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Wednesday, January 02, 2008
Ann Coulter :: Townhall.com Columnist
Kwanzaa: Holiday From The FBI
by Ann Coulter
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Will the Dems' health care Christmas Present to America be an improvement or detriment to our health care system?


Is it just me, or does Kwanzaa seem to come earlier and earlier each year? The same goes for the Iowa caucuses -- the early scheduling of which forced me to run an attack on a synthetic candidate, rather than a synthetic holiday, last week.

I've seen so few mentions of Kwanzaa this year, I was going to declare my campaign a success, but I see that President Bush issued another absurd Kwanzaa message in December, referring to millions of African-Americans gathering to celebrate Kwanzaa.

I believe more African-Americans spent this season reflecting on the birth of Christ than some phony non-Christian holiday invented a few decades ago by an FBI stooge. Kwanzaa is a holiday for white liberals, not blacks.

It is a fact that Kwanzaa was invented in 1966 by a black radical FBI stooge, Ron Karenga, aka Dr. Maulana Karenga. Karenga was a founder of United Slaves, a violent nationalist rival to the Black Panthers and a dupe of the FBI.

In what was probably ultimately a foolish gamble, during the madness of the '60s the FBI encouraged the most extreme black nationalist organizations in order to discredit and split the left. The more preposterous the organization, the better. Using that criterion, Karenga's United Slaves was perfect. In the annals of the American '60s, Karenga was the Father Gapon, stooge of the czarist police.

Despite modern perceptions that blend all the black activists of the '60s, the Black Panthers did not hate whites. They did not seek armed revolution. Those were the precepts of Karenga's United Slaves. United Slaves were proto-fascists, walking around in dashikis, gunning down Black Panthers and adopting invented "African" names. (That was a big help to the black community: How many boys named "Jamal" currently sit on death row?)

Whether Karenga was a willing dupe, or just a dupe, remains unclear. Curiously, in a 1995 interview with Ethnic NewsWatch, Karenga matter-of-factly explained that the forces out to get O.J. Simpson for the "framed" murder of two whites included: "the FBI, the CIA, the State Department, Interpol, the Chicago Police Department" and so on. Karenga should know about FBI infiltration. (He further noted that the evidence against O.J. "was not strong enough to prohibit or eliminate unreasonable doubt" -- an interesting standard of proof.)

In the category of the-gentleman-doth-protest-too-much, back in the '70s, Karenga was quick to criticize rumors that black radicals were government-supported. When Nigerian newspapers claimed that some American black radicals were CIA operatives, Karenga publicly denounced the idea, saying, "Africans must stop generalizing about the loyalties and motives of Afro-Americans, including the widespread suspicion of black Americans being CIA agents."

Now we know that the FBI fueled the bloody rivalry between the Panthers and United Slaves. In one barbarous outburst, Karenga's United Slaves shot to death Black Panthers Al "Bunchy" Carter and Deputy Minister John Huggins on the UCLA campus. Karenga himself served time, a useful stepping-stone for his current position as a black studies professor at California State University at Long Beach.

(Sing to "Jingle Bells")

Kwanzaa bells, dashikis sell

Whitey has to pay;

Burning, shooting, oh what fun

On this made-up holiday!

Kwanzaa itself is a lunatic blend of schmaltzy '60s rhetoric, black racism and Marxism. Indeed, the seven "principles" of Kwanzaa praise collectivism in every possible arena of life -- economics, work, personality, even litter removal. ("Kuumba: Everyone should strive to improve the community and make it more beautiful.") It takes a village to raise a police snitch.

When Karenga was asked to distinguish Kawaida, the philosophy underlying Kwanzaa, from "classical Marxism," he essentially explained that under Kawaida, we also hate whites. While taking the "best of early Chinese and Cuban socialism" -- which one assumes would exclude the forced abortions, imprisonment of homosexuals and forced labor -- Kawaida practitioners believe one's racial identity "determines life conditions, life chances and self-understanding." There's an inclusive philosophy for you.

Coincidentally, the seven principles of Kwanzaa are the very same seven principles of the Symbionese Liberation Army, another charming invention of the Worst Generation. In 1974, Patricia Hearst, kidnap victim-cum-SLA revolutionary, posed next to the banner of her alleged captors, a seven-headed cobra. Each snake head stood for one of the SLA's revolutionary principles: Umoja, Kujichagulia, Ujima, Ujamaa, Nia, Kuumba and Imani -- the exact same seven "principles" of Kwanzaa.

With his Kwanzaa greetings, President Bush is saluting the intellectual sibling of the Symbionese Liberation Army, killer of housewives and police. He is saluting the founder of United Slaves, who were such lunatics that they shot Panthers for not being sufficiently insane -- all with the FBI as their covert ally.

It's as if David Duke invented a holiday called "Anglika," and the president of the United States issued a presidential proclamation honoring the synthetic, racist holiday. People might well stand up and take notice if that happened.

Kwanzaa was the result of a '60s psychosis grafted onto the black community. Liberals have become so mesmerized by multicultural nonsense that they have forgotten the real history of Kwanzaa and Karenga's United Slaves -- the violence, the Marxism, the insanity. Most absurdly, for leftists anyway, is that they have forgotten the FBI's tacit encouragement of this murderous black nationalist cult founded by the father of Kwanzaa.

Now the "holiday" concocted by an FBI dupe is honored in a presidential proclamation and public schools across the nation. In Oregon public schools this year, Kwanzaa -- but not Christmas -- appeared on the official calendar.

Bush called Kwanzaa a holiday that promotes "unity" and "faith." Faith in what? Liberals' unbounded capacity to respect any faith but Christianity?

A movement that started approximately 2,000 years before Kwanzaa leaps well beyond mere "unity" and "faith" to proclaim that we are all equal before God. "There is neither Jew nor Greek, slave nor free, male nor female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus" (Galatians 3:28). It was practitioners of that faith who were at the forefront of the abolitionist and civil rights movements. But that's all been washed down the memory hole, along with the true origins of Kwanzaa.

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About The Author
Ann Coulter is a columnist and author of Guilty: Liberal Victims and Their Assault On America.
 
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Ken -- disruption
That was the standard penalty for a whole host of crimes. Nothing particularly special about it.

swampfox
"At the time of his life he [Jesus] didn't cause that much disruption."

Then why was He crucified?

Taking the fun out of it
Every year a I also watch How the Grinch Stole Christmas. We can literally repeat the dialogue. So what if she warmed over an old meal- it is her right, and you even read it! She won.

Merry KwanRamadanUkkah. Oh heck- I just say Merry Christmas nowadays.

Historical Jesus
This article appears to be pretty balanced, well-footnoted, and covers both sides of the issue:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Historicity_of_Jesus

As to dhimmiwit's link, I don't want to denigrate it (other than it takes WAY too long to load), but I can tell just from the domain that it has an atheist bias. Nothing wrong with that, but it does cast doubt on the veracity of this particular claim. I.e., one would surmise that the authors have an axe to grind.


Bottom line, it appears most scholars who study this sort of thing agree with me. Whatever you want to believe about the divinity of Jesus, he really did actually exist in history.



And, dhimmiwit, I'll never forgive you for forcing me to actually research this!!

dhimmiwit
d: "You claimed some sort of superior knowledge, while telling me I had less than you on the subject."

Eh. That was in response to this:

d: "You may want to do a bit of research before spouting off about the existence of a historical figure. I won't do your research for you, ..."

You implied I knew nothing whatsoever, which torqued me off. What can I say? Tit for tat.

I still stand by my original statements. According to what I learned "back in the day", there IS historical evidence to the existence of Jesus in the form of the records kept by the Romans. You disagree. Fine.

None of which really proves anything of import anyway, because the issue with Christians is his divinity, not his historical accuracy. Even if you can prove he never existed (and atheists contend that you can not prove a negative), Christians will still believe he's the Son of God.

Unca Alby
Unca writes:

Well I said I wasn't an expert, didn't I?

Uhm...no. You claimed some sort of superior knowledge, while telling me I had less than you on the subject.

Unca continues:

I studied the historical evidence of Jesus back in the '70's, long before anybody bothered to put anything up on a not-yet-existing website.

I have probably forgotten more information on this subject than you'll ever learn.


You claim to not want schoolin' and then ask for a link. Which is it?

I'll help you out. Here is a start. The rest is up to you.
http://www.rationalrevolution.net/articles/jesus_myth_histo ry.htm#1

dhimmiwit --
"Having done research in Jerusalem four times over the past decade, I feel reluctant to bow to your 'superior' knowledge on this subject."

Well I said I wasn't an expert, didn't I?

I just said you shouldn't just dismiss my knowlege as altogether vacuous. Because it's not.

"I left a little clue for you. Start there. Good luck on your 'enlightenment'"

Thanks, but no thanks. I'm too old for more schoolin'.

If you want to point me to a link or a reference that SPECIFICALLY backs up your claim, I'll gladly read it. But I have no interest in earning a PhD is Jesusology.

Anthony Thomas --
UA: "EVERY culture values their own more than others. That's just part of being human."

AT: "This is true, but there is a big difference in valuing one's own culture, and degrading and denigrating the cultures of others,"

It's only a difference to the degree of expression.

Some people prefer their own. Some people prefer their own to the point of having real hatred for outsiders.

It's all part of being human.


AT: "especially in the manor that Coulter, and many posters have on this column. Could you imagine if people did that to Christianity?"

People do. No big deal.

Christians don't riot in the streets when they're insulted, however. Instead they post megabytes to conservative websites.

As to Coulter, she is simply the Right's answer to people like Michael Moore. Somebody who takes pleasure in being so extreme as to be the other side's favorite Poster Boy(Girl) for "What's Wrong With Them."

I'd suggest that if she bothers you that much, stop reading her. I read her columns a lot less than I used to, ever since she's gotten this "thing" where she thinks she knows all about evolution, or at least enough to debunk it. I'm no expert in the field, but even I can poke holes in her absence of logic.

And, she's not as funny as she used to be.

But hey, nobody's perfect.

Poor Uncle Alby
Mr. Chill out.... Having done research in Jerusalem four times over the past decade, I feel reluctant to bow to your 'superior' knowledge on this subject. However, this is not the thread for that discussion.

With that said, when we do pick this up at some point, your 'belief bomb' will be a pleasure to explode.

"He didn't cause that much distraction" A difficult thing to do for someone who did not exist.
Having walked the Via Dolorosa many times, a skeptical mind wants to know how the path was marked 200 years after the supposed event?

I left a little clue for you. Start there. Good luck on your 'enlightenment'

UNCA Alby
"EVERY culture values their own more than others. That's just part of being human."

This is true, but there is a big difference in valuing one's own culture, and degrading and denigrating the cultures of others, especially in the manor that Coulter, and many posters have on this column. Could you imagine if people did that to Christianity?


"To say that none of us is perfect and so therefore we're all equally guilty is just silly."

Ever read the bible? By saying that, you're basically calling the teachings of Jesus Christ silly. Go figure.

Anthony Thomas --
"NO your view is nonsense and also troubling, and from my view rooted in white supremacy. I said earlier, historically white supremacist have placed hierarchical values on the cultures of other people."

Nothing new there.

EVERY culture values their own more than others. That's just part of being human.

That's why there has always been so much tribal warfare in every part of the planet over the thousands of years of human history.

And just because every human culture has blood on their hands does not mean a person can not stop and objectively compare one culture to another. Including comparing today's cultures to yesterday's.

To say that none of us is perfect and so therefore we're all equally guilty is just silly.

"What, do you believe in that phony baloney idea that Christians and Americans are more honest, more tolerant, and more benevolent than others?"

Objectively, we DO donate more to charities, which is provable fact. Both in absolute dollars and percentage of personal income. Of course, I don't know if that necessarily means anything to you.

And, objectively, we no longer treat women as property, although that HAS once been the case in various Western cultures. Nowadays, we go out of way and bend over backwards to treat everyone equally, even in cases where some people clearly don't deserve it.

Jesus
Unca Alby writes, "He [Jesus] didn't cause that much disruption. To the Romans, he was just another nuisance." At the time of his life he didn't cause that much disruption. However, later in the time of Constantine, the Christians took over the Roman Empire.

Unca Alby
"So, you believe that every culture, no matter how self-destructive it might be, is 100% equal to every other culture?

"That's PC nonsense."


NO your view is nonsense and also troubling, and from my view rooted in white supremacy. I said earlier, historically white supremacist have placed hierarchical values on the cultures of other people. All cultures and religions have done both moral and immoral things, and that includes Americans and Christians. I gave some specific examples of this.

What, do you believe in that phony baloney idea that Christians and Americans are more honest, more tolerant, and more benevolent than others? Please, give me a break. Looking at history, I don’t think that would be the case. There’s that little thing Jesus said about not throwing stones unless being without sin. Well, last time I checked, both Christians and Americans have sinned and been responsible for some of the worse atrocities in human history. The Christian Crusades; American slavery; and the theft of land and murder of millions of American Indians are all obvious examples. Now I don’t bring these things up to say that Americans and Christians are LESS moral than other cultures either. As we both know, Muslims, Africans, and Asians all have blood, hate and bigotry on their hands as well, and they too would be wrong for touting the views that many tout on this coulter post about their culture.

Finally, despite what revisionist history you may buy into, America has been an unrighteous country more than it's been a righteous country. So I think as Americans and as Christians we should get off our high horse and stop acting like we're better than other people, because all you have to do is open a history book to find out that we don’t even come close to being better than anybody, at least not morally.

dhimmiwit -- Jesus research
quoth dhimmiwit: "You may want to do a bit of research before spouting off about the existence of a historical figure."

YOU may need to just chill out before spouting off about somebody spouting off.

I studied the historical evidence of Jesus back in the '70's, long before anybody bothered to put anything up on a not-yet-existing website.

"Try to find proof outside of the bible and you won't find much."

You don't have to find MUCH just prove something exists.

"For a man that supposedly caused so much disruption at the time, it's amazing that the scribes of the time wrote nothing about him."

He didn't cause that much disruption. To the Romans, he was just another nuisance.

I have probably forgotten more information on this subject than you'll ever learn.

So just chill out.

Unca Alby
You may want to do a bit of research before spouting off about the existence of a historical figure. I won't do your research for you, but put a query into any search engine about the proof of Jesus' existence. Try to find proof outside of the bible and you won't find much. For a man that supposedly caused so much disruption at the time, it's amazing that the scribes of the time wrote nothing about him. Sorry to burst your belief bubble. Once you start down this road you will see that there is no proof of his existence.

Kwanzaa and reparations
I for one am on record for promoting anything that might help with reparations for Blacks. After they get their trillions, then my people (Cherokee, Sioux etc.) can get OURS.By the way, it is all ours!!! Buffalo Soldiers killed my people in the name of the US government and they are heroes? Broken treaty after broken treaty, talk about breach of contract!

Anthony Thomas - - Hierarchies
"See, only White Supremacist place hierarchical values on the cultures of other people."

So, you believe that every culture, no matter how self-destructive it might be, is 100% equal to every other culture?

That's PC nonsense.

Some cultures encourage hard work and thrift. Some cultures debase women and consider them as the man's property. Some cultures will be successful. Others will fail without artificial supports provided at taxpayer expense.

Besides, if you want to call Christmas a "phony holiday", be my guest. You have the right to free speech like everybody else. It's pretty much devolved into a phony holiday over the years anyway.

Anthony Thomas -- a Factoid
"There is no scientific evidence that proves the existence of Jesus. If there is, please tell me what it is."

There is independent written material from the Roman bureaucracy of the time that verify that Jesus did in fact historically exist.

If you like, you can argue whether or not any divine attributes should be applied. But there is NO doubt to his existence.

Anne strikes again!
Over 400 comments in a couple of days. Meaningless and unimportant budbud? Geez look in the mirror.

It’s always amusing when left wing trolls and assorted closet groupies post each week after every Coulter column that she is over, lost it, wasting our time, bringing conservatives down, ugly, mean, and of course meaningless and unimportant.

Of course as usual these Anne obsessed leftists continue to be drawn to her articles by some cosmic force. It’s as if a small part of their brains still yearn to perform critical thought yet then must suppress it. I hate her, I hate her, but I must read her. On no I have sinned! Let me repent by posting how much I hate her… and the vicious cycle continues.

BTW WWWJD???, the holy week of Kwanzaa just ended a day before her column. I'm surprised a culturally sensitive lib like you didn’t realize that. Too bad you are off to find something more "topical" (article on Britney Spears perhaps?) so will not see this post and become more educated on the topic.

Well I’m off to put away my Kikombe cha Umoja until next year……….

Meaningless & Unimportant Indeed!
I agree, how obvious is it that Ann Coulter is hiding from addressing the big issues of the day! I check her column from time to time but see I'm missing nothing interesting. Ironically, I clicked the "What's Hot" link on TH but I don't see it here - off to find something a little more topical, less obscure!

Why in the world is she ranting about Kwanzaa after the whole holiday season is over? Pointless....

wiseone
I don't know why this didn't post earler.

"Well educated black mayors and Congressmen? You mean like Marion Berry and Ray Nagin?"

Oh please. Every group has dishonest, immoral, sometimes racist individuals that embarrass the group as a whole. Does Larry Craig, Scooter Libby, or Jesse Helms truly represent what you believe to be Republican values?

"If you think it hasn't worked but will if we stay with it please provide an estimate for how long we should wait to (re)enforce the 14th Amendment."

I think it's working for many African Americans. Also, it has nothing to do with reinforcing the 14th amendment. As I said earlier, it has to do with correcting past injustices, by providing present opportunity. How Long? Well if we were to be fair, I would say another 250-300 years.


"The handouts I am talking about include welfare (you should read "Uncle Sam's Plantation"),"

I don't know if you know, but there are plenty of poor whites who live in trailer parks who abuse welfare. But for some strange reason, blacks are the only one's that get singled out.

"(black-on-white hate crime far exceeds white-on-black hate crime)"

Please provide the statistics to back this statement up. W Williams recently wrote a column about this and it was debunked by me and several other posters, so I would be curious to see where you get your information. Most victims of black crimes are other blacks.

"and, the most recent proposal, reparations. Do you really think a lump sum 'payment' to every black person is going to solve anything?"

I don't support reparations. And to answer your question, no.

"Will it change the culture of rap, drugs, and gangs that ruins the lives of so many young blacks?

I make no excuses for this behavior, African Americans, like all people have their faults, and the above must be corrected without government intervention.

wiseone
For some reason this didn't post earlier, sorry:

"Well educated black mayors and Congressmen? You mean like Marion Berry and Ray Nagin?"

Oh please. Every group has dishonest, immoral, sometimes racist individuals that embarrass the group as a whole. Does Larry Craig, Scooter Libby, or Jesse Helms truly represent what you believe to be Republican values?

"If you think it hasn't worked but will if we stay with it please provide an estimate for how long we should wait to (re)enforce the 14th Amendment."

I think it's working for many African Americans. Also, it has nothing to do with reinforcing the 14th amendment. As I said earlier, it has to do with correcting past injustices, by providing present opportunity. How Long? Well if we were to be fair, I would say another 250-300 years.


"The handouts I am talking about include welfare (you should read "Uncle Sam's Plantation"),"

I don't know if you know, but there are plenty of poor whites who live in trailer parks who abuse welfare. But for some strange reason, blacks are the only one's that get singled out.

"(black-on-white hate crime far exceeds white-on-black hate crime)"

Please provide the statistics to back this statement up. W Williams recently wrote a column about this and it was debunked by me and several other posters, so I would be curious to see where you get your information. Most victims of black crimes are other blacks.

"and, the most recent proposal, reparations. Do you really think a lump sum 'payment' to every black person is going to solve anything?"

I don't support reparations. And to answer your question, no.

"Will it change the culture of rap, drugs, and gangs that ruins the lives of so many young blacks?

I make no excuses for this behavior, African Americans, like all people have their faults, and the above must be corrected without government intervention.

wiseone p2
"Will it change the attitude imposed on too many young blacks by other young blacks that it is too "white" to behave, dress well, get good grades in school and work hard?"

This is a myth perpetuated by out of touch individuals like Bill Cosby, who haven't been in a public school in decades. I'm in my twenties and I experienced a lot of horrible things in public schools, being ridiculed for “acting white, was hardly one of them.



For Anthony Thomas
The info on MLK is true. In fact, MLK Sr. was a registered Republican.

Well educated black mayors and Congressmen? You mean like Marion Berry and Ray Nagin? How about Sheila Jackson Lee? There's a testament to ignorance if one ever existed. These three and many others are prime examples of black racism at the ballot box trumping education and common sense.

Affirmative Action was declared constitutional by SCOTUS on the grounds you cite. The problem is that after nearly 40 years it either has worked or it hasn't. If it worked then those "inequites" should be behind us. If it hasn't worked it's past the time we should trash-can it. If you think it hasn't worked but will if we stay with it please provide an estimate for how long we should wait to (re)enforce the 14th Amendment. You see, the real problem is not that libs want AA to continue as a fix for a past problem. They insist that it must be a permanent fixture in our public policy despite the reality that is legally enforced racism. It is no less racist than the laws that caused the damage it was designed to repair.

The handouts I am talking about include welfare (you should read "Uncle Sam's Plantation"), racial preferences for minorities, hate crimes legislation (black-on-white hate crime far exceeds white-on-black hate crime), and, the most recent proposal, reparations. Do you really think a lump sum 'payment' to every black person is going to solve anything? Will it educate anybody? No. Will it change the culture of rap, drugs, and gangs that ruins the lives of so many young blacks? Will it change the attitude imposed on too many young blacks by other young blacks that it is too "white" to behave, dress well, get good grades in school and work hard? No. All it will do is maintain the disgusting status quo.

wiseone p2
Finally, blacks do support government funds for people who can't afford a college education. Many of us do this because we know that an education is integral to competing in the job market.

If you're not talking about any of these things, please tell me what "government handouts", entice blacks to, as you put it “vote reflexively for the Democrats and don't even know why".

wiseone

"The reason the Republican Party does not get the black vote is because MLK basically told his people he could not abide the political party that had nominated Barry Goldwater for the presidency (in 1964) after Goldwater voted against the Civil Rights Act of that same year."

MlK didn't tell "his people" anything. African Americans were fully capable enough to make that decision on their own. I'm also aware of the "property "rights argument, that Goldwater presented, but given the racial environment at the time, African Americans COLLECTIVELY, took this as a slap in the face.


"Democrat demagoguery and LBJ's Great Society cemented that trend and now we've gotten to where most blacks vote reflexively for the Democrats and don't even know why, other than government handouts."

Well I don't think the well educated, elected blacks who are Mayors, sit in Congress, the Senate, and possibly the White house (OBama won IOWA!) are Democrats purely for "Government Handouts". If you are alluding to Affirmative Action, believe me, it ain't a handout. Affirmative Action was implemented to correct 300 plus years of past injustices, hate and economic marginalization against blacks. Blacks were robbed of vast amounts of accrued wealth, and there aren’t enough “government handouts” on Earth, to pay African Americans back for everything they lost. .

If you referring to Universal healthcare, yes indeed most blacks do support providing healthcare for those who can't afford it. You know, some of us seem to have morals, and don't think people should just die and suffer for lack of healthcare, because the "the market" hasn't reduced the cost yet. .


ct
"Christians enslaving blacks? I believe they were already slaves when they were purchased. Enslaved by African blacks, no less. Of course, you left out that jewel. And was it just Christians who owned black slaves? And was not slavery commonplace back then? Get a clue and then remove that mountain off your shoulders."

You obviously can't read, or your just intellectualy dishonest. I alluded to everything that you mention in my previous post from yesterday:

From my 3:02 PM post to Icedog:

Your statement should read IT WAS SOME "Western Christians who led the worldwide effort to end slavery". As I stated earlier, many Christians (along with others) were responsible FOR the institution of Slavery. Also, The Christian/Euro/ American version of slavery was much more brutal and inhumane than any other form of slavery in human history . Even Thomas Sowell admits this in his book, "Race and Economics", on page 19, paragraph 1. (I'm sure you have the book.


What part of "along with others" or "any other form of slavery" don't you understand.



Savage99 /VIC
You may not agree with my positions, but my post are based on facts, logic, and reason. I provide ample analysis and historical reference for everything I say. I don't lie nor distort data like some, and rarely do I resort to name calling. . I'm sorry people like you don't have the intellectual capacity to combat my arguments with facts, logic and reason and that all you have the ability to do is call people juvenile names like "trolls ", and then, as you say "scroll by" .

Vic/Savage99
Thanks for the kind words.

Sophistry Tool
Your post are so full of logical fallacies, it would take decades to educate you past your current third grade debating skill level. Go somewhere else and play your "if" games. Those games are for children, and those with child-like mental aptitude. You play th if card just like a child. Go play with other children and leave the adults to discuss politics.



Vic
You are quite right. I must admit RE hooks me once in a while with some remark easily refuted. When i get sucked in, he quickly does the usual moves. He either changes the subject, goes ad hominem, or resorts to You do it worse, first and from baser motives. Give me credit, i don't even read the trolls, except by mistake or something catches my eye while reading another post.
That tactic of throwing up some outrageous remark works very well for the trolls. We all have buttons, and the newbies are ever hopeful. What works is to consider the source and scroll by, knowing it is exactly, as you say, a waste of BW.

Anne/Savage
Yes, most of the "debate" was people trying to answer posts by AT and RE. These two guys are the biggest race hustling bigots who have ever been known to drop in and onto TR. They are prime examples of the types of people who would join the organizations that Ann C. speaks of in this column.

They are practitioners of the modern day credos of:

Only white people can be racist
OJ was innocent
Affirmative action is justice
White racism is the ONLY reason blacks just can’t get ahead

I could go on and on but it is really like trying to debate those two idiots. It is a waste of bandwidth. Even Lilly has a cogent thing to say ever now and then, while these two don’t. The best thing to do is scroll by and ignore.

Good morning Anne
Coulter really stirs the pot, doesn't she? Doubtless grins all the way to the bank. Prelutsky has the knack too, and in a gentler way than Ms. Coulter. But the 411 is not really about kwanza, its about race.

Anne on a Mouse.. 411 posts! They CARE!
And, that's just on TH. Wonder how mnay other posts are on the other sites???


fascism is near
As communism & nazism are both sub-sects of social-fascism, who cares if they hate each other? It would have been much better in WWII, if Nazi Germany would have been allowed to battle it out with Communist Russia. Once their war was over, America could have gone in and eliminated what was left of the social-fascists. But, thanks to the communist Franklin Delano Roosevelt, over 250,000 Americans lives were wasted defending a sub-sect of social-fascism - Stalin & Communist Russia from Hitler & Nazi Germany. Ever since WWII, the social-fascists in America have worked against members of our Constitutional Republic who have defended other nations against social-fascists. It's time that the social-fascists are eliminated from American society, otherwise Constitutionalists will loose their freedom to the social-fascists - both communists & Nazis who've merged in America by taking over the "Democrat" party.

For wiseone
If a white group attempted to set up several states as a white only area, do you think liberals and blacks would say those folks did not hate blacks?

Ever wonder way the Conferderate states are still regarded by many as not liking blacks?

For Frank, N/A, and others
I will repeat what I wrote in my first post on this thread. There was nothing on the Black Panther Party's founding postulates about hating or attacking whites. Their solution to the oppression they perceived was to become separatists; they wanted 5 or six states of their own with no white people. Their reliance on arms was for self defense; essentially their own version of our Second Amendment.

Nothing that N/A posted from Wikipedia, or previously posted by inthePRofCA, alludes to any hatred of white people.

This is not to say that individual Panthers were not violent. Huey Newton and other Panthers were tried for numerous murders. But with the notable exception of the shooting death of an Oakland police officer, most of these crimes were perpetrated against other blacks.

Newton himself died when he was shot to death by a drug dealer.

It was very common for well-meaning liberal groups in the sixties to be taken over by militants. Another example of this was Students for a Democratic Society (SDS), which was soon dominated by a wing so militant they eventually broke away from SDS and formed the Weathermen.

Coulter's claims that the FBI carried out a rather ruthless war against the Black Panthers is also believed to be true and credible. This war was believed to include assassinations and I certainly wouldn't rule out the possibility that the FBI (under Hoover) would set the United Slaves against them.

The one part of Coulter's claims that is curious is that the Panthers and the United Slaves would be at each other's throats. Both were essentially Marxists.

For King Liberal
Response to a comment you made in your post at 2:21.

The reason the Republican Party does not get the black vote is because MLK basically told his people he could not abide the political party that had nominated Barry Goldwater for the presidency (in 1964) after Goldwater voted against the Civil Rights Act of that same year. Prior to 1964 MLK had little use for either political party. But after the Goldwater nomination the Democrats began to get the vast majority of the black vote. Democrat demagoguery and LBJ's Great Society cemented that trend and now we've gotten to where most blacks vote reflexively for the Democrats and don't even know why, other than government handouts.

Goldwater was not a racist. He opposed the Civili Rights Act on the basis of state's rights. It never occured to the Republican Party that their choice of a Presidential nominee would be interprtedas racism after they overwhelmingly supported the Civil Rights Act of 1964 as Party; voted for it in Congress with a much higher percentage of their votes than the Democrats did. And also the fact being that the Republican party was founded to end slavery and the fact that virtually all of the government-sponored and institutionalized racism in the country was initiated, fomented, and sustained by Democrats.

The fact that the black population continues to blindly vote for the Democrats, and your response as well, are merely more evidence that CW is correct when he writes "Blacks are completely disinterested in being educated about republican positions."

It appears you would rather rely on knee-jerk regurgitations of liberal propaganda and revisionist history.


Huh?
To Ralph Ellison: Ann is not over, you only wish she were. She will be around for a long time because she is right, funny and smart. Too bad the liberals don't have anyone they can say that about!

However, I don't understand why Ann says the Black Panthers did not hate white people. If they did not, they sure fooled a lot of people.

Finally, and this ought to get a lot of people up, Christianity is superior to all other religious becase it celebrates God's son.

Anthony writes:
"Icedog Why wouldn't I? Does Christianity not have blood on its hands? The Christian Crusades? English Christians enslaving blacks? What makes Christianity hierarchically more moral than any other religion?"


Christians enslaving blacks? I believe they were already slaves when they were purchased. Enslaved by African blacks, no less. Of course, you left out that jewel. And was it just Christians who owned black slaves? And was not slavery commonplace back then? Get a clue and then remove that mountain off your shoulders.

Sophia/Devout Agnostic/Pagan
Fiest, do you know what a pagan is?

Second, from Coluter's column, "In Oregon public schools this year, Kwanzaa -- but not Christmas -- appeared on the official calendar."

Try reading the article before discussing it and challenging other posters. You'll make an @ss of yourself less often.

The black
posters here admit neither they nor anyone they know celebrates Kwanzaa. So then, why is it foisted upon us by the (liberal) media, the public school system, and guilty whites (such as Sophia)? That is the problem I have with it.

For Devout Agnostic - You're a weirdo. I'm sure you presume that you're witty but try posting something with some logic to it for once.

Dear Ralph Ellison,
"Ann Coulter is old news. Don't you get it: NO ONE CARES WHAT ANN OR ANNE HAS TO SAY!!!"

I care what Ann and Anne have to say. You, however, need to go away.

That is all.

Ralph, we need Ann's help, no question
Ralph Ellison writes: Wednesday, January, 02, 2008 9:35 PM
Ann
Why do you "re-run" the same column over and over again????

Do you actually get paid for copying and pasting the same article from 5 years ago??

If you don't believe me, here are the links to the practically same column from 2001,2002, 2005, and 2006:

http://townhall.com/columnists/AnnCoulter/2001/01/01/kwanza a_holiday_from_the_fbi

http://townhall.com/columnists/AnnCoulter/2002/12/26/kwanza a_a_holiday_from_the_fbi

http://townhall.com/columnists/AnnCoulter/2005/12/28/kwanza a_a_holiday_from_the_fbi

http://townhall.com/columnists/AnnCoulter/2006/12/27/kwanza a_holiday_from_the_fbi

Stop already!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
____________________________________________

Ralph, it is very simple: The thickheaded libs/lefties need their noses rubbed in the lib/lefty nonsense periodically, else we will not make much progress in destroying the lib/lefty machine that so wants to pervert, subvert the greatest nation in the history of man. PLEASE CONTINUE, ANN, REMINDING US OF THE INSANITY OF THE LIB/LEFTY MACHINE.

big mick's political economic theory
You asked if I wanted a return to Laize Faire (sp?) Capitalism. The answer is, in the main, yes! My political models are an uneasy synthesis between L.Neil Smith's "Confederation" Libertarian Eutopia and The Biblical Model of the Books of Joshua, Judges and Romans 13. I think Jefferson was absolutely right that the Best Government is MINIMAL. Joshua and Judges Fit this model, with One Supreme Court Justice ycum (ye Gods the E-Censor blocked a perfectly legitimate Latin Term because somebody vulgared it up--sad) Commander and Chief and NO Administrative or Legislative beyond the Local (in the Biblical case extended family and community) level. Modern application would be for a RADICALLY lobotomized Legislative, Judicial and Executive.

I believe that Matt Dillon is the Model for the Proper Roll of Government in this Constitutional Republic. Matt's job is to hang horse thieves. In my model that includes Foreign Horse thieves out to steal my Liberty--like the Sandnazis, and Domestic Horse thieves out to steal my money and quality of Life--which includes Marxists, Socialists, and POLLUTERS!! So you see, there IS a place for SOME restriction on Industry doing whatever it pleases. But the GOVS role in that is limited--the right to use LAWSUIT to correct Bad Business Practice as well as market forces has a place. Consult L.Neil Smith's works to see how he sees that working.

As to your argument on graded Socialism and Economic Control--I find they tyranny of one person over 50% no less intolerable than the tyranny of ONE or the Dictatorship of the Working Class and their Elitist CQ handlers.

the big mick

soph
Just occured to me to ask if The Civil War being about Freeing the Slaves is also an oversimplification in your book?

the big mick

soph more Thanks for the heads up ANN YL
G etc.
And soph you still didn't answer the concept that
arguing ALL violence is intolerable only assures the victory of the Agressor. Or how a Sodem's rape rooms are shut down by high moral dugeon. Or how the Sandnazi Womenslaves are going to be freed by calling Gunny or me names?

The original engagement here was your intolerance of the Concept that Sandnazi Culture, enslaving its women as it does, CANNOT peacefully co-exist with a culture of Liberty as represented by the United States and that War to the Knife is THRUST upon US by THEIR intolerance. And I don't think it oversimplification, merely succinct. The COMPLAINT of the Sandnazis is not Western Money, but Western CULTURAL INFLUENCE.

If you find this tiresome, why don't you try getting past your snit at "commiequeer", and engage the real point--Sandnazi Delinda Est.
For it was on THAT point--being AGAINST defending ourselves against the Sandnazis out to destroy us, that I showed ANSWER demonstrated the shared aims of Radical Greens, Radical Marxists, Radical Islamic Fronts, and Radical Homosexual Groups. I didn't make the site, I didn't sign em up. It was self-selected. ON THAT KEY ISSUE, the War for Survival against the Sandnazis, those groups showed AFFINITY! Your only rebuttal to THAT was "well it ain't everybody." No it ain't, but it's enough.

And you seem to share the position of those groups that Sandnazi Culture should NOT be destroyed.
Me, I see no difference in the Sandnazis and the German and Jap Racist Nazi Statists. And I see the solution as remaining the same and only one. Destruction of the Parent Culture.
You disagree. I don't find that tiresome, simpy lacking in cogency.

the big mick

airfoil and SOPH
still engaging while watching my Hokies Choke.

SOPH 3! Well NOW we gettin somewhere. Again I've explained the etymology. Rebutt, if you can, MY point that "liberal" is a false label and that "liberalism" as it is truly constituted believes in Statism and State Control of Wealth--which is QUALITATIVELY NO DIFFERENT from communism! You have admitted yourself the difference is (merely) QUANTITATIVE. Your refusal to acknowledge the kinship does not rebut the reality. You have also not rebutted my premise that "liberalism" as currently constituted shares a "common" and "commonly held" support of homosexuality. Evidence that Soviet Communism was anti-homosexual in no way rebuts the premise that American and World "liberalism" is pro-homosexual. Hence "commiequeer" accurately describes both the "liberal" (a "terminological inexactitude" remember) affection for for communism and their common support of homosexuality. Nothing you have said rebuts the fact that "liberals" view both with some affection and much agreement.
Until you can rebut the main point of the term, or when the homosexual community quits using "yqueer" or the day the dumbolcraps stop being Socialist I'll say the term is no longer accurate. Until then, get as bunched as ya want.
It's still semantically accurate. And I didn't event either part of the term.

the big mick

Yes, there is a ME :^)
Anne writes: Thursday, January, 03, 2008 8:57 PM

(Yes, there IS a God! :-) )



And I am watching you all.

Thebigmick: Aaaahhh, she's baaaaaaaack!

Note, she probably makes no sense... usually the longer her posts, the less sense she makes.

But if she's up to her usual potty mouth rhetoric, he's full of ad hominem attacks, and is probably as vile as usual, and will probably be BANNED YET AGAIN!!!


(Yes, there IS a God! :-) )



Annnnnnnnne
Yes, I caught a cold.....

I has drop-kicked me like a high-priced hooker on Sunset Strip....Don't ask where I got that from....the flamingoes flying around my head told me so....

I noticed they were conspicuously absent today, Maybe they are out campaigning, in a very small group.

Yo YLG: You got a cold or what?


Wondered where you were...

But, have you noticed that on the other threads the paulists have been strangely absent by numbers?

Ummmmm?



Children
wussup wid Kwanzaa? Mick, where did everybody go?
You got one website? I need action, not "I know you are but what am I or genital or potty."
I need a Kingfish fix or a hoorah

KL, bigmick, Anne, et al.
Gee, I was seduced by a powerful antihistamine, and I wake up to find the thread has been hijacked by a bunch of squirrels. I can only deduce it is squirrels, since the talk is about nuts.

I'm going to take some more antihistamine now, but wanted to take the time to wish you all a good evening.

Gathering nuts, if that's what y'all are doing....

Oh and bigmick....


She also uses the screen name "Devout Agnostic!" Clever, huh??







Thebigmick: Re soph

You might already know that her screen name is her fourth or fifth in just over a week or two, and NOT because she’s been so cherry, delightful and intelligent.

In fact, she’s been, without question, one of the most vile, foul, depraved posters in recent TH history, and if she doesn’t hold a record of being banned, she’s pretty close to it.

Only peice of advice is to just scroll on by her posts... Works for me.




soph 2
I track you as first engaging gunny at 12:10 with an almost exclusively ad hominem attack.

"Most can't be reasoned with...Just like you can't be reasoned with...In fact your mind set is little different than islamic extremists.
If you had been born in the M.E. you would be among the rabid, irrational extremists. Your intolerance, hatred, and limited intellectual capabilities would make you an excellent recruit for the Taliban or Al Queda." Not exactly your model calm, reasoned, cogent argument. Gunny could be reasonably pardoned for thinking YOU "tiresome" though I don't persume to speak for him.

At 12:25 you come after me: "'Commiequeers'?
You people would be funny if you weren't so pathetic...We know the closeted queeers are all republican..." Real cogent rebuttal that. Followed by another cut at gunny "Is your impotence just mental or is it physical too?"
Soph, I just don't think I've argued with you in that tone of slander.

to be continued.

mick


David Duke
Good article. Ann does sound like David Duke and frankly, I don't seem to have a problem with that anymore.

soph!
Oh am I? (tiresome) One could cogently argue that the tiresome one here is the one who refuses to rebut the argument of her opponent. It ain’t my fault if you find your position tiresome to defend.

Seems to me OUR little tet a tet started when I agreed Gunny’s comment bout 9:30 to Buzz Cat–about slavery being a MUSLIM thing these days. I pointed out that a CULTURE who BOUGHT INTO THAT (much like the Confederate States of America) COULD NOT co-exist with a FREE SOCIETY. One or the other would HAVE to be destroyed. And I quoted Lincoln on that very issue.

I repeated this in my 11:58 in response to Jack H’s 2am. A culture that buys into the enslavement of their women is a culture that CANNOT peacefully co-exist with a Free Society. You will note that the chief vices made over into spurious virtues most especially the treatment of women are SIMILAR across ALL the cultures mentioned– including Southern Racist, and and the Muslim and African Tribalism examples mentioned.

In FACT, sophie–that is what I believe to be the TRUTH about the War for Survival against the Sandnazis. It ain’t about Oil. It’s about their women drinking coke, getting their nails done, listening to Rock and Roll and getting UPITY! Didn’t you see the news piece on underground beauty parlors a few nights ago? Long as America exists they AIN’T secure in their enslavement of their women. World Wide Sandnazi Hegemony is their alternative.

But more on what you find tiresome below

California time
Looks like I'm in a little late. This morning
was great fun and educational. Laughing at oneself and others in fun is healthy, and sign of a good discussion, community etc. I look forward to crossing paths wit yall soon.

Fact is, you
could date my diploma with Carbon 14.

Carbon 14
All living things "fix" Carbon 14 while alive.
On death, the process stops and the isotope
begins to "decay". Deposition of the isotope
and its quantities in remains can "date" the organism. It is fairly accurate I believe for
organic matter between 5 and 20 thousand years old. My degree is in Anthropology, but it is way
old, someone correct my info if incorrect.

Good to be back. Where's Gunny? MIck? King?

King Liberal
Yeah. It was funny and makes a good catchphrase!!!!! Lol!!!!

Actually, I just had to respond to badboy. He mad this remark in like 5 different posts. I hope TH sees that the poster badboy was the aggressor toward myself and Sophia. He needs to go.

Sophia Pagan Queen
Your very welcome. Thanks for your support also.

I feel bad for little bad boy. I can't imagine living in your grandmother's basement at the age of 45 with a high school diploma. So pathetic!!!


Sophia
The pleasure was mine, Lady "Heather" Sophia.

Gotta run for now - will probably check back in a few hours.

tranny ybitch all ya want
All I know about Carbon 14 dating is that it is the accepted stardard that the Carbon 14 isotope, as I remember it decays at a standard rate of "half life" that makes it possible to "read" a fossil's "age."

MY POINT is that at one time we thought the Atom was INDIVISABLE too! Can you GUARANTEE me that some FURTURE discovery or understanding of Sub- or sub sub sub atomic partical understanding might not suggest that what we THOUGHT we knew about Carbon 14 isotopes and their half life MIGHT--under CERTAIN CIRCUMSTANCES CHANGE!!???

Before you answer that remember that we were GUARANTEED the Atom was indivisiable too!

THAT'S the point, tranny, NOT what I know about Carbon 14, or what YOU think YOU know--or what the current state of Consensus Scientific Opinion THINKS it knows. Hume's equitorial Savage didn't believe in Icebergs because he'd never seen water freeze and could imagine no circumstances based on his observation where it could. The Titanic sank anyway.
There are Limits to Scientific Knowledge tranny--as Hiesenberg's Uncertainty Principle and Shrodinger's CAT if I remember right, should tell you.

mick

Sophia Pagan Queen
Sorry for people like badboy. He had no business talking to you like that. I always told his mom not to live near those power lines!!!

Also badboy
You have been flagged. Goodbye.

I can't keep up!
Badboy - my reference to "treasonous repug" is outdated.

His new (and I think 20th or so) handle is "tranny repukes" - and his posts here speak for themselves!

Like school in the summertime - NO CLASS.

very last mean it this time out the door
soph

you make my point for me. The KKK and and CONSERVATIVES (as opposed to the GOP where the balance of probabilites suggests there ARE commies) DO both hate commies. Are you agreeing that the yqueers and the sandnazis both hate Christians?

The folks to answer your quesion begging soph is Cross Dressers Against the War--they're the dogs lying down with fleas. How DO you explain it?
Again, I simply observe commonality of SELF-Avowed aims and extend the logic to conclusion.
Again I take THEIR rhetoric at face value.
I applaud the KKK for hating commies--if they do. I reject them for being Racists. I can DRAW the distinction-can you? I, and many others, can see clearly the shared aims of the REdgreens, the Marxists, the Sandnazis and some of the more radical homogroups. The distinctions are YOURS to make. Again, take it up with Cross Dressers Against the War--I didn't sign em on to Answer.
For that matter point me to Homosexuals For the Destruction of Islamic Facism--or Homosexuals against the Reconquista! Or Homosexuals for STrict Constructionism! If I thought THEY were a homosexual majority YOUR point would be made.

the big mick

badboy
We agree on much politically, but your 4:57 to Sophia was a little over the top - and I'm sure you don't want to sound like some of the liberal trolls that show up here ("treasonous repug" comes to mind).

I'm sure you're classier than that.

Sophia can dish out... and she can take it, too. And usually in good humor.

Just my opinion, badboy.

Tranny
Teach the WHOLE truth - that Darwin came up with this theory, and that the fossil record has failed to verify it yet.

AT
Using your logic of equivalency, if my religion includes killing your housepets, it is as valid as any other. No, I don't believe Kwanzaa, a made-up bunch of crap by a felon who tortured someone, is equivalent to a religion preached by someone who said "turn the other cheek" and believed in his point strongly enough to be crucified for it.

last nights history channel on "LUCY"
stated that Lucy, if not explained, upset evolution. It further stated that the explanation was to be found in the "extinction phenomenon" of some millions of years ago when the Forest was replaced by grassland.

I take this to mean that evolutionary theory still has holes. My point was the very Bible being distained as myth contains the SAME principle as the Show's Evolution's Explantion for Lucy--a massive extinction that allows ONE branch--Lucy's--(or was it NOAH's) to supplant all others.
For the rest, I am rebutting sophie's premise that Imperialism began with the Hebrews--she may not have MEANT it, but she SAID it.
And I am questioning her absolute faith in Carbon Dating, using an example from Newton being supplanted by Einstien, being overturned by Quantum Mechanics.
It seems clear to me that much of "Science"deconstructs and corrects itself every generation or so. To put it another way--to lay claim to something being Absolutely Proven by Science seems to be contrary to the Very Scientific Method. Much like saying The Supreme Court has given a final ruling.

the big mick

sophia
"Not a SINGLE one of you has the worldwide recognition and respect as Al Gore!"

What worldwide respect? When he ran for president, he didn't even carry his own home state.

However, we must give Gore some credit. After all, he did invent the Internet. HA!

Sophie
I have to pack for a trip, but until evolution has been proven, it's just an article of faith. Like religion, and like global warming. Enjoy your day near the beach! I wish I was there.

Oops...
2nd sentence - "right" should be "write"

Sorry...

Sophia writes:
"Evolution is not incompatible with belief in a higher power."

Agreed... totally. (Wow... right THIS date down!)

What I and many conservatives get concerned about is the way evolution is taught to our children in school.

If it were presented as you just described it - okay fine.

Too often it is presented as the "anti-Higher Power" theory.

I don't want God or the Holy Bible or the Quran taught in our schools - just don't teach atheism through implication.

Leave "spiritual" questions out of the curriculum altogether.

tony
and you don't see that YOUR argument means White Supremacy is no more or less valuable and valid than any other culture?
Not only that, but all equating Islam and Christianity does is fail to take the teachings of either seriously.
Shoot, boy, by your logic Nazism is no worse than anything else! Humanism no better than Nazism--intriquing thought--Science no better than Mythology--interesting concept.

Deconstructing Yourself no worse or better than Propaganda--you DO make me think, tony.

the big mick

TR
Big Mick's 4:09 was easily understood...

Well - easy if you aren't a liberal.

Knight reread mine to mspaddy 2:22
There IS no "conservative" alternative. McCain=Hilly=Huckayou=obama=julianie=edwards on a MaJORITY of my pledge WIN DEFEND RESTORE REDUCE SECURE NONE of which is negotiable. Two out of FIVE is NO better than NONE out of 5 if ALL FIVE are CRUCIAL!!You make my point about Europe--the SLOW death of Socialism--those crushed by the Russians are NOW moving back toward Capitalism and Democracy with vigor are they not! Britain decends, Poland Rises.

You all believe in a fool's hope that the trend can be reversed. It can't, it can only be revolted against when it reaches its logical conclusion. All you are purchasing is an extension of the death, not life.
Witness the fact a TRUE REGANITE conservative is NOT in the Top Candidates of EITHER party.
Give me a 21st Century Reagan and I'll vote for him, knight. Where is he?

the big mick

sophia
"the gospel of thomas"

That's an interesting point. Skeptics say the four biblical gospels cannot be trusted because they were written too long after the time of Jesus (a claim that has been greatly exaggerated). The Gospel of Thomas was written in the middle second century - much later than the four biblical gospels. Why does it rate as such a credible source?

The fact is, the Gospel of Thomas and the other apocryphal gospels were left out of the Bible because they were obviously spurious.

Sophia:
I cannot speak for others on this thread, but if my comments about evolution have led you to believe that, by contrast, I believe in Adam, Eve & Noah - then you are speaking from a false assumption.

What I DO believe (and KNOW), is that creation isn't some big accident born by chaos theory.

Is there a higher power or higher intelligence?

Absolutely.

Is it ME?

Absolutely NOT!

icedog
"Bottom line, despite its scars, America and Christianity have been a powerful force for good in this world. You can continue to wallow in hatred and pity and you can continue your attempts to tear down western civilization and be a cancer to society.....or you can simply thank God for what you have and the fact you live in a free and glorious time and place. I choose the latter"

I'm not trying to "wallow in hatred and pity", nor am I attempting to "tear down western civilization". Please don't let my original point get lost in the madness. My original point was "only White Supremacist place hierarchical values on the cultures of other people". Ann Coulter and Th posters have done this on this column, and so have you with your original statement:

"Are you seriously ready to defend a belief that ALL cultures should be viewed as "different but equal"??

And I replied yes, and commenced to make my point.

Islam is no better than Christianity, Christianity is no better than Islam, and neither is more, or less valid than Kwanza.

Touting a culturally hierarchical higher position, by condemning other cultures is rooted in pure white Supremacy. One can be proud of one’s religion, but one should not condemn, nor denigrate the belief and worship of others. That’s it.

Sophia writes:
"The quotes are not in context.

In most I believe she was referring to the Bush tax cuts for the wealthy.

McCain also voted against those. Is he a socialist too?"

Okay, let's see...

Out of context quotes? Happens to Bush all the time. But can you even find "out of context" quotes like these made by a conservative? Good luck!

You "believe" she was referring to tax cuts for the wealthy? Are you sure? Or are you just assuming? And isn't "class warfare" a predominately socialist tactic? History says it is.

And does McCain's vote make him a socialist? If you apply inductive reasoning, perhaps. More likely it was just McCain being the maverick he loves to be. Our "Lieberman", if you will.

soph
and I don't care what ya'll do in the bedroom as long as you keep it outa my kids' face. But your Homeboys don't seem content with that, and they have, by their own words and actions allied themselves with people who STATE CLEARLY that they want to Chop My Head off, Stick My Wife in a Burka, and rape my boys. That's THEIR doing, soph, not mine.
I'm not the one who started defending That culture from the beginning of the thread, soph.
You're the one who seems to think it has a right to exist.
And you never answered how yo sistas under Radical Islam is gonna get freed.

the big mick

Sophie
These two lines are inconsistent.

"That is why it is referred to as a theory."

"That it occured is a fact."

A fact is something that has been proven. A theory is something provable (or disprovable if that's a word).

Now personally, I think evolution is POSSIBLE, and I think the existence of God is POSSIBLE, but neither has been proven. Regarding the age of the earth, I agree that it is much older than 6000 years.

Most Christians also believe that. There is a VERY small minority who believe the Bible is to be taken literally, word for word, but most of us don't believe that.

Until priests can SHOW me definitive proof of God, all religion is just a theory. And until I see fossil evidence without the gaping holes that currently exist, that too is just a theory. What I object to is teaching it as fact in schools, when there is very little real evidence to support it.

Anthony Thomas
You said: "There is no scientific evidence that proves the existence of Jesus." You were responding to someone who argued that Jesus lived as a real, historical person.

I challenged you to name ONE reputable historian who denies that Jesus ever existed. Thus far, you have failed to do so. The fact is, you made a statement that you cannot back up.

By the way, you also said that "books were left out of the Bible." Would you care to elaborate on that statement?

why do you think it's mutually exclusive
soph. If Russian Communism was so ProJewish why the immigration to Israel? Why Russian Red support for the Sandnazis? Why Chinese and North Korean support for the Sandnazis? Why Jewish support for communism. Hell why do some JEWS support the sandnazis (and some cq chrisians). Why do Jews vote democratic?
I simply observe commonality of actions, and self-avowed aims and purposes. They YOU homeboys as I've said before--YOU tell ME why?

I take em at their word, if you don't that's your priviledge but NOT a rebuttal.

mick

Sophie asks:
"Where again is your PHD in Evolutionary Biology from?"

You see, that's my point.

Please convince me that an Evolutionary Biology PHD would EVER attempt to disprove the theory that he has obviously spent his life defending?

Next thing you know, Berkeley will be offering doctorates for "AGW Meteorologists."

bye soph
So there were no Imperialists before the Hebrew Slaves rabbited out of Egypt?? You SURE?????
Tell it to the Hittites and Sea People, and Sub-cataracts of the Nile African Tribes, soph. Not to mention the Chinese, and Indian Sub continent tribes.

And there is NO possibility that Carbon dating might eventually be shown faulty by say, new evidence regarding sub-atomic and Quantum Physics? We DO know that TIME is a VARIABLE as speed approaches Light but NO possibility that yet to be discovered corollaries or principles might cast doubt? No possibility that Lucy represents an odd branch on the evolutionary tree that SAVE FOR the EXTENTION PHENOMENON bout 4 mill or so ago overturns accepted principles of evolution--got THAT off the history channel LAST NIGHT soph!!

As to the "extinction phenominon" that replaced Forrest with grassland. Can you say NOAH!

the big mick

AT
I think this whole line of thought is getting too nit-picky. Looking at human history, I would say, including up till this very moment, slavery haS been more of the rule than the exception. Arguing over who was meaner is irrelevant. Slavery was just an accepted practice worldwide until recently, and it still goes on today in some areas.

Comparing the Inquisition to the current beheadings and 9/11 events seems fairly inane; can you come up with something at least in the last 500 years?