions, he signs on to them by his approval. Is that a big enough set of crimes for ya?

What about borrowing money?
Inflation will also cause higher interest rates on bonds we sell to other countries. Wouldn't it also cause countries currently holding our bonds to want to dump them as well?

Definitions and Data Validity
"But most of the US universities are no better than what you'd find say in I don't know Eastern Europe or Africa."

Pure fiction.

"Again, Standard of Living is not simply an economic measure not withstanding your desire to make it so."

I am an economist. "Quality of Life" is not an economic calculation (albeit it includes economic factors); "standard of living" is. Standard of Living is DEFINED as an economic measure not withstanding your desire to make it otherwise.

Actual economists recognize that "The Economist" is consistently left of center (unabashedly Keynesian to say the least).

At least you’ve given a list that can be evaluated along with the underlying data (conveniently called a "quality of life" index). Much of the data selection though is subject to contention. Material Wellbeing (standard of living) tops the list; Health comes in at number 2, but life expectancy, heavily influenced by genetics and behavior is notably suspect as a useful variable; Political Stability suffers from a lack of objective quantification; Family Life sounds good, too, but the divorce rate is so influenced by culture rather than life quality; the dummy value for Community Life is useless; Climate and Geography is completely outside of human control so not at all useful; Job Security is a perfectly acceptable inclusion; Political Freedom is also of value (I find the IEF’s measure valuable but Freedom House’s is fine; and Gender Equality is useless (in the US, the REAL differential is less than 2% for men/women in comparable jobs with comparable experience, the oft-repeated 22 cent differential is almost entirely due to career choice.

Defend and protect
Well perhaps then we should arrest George W. Bush then--he violated the Constitution a good deal didn't he? He even signed into law a law he himself said was unconstitutional but signed it anyway in hopes the courts would agree with his analysis--sadly they didn't and the US now has McCain-Feingold.

I suppose we could have charge Reagan with the same thing. Isn't violating a US law grounds? Did he not understand the TRA? If so then why did he sign the Third Communique with China?




Akagi
The plan below is what Ovomit is following.

"World dictatorship can be established only when the victory of socialism has been achieved in certain countries or groups of countries … [and] when these federation of republics have finally grown into a world union of Soviet Socialist Republics uniting the whole of mankind under the hegemony of the international proletariat organized as a state." ..Joseph Stalin

And.."If the opposition (citizen) disarms, well and good. If it refuses to disarm, we shall disarm it ourselves."..Joseph Stalin

MerryColin
Some "government" schools are bad and some are outstanding. Some private schools (and these tend to be protestant Christian schools) are no better than your average public school.

I'll put Walton High School in metro Atlanta (a public school) against any prep school you want to bring me. Walton students score 150 points on math and verbal over the national average.


Goshawk
Sure he is. Obama is Stalin. Okay. You did a lot of drugs back in the 60s did you?

Akagi
Why would you consult a document or publication to determine the place with the best "Quality of Life"...when you have reality to turn to?

How many folks around the world are flocking to Asia, Europe or Africa? Yet we have'em waiting for years to immigrate here and millions more coming illegally. Shouldn't that tell you something?

Akagi
Walton High went into lockdown yesterday because of a threatening note.

And over the last 3 years, they're about 4 points above the national average in Math - on the ACT. Of course, most any school that isn't in the slums of NY, LA, Detroit, Chicago, Miami...can probably get 4 points above the national average.

Tell Congress NO to Bonuses and waste
Tired of seeing bill after bill with more bailouts and deficits as far as the eye can see?

Tired of having big corporate bonuses paid for with YOUR tax dollars?

Follow the link and send a message to your members of congress.

Tell them you’re sick of the waste! Tell them you’ll HOLD THEM ACCOUNTABLE.

Tell them to STOP the Spending!

http://www.conservativeoutpost.com/campaign/cta/stop_spendi ng

Akagi
Ovomit is Stalin??? Nahh.. Like you, Ovomit is a student and follower of these insane dictators teachings!

Even Ben Has Fallen For Liberal Lies
This entire article is living proof that even conservatives see the world through liberal lenses. Liberals have cleverly orchestrated the belief that Capitalism is an "economic system" that we the people have the freedom to engage in or reject in favor of some other "economic system." If conservatives would start seeking the truth, and not just try to make sense of what liberals tell them, there wouldn't be any confusion about what capitalism is or is not, and whether capitalism is favorable or unfavorable.

To be clear, capitalism is not something that can be created or destroyed. Capitalism is not something that Obama or Geithner can change, pervert, redefine, retool, alter or abridge. Capitalism is not a system in and of itself; it is the RESULT of the people's execution of our Founding Law. All other "economic systems" are the result of the people's violation of our Founding Law, which is the reason why all other "economic systems" exist in opposition to capitalism. It is now your duty as an American to identify and execute this all-important, all-encompassing Founding Law. To uncover our Founding Law, you must start with our Founding Documents.

Goshawk
Actually one can learn much for Stalin. He was after all able to rule with an iron fist (which fits his adopted name of steel)for decades. Obama is no Stalin. There are American Stalins, but not in government--the American dictators prefer business. The American system limits your ability for power inside government--a good thing.

Terry
Walton is 150 points over the national average and their SAT scores are on par with Westminster, Paces, Woodward or any other of these high prized priced schools in the city.

A lockdown has nothing to do with the quality of the education you get at Walton. Walton is also known to have issues with drugs, but I bet the same can be said for Westminster and anyplace else.


akagi = contrarian
Akagi's goal in here is debate for debate's sake, not enlightenment, so do not be surprised when he seeks to find fault with someone's statement. Case in point, to prove Obama is not a marxist he directs us to someone else's actions, Bush's in this case. This fails as an application of logic, as Bush is not the one under discussion.

Lenard
Hardly. The claim was Obama was a Marxist and to back up that foolish claim, used the claim that Obama was going to take over the banking system (which even if he did wouldn't make him a Marxist--until the 1990s almost every bank in Taiwan was owned either by the national government or the provincial government. The chief exception was ChinaTrust headed by Koo Fu-chen (who led the Taiwan delegation in 1993 for the first direct talks with China since the end of the civil war). Was Taiwan Marxist? No.

I correctly pointed out that Bush did a pretty good job at nationalization of both the education and banking system, so if Obama is a Marxist, so was Bush. I doubt few here will make the claim Bush was a Marxist and if Bush isn't neither is Obama.


akagi
15 minutes!! Busy day? Anyway, case in point.

Akagi
I just thought it was funny that you mentioned Walton, when they were just in lock-down yesterday. That's all.

But again, you cite individual examples; "Walton High", to make a case for public schools. Sure there are some good public schools, no doubt about that. But it is the OVERALL that we generally refer to in forums. And even public school officials, administrators and teachers will readily admit that public schools are not as good as the private ones. They come-up with every excuse in the world as to why, but yet admit private schools are better.

Do you not know that?

Terry
Most of the people who are coming to the US are coming from states with much lower standards than exists in the US. People in Sweden aren't breaking down the door to come to the US (I think last year I saw was 500 immigrant visas from Sweden).

Second, you have to say, while there are countries with more liberal immigration systems, the US is one of the most liberal and many countries that have a higher standard say Japan for example have a much more strict immigration system. To test who is the best based on voting with their feet, you'd have to have an open immigration system outgoing and incoming for every country on earth and that just doesn't exist. Of the top ten countries that send immigrants to the US--only Canada and Ireland are fully developed countries (unless you want to add the ROK to the list).

Usually people don't immigrate to countries with lower standards of living and since only a dozen or so countries have a higer standard than the US and the fact Americans make awful immigrants and have this rather strong degree of chauvinism, it is no suprise many more people are trying to get into the US than those leaving it. But the same goes for Sweden too except maybe the chauvinism and poor immigrant part.


Take to the Streets!!!
Shapiro is dead on correct. Obama must be stopped NOW or he will drive the country into an economic downward spiral which will allow him to assume extraordinary powers. This Chicago slime ball, socialist bast*rd must be blocked decisively. There is not a moment to be lost. Flood the streets and scream your dissent at congress!!

Glenn Beck is being characterized as a madman by MSM. He's a prophet; he's one of a handful of who understands the magnitude of the crisis facing this country. Remember, Sam Adams was viewed as borderline deranged by many of his contemporaries. We all know how that story ended.

WAKE UP, AMERICA, OR DIE IN YOUR SLEEP !!!

Terry
There are good public schools (Walton, the P'tree City ones, some N. Fulton, West Cobb like Harrison, etc) and bad ones--Crim HS in Atlanta, Meadowcreek in Gwinnett.

But there are bad from an academic point of view private ones too. Many of the Christian ones are not that expensive, they don't hire really any better than the public schools do and don't pay all that well. I saw one school charges $12 a day. I also know its students aren't all that hot either, but the parents put their children in there for ideology not the academics.

Socialism fails!
Capitalism isn't failing, capitalism is being sabotaged. It's being sabotaged by governmental socialist policies and bailouts.

Stop the madness ... attend a Tea Party this April 15th!

Akagi
What do you really know about Sweden? How much time have you spent in Sweden, that you've got a good feel for whether Swedes are chauvenistic or not?

Is "Sweden" the last buzz-word for the Left? I've been hearing "Sweden" among the Left, ever since their banking system was mentioned a few weeks back.

Or is it that you just sit back and any time anyone mentions something good about the United States, you rush right out to try and find where someone else in the world is better?

If someone mentions that Portland, Oregon grows the best tulips, do you try and find where someone else has better ones, like, maybe...Sweden?

What exactly is it that you Leftists get out of trying to find everything wrong with your own country? What do you actually get out of that? What makes you folks try so hard to destroy everything that is American, just because we aren't perfect? Do you folks actually see your positions on things and the great lengths that you will go to continually put-down your own country, as some sort of virtuousity?

There isn't a person on this board; including you, that would trade-in what we have in the United States for 10 Swedens! And you damn well know that.

Terry
A number of reasons why private schools do better overall:

First, they do pick and choose and the PS system doesn't have this luxary. I know of a Christian school in the Atlanta metro that refused to admit a girl who had ADHD. Second, since the top schools charge 12, 15 and 20 thousand dollars a year you get frankly a better crop of students. Third, and most important, as parents who did well academically and who are paying thousands of dollars they are very involved in their child's education. Walton (in one of the most expensive areas of metro Atlanta)shares this in common with the good private schools like say Westminster--parent involvement.

Too many parents see the PS system as a babysitting service. Look at the quality of students and parents at Crim and compare them to Walton? How many Crim students are on welfare? live in a one-parent (or no parent) home? A good many. And Crim? 18% graduate compared to Walton's 97% and the SATs? Only 4 students took the test last year so who knows, but last time results were published a total 685 math/verbal score, 330 points below the national average. Sending a kid to Crim should be considered child abuse.


Akagi

In the last 6 months, the Fed Res. and the fed. govt. have tripled the amount of money in circulation. If you fail to believe that inflation is on its way, I am sorry. The govt. cannot inject that kind of money into circulation without causing inflation. Add to that, the amount of money that is sitting on the sidelines because investors removed their funds from the markets.

Terry
How do you know what I'd trade? Sweden for me? No. Too cold and I dislike their diet.

Actually at least one of the two countries I am rather fond of actually in most categories ranks behind the US. The US beats it in most categories--standard of living, its best university is ranked 124th (the US best ranked #1), quality of life index 21st compared to the US 13th, economic freedom, transparency, GDP 40th against 10th and on and on. The US doesn't have to fear waking up one morning to see an invading fleet off the west coat either. So you don't know what I'll trade.


Denise
When faced with deflation, that is the point is it not? Inflation?

Akagi on schools etc.
First, kids with learning issues in public shool here in Az receive additional monies for their needs. Private schools do not.

The Goldwater Institute here just published the actual dollar figure spent on each student for public school here in Az.

The figure is 9,000.00 per student and change. Charter schools receive less.

My children went to a private school. The tuition for that private Christian school is now approaching 8,000.00 per year, and it is very comparable to others in the valley.

Bottom line, private schools here for the most part are receiving less money than public schools for tuition. And as to refusing students because of disabilities?

There may be some, but that is highly problematic and rare here.

Public schools in my area have less than 5% of those types of students.

And as to parental involvement. That is of minimal impact when the curriculum and teaching is so poor, and politicized that learning becomes secondary.

Denise on inflation
Some recent history supports your point. LBJ printed lots on moeny to pay for the Vietnam war.

Many economists at that time warned of inflation dangers to the economy that this printing of money woud bring.

The 70s were not the best period. Stagflation, and I remember interest rates well over 10%.

A goodly part of it due to printing money, much like today.

I think you are right, deflation is an economic theory that could happen. It has had a model for it that I have studied, but who knows.

Terry
Curious and looked at your blog. Advice from me to you. Unless you like SPAM, I'd remove my email address from that webpage or at least change it to youremail(at)bellsouth.net. Real people will know to remove the (at) SPAM bots won't--other examples are youremail@(NO SPAM--Remove When Sending)bellsouth.net.

SPAM bots search millions and millions of webpages looking for people foolish enough to put their email up in plain text on a website. They harvest them and bundle them and sell them to spammers. I once saw a claim of 10 billion email addresses for sale (only 6 billion people on earth).

Just my advice.


Anderson
By in the 1960s the US wasn't facing deflation either but the opposite--the Great Society programs and Vietnam and the Space race and everything ran up the debt. What killed Bretton Woods was the US exporting inflation and Europe having enough of it. The US told Japan it would support the dollar-gold parity and the Japanese bought dollars and then the US pulled the rug out by unilaterally pulling out of Bretton Woods--Japan called in Nixon shock--and now holding basically piles of worthless dollars.

Inflation--especially in the real estate sector would be great right about now.

Anderson
Interest rates were over 20%. A good deal of that inflation was due to Oil Shock II as energy prives (and everything else of course) went through the roof as well as the left over effects of Vietnam.

Oil prices are stable at what $44. Housing continues to lose ground. Inflation is at $0.24% basically zero compared to over 4% a year ago--inflation isn't a concern at this point.

What Is This ????

Army Investigating How and Why Troops Were Sent Into Alabama Town After Murder Spree
Wednesday, March 18, 2009
By Pete Winn, Senior Writer/Editor

U.S. Army soldiers from Ft. Rucker patrol the downtown area of Samson, Alabama after a shooting spree March 10, 2009. (Photo: Reuters/Mark Wallheiser. Used by permission. )(CNSNews.com) - The U.S. Army has launched an inquiry into how and why active duty troops from Fort Rucker, Ala., came to be placed on the streets of Samson, Ala., during last week's murder spree in that tiny South Alabama community. The use of the troops was a possible violation of federal law.

“On March 10, after a report of an apparent mass murder in Samson, Ala., 22 military police soldiers from Fort Rucker, Ala., along with the provost marshal, were sent to the city of Samson,” Harvey Perritt, spokesman for the U.S. Army Training and Doctrine Command (TRADOC) at Fort Monroe, Va., told CNSNews.com on Monday.

Kindling For The Inflationary Fire

Today, the Federal Reserve announced as whole slew of new programs to "get our economy back on track." The price tag?

1) $300bn to buy govt. bonds so as to decrease mortgage rates. This is the first time since the inflationary period of the 1960s.

2) $750bn to buy more toxic assets, which is on top of the $500bn that it has already spent.

3) Up to $1T for bank stabilization.

Add these to the tripling of the currency in circulation in the last 6 months and the amount of money sitting on the sidelines due to investors' fears and we will likely face serious inflation once the deflationary cycle we are in now ends.

Akagi
Are you mad because you were not lucky enough to be born an American citizen? Your envy for America and Americans is obvious. Since you love Taiwan and China so much and obviously are ignorant of the economic principles America was founded and flourished on why don't you take your America hating a$$ back to the land you love and hold in such high esteem? Why stay in a country you hate? I am sure a REAL American would be glad to have your job.

As far as healthcare is concerned, I don't hear about people from all over the world traveling to Taiwan for their medical care. Also America already has universal health coverage since any one of those "42 million uninsured" can walk (or be carried) into ANY hospital in America and get treated for ANY life threatening condition they may have, whether they can pay for it or not. And for non-life threatening problems every major city has public health clinics they can go to for treatment...FOR FREE.

Akagi
Nixon closed the gold window, effectively stating we were insolvent in 1972.

Yes, the space race, etc. ran up debt, but it took some time for inflatin to creep in. I was around during price controls under Nixon, and all of the economic chatter that went on about it.

What proved to be right was that printing of money for whatever reason, had led to dramatic inflation and stagflation.

Inflation may not be a problem today, that is true, but that may change shortly. And nearly all effects form printing too much money take some time to see.

A perfect example of printing money to cover debts was postwar Germany after WW1 to pay reparations. To summarize what they did, they printed so much money, it became worthless, but all debts were paid. The government fulfilled its obligations, but it broke the middle class.

Interesting parallel.

Never a Dem
"Are you mad because you were not lucky enough to be born an American citizen?"

And you know this how? I am pretty sure I have never disclosed my citizenship status directly, what countries I have citizenship in or how I obtained them. As for people not rushing to Taiwan for medical care, well unless you are a ROC citizen or if I am correct an immediate relative of an ROC citizen you are ineligible for the UHI program.

6% of GDP against 16%, $900 per person against nearly $7000. The results speak for themselves.

A report by the Urban Institute showed that 22,000 people die each year in the US due to lack of health coverage. Sure sounds like universal health care to me.

"Why stay in a country you hate?"

Apathy isn't the same as hate.

Love for China? And where did you get this from?

China and I don't get along so well. Perhaps you missed my comments on the Pat Buchanan column in regards to the esteemed panda hugger, Chas Freeman. Few pro-China types would name their blog what I named mine.




Anderson
Well. There are ways to control the fire once this starts to happen but at present you face the danger of deflation which is no less awful than inflation.


Akagi
Yes, you are correct about deflation. China, India and Japan will be a very big part of the deflation dynamic. The Yuan is pegged to the dollar, they hold vast notes,

Perhaps the Chinese have a certain interest in a deflationary period. Deflation would offer a competitive edge since many players could not compete in such a situation.

Your thoughts?

Never A Dem

Akagi is telling you the truth about his hatred of China. We have had several conversations about China, most recently concerning the (thankfully) aborted nomination of Chas Freeman.

Anderson
Wen Jiabao is concerned over China's investments in US paper. I don't think it would welcome seeing its paper worth less.

I don't see how deflation in the US helps China excpet that it could buy up US assets cheaper, but then its investments already in the US become worth less as well--so seems to me deflation is at best a push for China.


Akagi
Interesting thought on the push situation with China on deflation.

I wonder, whose currency will stand out in value in the next 36 months or longer? Whose currency will escape inflation and the ravages of currency traders?


STFU Wobbie!

It's your f-ing loser who is f-ing up NOW!

Bush is home in TX.

Go take your BDS meds.

Maybe, you can bring the wonderful, inflatable Mrs. Wonder Wobbie to eat on top of a Great Pyramid. Yes, it has a restaurant on its pinnacle, just like the Parthenon had a cafe!

Capitalism and Bush
For 6+ years the economy expanded under George Bush. Then, an amazing thing happened in November 2006. The Democrats regained their power in Congress. They promised change, and that's what we eventually got. When Nancy and the boys started their magic, things started going south, slowly at first, then gaining momentum. Robert, you can blame Bush all you want, but follow the time line and you'll see the signals when Democrat policies started bearing "fruit." The financial collapse was an orchestrated event, possibly by George. Yes, George. Not Bush, but Soros. His fingerprints are all over this collapse. There is a Pulitzer waiting for the brace "journalist" who seeks the truth.

"Dr" Dougie..............




.........sorry it took me so long to check in. Hope you didn't think I forgot about you.

As usual, you, sir, are an idiot.

Robert misses again
"The Republic cannot survive another
8 years of capitalism as practiced by Bush and the GOP"

__________


But rather than oppose Obama's continuing it on steroids, Robert would rather argue about the non-existent threat of Bush.

Robbie, he's no longer in office.


Akagi
"I correctly pointed out that Bush did a pretty good job at nationalization of both the education and banking system, so if Obama is a Marxist, so was Bush. I doubt few here will make the claim Bush was a Marxist and if Bush isn't neither is Obama."

_________


If you are so confident of the rightness of your postion, why do you argue so deceitfully?

Your Obama psychophancy is appalling.

A quote that fits:
"The way to crush the bourgeoisie is to grind them between the millstones of taxation and inflation. "

Vladimir Lenin

Another from Trotsky;

"There is a limit to the application of democratic methods. You can inquire of all the passengers as to what type of car they like to ride in, but it is impossible to question them as to whether to apply the brakes when the train is at full speed and accident threatens"

Leon Trotsky

One last Lenin:

"The best way to destroy the capitalist system is to debauch the currency'.

Vladimir Lenin

Akagi has made good points about Americans not knowing history. WOuld anyone who knows history have voted for someone who has roots in this type of an economic system?

National disgrace
233 years of difficult but unending progress are being rapidly destroyed by Obama and the Obama Administration.

I posted this on other threads but:
If the times fit:

"Owners of capital will stimulate the working class to buy more and more of expensive goods, houses and technology, pushing them to take more and more expensive credits, until their debt becomes unbearable. The unpaid debt will lead to bankruptcy of banks, which will have to be nationalized, and the State will have to take the road which will eventually lead to communism.”

— Karl Marx, 1867, Das Kapital

Universal Health Care is a FAILURE
"A report by the Urban Institute showed that 22,000 people die each year in the US due to lack of health coverage. Sure sounds like universal health care to me."

Actually, the figure from the NIH indicates the number of people who die from "delays receiving care". It is used as a de facto substitute for "lack of insurance", but that is for a country with over 300 MILION people. The track record for countries with universal (sic) care is NO BETTER - at least as many die PER CAPITA in countries with socialized medicine.

Not the baseless...
...adverse selection canard again.

"First, they do pick and choose and the PS system doesn't have this luxary. I know of a Christian school in the Atlanta metro that refused to admit a girl who had ADHD."

The claim that private schools do better because they can pick and choose their students is pure, baseless, liberal drivel repeated as gospel without any actual facts (largely because they don't exist. Instead we get anecdotes about how some schools deny admittance. That's true, but there are also private schools who specialize in students with special needs, special family circumstances, children that have been expelled from public schools, etc. For some bizarre reason - dishonesty, that it doesn't suit their agenda, etc. - THOSE examples never seem to make it into the anecdotes.

Addressing economic absurdities
"What killed Bretton Woods was the US exporting inflation and Europe having enough of it."

By no means. Europe was engaged in the same expansionist monetary policies. The agreement was never sustainable in any event. But that isn't the real problem. The real problem is that it is complete economic incompetence to argue that inflation is EVER economically beneficial - ever, under any circumstances. The whole premise is ludicrous.

What a bunch of crap
Every Empire falls, an America is coming up to bat. We dont have a truly free market system. We dont have true capitalism. We practice exclusive socialism. Rich folks and corporations hide behind the corporate veils and sheild themselves from taxes. Very few corporations pay the full corporate tax rate. Hell how many small companies operate for years and decades without ever showing a profit to be taxed on. If you anyone thinks this is about Obama you are foolish. The derailment of capitalism started way back with the adoption of the federal reserve system. It is not even federal! Its a bunch damn private rich folks controlling the flow of US money. Thats bullish. We can never pay off the debt, the money is not even in circulation. Break away from the fed system. And live the ISM's alone socialism, capitalism, racism, and stupidism alone. Wise up people George W, started us on this path. The PNAC has plans for America, and unfrotunately the plan is to destroy the middle class. You will have two extremes the super rich and the super poor. next thing you know we will see talk about the AMERO.

Anderson
The Yuan because it is protected. Look at 1997 when Soros attacked the Asian currencies starting with the Thai Baht. The Yuan is undervalued and China keeps it this way to give it a competitive advantage in trade--a modern day form of beggar thy neighbor. This is something that has vexed the US, but the overall relationship seen as too important to push too hard on the Yuan's value.

Obama's puts his faith...
... in the Saul Alinsky "community organizing" model. Under Alinsky's prescription, the "community organizer" highlights and dramatizes his neighbor's "discontents". In the present situation, Obama-- as president-- has the power to actually INTRODUCE economic dislocation and destabilization in order to MAKE SURE we ARE "discontented".

How much longer before Barak Hussein begins introducing socialist principles as "the answer to our problems"?

JPL17
I suspect that what you say is more true than not. It's why I have practically begged over the past few months that the regs especially not respond to the likes of Tammy, Robbie, Hal, and other kuckieloos. It just encourages more of the same and intelligent info sharing gets lost because most of us cannot afford to stay on here forever just to glean a little help. I try to pass over them. Please try to do the same.

If I Didn't Believe
what Shapiro says, I'd be tempted to say let's just watch so we can see what "trickle 'up' economics" can do. Then I thought about it again and I said to me - What the H*ll!! Are you freakin' nuts??????

Development
"There is a limit to the application of democratic methods. You can inquire of all the passengers as to what type of car they like to ride in, but it is impossible to question them as to whether to apply the brakes when the train is at full speed and accident threatens"

He was right in regards to developing countries. Democracy is not a good idea in this regard. Look at the Asian Tigers, before they became tigers, none were a democracy.


The sky is falling! The sky is falling!
Ohforgodsake, TH readers. Grow the **ck up. Obama is not ending American capitalism. No matter what your right-wingnuts tell you, capitalism is alive and well in every single EU country. The expansion of social services and economic regulation that has been a fact of life now for nearly a century in Western Europe has not, repeat not, "ended capitalism." The theorists and policyi-makers who created the modern welfare state had no intention of ending capitalism and in fact didn't end it.

Exactly which country do you think has ended capitalism? Does the government of France or Germany or the UK or Italy or even Sweden own what the Marxists call the 'means of production?' Nah, not even close. In fact, the welfare state has been maintained by governments left, right, and center, with a variety of changes, for a very long time now.

What you folks really don't like is the thought that just maybe, just possibly, government regulation might impose restraints on corporate managers who would otherwise pile up massive debt with technically arcane financial instruments and reward themselves for doing so. The other thing you guys don't like is the possibility that healthcare might not remain what economists call a 'market good.' (look it up)

To Gestell
Thank you.

As a devotee of townhall, I would like to explain to you how townhallers think. Today in my morning paper I read about an incident in which, at a public demonstration, an American woman accused an immigrant of spitting on her and an air of angry retaliation soon spread through the crowd. Then a man went over to her, laid his hand on her shoulder, and said gently, "Did he really spit on you?". "No," she answered, "but he could have."

In townhall you are dealing with folks who think not only in terms of all-or-nothing but of "he could do"---and "could do" soon becomes "actually did". A couple of weeks ago there was a thread on which somebody suggested that if Obama gets universal health care, he might ration medical services. Then followed a series of posts (to the same thread!) on which you could trace the development of something else entirely: "Obama MIGHT ration care" became "Obama WILL withhold medical care from the elderly" to "Obama IS establishing gulags where the elderly will be sent to die without medical care". There is a great appetite here for hysterical, ill-informed, and baseless rumor based on misrepresentation and distortion---and as long as it's what people want to hear, they believe it. I suspect that this is being modeled by Conservative talk radio, but that's another story. How information is given, received, processed, and applied is endlessly fascinating.

To B2 Slim
Did you ever see that old Lucille Ball skit in which she plays a vaudeville guy who goes crazy every time he hears the word "Chicago"? Every time somebody says "Chicago" he does this "Slowly I turn" routine and goes nuts, starts beating up on everybody. Just hearing the word "Chicago" sets her off. So now I am reading your posts, and I am wondering if we are supposed to react that way, because you don't write in sentences. You don't express a thought. You just write lists of words you hope we will find scary, like Soros! Hollywood! So what are you saying, Soros is good to his mother? Hollywood is in California? You seem to think we will all start foaming at the mouth if you just breathe a poisonous word at us. Why don't you see if you can write a sentence to show us what you mean? Then we can have a conversation. PS, a hint: If you don't actually know what some of the words mean, or who some of the people are, google them. Wikipedia is a good place to start.

Americans Are Waking Up
Americans are waking up to the fact that the Obama administration does not know what to do about the economy because they haven't a clue what caused the meltdown.

This economic situation has been predicted for decades by those people who are true free market capitalists such as Ludwig von Mises, Murray Rothbard and Congressman Ron Paul.

The Federal Reserve was founded by Congress in 1913 to keep the US economy from experiencing the normal ups and downs of a free market system.

It only took 15 years before the Great Depression came along and proved that government intervention not only does not solve the problem but makes it worse by delaying the necessary market corrections.

Government intervention and central planning is not Capitalism/Free Market economics but is Socialism that leads to Marxism/Communism when the central government planning replaces individual consumer choices.

Capitalism in a true free market allows people to use their own discretion as to what bank they want to deal with, and they quickly learn whether or not they made the right decision.

The bank that enjoys a good reputation will grow and prosper while the bank that uses poor banking practices will not keep customers and will go bankrupt...not propped up and bailed out by a government FDIC giving a false sense of financial safety to the consumers.

Basically speaking, the US needs to abolish the private, central banking Federal Reserve System and let the local banks handle their local monetary needs.

To tax more and spend more is irrational. Government needs to CUT TAXES and to CUT SPENDING to a bare minimum. Cut out ALL foreign aid and close ALL 800 foreign military bases and bring home ALL our troops.

If Obama and Congress will not do this they WILL most assuredly be voted out immediately.





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