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Wednesday, November 29, 2006
Ann Coulter :: Townhall.com Columnist
Airport Security Should Be Profiling Arabs
by Ann Coulter
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The six imams removed from a US Airways flight last week have apparently adopted my suggestion that if they really want to protest the airline, instead of boycotting US Airways, they should start flying it frequently.

The spokesman for the imams -- or as I believe it's phrased in their culture, "designated liar" -- Omar Shahin, staged a protest at Reagan Washington National Airport on Monday, after which, according to the Associated Press, "he and other religious leaders boarded a US Airways flight to demonstrate their determination to continue praying and flying."

The original six imams removed from the flight last week first attracted attention when they said prayers to Allah on traditional Muslim prayer rugs in the boarding area. After boarding, they changed seats, spreading themselves throughout the plane. They were also overheard spouting anti-American rhetoric. Witnesses said the six men appeared to be either Islamic fanatics or U.S. Army chaplains on leave from Guantanamo.

Following the lead of FEMA in keeping Americans safe, the Homeland Security Department's Office for Civil Rights and Civil Liberties is investigating the removal of the imams from the US Airways flight. (Talk about coincidences -- I'm currently investigating the removal of the Office for Civil Rights and Civil Liberties from the Department of Homeland Security!)

Imam spokesman Shahin is a great example of why airport security ought to be profiling Arabs. Shahin's predecessor at the Islamic Center in Tucson was Osama bin Laden's financier and head of logistics -- until he was arrested in Saudi Arabia in 2002.

Instead of aggressively distinguishing himself from his terrorist predecessor, judging by news reports, Shahin spent the five years after 9/11 denying that Muslims were behind the attacks and complaining of phony anti-Islamic "hate crimes" -- as opposed to the pro-Islamic hate crimes he presumably endorses.

In 2003, for example, Shahin alleged that a woman in Arizona had thrown shoes at children at the mosque.

This is the most transparent hoax I've heard since, "If I did it, here's how I would have done it." This is like the joke about a speaker at an American communist rally opening with: "Workers and peasants of Brooklyn!" Shahin has so little insight into this country, he can't even invent a believable hate crime.

It's Arabs who have a thing about shoes being a sign of disrespect, not Americans. When Iraqis toppled the statue of Saddam Hussein, the crowd immediately pelted it with shoes. Saddam installed a mosaic of the first president Bush's face on the ground floor of his palace so that visitors would be forced to disrespect Bush by walking on his visage in their shoes.

Shahin himself couldn't get away from this pan-Arabic shoe fetish, adding: "The incidents of Muslims being attacked kind of shocked me in my shoes." Note to imams trying to fabricate hate crimes against Muslims: Americans don't share your shoe neurosis.

At Reagan National this week, Rabbis joined the Muslims at the prayer protest -- though one imagines they did not share this prayer from the Hadith: "And the Jews will hide behind the rock and tree, and the rock and tree will say: 'O Muslim, O servant of Allah, there is a Jew behind me, come and kill him!'" In fairness, they usually save that one for the high holidays, like the "Festival of the Six Dead Jews" or "Honor Killing Week."

Nor this one, also from the Hadith: "The Prophet said: 'The Hour will not take place until the Muslims fight the Jews, and the Muslims kill them. The Muslims will kill the Jews. Rejoice! Rejoice in Allah's victory!'" (Is it just me, or might some fanatic twist those words into an excuse to kill Jews?)

Also strange was that the NAACP has piped in to complain about racial profiling of Muslims. The only reason Americans feel guilty about "racial profiling" against blacks is because of the history of discrimination against blacks in this country.

What did we do to the Arabs? I believe Americans are the victims in that relationship. After the attacks of 9/11, profiling Muslims is more like profiling the Klan.

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About The Author
Ann Coulter is a columnist and author of Guilty: Liberal Victims and Their Assault On America.
 
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Profiling the Klan
Imagine if Klansmen began traveling around the country decked in their sheets and shouting prayers petitioning God for their wish lists. Nobody would have a problem siding against them and their disruptive behavior. Profile away, please. They should direct their anger at their fellow Muslims who were terrorists and gave them their bad name, not at those of us who wish to ensure that we don't get blown up.

Keep profiling
As I had said on another blog: they'll sue, they'll win, they'll use the money to fund their next attack. That's what this is all about. They laugh at us because they know we've incapacitated ourselves with political correctness.

US Airways - You did the right thing. The safety of your passengers is foremost, and if I had been on that plane that day and you had not removed those very suspicious muslims, I would have demanded that I be let off the plane.

What we Did to Arabs
We support Israel.

UncaAlby
Then explain to me why Muslims have been killing people for over 1500 years for Allah. That is way before Israel came into existence. Muslims are just using that as a excuse to kill people. They don't care whom they kill. They even kill each other in the name of Allah.

"Shahin's predecessor at the Islamic
Center in Tucson was Osama bin Laden's financier and head of logistics -- until he was arrested in Saudi Arabia in 2002."

Shocker, that.

Classic:
["The Prophet said: 'The Hour will not take place until the Muslims fight the Jews, and the Muslims kill them. The Muslims will kill the Jews. Rejoice! Rejoice in Allah's victory!'" (Is it just me, or might some fanatic twist those words into an excuse to kill Jews?)]

Come on, Ann. Everyone knows that's just figurative language for "Can't we all just get along?"

hypocrites
Someone please ask the imams what would happen to Christians in Iran or Syria if they acted in like manner (christian prayers, anti Iran speech, etc...) Would it be ok to treat them in like manner?

Being Offended
Maybe I'm just getting worn down but I have no energy left to care about people who are "offended." I don't care if Muslims are offended. I don't care if audience members are offended by that Seinfeld guy and I don't care if athiests are offended by Christmas. It's not against the law to offend anyone in the United States of America. It's also not recommended due to the possible consequences and if you don't like that then go back to - or forward to - wherever it is you would be more comfortable. We're a free country and do not build walls to keep people "in."

Cynewulf
I've cited that passage from the ahadith, to someone who wondered even if I'd read the KORAN. (Yes, I have, and from the commentaries as well!). Of course, they did not really address this point.

Oi vey. I suppose only radical extremist muslims believe in Islam.

Ralf
I'm joined-at-the-hip with you on the whole being offended thing. In this day and age, being offended is like breathing in - about half our lifespan. Just frickin deal with it.

CC
"They laugh at us because they know we've incapacitated ourselves with political correctness. "

We didn't do it - the fing liberals did it.

Isn't letting Imams fly on American jets
like Hitler drink in German bars?

correction
like LETTING Hitler drink...

Commando flash back
Substitute a jihadist for Arnold and a liberal for Solly.

Jihadist to liberal:"You remember when I told you I'd kill you last?"

Liberal: "Yeah."

Jihadist: "I lied."

Rush Limbaugh today
Listening to the guy in for Rash Lambast today, I forget his name - Roger Winter? I don't know

Rush is on a 'secret' mission -- something 'once in a lifetime'... I wonder if he's to be lunching in Qatar with the president or some such? Perhaps getting briefed by the CIA on the next talking issues to be disseminated to the American public?

All this as Bush, after the quick meet and greet with the Dems, heads off on the global tour inviting everyone to Nato, the WTO, and Iraq to join in the fun.

The president is determined to get the talk show hosts in line - we'll have to see when ol' Rushbo gets back if it's really what the Limbaugh Inst. Advancing Republicans was up to

Actually the only thing advanced about the quite simpleton set up is when they convolute things to explain away the not so conservative Republicans [conservative studies my... it's L.I.A.R. more to me] --- though the big man says he "won't be carrying their water anymore" - post this last election -- yeah right.

So as our globalist all of sudden president, now that the voting machines are fixed and bankers [build a burgers - for all you fast food conspiracy nut cases] have the set up they want (via diebold?)...... we have the twig (as the air head Am gas bags like to call him, or shrub or something) galavanting around the global town, as Mort Kondracke says we now - a quarter century late - need some oversight on the imports the free tread corporate lobbyists have lobbed our way - so furiously injurious to our citizenry........ niktesla.com Nik Tesla 71
Tacoma 9 Washington state of snow shock

Michael Medved
Medved mentioned today that the gang [of talk show hosts - conservative of course] are heading back to the white house. This should be interesting to go along with the Rush - whom M.M. first substituted for - when he got hooked and decided he needed his own easy gig - secret escape[ade] NT71

What? What? I don't
get it. So some imams move about the plane. Big deal. Was the seatbelt light on? If not, so what? So what if they were swinging wet towels in the air like flashing scimitars, and so what if they said their carry-ons were full of human heads? Cultural diversity, dude. Don't be so narrow minded. And so what if they were chanting "death to the Great Satan by which we mean America which we hate and want to destroy"? That's just a typical Moslem prayer, right up there in the Islamical catechism with "may all the jews be burned to powder and their ashes mixed with pig urine and drunk by dogs".

Hey, dude, listen: in this country we have this thing called "Freedom of Religion." It's in one of those amendments. (Hey, did you ever notice that Amendment starts with AMEN? That unconstitutional. Separation of Church and State!) Freedom of Religion is in one of the early, good amendments, that matter. Not that one about guns, though -- guns are bad. People don't kill people, guns kill people. Guns and America. Why can't we be more like Canada? Anyways, what I was saying is that, um ... well, I seem to have lost my train of thought. Something about how America and Israel steal oil and are so full of hate.

I hope that clears it up for all you rightwing haters.

OH, and did you hear in the news about how women are throwing shoes at little mosqlem children? It was on Air America, so you know its true. I wish I was Arab. I'm white. That's bad. And I wish I was a woman.

J
http://forgottenprophets.blogspot.com/

JackH
You don't want to be an Arab woman!

Before this gets out of hand...........
Please, please, please don't respond to idiots, drunks and the uninformed as if they had a point to make.

I am tired of the jousting between contributors on this forum with personal attacks. It is boring, juvenile and a waste of space.

Coulter will get lots of debate here but this issue seems to be one she cannot lose, unless your are from the ACLU or CAIR and think you have a relevant point to make.

Give it a shot but I ain't going to want to fly with you regardless of your prayers.

An end to profiling, please!
All profiling at airports would be unnecessary if we adopted a few simple measures:

1) All airlines must upgrade their upholstery to have pigskin trim, like on the arm rests and such.
2) The ink used to print airline tickets should contain a percentage of lard practicable for printing.
3) All lubricants in and around all airports, and on doors and seats in aircraft cabins should contain 10% lard with signs to this effect.
4) Airports should abandon those high tech hand held explosive sniffers handled by imbeciles in favor of dogs and pigs. Yes, pigs! Very good sense of smell, smart and packed with Muslim repelling power!
5) Passengers will be issued a Chihuahua to hold on their lap during the flight.
6) For those allergic to dogs, a Vietnamese pot bellied pig will be offered as an alternative.
7) Pork rinds will replace peanuts for in-flight snacks.
8) Kosher meals and snack will be available to passengers showing proof of being Jewish.
9) Vegetarians…hmmm…Sorry,better luck next time.

I was talking to a relative of mine....
and he said, "they should have waited until the plane was 30,000 feet and then kicked them off."

We might not have gone that far, but it is my opinion the we still prevented another 9/11 that day. What say you???

End to profiling
Anne you hit the nail on the head!

We should also:

1. Automatically arrest all Black people in the area when a crime has occurred.
2. Deport any Mexican person who is working.
3. Round up any White male when a child is molested.

Thank you Anne!

No Spin
You can't do that. Ever heard of "Explosive decompression"?

I don't think many people were fooled by the Imams. This was a stunt. I will be flying US Air the next time I take a vacation.

Give me a break...
Not all crime is committed by black people, not all mexicans are illegal (but a lot are), not all pedophiles are white men. However, just about every act of terrorism perpetrated in the last 50 or so years has been caused by an islamic nut job. How can you compare the two? It's easy to carp from the safety of your home. I wonder how you would have felt getting ready to board that plane. Like they say, "There are no athiests in a foxhole".

Hmmm, Nik-T....
.... signs his posts "NT71".

"71".... I.Q. maybe?

AidanKM writes:
"...If she was to be listened to none of us would be safe."

If you define "us" as "liberal/socialists" -- you are correct.

:-)

Primus54 writes:
"...If she was to be listened to none of us would be safe."

If you define "us" as "liberal/socialists" -- you are correct.

:-)

So not only is her thinly veiled threats pointed towards the entire Muslim world but also to liberals, socialists, democrats, any others? This type of siege mentality that conservatives foster to energise their base is extremely depressing when one takes a long term view of the implication it will have for the future. The world is not out to get conservative Americans.

Thasic
Islam is Arabic, meaning slavery or submission. It was invented by a man named Muhammad. Muhammad was a dictator. Muhammad was a pedophile. Muhammad exterminated thousands of tribes for refusing to accept his religion. Muhammad preached that his followers were to cause the whole world by the sword to come under submission to them, who would, in turn, by subservient to Allah. They would be rewarded in paradise with 73 virgins, hundreds of young maidens, and thousands of divorced women who would fulfill their every sexual desire. No other religion teaches this. Islams is, in fact, the first and only religion ever to teach children how to kill themselves. Christianity teaches forgiveness. Judaism teaches the concept of being like God by following strict standards of morality. Buddhism teaches peace, and enlightenment. Atheism teaches evolution, and developement/advancement of the species. Islam, on the other hand, teaches that it is their duty to exterminate entire nations. They are permitted to lie to the infidels with the intention of killing them. It is based upon the absolute-most primitve impulses of man: sexual gratification, spiritual superstitions, and destruction or rival tribes. Any questions?

We should ex-spunge spunge
He doesn't seem to have noticed that the jihadists have committed over 6,000 attacks against non-muslims, World-Wide, just since 9-11.

More people have died at the jihadists' hands just since 9-11, than the IRA or ETA have killed in.... how many decades?

Nik-T, on the other hand, just makes absolutely NO sense. Was his cat walking across the keyboard at the end of each post?

so sorry
I meant to say all that to spunge.

otter
"6000 attacks against NON-MUSLIMS since 9-11". Interesting. Where did you get this info and could you provide some facts to back it up.
I'm assuming your not counting attacks against Isreal in this number but i'm sure you'll correct me.

AidanKM
Read Suzanne Fields article yet?

yes it is!!
The world is out to destroy the United States of American, just like the liberal are trying to destroy Walmart. The Liberal View "We shall have no success unless the goverment is in charge", for the world it is "We shall have no success unless the UN is in charge". What do you mean the world is not out to get conservative Americans. Get your head out of the sand.

No spin
There is no need to lecture me on Islam you pompous git. I agree with most of what you said. All i was saying i my comment to Thaasic is that saying just about every act of terrorism perpetrated in the last 50 or so years has been caused by an islamic nut job is simply not true. But truth never seems to be a high priority for some here.

Go ahead and Profile Please
It would save the rest of us a lot of time. I mean really, are we wasting a bit of time frisking grannies with their carry on full of keepsakes and letting the IMAMS get by while acting totally whacked? I mean moving to the isle seats only, asking for seat belt extenders and then laying them on the floor beside their seats? Hello? I would be a little concerned.
Now about the woman who was breast feeding on the plane and got kicked off. WRONG! Hey if a stewardess was offended at see her feed her baby, then she needs some psychiatric help.
I mean, what does that hurt? And as far as throwing shoes at Muslim Children? I would waste my time to drive onto the parking lot of a mosque to start with, why would I throw my perfectly good shoes at their kids. That has BS written all over it!
Profile, Profile, Profile, and when you get tired, Profile some more! By the way, where is my .357 Magnum?

I wouldn't waste my time
driving onto their parking lot. Come to think of it, I wouldn't even go pee on their Mosque if it were burning to the ground.

Interview

Just saw an interview on TV

Progressive MUSLIM writer said Imams were naive at best, that in today's climate, doing provactive things where sure to attract unwelcome attention.

He has the flick.

AidanKM:

You need to develop a sense of humor!

One thing you've got to admit about Ann Coulter -- she doesn't hide what she is like so many of the so-called "journalists" of the MSM.

And whether you like it or not, she WRITES what so many people wish they would say if given a chance. When it comes to national security and protecting innocent civilians FIRST... liberals are 180 degress out of phase.

And it is such a convenient postion to take... if we "profile", we're rascists and homophobes. If we don't catch the next batch or terrorists before they are successful in pulling off another 9/11... then we'll be accused of not "connecting the dots" to protect Americans.

Have you or any of your liberal friends ever really looked at the actions FDR took during WWII to isolate potential enemies? If you have... and if you are intellectually honest -- how in the world can you look at what this administration has done and even remotely criticize it for supposed abuses of liberties or creating a climate of racsism?

It defies common sense... which is apparently not all that common anymore.

You Are Now Free to Fly Back to Mecca
So the imams want to fly? Swell, send them all back to the Middle East.

Let's not stop there, either. Let's round up every anti-American Muslim in the US and send them packing, too, without their women, whom we should liberate.


Islam = Nazisism
Islam is a religion like National Socialism is a Religion. Islam should be outlawed and ALL Moslems should be deported or jailed.

Non-Islamic terrorists?
Irish Republican Army; Trained in PLO-run camps in Libya, supplied with arms by PLO.

ETA; Same.

Renko Sekigun (Japanese Red Army); Same. Carried out Lod Airport (Israel) attack in 1975 on behalf of Black September.

Brigade Rosse (Red Brigades, Italy); Trained in Black September camps in Syria. Carried out attack on U.S. general commanding NATO in 1977 on behalf of el-Fatah.

DRW (Deustche RotWehr,aka "German Red Army", aka "Baader-Meinhof Gang"); Trained in PLO camps in Libya. Carried out atacks on NATO airfields in (then) West Germany, with intent to steal air-delivered tactical nuclear stores to be passed on to PLO.

(Note; Similar plan proposed but never carried out by "Wehrsportsgruppe Hoffmann", aka "Military Sports Group Hoffman", ultra-right wing [neo-Nazi] group in FRG at the time, with connections through East Germany to Black September.)

I've just hit the highlights here. There are numerous other examples.

The reason for these disparate groups working together was a mixture of convenience (the Islamic groups had the resources for arming and training them), practicality (they also had the deepest pockets courtesy of their state sponsors), deniability (no overt connections to the USSR or PRC, which was where the Western intelligence agencies were looking at the time), and the fact that every group mentioned, Islamist or otherwise, shared two psychological attributes; they were both anti-Semitic and anti-American.

For the last fifty years, Islamic fundamentalism, in all its forms, has been the engine which moves international political terrorism. In a very real sense, the various Islamist groups (PLO, el-Fatah, Black September, Black June [aka The Corrective Movement For El-Fatah aka the Abu Nidal Group], and later al-Qaeda), have been to internatioal terrorism what the Sicilian Mafia has been to international organized crime. Without the Islamists, terrorism as we understand it would not exist.

(Most of the above information from "The Terror Network" by Claire Sterling.)

P.S.; As to "what we've done to get the Islamists mad at us", it's easy; we exist. That alone is enough to offend them. Just as the fact that the Jews existed was enough to offend the Nazis. And BTW, the Islamists, going back to the Mufti of Jerusalem, had a very cozy relationship with those goose-stepping b*****ds, as well.

cheers

eon

Who Invited Nik T to the party?
I notice he spends time listening to Rush. Let's hear it one more time - TH is for conservatives, the liberals and Democrats have their blogs, let them keep each other happy over there. And, far from carrying water for the GOP or Bush, if you listen to Rush with a fair ear, you notice he has his own opinions, true very conservative, very anti-Democrat and anti-liberal, but you'd have to be a talk show host for Air America to believe Rush is in the pockets of the GOP. In fact, when will Rush get credit for being one of the most knowledgeable and independent conservative thinkers and commentatators in the U.S.?

the Faithful of the koran
We constantly hear that it is the fringe extremists of Islam that are the problem NOT the majority of Muslim adherents. My ears are tired of hearing this hogwash. (Was it a fringe that elected Hamas?)
If a practicing Muslim is to be 'true' to the teachings AND practices of Mohammed and the Islamic text....he SHOULD be violent against Jews and Christians and anyone that opposes Islam. If he or she wants to be consistent and faithful to the letter of Islamic ideology (as urged by most of their imams) they will kill the infidels. Anything less than that is not 'true' Muslim practice.
Having read the Koran and much of their so-called sacred texts and commentaries, it is brutally (and I do mean brutally) apparent that this religion and its founder is anything but peaceful. Our country and our culture will wake up to this reality too late...after all, we wouldn't want to hurt anyone's feelings or religious practice even if that belief is one of subjugation and repression and even killing.

The terrorists will beat us if ---
They are smart and they understand us better than we understand ourselves.

They instigated this deliberately in order to create the bedlam that followed. And the PC voices among us obligingly responded with "This profilling is terrible."

We need to wake up or we will be the casualties of a culture that hates us just because we exist.
We can't reason with the proponents of this philosophy from the pit of hell. Doing so just plays into their plan to exterminate us.

We do have choices. We can become intollerent muslims; we can become dead or we can become fierce warriors.

What we cannot be is what we are - because that is not a choice they will allow us to make.

spunge
Ok its actually 25 or 30 years. The IRA has no reason to hate the USA so we let Britain deal with it. The fact that people in Ireland are mostly Christians(or were) has nothing to do with their goals-which was political independence from the UK.

The terrorists have *explicitly* stated their goals. This is NOT Anne's paranoia. Its like Mark Steyn said: he has simply listened to the terrorists while much of America has not.

Shall I post the littany of attacks on the US since the late 1970s?

I think it is YOU whose head is in his alimentary. Between me, you and the Islamic radicals only you have a different interpretation of things.

The best
Ann Coulter is the best columnist out there. To the point and funny as can be. Oh yeah, and she speaks "truth to multiculturalists", and I love that. Where are the Ann Coulters of the Arab/Muslim world? Oh, I forgot; "no school for you little girl!"

It's the Friggin Schools!!
Not to get too far off the subject, but one of the main reasons people like “spunge” and AidanKM exist in our country is due to our schools.

Unfortunately, I live in a “blue” state. My son is a sophomore in High School, and for the last 3 WEEKS (!!) his US History teacher has been teaching our future generation about “American Imperialism”!! (btw, did you know we acquired Alaska through our “imperialism” – just like Japan acquired the Philippines in WWII)

However, when I ask my son about Valley Forge, Patrick Henry or Thomas Paine I only get a blank stare.

So, please don’t be too quick to jump on our regular moonbats, they are often just victims of the liberal brainwashing found in most of our public schools.

Where are my school vouchers!!??

Racial Profiling Against Muslims?
So the NAACP belives that Islam is a race?

That explains so much of what is wrong with what was once a great organization.

Who's doing the profiling?
Not our revered TSA. Not our inestimable Sky Marshals. REGULAR PASSENGERS! Our politically correct governmental organizations will not save us. We individually are our only line of defense. Hooray for the passengers who pointed out these fanatics and hooray for the flight crew who had the cahones to boot them off the plane.

When are we going to stop all the crap about "security checks" and allow passengers to carry firearms? Then we'll see how many would-be terrorists survive through the descent and landing. Viva La Second Amendment.

(Yes, I'm somewhat tongue-in-cheek for those of you wondering.)

Icedog
In case you go to far in your crusade against American formal education. I do not live int he US. I have lived there and love the country. It is also interesting to take an outside perspective on issues. At times the US is far too insular in its view of its place in the world. I think the US is a major force for good in the world. There is dark side to it too. And for the record, not seeing the world in black and white, good and evil does not make you a "moonbat".

What I love
about Ann is she is not afraid to speak her mind, as so many today cannot do out of their fear of being offensive.

I am with Ralf, I am weary of worrying about someone's feelings. Talk about fear. Is that not fear induced, worrying about that? Do we have to be so PC that we risk our own lives?

The Islamic radicals know us better than we (some of us) know ourselves. They know how to play us; they use every freedom we have against us; they know exactly how our PC is going to help them.

I bet that every time the Muslims hear "PC" they laugh themselves sick.

When was the last time they worried about feelings?

Right, I imagine those dancing in the street in Palestine on 9/11 were really worried about offending us.

Nikt
Nik obviously listens to Rush so he can throw in some of his clever remarks (well, clever in his mind), I think 71 is probably a bit optimistic, I'd put him somewhere in Kim's range, maybe in the high 40's or low 50's.

Does profiling work?
Nearly every terrorist event has been committed by muslims over the past 50 years only if we discount Sein Fein, the Ulster Unionists, the Vietcong, the Khemer Rouge, the Bahder-Meinhof anarchists, ETA, the ANC, the Klan, the anti-abortion movement, the Sandinistas, lone nutters, Hindu fundamentalists, xtian fundamentalists…

We can learn useful lesions from the mistakes and successes of governments experiences with these groups rather than pretending they didn’t happen. When people target a whole group then terrorist support grows as it reinforces the claim of terrorists that they are defending the group. Terrorism usually recedes when starved of civilian support.

I think that security services do have to be more careful in using profiles for other practical reasons as well. The difficulty about wide profiles such as “muslim” is that you can’t necessarily tell someone’s religion or politics by their appearance or name. Even if you can name your child Piety Divine that doesn’t mean when she grows up that she will be. Also when someone sets out to do harm they will obviously avoid behaviours which make them look suspicious. That may be why Al-Qeada has been actively seeking out recruits with non-stereotypical muslim names and appearances.

This also explains why the 9/11 bombers wore western clothes, didn’t pray but did drink and listen to music and avoided passengers knowing they were together. If security spends too much effort targeting a wide group rather than smaller subsets (ie those who are actually connected with known terrorists or terrorist organisation) what will obviously happen is that whilst praying visibly muslim religious people or groups are being ejected by staff or bigoted fellow passengers some innocuous looking girl with lippy and western dress is going to blow them up. I think your ignoring the point that she can not pray and break religious taboos because she will consider her last act to absolve her from any previous sins that she has committed so what does she need to pray for.

PS. The equivalent isn’t profiling the Klan obviously but profiling white or white xtians as the obvious repost using her logic is how many black people are there in the Klan.

Oy
As someone that is normally far to the left, it is slightly painful that I have to admit that I agree with Anne Coulter, but she is exactly right. I think I must have missed the memo when logical conjecture based on overwhelming empirical evidence became known as racial profiling and thus offensive. If I am a cop and I hear there is a bomb threat on the plane, sorry but I am going to look to the Arab guy first. Statistically he is probably more likely than the black guy next to him to have done it. Now if we are talking about food stamp fraud, probably gonna go after the black guy first. Maybe that's wrong of me to say aloud, but it's true. Serial killer? Probably the white guy. Maybe some will say its racist and unfair, but I say get over it and realize that it is common sense. Honestly I'd rather offend a few people than see two hundred others dead.

Oh yeah, read my blog. http://think.dumblaws.com

Icedog
You'll be delighted to know that i do not exist in your country, although i've been there many times and love it to bits. My father is from New York, my mother for Dallas and most of my family and my sisters have lived in America for the greater part of their lives.

Are you a mind reader(and a bad one at that). How do you know what my political preferences are. Did I metion America or Impererialism in any of my comments.

I love America, its culture,its freedoms, its people(not you tho).
I love the fact that ( despite what you might think of my opinions) America tries to do what is right and just around the world, even though lately you seem to be making the world alot more of a dangerous place to live in.

You make assumtions about my politics that have no basis in fact , and if you are a reflection of the American people(which thankfully you are not) then i feel great pity for what are a great pweople.

Do you consider yourselves racists?
10%white-80%grey-10%black

It's not so cut and dry, but I guess I wouldn't expect any of you to understand that. Hey, here's and idea, let's just round all the brown people up, put them in the new FEMA camps being built for "immigration purposes" and sort through them as time allows. Did it with the Jap's, worked out great! I served in Iraq, so go ahead and talk your trash to me if you must, but I have see what this kind of arrogant talk leads to. You people can't seem to wrap your heads around the fact that we're killing the Muslims much more than they're killing us, and have been doing that as it has suited the interests of the US. And by the way, not all Muslims are Islamists! Look it up! It's a little something called base rates. Furthermore, profiling is not something that Democracies do or should do! Wake up and use the morals you are all claiming to have!

Snakes on a Plane.
The best way to ensure you don't have any snakes on the plane is to not let snakes on the plane. Simple.

AidanKM
English Lords still think that Swift wanted to eat babies.

Jerubaal says...
"I'm joined-at-the-hip with you on the whole being offended thing. In this day and age, being offended is like breathing in - about half our lifespan. Just frickin deal with it."

As a siamese twin I am DEEPLY offended by your insensitive comment! ;)

Profblog
English Lords still think that Swift wanted to eat babies = ? :-( WOW

Spunge & Aidan
Yes, I made some assumptions about your political beliefs. However, I made those assumptions based on your own words.

For instance:
“…the numerous christian terrorist assholes who between then have carried out just as many if not more atrocites then the islamic.”

“This type of siege mentality that conservatives foster to energise their base is extremely depressing…”

I guess it was way off base for me to assume you are both liberals.

However, I do find it interesting that both of you live outside the US, yet want to criticize and complain about the methods Americans use to protect themselves. I guess if NY or LA goes up in a mushroom cloud you will still be able to make it to your “Cultural Sensitivity” focus group.

Mr Matt
"we're killing the Muslims much more than they're killing us"

Good let's keep it up!

Let's not just profile ...
Let's put 'em in a line-up!
Hey, "SPUNGE" or whatever the he11 you call yourself ... have you got the nerve to tell everyone what your acronym name really means? I have heard one version using those initials, but I don't know if that's the one you intend to promote and being a Christian, I don't care to repeat it. Or are you just a "sponge" on society with no contributions of your own to make?
Before you come back to me, my handle means "Gunners Mate", a rating (job) within the U. S. Navy, in which I proudly served for 11 years before health reasons forced me out.

Thasic
>just about every act of terrorism perpetrated >in the last 50 or so years has been caused by >an islamic nut job.

I really have to disagree with this, and it shows the problem with profiling.

As I recall, Tim McVey was white, and a Gulf War Veteran with a Bronze Star. Eric Rulolph was not only white, but Christian! In fact, I suspect all of the KKK is white

If you want to go to europe, then you should include the Red Army Faction on your list, and some would also look at the IRA.

If we look at just one race as the attacker, then we are vunerable to people of other races being recruited for terrorist acts.

Pressure
Ann and all the townhall columnists as well as any and all conservatives with access to MSM outlets need to keep pressuring this anti-profiling mentality.

It should be demanded of all of these conservative politicians and commentators to demand that the MSM go under cover into US mosques, and also demand to speak to any imams that will give their opinions on radical islam.

It is such a no brainer to get to the bottom of this in 90 days that I/one can only assume the political agenda's of the press is comprimising their objectivity, and responsibility to the american public to present the situation as it is, and not how they wish it would be.

Mr. Matt you are disengenuous at best. A RASIST! (misused word in most cases) is a person that believes a human being is deficient-flawed-lacking-defective-non human because of their race. Sounds pretty muslim in the right context; but I digress. Most western thinking people with narrow minds fall into the bigoted, and prejudice catageries.

And most reasonable people suffer from incongruence, their comments about given races and religions run counter to the way they actually treat these same people, and it is not out of fear.

My father told all the N jokes, bohemian jokes, polish et.al. But given the professional opportunity to hire hundreds of employees he was remarkably very open minded in his hiring, and social deeds. This was in the 70's.

11H

Malkin & Coulter!
One following the other is like having Ruth and Gehrig in the lineup. And all the libs have is 90% of the MSM, and the dispicable democrats who can't wait to pin a war loss on the President of the U.S.

Hey, it's still no match. We win going away. Pelosi was foiled when she tried to put the totally corrupt John Murtha in the #2 spot and the impeached Alcee Hastings as head of the House Judicial Committee as part of the new "most honest congress in history." Yeah, right. How are things in Louisiana, Mr. Jefferson (D-La)? Ya still got the 90 grand in the reefer? Nah, but yer about to be indicted. Rock on, Nancy.

Spunge_
None of the groups or governments you label as "Christian" have acted because their religion tells them to kill non-believers. These groups are not even Christian. They may have individual members who are truly Christian. You are not Christian because you live in the "west" and are not Jewish or Muslim. Being a Christian is a choice, not an accident of birth.

Many Americans are just plain ignorant
Not that long ago America would not put up with this Islamic Imam bull fodder or anything else for that matter.

Today many Americans, including those sworn to protect this country are too touch feeley and want to be in-tune and understand those who want to cut our heads off.

Good old American common sense has been replaced with this endless physco babble of over analyzing and debating in what we should do to not hurt the other guy's feelings, all the while the other guy is trying to sever our heads from our bodies with a dull butcher knife.

Many Americans run around like scare rabbits popping prozac making endless visits to their therapists because their afraid to face the harsh reality that there are still bad people in the world and they have to be dealt with harshly, and these scared rabbits just can't face the fact that America is going to have to step into the ring and fight these Islamic thugs, who hide behind their religion to use it as an excuse to murder, rape non-believers all over the world.

These Imams who were removed from the airplane knew exactly what they were doing. They knew that they were going to be removed and their next plan was to make this a huge public relations embarrassment to this country and the airline.
Then the mainstream media like the dumb sheep that they are, parade these poor Islamic holy men around like poor helpless victims of American brutality, and bigoted feelings towards Islam. Score one for the Imams in their public relations victory, and a loss for America because if it's stupidity in believing the crap that mainstream media puts out.

I'll probably be called a racists,bigoted,angry white,Republican, homophobic male or some other cute little sound bite or catch phrase that Islamic butt kissers like to attach to Americans who want to protect this country from enemies foreign and domestic, but you know what? I don't care any more. You damn right I'm bigoted against anyone who is trying to bring my country to it's knees and kill me or my family, or rape my wife and daughter.

If those Imams and CAIR don't like it, well, they just can on what ever means available to them and get the hell out of this country, and take the touchy feelies with them. But one for thing is for sure like the sun coming up, the touch feelies will be begging to come back to the U.S. because they'll finally realize that this country wasn't so bad after all.

Long live America and the ideals that it stands for, and if you and the rest of the anti-American don't like it, then you can get the hell out to!



Civillian Support
joys writes:

"Terrorism usually recedes when starved of civilian support"

THis is the most intelligent statement I have read since 9/11.

America has not won a real war since WWII. And we will never win another until we understand the only way to destroy the "enemy" is to remove or subdue its civillian support.

The reason we face unrelenting propsects of terrorism is we have yet remove or subdue the civillian support it relies upon.

Naked
Your examples (other than the IRA) are for lack of a better term LAME! Your arguement, point, or opinion is nonsensicle.

Jim Jones does not represent Christians, Karesh, McVay, the nut jobs who went to meet the comet are all abberations, muslim nut jobs are NOT!

When 75 year old ladies from Iowa bomb an airplane...we can start profiling them; until then it seems arab males between 17 and 45 are, and should be-the target group.

As they say, the constitution is not a suicide pact.

11h

Icedog
Your right. I consider myself to be a small bit left of centre but i fail to see how you can make these assumptions based on what i wrote. All i was trying to say (badly) was that islamic terrorists were not the only terrorists who existed. If it seemed like I was making excuses for them I am sorry.

I couldn't care less about being sensitive to the cultural differences of anybody, and if I let rip, i'd probably be blocked from posting here. Which might not be a bad thing#!!

But it does seem to me that Americas methods of protecting herself have increased the danger of attack for her allies across the globe.

Apologies if I was rude in my previous comments

Naked Pagan,
I don't know where you've been, but obviously you've been mushroomed. Perhaps you should change your name to Rip Van Winkle.

conservativeman
Nice post. I agree with virtually everything you said, and the way you said it.

Yippee!
I like most of the posts here, by far. AidanKM, Nik_T, et al are obvious exceptions. As you might guess, I thoroughly enjoyed Ann's article, too.

It's ironic that we are just now starting to allow ourselves to profile, as terrorist groups are recruiting new members who look like Europeans, so profiling on the basis of appearance (looking like someone from around the Mediterranean, etc) will be ineffective.

Thank you to the PC crowd! Now, if all you liberals don't mind, please move to some country where a large majority of the people already think like you do, and let us defend ourselves. If you want to offer yourselves to the terrorists for sacrifice, I can't stop you - just don't drag me along with you!

I think that AidanKM....
...is a Muslim, and a radical one at that.

Ann is a gift to us all. With a sense of humor - albeit at times with considerable bite - she's doing her best to keep us awake.
Because, as evidenced by the recent election results, so many of our countrymen are too busy to think, or are asleep.

Listen, I'm just your average old (and I do mean old) working person, and I gotta go to work.
Ciao.

Logic
Conservative Liberal

The maths doesn’t work for empirically logical case. For the case to be logical it would have to be transferable to a comparable situation and still make sense so we know were aren't allowing are biases or fears to influence our judgement.

Since over 90% of domestic violence is committed by men we should profile them and assume that all men are a danger to their families until proved otherwise? How about doing what happened to these men and bringing them in for questioning on the subject at the suggestion of any unknown woman.

Even though nearly all rapists are men doesn’t mean that most men are rapists, just because most domestic violence is done by men doesn’t mean that most men beat their wives and children, just because most infanticide is done by mothers doesn’t mean that mothers are normally a danger to their kids, and even if most terrorists really were muslim that wouldn’t mean that most muslims are terrorists.

Why are people asking for one group to be profiled and not another?

gunrsm8
My tag is simply a stupid nickname I've had since i child. The short story is i got it because i have hair of a particular colour. I'm interest to know what you think it stands for.

"and being a Christian, I don't care to repeat it. Or are you just a "sponge" on society with no contributions of your own to make?"

It seems to me your not that bothered about your christianity if your resorting to personal attacks so do tell me what you think my name stands for

Yours in anticipation,
Spunge(and proud of it)

Mr. Matt
I don't expect you to understand any of the following, but try anyway:

I think you're an arrogant little jerk and should finish high school before you post your drivel.

You CLAIM to have "served in Iraq", but I have my doubts. You don't know how many terrorists have been killed by American and coalition forces. You don't know how many Iraqis have been killed in sectarian violence or by Iranians/Saudis who entered Iraq illegally.

You don't know any of that, yet you still claim the Americans kill more Muslim than Muslims kill Americans.

You posted, "Not all Muslims are Islamists! Look it up! It's a little something called base rates." Right. Mohammad Ali wasn't an "Islamist". You're quibbling. But that passes for rational discourse in your pathetic universe. You wouldn't know a base rate if it fell on you.


The War Is Not Over
It is taking place under our noses, and we are forced to sit and look like sitting ducks while the Lefties use the courts to further and further emasculate our country.

Wth the recent election, we have shown the world that we ARE like a paper tiger. All the evil groups of the world have to do is wait it out until the next bunch of Lefties are voted into power and they are in like Flint.

No wonder Prime Minister Maliki stood up President Bush at the scheduled meeting yeserday. He is just as anxiety as the rest of us over what the United States will do next. When he appeared in the press conference, he showed the strain.

I have written in my blog regarding my frustration over this in my latest post entitled "ANXIOUS IRAQ: How Can They Trust Us?"

Drop by and comment!

Mr Matt served in Iraq?
Say Matt, what was you mos? What unit did you serve with? and where in Iraq did you serve? If we are killing muslims more than they are killing us it is because we are better at head to head combat than they are. Oh yeah, and we don't use suicide bombers to kill innocent men women and children. we also don't fly airplanes full of innocent civilians into buildings full of innocent civilians to further our cause. Remember FDR (DEMOCRAT) put the japanese into camps....were you aware of that or are you just stupid?

Naked Pagan
Let's meet in the middle. No one (and I think others will back me up) is saying to let our guard down on all others. Random checks can deter others. But it is simple logic that those trying to cause harm in our country are Muslim. Can we please use our common sense when it comes to protecting ourselves?

There is going to be a major event that will likely be traced back to being politically correct rather than vigilant. I don't want to hate anyone but it is clear that a significant portion of this group hates us and means us harm.

Mountain Rose
"The War Is Not Over
It is taking place under our noses, and we are forced to sit and look like sitting ducks while the Lefties use the courts to further and further emasculate our country."

Emasculate, what a good word, Rose.

Also, I just read your new blog. Good one!

Conservative-Liberal
Well said. I just cannot believe that security in this area is not agreed on 100%. Profiling has been made a dirty word-by your side, sorry. It is not a bad thing if there is a common sense basis behind the particular profiling that is occuring. Come on everyone. Please use the common sense you were born with. The IRA is not to be admired but they aren't threatening us.

re: Taskwazen
quote: "Islam is a religion like National Socialism is a Religion. Islam should be outlawed and ALL Moslems should be deported or jailed."

Have you ever read the Constitution?

kudos
Well said, David Mac and conservativeman. On the other hand, naked pagan, you are a dunce of monumental proportion.

terrorists
I couldn't care less about which group has performed the most terrorist acts in the last fifty years(obviously muslims). I just know that muslims carried out the last terrorist attack on my soil, and they pontificate about how they will do it again. So let's be logical. I don't care if they strip search every arab that gets on a plane.
And so-called 'moderate muslims' should not get offended but should gladly submit to tougher searches.

Cookie
"I don't want to hate anyone but it is clear that a significant portion of this group hates us and means us harm."

Cookie, I just have to comment tongue in cheek.

It's more important to some people that we have "hatred" towards the muslim killers than whether they hate us.

If you are to believe some people, the fact that a certain group of people call for our destruction on a daily basis has no meaning. We are not supposed to be wary, cautious, take them at their word.

No, let's all be kind and snuggly and stupid.

Naked Pagan
Did you know that I'm actually a Professor of Physics and I speak three foreign languages? It must be so, because I said so! (Lest I get into trouble for false claims, I'm not a professor at all, I've studied only two foreign languages, and I've done hardly anything in either of those languages since I graduated from college, so by now my conversational skills aren't worth crap.)

So Timothy McVey said he was Christian? By his actions, he proved to me that he was not. The same applies to Eric Rudolph, every member of the KKK, Hitler (yes, I know he was once in a seminary, studying to become a Roman Catholic priest. So what?), and I'm sure that you and/or other posters here can provide more examples.

I do not, by any means, intend to insult the Roman Catholic Church by saying that going to one of their seminaries won't make you a Christian - but the fact is that it won't, any more than sleeping in an auto factory every night for the next five years will turn you into a car. Going to one of the seminaries of my church won't make you a Christian, either.

IceDog
On the educational system. Liberal leanings is not a myth. Quick example. My son is a freshman in high school. He is in a special program for elite students that takes in students from 2 neighboring high schools for 2 hours every morning. Early this fall, they were being introduced to various groups of administrative people. Their was a group of social workers in the room. The teacher was going through a list of all the clubs available. When the "Republican Club" was mentioned (which he joined), there was audible laughter and snickering from the social workers. This is the kind of thing that goes on all the time. I got hold of my son early and I'm lucky that I can have adult conversations with him and that he thinks rather than lets his emotions dictate everything. He is conservative and can't understand any logic behind being anythingelse. He's going to get a lot of flak in school but he has an ally in this special class and they are tough.

Not Swift
Dear Mr. AidanKM

Satire is most often lost on the willfully blind, or the entrenched & powerful. Suzanne fields explains at length what I attempted to express quickly. After reading her post, re-read Miss Coulter's article and have a good laugh or say hello to your neighbors mentioned above.

All the best

Muslims on planes
Rest assured, since 9-11 when I see Muslim looking people on my flights, I get a little nervous. They may not admit it, but the average Muslim supports the murders the radical Muslims are committing across the world. So in my opinion, that makes all of them suspects for wanting to kill me and my family.

John Galt
First Amendment:

"Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances."

The right to freedom of expression is all that is being done here. People speaking their minds; people venting their frustrations;people disgusted with our government's inability to protect us, which by the way is the primary duty of the government.

So, while everyone has the right to their religion, we all have the right to express ourselves too.

Mr. Matt and other ACLU lovers
I don't support "rounding up all the brown people". I just think it is ridiculous not to use a little extra scrutiny in regards to muslims boarding our airplanes.

Could a terrorist hell-bent on destroying the plane be white? Sure. Could the pilot just fly the plane into the ground because his wife is having an affair and he's suicidal? Could a one-in-a-billion meteor slam into the plane and kill everyone? Do these remote circumstances justify being ignorant?

Earlier this year, I was returning from temporary duty at Osan, Korea. When I went through security at the airport in Seoul my bags (and the bags of the other US military troops with me) were completely searched. Why? …because recently, many American troops leaving or traveling through Korea had been taking military "souvenirs" on the planes.

Did I feel discriminated against because I wasn’t Asian or because I was singled out? No, I understood the rationale and it made sense.

Lets just use a little commonsense people. “The Constitution is not a suicide pact” pretty much sums it up.


Like I said Snot
You can get the hell out to. I'm sure you'll enjoy living with Iranians or the Syrians.

Difference between Islam and the Klan...
The believers of the cult of Islam killed more people in just the past week than the KKK has killed in their 140-year history. Compared to Islamic monsters, Bobby Byrd and his fellow Klansmen are saints.

Teaching Saudis
One of my students who was preparing to fly home for a break, just on the heels of the bomb plots this last summer, commented on the plotters, "They're just stupid people." Well and good, I have stronger words than that. As suggested above, if aggressive profiling of Middle Easterners will cause sufficient outrage amongst the "peaceful majority" of Muslims and Farsi speakers, and will motivate them to self-police, all shout hurray! If they are offended and don't want to fly, all shout hurray! Drop our guard against others who would do harm?... not a minute. But Israel can certainly be used as a model. Sadly, bombs bursting and rockets falling is the usual price the unvigilant must pay. Let's avoid that payday and keep watch.

joys - logic
"Even though nearly all rapists are men doesn’t mean that most men are rapists, just because most domestic violence is done by men doesn’t mean that most men beat their wives and children, just because most infanticide is done by mothers doesn’t mean that mothers are normally a danger to their kids, and even if most terrorists really were muslim that wouldn’t mean that most muslims are terrorists.

Why are people asking for one group to be profiled and not another?"

Although I haven't checked, I'm inclined to believe your statistics, so I'll let it go at that. However, can you find these statistics for me: how many of the hijackers on 9/11 were women? How many had blond hair? How many had blue eyes? How many were over 50? Repeat the same categories for other terrorist attacks; now tell me why we should strip-search 87-year-old Swedish grandmothers and not 30-year-old men who look like they're of Arab extraction? Doesn't it make sense that we should concentrate on the Arabs, who are more likely Muslim, and therefore more likely to believe that 72 virgins await them as soon as they fly an airliner into a building?

end to profiling
In addition to the measures proposed by troglodyte, I add 10)Replace flight attendants with strippers. Muslim men are forbidden to look at nude women and this would certainly boost business travel( I'm sure ol' Bill C would rack up frequent flyer miles at a record pace).

re: Peppermint
quote: "The right to freedom of expression is all that is being done here. People speaking their minds; people venting their frustrations;people disgusted with our government's inability to protect us, which by the way is the primary duty of the government.

So, while everyone has the right to their religion, we all have the right to express ourselves too."

I'm a bit confused, I never advocated anyone not freely expressing himself. I did ask a rhetorical question to someone who posted here if he had read the Constitution because he was advocating action that violates Constitutional principles: arresting everyone who practices a particular religion.

I'm a big believer in freedom of expression, which is why I don't tell people with whom I disagree to "go somewhere else" or "get the hell out" or "move to Canada" the way some folks around here do.

RE: spunge_
I'm sorry to burst your pathetic little bubble, but the cult of Islam has killed more people in the past year than the IRA has EVER killed.

Islam DEMANDS its followers to murder any man, woman, and child who doesn't call god "Allah". No other faith in human history has made such demands.

Regarding the Imams
Does anyone else think that these guys knew full well that their actions would cause such a firestorm? Methinks they were looking to stir things up for the purpose of becoming media "martyrs" (figuratively, not literally) and trying to provoke anti-Muslim backlash, which they could then use to say "see? Americans are anti-Muslim!". Stoking the flames, so to speak...

Just my $0.02 on the original question.

I'll follow GunnyG's example
and ask you all to come visit my blog too.
I have a new article posted about Joseph Kennedy and Chavez, business partners.
Thx

Oh, yeah, GunnyG, I guess she also forgot about
Zarqawi having a training camp in Iraq also. Duh?

troglodyte
You are quite correct!

During my lifetime, I've not known of New York as being anything but a liberal city (one would have thought that with the claims made by the Islamo-fascist pigs, they would have chosen a conservative city). Truth is, the only thing the Islamo-fascist pigs & the Democrats have in common is that they both seek to destroy the Constitutional Republic of the USA.

Israel doesn't count?
"I'm assuming your not counting attacks against Isreal in this number but i'm sure you'll correct me."

After all, like all sinister wingers, you think that blowing up those evil J-O-Os in playgrounds is simply "taking out the trash".

You and your ilk simply disgust me.

re: anti-socialist
quote: "Truth is, the only thing the Islamo-fascist pigs & the Democrats have in common is that they both seek to destroy the Constitutional Republic of the USA."

Intelligent people can disagree while still having noble motives. While I disagree with the Democrats on most issues and have never actually voted Democrat for any office except, I believe, county sheriff, I think it is completely untrue that they "seek to destroy" the United States. While many of the Democratic Party's policies are misguided in my opinion and undermine individual liberty, all the Democrats I've ever met love this country just as much as I do and are seeking policies that they believe actually improve the United States.

Neither party, and no political philosophy, has a monopoly on patriotism and noble purpose.

John Galt
"I'm a bit confused, I never advocated anyone not freely expressing himself. I did ask a rhetorical question to someone who posted here if he had read the Constitution because he was advocating action that violates Constitutional principles: arresting everyone who practices a particular religion."

"I'm a big believer in freedom of expression, which is why I don't tell people with whom I disagree to "go somewhere else" or "get the hell out" or "move to Canada" the way some folks around here do."

Well, JG, that is just people blowing off steam.
Everyone expresses themselves in different ways.

Shameless plug: come up and visit my blog.


Jihad vs the IRA
Thasic and others who try to equate Islamic Jihad to the RELATIVELY rare instances of violence should spend a little time checking this site:

http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/

There, you will find tabulations of worldwide Jihadist crimes. There, you will learn that comparison of Christians to Jihadists is a fool.

Profiling Arabs
Good article, as usual.

Can we imagine what would have happened in an alternate universe if six rabbis had boarded a middle eastern airline carrier, at first sitting together as dhimmis would be required to do, then somehow managed to split up, sitting two in the back, two in the middle, and two in front?

No "please get off the plane," you can bet.

More like immediate decapitation.

Now, _that's_ profiling, and not at all a bad model to work from when we're contemplating how to deal with our own muslim problems.

But, back to reality, what's really going on when six imams spread out their rugs in a terminal and ostentatiously apply noses to to the ground and put butts in the air, then go through the reported musical chairs exercise on board?

I suggest the the entire show was intended as a symbolic show of presence: "Here we are, infidels, doing what we please, no matter how uncomfortable it makes you, so you may as well get used to it, because we're going to do more things that will soon make you even more uncomfortable ."

And the horrible part is, we not only sit there and take it, but we obsess over it and apologize over it, and make it as obvious as possible that we're willing to take even more of it.

And, therefore, we will, we will....

Profiling
Our political leaders (elete) often are closet globalists. Consistant with such a world view, diversity must be "celebrated". This is also the policy of most private corporations, as well. Profiling would undercut their worldview that all countries and peoples should be one.

Profiling air travelers would be more effective at identifying potential terrorists than mindless screening of everyone as if they all might be a threat or fussing over each tube of Colgate toothpaste. Most security is physical security (access control) and underutilizes intelligence.

Italian American Tom Tancrendo (R-Colorado) said it correctly in his recent letter to Gov.Jeb Bush:
" diversity is good, up to a point. It is not good when it is worshiped above assimilation".
Rep. Tancrendo is of course in opposition to both illegal immigration, blanket amnesty, and high levels of legal immigration. He recently criticized Miami and Dade County Florida for being "third world" because English speaking residents are uncommon and the county high schools have only a 45% graduation rate. Others complain you can not get good service anywhere or even good food, aside from Cuban entres.

David and GunnyG
"And the horrible part is, we not only sit there and take it, but we obsess over it and apologize over it, and make it as obvious as possible that we're willing to take even more of it."

Yeah, let's all cry, "beat me, beat me, we're a bunch of masochists.

GunnyG:
"As for facts, liberals have NEVER allowed those pesky critters to get in the way of their diatribe."

FACTS? What facts? Are there facts? Really I just thought everybody is supposed to make it up as ya go along.
Al is sooo smart.

Promoting jihad!
Without question, I believe those imams, the swine that they are, were simply enforcing the jihad against America. Unlike bin laden, they can not go on television and outright tell muslimes to kill Americans. So, they give these same muslimes something to get angry/angrier about. It was a "hidden message". Those animals new exactly what they were doing. After all, they were at a meeting/conference with others. Clearly, as proven by their actions, they were not discussing how to fit into America.

p.s., I am no longer going to debate/argue with the liberals in this forum concerning our rights as Americans to do what ever it takes to protect ourselves. If I want an arguement against that sort of intellect, I have a ficus tree in my office that's not busy. I'd rather focus on the terrorist themselves. Not their liberal supporters.

Kudos Michael
Thanks Michael for responding to joy. I was thinking exactly the same thing. I never said we should assume all Arabs are terrorist until they prove they are not, but again, if someone comes on the plane and says there is a serial killer aboard, if there is a white guy in his thrities sitting next to me, I am going to ask to be let off the plane and I think that my assumptions would be backed up with empirical evidence and common sense.

What profiling is
It makes sense for security agents to investigate and keep tabs on mosques, organisations, charities or any group or individual that has links to terrorism or terrorists. That isn’t profiling, that is investigating. But when you profile so widely as praying, or being born into a religion or race then perfectly normal young people see their parents, friends etc being humiliated regularly just for existing and this breeds hatred and distrust. People tend to sympathise with their family and friends.

Nor is it profiling to suspect someone who is casing your house, or hovering near your bike or who follows you in the dark. That is called common sense. What is profiling is to stop and search every bike owner in a town because bike thieves normally own bikes.

Pretty soon all bike owners will start being a little bit peeved at police and assuming that they are picking on people rather than that when someone is questioned that they have reason.

Just undo it
Advocates against 'racial profiling' are trying to make people blind to race, religion, nationality, etc., while we are in the middle of a war revolving around . . . race, religion, nationality, etc..

I suppose it's too late to hit the "undo" button on that term's existence. . . . I knew it was a mistake to let it into the country in the first place. It's not that racial profiling is good, or bad, in and of itself. It's just that there needs to be some discrimination . . . oh, forget it!

Islam and liberals
Islam, along with Satanism and Santa Ria, should be outlawed. Human and animal sacrifice and preaching hate and intolerance. Simply being a Muslim is a hate crime.

Liberals are hypocrites.
They think government agencies are corrupt, yet want the government agencies to grow and redistribute more of other's wealth.

Everyone one is equal, except the poor, the rich, the whites, the blacks, the hispanics, the asians, the born and the unborn. So WHO is equal? ............, oh forget it!

The only lives that seem to be worth protecting are the terrorists, the murderers, the atheists, the non-Christians, the sexual deviants and the poor. The rest of us are on our own.

I get a kick out of the liberals stopping at Starbucks for their lattes on their way protest Walmart . Walmart pays their employees much better than Starbucks does, but a liberal has to draw the line somewhere.

Liberals have spent the past 10 years spewing their hatred of conservatism, conservatives and it's leaders, yet when we respond, we are the ones full of hate. Liberals are nothing more than little spoiled brats.

Have you noticed there have been no claims of voter fraud in this past election? That is because the fraud perpetrators and the vote cheaters won. Conservatives don't cheat in elections, we don't have to. Liberals/Democrats have a well established history of fraud and cheating, because it is the only way they can win. I hope the Liberals enjoy their pyrrhic victory; their margin was slim and by no means a mandate. It will remind America why they elected Bush in the first place.

Nik T writes:
"Rush Limbaugh today "

Nice post. Excellent exemplar of "Argument by gibberish."

11h
I notice you didnt disagree with my klan referance

Profiling A**holes
Let's compromise. Let's not profile all muslims. Let's just profile the ones who act like a**holes in public.

That means when they get on an airplane and intentionally try to incite fear among the other passengers we not only remove them from the plane, we arrest the for assault.

If you check the legal definition of assault it includes any and all acts that unnecessarily cause an innocent person to feel fear. Most people incorrectly believe this has to be a physical attack, like throwing a punch, but this is not so.

Then when the libs like spunge, Mr Matt, and a couple others on this board complain that we have to enforce the law evenly we can agree and start locking up white people who act like A**holes in public too. After a few years half the liberals in the country will be ex-cons, ineligible to vote, and we can finally get our conservative agenda passed.

Misplaced blame
Why are these six imams blaming USAirways anyway? The description I read of the event stated it was passengers on the plane who demanded they be removed. I guess it is just alot easier to drag down the big name versus a plane full of anonymous passengers.
Personally, I dont like 'em, I am not going to like 'em and no amount of crying over racial profiling is going to make me like 'em.
I say kudos to the brave people on that flight who demanded their removal. Maybe Hertz can start renting camels for the occasions of these unfortunate incidents.

For What It's Worth ...
I have seen several posts that compare the IRA to the terrorists that we deal with today, which quite frankly is wrong.

I worked in London for a number of years during the IRA bombing campaign, but never feared for my life. Did you know that the IRA would typically issue warnings before setting off a bomb ? Their primary goal was disruption and not to kill innocent civilians.

Did the terrorist on 9/11 and 7/7 issue warnings ? Did they try to avoid injuring innocent civilians ?

From the information I have gathered, the Imams got exactly the reaction they desired.

Mick7
I spent most of last year in OIF, to tell you the truth.

One thing we have found out is that our OPFOR is adaptable and flexiable, and will respond to our counter measures.

So, the moment its obvious that we are concentrating on 'muslims' or 'arabs' or any other pegion hole you can find, they will simply work around that.

The terrorist threat to this country comes in all forms. There are many white non muslim groups that are equally threathening, and its possible they could be recruited to perform specifc mission where a 'traditonal' terrorist would be spotted.

So because they are so rescourful, allowing our viglance to get hung up on any one thing would be determental to our security.

security
I would like to know how many people whining about Ann's column would have felt if THEY were on the plane when imams behaved this way????
Would they just ignore it?
Hello??? what a stupid thing. OF COURSE any semi intelligent individual would have had a problem with muslims behaving the way the terrorists did before crashing the planes on 9/11.
I mean, really folks, how many times will it take for you to realize the imams are the ones out of line for being offended and behaving as they did? Will it take you being on a plane when another ARAB TERRORIST exhibits the same behavior and then either blows you up or crashes the plane you're on to get it through your excrutiatingly THICK skulls?
If you think they are being discriminated against, go over to the middle east with your wommen in your family. Then come back and whine about the friggin muslims being discriminated against.

walmart
walmart does not pay it's employees better than starbucks, that's just stupid. Also starbucks has health benefits for all part time workers. http://www.wakeupwalmart.com/change/ click that link and learn about evil walmart.

Apology?
Maybe,the Imams need to give us an apology for behaving so badly they had to be taken off the plane for scaring people.
I guess that would be politically incorrect for us to want an apology.


GunnyG:
"Right, I'll be off of this site when I pilot the next shuttle mission. You did not know I had a PhD and an antique gun collection as my retirement fund did you? Also a triple Master's and a Ferrar"

You crack me up. And you probably didn't know that I live in a $500million dollar mansion in Beverly Hills and raise Arabian horses. Besides that my doctorate degree will be completed in Human Studies shortly. Oh, yeah, I drive to school in my Lamborghini.

Taking a Page From Saddam's Book
____ As always, Troglodyte comes up with cogent ideas - funny, as well as useful.

____ But Saddam's idea of putting George H.W. Bush's portrait on the floor of his palace entrance got me thinking. How about putting large tile floor portraits of that illiterate, gynocidal, murdering arab despot Muhammad in all entrances (including service and boarding tunnels) of airline concourses and hangers? ;-D

____ In this fashion, would all American airlines be far safer from any Muslim dreams of martyrdom since Jihadis would have to step on the face of their prophet to get near our planes in any capacity.

____ And in Iraq, why not add the floor portraits of Ossama bin-Laden, Hassan Nasrallah, Mahmoud Ahmadinejad, Muuqtada al-Sadr and other notorious arab sub-humans Maybe the same treatment would also help protect bus terminals, subways and other public transport systems.

____ And while we are at it, why not sell thunder jugs with porcelain portraits of Jihadi nutjobs on the bottom facing up? A big seller in the Middle East. And then lets sell: Not-So-Welcome Mats to wipe your feet on featuring Jihadi portraits, Dart boards and pin the tail on the Jihadi. Many books have been written, but there's room for a few more titles: "Islam for Dhimmis", "Islamic Population Control Strategies Utilizing World Wide Holy War Enhanced By Terrorism", "Islamic Scientific Contributions in the Last Three Centuries" (3 pages), "Female Circumcision Using Common Household Implements", "Iranian Army Field Manual A-189z: How to Clear Mine Fields Using 10 Year Old Martyrs Rolled in Rugs and Methods for Expedient Disposal of Their Remains".

____ And for all those Muslims who are inconvenienced or embarrassed by these tactics, please send a thank you card to al Qaeda for turning America into Dar al Harb. But for right now, I'm fresh out of tolerance for human butchers and their fellow travelers.

Yours in Liberty,
Mac

Imams provocateurs
Anyone who doesn’t see the imams’ calculated theatrics for the intentional provocation it was designed to be is either idiotic or complicit. As far as I am concerned, in the absence of demonstrated words and/or actions to the contrary, I consider every Muslim to be in sympathy with, if not active support of, the Islamofascist agenda.

I realize this is a hard line to take, but it is made necessary, in my view, given the widespread failure of the Muslim leadership in this country to show sympathy and to make common cause with the legitimate security concerns of America, vis-à-vis the Islamofascist threat. On the contrary, their every public word or deed puts them squarely in the same camp with our declared enemies. I have yet to see or read of any high-level Muslim figure in this country offer anything constructive to the resolution of our terrorist problems. They choose instead to exploit our freedoms and politically correct weaknesses in order to advance objectives which shouldn’t be too hard to figure out.

The imans in this situation, and those who take direction from them, have made it clear that they intend to advance an agenda that is at odds with our security needs. I do not intend to stand idly by while the likes of our imam provocateurs, CAIR, ACLU, and the other assorted seditionists in league with them attempt to take us down. I intend to challenge them wherever and whenever they surface, be it in the airports, on the plane, or on the streets. Loyal Americans, Muslim or otherwise, will understand and accept the inconvenience this may place on them, while we tend to this necessary work. A loyal American should be willing to make this comparatively low-cost contribution to the effort. Those of questionable loyalty will attempt to make our work more difficult, and should be identified and handled accordingly.

Nuke Mecca Now

And make NO apologies.

Profile, schmofile.

First Islamic terrorist attack on an American target results in the complete and total destruction of two Islamic countries: Iran and Pakistan.

Subsequent Islamic attacks on American targets result in nuclear elimination of Saudi Arabia, Syria, Egypt, Kazookistan, etc, etc, etc.

And ignore the Frenchies and other neo-castrati.


Steve
Thanks for adding number 10 to my list. I'd thought of that but I didn't put it on my Christmas wish list fearing that was too much to hope for! Here's another couple:

11) All floor wax used in public transportation facilities will have a small percentage of lard, again with signs to that effect.

12) All floors in high traffic areas of public transportation facilities will have mosaic images of Islamic holy places and persons structurally integrated in areas to be walked on by the maximum traffic possible.

13) Any person objecting to any of these simple security measures will immediately be screened as a potential agent of an enemy power.

BTW, I include subways, train and bus stations, port and ferry terminals, and car rental agencies in transportation facilities, not just airports. Livestock transport systems are for the most part self securing.

If camels, goats, donkeys, and bicycles are acceptable transport for Middle Easter deserts or roads, then I'm confident they'll provide more than adequate transport for the followers of the prophet in the safe haven which is America.

If anyone has any more such suggestions, let's hear them. The idea is to do what lefties do: Don't come right out and say "No Muslims." Create a rule whereby we can claim they are welcome but no Muslim in his right mind would go there.

Hey Mac, you stole my thunder
with the mosaics. I was slow with the submit key. I admit it. I got the idea from reading about Saddam. That's proof that it would work because it appeals to the arab mind set.

Mac
I think you have some solid merchadising ideas there. Funny stuff!

Bible just as "evil" as the Koran
Ann Coulter picks a few choice quotes she attributes to the Hadith (oral traditions that were later written down). She also calls them prayers, though not being a muslim I don't know whether they are really prayers or not.

So, whats the point. One can easily find examples in the jewish and christian traditions advocating behavior that we now call genocide or evil. Just one example:

FROM NUMBERS 31:1-18 in the bible.

"And they warred against the Midianites, as the LORD commanded Moses; and they slew all the males.... And the children of Israel took all the women of Midian captives, and their little ones ... and they took all the spoil, and all the prey, both of men and of beasts... And Moses said unto them, Have ye saved all the women alive?... Now therefore KILL EVERY MALE AMONG THE LITTLE ONES , AND KILL EVERY WOMAN that hath known man by lying with him..."

Is this what the Iraqis should assume is in store for them when we invaded their country? If so no wonder they are resisting us.

There are plenty more sections of the bible praising or advocating "evil."

Does this mean we should prevent christians and jews who think the bible is the word of god from flying on planes if the don't disavow their belief in the evil parts of the bible? I don't think so.

All that quotations from the koran, bible, the hadith are totally irrelavent to whether people should be allowed on public transportation or to pray in public.

All of these books require interpretation, and reasonable people can rationally interpret them quite differently. Anyone that takes them literally as the word of god is foolish. I am sure both christians and muslims will be offended by that. But its the truth.

I assume Ann considers herself a christian, though it is hard to tell from her rhetoric. In any case, people who live in glass houses should not throw stones.

Profile them if you must. But let the muslims that are no actual threat pray and fly on planes.



Those were the days...
For those with a penchant for pork-based solutions to our terrorist problem, check out this link, for an example of the way we used to deal with these problems, back in a less delicate, more results-oriented era. http://www.soldierlife.com/2006/06/26/general-black-jack-pershing/

Sandman, and this would solve
... absolutely nothing. It would just make things worse.

All it would do is guarantee many other people besides all devout muslims would hate us and do their best to defeat us. Today, only a portion of devout muslims hate us, though tactics similar to those you advocate, such as used in Abu Ghraib have caused the size of that portion to grow.

If you don't agree with me how silly your suggestion is, you should think about it some more. How strongly do you feel that we should leave the terrorists that behead people on TV, kill innocent women and children on a daily basis alone? Or that we should leave Iraq immediately? Was your first reaction after 9/11 "Wow, those guys really mean business, I guess we should do whatever Osama wants us to do?". Never crossed your mind at all? I didn't think so.

If those tactics don't work when the terrorists apply them to us, why do you think it will work when we apply them to muslims?

Liberal Posts
Forgive me stating the obvious, but one common thread to all liberal posts is that they'd rather spend paragraphs, days, lifetimes and lives discussing, moralizing and arguing about a job than simply getting a job done. Obscure quotes from biblical passages describing three thousand year old situations, then misapplied to today's situation is not piety, reverence, or spirituality. It's simply idiocy "because I can."

You've got to love simple eloquence of Forrest Gump, "Stupid is as stupid does."

Inaction or indecision is a far greater error than a bad decision.

Sandman
I enjoy your satire. Some here don't get it though,
they are just WAY too serious.

tsk, tsk, it would just make things worse.

troglodyte
"Forgive me stating the obvious, but one common thread to all liberal posts is that they'd rather spend paragraphs, days, lifetimes and lives discussing, moralizing and arguing about a job than simply getting a job done. Obscure quotes from biblical passages describing three thousand year old situations, then misapplied to today's situation is not piety, reverence, or spirituality. It's simply idiocy "because I can."

Well said. No forgiveness needed.

Come visit my blog when you get a chance.

slacker
I am sure you understand history(the passages you quote) and actual commandments to all followers of the faith?

That is what God commanded of the Israelites in 3000 BC, period. It still doesn't apply today no matter how much you say it does.

I don't think any warlike Christians in history shouted (Numbers 12) running into battle did they?

You guys keep posting that idiocy and maybe oneday you can start believing your own moral relativity.

PS. Washington crossed the delaware. Since no other presidents have done it, they really aren't president.

Eon
Well said!

Coulter , Witnesses said the six men appeared to be either Islamic fanatics or U.S. Army chaplains on leave from Guantanamo. If you like her or hate her , thats funny!

Troglodyte, You Rock Dude!
____ Thanks, but you and Anne set me off. Your posts are great with some very good ideas

____ I think humor and ridicule work best - especially on the undecided watching from the sidelines. Rush and Ann understand this very well. They make headway in a serious purpose and make a living too. No need to be rude or nasty to the fools we would rather not suffer. Make our efforts a teaching moment combined with enough irony and witty amusement to entertain as well.

____ As for merchandising? It could work. America is host to many refugees from Islamic persecutions. They, too, have long memories and wouldn't mind seeing what went around coming around. They would love cogent, pointed and passionate ridicule delivered with style and panache. These communities might be good place to seek financing and marketing resouces. Remember the Danish cartoons? How the Jihadis howled! I want them hoarse from screaming outrage. And the more it worked, the more the merchandise would fly off the shelf. And more competition too - all good!

____ Another idea would be sneakers and flip-flops with the beloved prophet of mayhem molded into the soles facing down. Stepping in dog crap would be optional. Mucking-out boots used by farmers would be another choice. Pig farmers would really love them.

____ Lots of ways to monkeywrench the Jihadi (bowel) movement. Since the war is going to more decisively fought in the press and electronic media, than on the battlefield, we should not forget our seditious MSM. They are afraid of the Jihadis (remember the Danish cartoons?). Lets make them more afraid of us. Humiliation - very public humiliation - would work far better than violence. Why use a club, when a gimlet will hurt worse and be remembered longer? Done correctly, outing these useful idiots in memorable fashion can be great fun. Mike Adams seems to be having fun. Should we ask him for pointers? I bet he has some ideas.

Sandman, Steve, Mac, Peppermint...
and others: nice, lucid posts.

Slacker: what can say! I think your handle says it all. I just shake my head. Are you by any chance a relative of Baghdad Bob?

Question
For all you are opposed to "profiling" muslims at the airport....answer me this: How many terrorists attacks by muslims on American soil would it take in order to change your mind?

If the next ten terrorist attacks in the US were carried out by middle-eastern looking men, would you change your opinion? How about a 100 out of a 100?

It may be a hopeless undertaking, but I’m just trying to understand the liberal mind. Do you think muslims don’t pose enough of a threat to warrant special attention...or do you believe you should ignore all threats by anyone different than yourself for fear of being labeled?

I’m convinced that liberals cannot spell out anything they actually believe without looking completely insane. If I’m wrong then please help me to understand.

Mac
Flip flops, sneakers, mucking out boots....Brilliant!

How about toilet paper? I you can print roses and clouds, you can print pictures of....well, I guess we have lots to choose from.

Typo...should read
IF you can print....

Good question Icedog
Another common thread in left-think is to only use statistics (badly at that) to try to disprove conservative common sense conclusions about empirical evidence. However, in positing a theory about how to solve a problem they immediately switch to wishful thinking and general cowardice.

slacker-- and the 'evil' Bible
"One can easily find examples in the jewish [sic] and Christian [sic] traditions advocating behavior that we now call genocide or evil."

"All of these books require interpretation, and reasonable people can rationally interpret them quite differently. Anyone that takes them literally as the word of god is foolish. I am sure both Christians [sic] and muslims [sic] will be offended by that. But its the truth."


Do you even know what Jewish and Christian readers say regarding Numbers 31 and other passages which can be troublesome at first sight? Until you do, how can you determine what the offensive truth really is?

The enlightened United States killed men, women and children in Japan intentionally targeting civilian cities with firestorms and atomic weapons. Yet there is a rational justification for it, though not all agree with it.

There is a rational for what God ordered Israel to do when at war with the Midianites and other people. But I question whether you are even informed enough to know whether you agree with that rational or not. It would seem you have simply set yourself up as judge, jury and prosecutor over the Bible, Israel, Christianity and the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob. And then you defend your statements by simply saying "it's the truth."

Really. Are your words the way and the life, too?


slacker
You are a master of the red herring, the non sequitur, and the irrelavent.

What difference does it make what "evil" the old testament urges if no Jews or Christians are imitating what the Hebrews did 2000 years ago? Besides that, the events the old testament refers to are referred to as history, not an admonition of genocidal behavior toward an entire present day nation or entire present day religion.

Secondly, why do you compare an actual act of war, which is what the suicide attacks on the US were, to suggestions that we make it tough for Muslims to live in this country? If they insult us or revile us, we laugh and walk away. If we so much as believe differently, they kill us. We're supposed to respect them? Treat them as equals?

The first response of a coward to a threat is to pretend it doesn't exist. The first response of a coward to an actual attack is to pretend he deserved it. The first reponse of a coward when he is killed is to stink. That's also what he does before he is killed.


incorrect correction
I guess I accidentally corrected slacker's misspelling of 'christian'. My fingers must have automatically capitalize Christ without checking with me first.

OOPS
not 2000 years ago--4000!

Once Again Dissention Is Pervasive
It doesn't matter what non-muslim terrorists have done in the past. We are not at war with the IRA. We are....class, pay close attention,...WE ARE AT WAR WITH MUSLIMS. Understand. THEY WANT TO KILL US! You want to sit around worrying about racial profiling or hurting feelings or religious intolerance while they plot and plan your demise. Whatever purpose these imams had for their actions in the terminal and on the airplane, whatever that purpose, it had no good intentions for the American people.

Dullhammer & Livefree you prove my point
Its perfectly legitimate for me to respond to Ann Coulter's slander against the muslim religion by bringing up some troublesome quotes from their hadith completely out of context.

I just pointed out that one can also bring up quotes that are just as troublesome from the bible. I picked the old testament because its also a text of the jewish religion.

Of course, as you did, you can twist and turn logic like a pretzel and come up with a goofy rationale why a holy book would describe god commanding Moses to perform acts of genocide. You can also do some research and discover that this reported slaughter perhaps never really occurred.

That just proves the bible is not a particularly authoritative text on either history or morals. Just as with the hadith, one has to take the bible with a grain of salt and it should usually not be taken literally without investigation. Its testaments are a collection of stories and myths, some of which may be true and others obviously are not. The Noah's ark story about all the animals in the world on the ark for example is something only a small child can believe - or someone with the mental capacities of a child. Same for the creation of the world in 6 days, or Jesus rising from the dead.

Of course you can say the same for the myths in the muslim religion and any of the troublesome hadiths that Ann Coulter brings up. Most muslims don't take them as literal commandments to go out and slaughter anyone. She's only doing it to inflame her gullible flock into greater heights of hatred against the muslim clerics. And of course Ann is waving a red herring by bringing the quotes from the hadith up. Exactly my point.

I never said there aren't some islamists that would do anything they could to harm us, or that we should not protect ourselves from them. BUT, the muslims praying in Reagan airport are not the ones who attacked us. You can even find quotes from old newspaper articles of Omar Shahin condemning violence and the 9/11 attacks. So Ann and her fellow travelers making a big whoop about muslims praying and flying on planes is not making us any safer or protecting us from the ones who do want to attack us.

So we probably agree that Ann Coulter's column, as usual, just raises red herrings and signifies nothing but the demented ranting of a somewhat batty woman.

Buck, you are wrong when you say
"WE ARE AT WAR WITH MUSLIMS. Understand. THEY WANT TO KILL US! "

That is certainly not the official position of the Bush administration. Nor does anyone in the administration or any of our military leaders believe that. If you disagree with me, then please enlighten me with a link to anything where the Bush administration officially states that we are at war with muslims. You won't find it.

The military does not believe that either. That is because while you might find a quote here and their from an officer or two who is off the reservation, our generals are not conducting the war in such a way that you could convince any rational person that we think we are fighting a war against muslims.

So if neither the Bush administration or the pentagon believe we are fighting a war with muslims you can shout it all you want, but it is not true.

We are fighting a war against Islamic terrorists. These are all muslims. But that does not mean all muslims are Islamic terrorists. Get an elementary text on logic if you don't understand that point.

We are also fighting this war against Islamic terrorists so badly that we, the most powerful nation on earth, are losing. And our position is getting worse with every day. But hope is around the corner. The democrats gained both houses of congress in this election. That gives us all some hope that we can survive the last two years of Bush's presidency.

Slacker
Riding the short bus has taken its toll on you. Read slowly and get some trustworthy reference books to help you. The Koran and Hadiths teach that good Muslims must convert others by the sword if necessary. The Koran was written in one dispensation, what it said 1400 years ago is applicable today. The Bible contains many different dispensations. The Old Testament told the Hebrews to wipe out the pre-Muslim baby sacrificers and scumbags in the promised land. Most people fled before their destruction. The freaks who occupied Canaan pre-Israel,have been called by secular historians,the worst, most despicable peoples around. The Old Testament does not advise the Hebrews to do anymore of this. The Koran makes no such distinction. The New Testament explicitly teaches against such coercion.
In Turkey, the most "moderate" country in the mid-east region, Mein Kampf sold 100,000 copies last year and a new book advocating the assasination of the pope is selling by the thousands. These freaks voted Hamas in as their government in Israel. They are not rational but are blasphemus, dictatorial, evil, vile and violent.

Slacker
The terrorists we fear COULD NOT EXIST without help with finances and concealment from the Muslim community.
They refuse to expose or expell them.
If YOU knowingly harbor a criminal you are just as guilty as the criminal.
JUST HOW MUCH MORE DO YOU EXPECT AMERICANS TO ENDURE?

This is the exact same tactic Muslims have continued to use throughout history. They conceal, finance and protect the guilty until whatever society has had enough of it and then the cry is;
"KILL THEM ALL AND LET GOD SORT IT OUT".
The last time this happened was Kosovo and Bill Clinton came to the rescue of Islam and crushed the Christian Serbs to stop them from killing ALL Muslims.
If the same thing were to start with America, who would OR COULD save the Muslims from extinction?
What Nation has not had problems with Muslims?
Who would shed a tear if they were EXTERMINATED?
NO, I do not advocate this but the Muslims seem to be trying their utmost to bring it to pass.

slacker
You know... it's been 23 days since your fellow Democrats have regained the majority for the next Congress... and I'm STILL waiting to learn what great plans your leaders have to turn this Islamofascist war around. (and you CAN find links to that description).

All I heard before the election was "we can do better" and "we have a plan".

The only thing I've seen so far is Nancy Pelosi losing battles within her own caucus for Majority Leader and House Intel Chair.

Will she be just as proficient when she and her fellow Dems get down to some serious work that matters? :-)

- Primus54

P.S. If Ann Coulter were a liberal, supporting liberal ideals & writing in the same prose... she'd be the Champion of the Left! And you know it!

give em pork
We bombed, nuked, the evil terrorist midgets from Japan into democracy and we should do likewise to the camellicking freaks.

Nik T
You aren't even commenting on the subject at hand. And you aren't on a forum friendly to your warped views. Get a clue.

Make them eat pork
I've sais before, make one requirement to board an American airliner this: You must eat at least a pork fritter prior to the plane leaving the ground. Fritter provided at no charge.

typo
I've said, not sais.

Slacker: master of the nonsequiter
Question: How to rid the world of murderous Islamofascists?

Slacker response: (a)harangue posters with alleged inconsistencies in ancient Judaic writings; (b)Evade real-world realities, by engaging in sophomoric moral-relativity one-upmanship; or (c) Terrorists? What terrorists?

Real-world solution: kill them.

MyOpine
Extermination sounds like it would work. Let's be like the Dems and get a committee going on the subject. We can load our rifles at the same time.

TH Computer brain-fart
The following from about halway up the posts is NOT my post. I don't disagree with. I just can't take credit for the research and link.

troglodyte writes: Thursday, November, 30, 2006 11:45 AM
Jihad vs the IRA
Thasic and others who try to equate Islamic Jihad to the RELATIVELY rare instances of violence should spend a little time checking this site:

http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/

There, you will find tabulations of worldwide Jihadist crimes. There, you will learn that comparison of Christians to Jihadists is a fool.

slacker
You wrote:

"That is certainly not the official position of the Bush administration. Nor does anyone in the administration or any of our military leaders believe that. If you disagree with me, then please enlighten me with a link to anything where the Bush administration officially states that we are at war with muslims. You won't find it."

Dude that's why the GOP lost in the election. The real Republicans and AMERICANS who voted for GOP candidates in 2004 are tired of the "blinders over the eyes" mentality of the current leadership. Unfotunately, the new guys (Dems) won't be there with a solution either.
Thank God for the 2nd amendment!!!

slacker
"I just pointed out that one can also bring up quotes that are just as troublesome from the bible. I picked the old testament because its also a text of the jewish religion."

Bringing up troublesome quotes is one thing. But you presented them as easy examples of the Bible advocating evil. And that people who take the Bible as the word of God are foolish. I questioned your ability to understand, let alone say, what you did. Now you are back peddling.



"Of course, as you did, you can twist and turn logic like a pretzel and come up with a goofy rationale why a holy book would describe god commanding Moses to perform acts of genocide. You can also do some research and discover that this reported slaughter perhaps never really occurred."

I made no such effort to make a rationale for the passage. I did temper it some by comparing it to some rather acceptable US behavior, but I left the passage alone. I didn't want to help you against my charge that you are being superficial. Had I tried to explain the passage you would have probably dismissed my words as old news.

The Bible and the Koran do not equate. Are you profiling or something? What ever you're doing, you need more discrimination.






CraigC
What you are saying doesn't make sense.

The real Republicans and AMERICANS who voted for GOP candidates in 2004 are tired of the "blinders over the eyes" mentality of the current leadership.

And so they voted for democrats? I find that hard to believe. I take it you are one of the "real" republicans. Did you personally vote for democrats or even consider it for a milisecond?

Profiling is nothing more than the
exercise of logic derived from empirical evidence. It is the process in which a person learns through repeated experience. In this case it is called 'survival'.

Had our ancestors been as enlightened as today's liberals, none of us would be debating this issue today. Only a fool(am I being redundant?) would enter Harlem with the same blitheness as East Hampton, or leave his children in the care of a stranger's pitbull.

As far as I am concerned it is up to muslims, by their words and deeds, to convince me that profiling is unnecessary. Until I hear their leaders renounce the radicals that have hijacked islam, I will consider all of them to be dangerous or complicit. And I will be as wary of them as I am of bad neighborhoods and pitbulls.

Ignore That Man Behind The Curtain!
____ Thank you Eon for a thoughtful and informative post.

____ You briefly touched on the involvement or the USSR in sponsoring terrorism by proxy against America (and Israel). But it was they who fully armed the Arabs against Israel and our mutual culture of liberty. It was the Soviets who set up the anti-West terrorist training networks and trained those who proliferated and executed the terror in both Africa and the Middle East. Lumumba University comes to mind as a terrorist and revolutionary training center in Russia (just outside Moscow itself). The Soviets were the midwives of Mid-East Terror as an exercise in anti-American counter force. China, of course, helped train and lead both North Korea and North Vietnam invasions as well as insurgencies in Philippines, Laos, Cambodia etc. Today China uses the Norks as a proxy goad to the whole region of free S.E.Asian nations.

____ The Marxists are not tamed or even civilized. But they remain players, dangling arms and other support to any agency that will oppose us. Even with the blood barely dried in Afghanistan, Chechnya and Beslan, Putin is making nice with Iran, Syria, Hezbolla etc. Supplying modern weapons (for cold cash admittedly) to use against Israel and the USA. Throwing us off the back of the troika, so to speak, to appease their own large Muslim minorities. Russia let the Genii out of the Lamp and has, in turn, learned to enjoy the consequences. Hoping, I think, that we will be weakened in our confrontation and emerging victory over Jihadi Islam. So savaged and weary by the proxy fight, that we cannot, or will not, be capable of facing their growing challenge. Of the two, China is the more dangerous. Iraq is but one front in a WW4. It's 1938 all over again.

Yours in Liberty,

Mac

And another thing! :-)
Whenever I think about (or read about) the so-called moderate Muslims that do not stand up to be counted against the acts of the militant Islamofascists, I get as frustrated as the next person, but someone recently said to me that I need to see these moderates in the same way as the populations that used to live behind the Iron Curtain.

His point being that they run an altogether real risk of being killed for speaking out too vocally because all the power rests with the militants. And they are not safe no matter what country they live in if they "blaspheme". (Salmen Rushdie anyone?)

While I firmly believe they have more power as a group than they give themselves credit for, it takes a while for "sheep" to become "men" again. And sometimes it takes a deeper fear that doing nothing can be worse than taking a life or death risk to do something.

That's why I believe we have to start taking the same approach as we did in prior wars, and that is -- to make war so scary for the non-combatants that they get the courage to rise up and put a stop to the "leaders" in their midst... and sue for peace.

Sandman, kill who?
All muslims? That doesn't sound possible or likely. I don't think you think it is likely either, much as you might wish it were.

Given the Bush administration position - and correct me if I have any of this wrong- that:

1) We aren't going to put any significant number of additional troops into Iraq.

2) We are 100% behind Maliki. He's the right man for the job, in spite of the fact he's in the hip pocket of the nefarious Sadr

3) We aren't going to just nuke the place.

4) We are going to continue and even accelerate the process of handing over the responsibility for maintaining order and combatting the "insurgency" to the Iraqi government, its army, and its various corrupt police forces.

5) We are not going to demand, much less require, Maliki to disarm the dozen or so militias in Baghdad. Nor will we do that ourselves.

I assert that those are essentially the conditions under which our military is operating - per the Bush administration - in Iraq. I don't think you will disagree that these are the conditions our military is fighting under.

Given that, how and when do you propose we win whatever war we are fighting in Iraq? What will Iraq look like when we are done? Will there be fewer Islamic terrorists in the world when we have won?


If we proceed down this path for the next two years, I think that what will happen is:

a) we will look like losers to all muslims everywhere

b) there will be more islamic terrorists in the world than there are now.

c) Iran will be the dominant power in the middle east.

d) We will have less influence over events in the middle east than we do today. We will certainly have less influence than Iran.

I cannot predict whether a democrat or republican will hold the white house after the next election. I don't even know who will run. But this is the legacy that the Bush administration will leave behind after their eight years in office.

And you probably voted for him twice.

At least I can say I never voted for him.

Dullhammer, I'll backpeddle on the...
comparative religion argument. You win. My point was that Ann Coulter brought up the hadith stuff and its a red herring. I made it poorly.

I agree that comparing religions is not relavent to this discussion over muslims on planes, praying in airports, or the Bush "adventure" in Iraq.

Neither christianity, judaism or islam are attractive to me. They all have enormous and obvious faults. But while I am not interested in subscribing to any organized faith, as far as those religions go I will say that islam is the least attractive to me. In fact, while I intensely distrust and often dislike "true believers" of any religion I find those of the muslem faith the most odious.

Having said that, I remain convinced that this hullabaloo over muslims praying in airports is stupid and counter productive to our real struggle against islamic extremists. But I made my point poorly.

As an agnostic, I really don't have a dog in the fight over which "religion" is "better" or "true". So you are right, I should lay off the comparisons for now. You win on that.

Slacker
Voting for Geo. Bush?
UNFORTUNATELY THERE WAS NO OTHER VIABLE CANDIDATE!

Kerry is a TREASONOUS COWARD!
I would vote for Fidel Castro before I would vote for Kerry. At least the man is honest and does not PRETEND to be something that he is not!
You express contempt for those who held their nose and voted for Bush, did you vote for a tin plated traitor who is revered and honored by the ENEMY?

slacker
I personally voted GOP. But a lot of the core group of voters either didn't show up at the polls or actually voted against Bush and some of his stupidity (illegal amnesty, for instance), thereby giving control to the Dimwits. You can believe it or not, but it is a fact. Again, thank the NRA for its existence. I'm a life member of the group that will help save the country in the end.

Well, I for one
would like to know which "democrat" from the "peace party" is going to release the nukes as one of the other posters referred to.

With the stand the democrats have taken on any of the war on terror I do not have any trust they will handle anything better than Bush. In fact, I don't even know what their stand is since I have never heard one. Prior to the election all I heard was we have a "plan".

Now, when I hear a democratic strategist speak on TV and they are asked this question, "what is their plan", the dem says,"we don't have to have one, it's up to the President".

Like someone else said thank God we have the 2nd
Amendment. It's time to start arming yourself if you haven't already.

MyOpine
Thanks for reminding us just what our "choices" were in 2004.
If I have the opportunity to vote for a traitor or someone, who at least at the time, seemed to be "really fighting" this terror war, I would not ever choose that traitor.
I have too many bad memories of that man back from when my brother served in Vietnam and the misery he brought down on all the guys who served.


no slacker
I am not used to hearing people concede on their argument, and I am greatly impressed that you have done so. I hope if (and when) I ever put forth a poor argument I will be as honest as you when someone challenges me. Thank you for your example. I will remember it.



slacker-- and as for Ann Coulter
I'll let other people argue her point. Even though I agree with her, my dog is with Christ and the Bible.

slacker
Well, it's encouraging that you actually admit the Islamists are a threat. There may be some hope for you.

I find it interesting you changed the subject from investigating worrisome behavor on an airplane to the politics of the Iraq war.

Now you've switched back to to the investigation. (I refuse to use the shorthand term "profiling" since in current parlance it is code for racism.)

You said: "Having said that, I remain convinced that this hullabaloo over muslims praying in airports is stupid and counter productive to our real struggle against islamic extremists. But I made my point poorly."

No, you made your point exactly, and it is still meaningless. People are concerned about this little sideshow because they can see the handwriting on the wall. Our enemy is trying to hit us at our weakspots, and in this particular case, the weak spot is our court system and our paranoia about racism or anything remotely related. These Imams want to make a literal federal case out of security at our airports, hoping to weaken the application of stringent investigative techniques against the people most likely to pose a threat. All the "hullabaloo" as you call it serves the purpose of bolstering the resolve of the American people to resist this little gambit by the islamofacists, and any others they come up with. They know they can't beat us militarily, but they can beat us psychologically and, if we aren't careful, demographically as in Europe. It is the height of prudence that we do everything we can to discourage any more from coming here. In fact we ought to deport those who are here. But that won't happen. There are too many cowards living among us.

Craig C
You are in like company.
Many NRA here. I became a life member in 1958.

________________________________
WE HAVE SOMEONE WHO VOLUNTEERED TO SAVE US!
In a letter;
Mahmoud Ahmadinejad, President of Iran!
Has offered to save our civil liberties from Geo. Bush!

Wish we had some way to sent him a "Thank You" letter.


Profiling Muslims
I am sick and tired of this even being a question! Who was responsible for taking over 9/11 planes, who boards planes with bombs in their shoes, etc etc.

The Imams were out of order - from what I gather they did their dead level best to raise fear in the passengers. The passengers should be commended for their actions as well as the airline. Job well done! This obvious provocation was to elicit a forum and hopefully it will backfire on the moslems. I REFUSE to bow to islam-- a religion that is based on hate and getting their way by force.

I am all for profiling - rather be safe than sorry.

According to
David Mackett who is President of the Airline Pilots Security Alliance says that airline personnel have to look at the behavior of passengers to determine if they are a threat.

He said the praying was not the bar they use. They look at what the suspicious passenger/s are doing such as:
1. Are they sitting where they were assigned.
2. If they are not sitting where assigned, every opportunity will be given to them to explain why.
3. I they explain, the airline will accommodate.
4. If they do not have any good explanation then the airline personnel has the option of removing them.

The bottom line was that Mr. Mackett stated that if passengers cooperate that works.
If they do not cooperate they are removed.

This applies whether they are Muslim, white,
black, brown, whatever.

This was an excerpt of an interview I saw with Mr. Mack