Tuesday, November 25, 2008
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Not Exactly the Kind of "Hope" They Had in Mind
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Posted by:
Carol Platt Liebau at
12:09 PM
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Writing at Slate, a Catholic, Melinda Hennenberger (who apparently voted for Obama), worries about the President-elect's strong pro-abortion views -- suddenly realizing that if he was serious about his promise to sign the Freedom of Choice Act, it might well mean either that staff at Catholic hospitals are forced to perform abortions against their will or (in her view, the more likely scenario) Catholic hospitals across the country will simply close their doors.
Well, yes. Could it be that pro-life Obama supporters are suddenly realizing that pro-lifers -- including Archbishop Charles Chaput and other prominent Catholic clergy -- weren't kidding when they called Barack Obama the most extreme pro-abortion politician ever in mainstream American politics?
She ends her piece like this:
At the very moment when Obama and his party have won the trust of so many Catholics who favor at least some limits on abortion, I hope he does not prove them wrong. I hope he does not make a fool out of that nice Doug Kmiec, who led the pro-life charge on his behalf. I hope he does not spit on the rest of us—though I don't take him for the spitting sort—on his way in the door. I hope that his appointment of Ellen Moran, formerly of EMILY's List, as his communications director is followed by the appointment of some equally good Democrats who hold pro-life views.
It's not clear what in the substance of President-elect Obama's voting record makes such hopes at all reasonable. And somehow, I doubt this was the kind of "hope" Obama supporters had in mind when they voted for him.
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I know people like this, too. I work around them once I figure them out.
In the present case, I don't need to win the point that Ivan is a troll. He is a scrollby. I wasted a few posts on him and found him out; that's enough.
Enjoyed the discussion -- see you next time.
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I wouldn't call Ivan a troll. I think that his arguments, however vitriolic, are sincere; although there probably is some intent to aggravate his opponents, he isn't saying anything that he doesn't truly believe.
I've fraternized and worked with his type of person all my life. As far leftists go, he's the real deal.
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Adolf-
So I provide a simple example where someone was punished by the union for not wanting to vote for who they told he to. They obviously asked, she obviously told, they obviously wanted to make sure that everyone knew what happens when you don't vote the way that you are told.
You simply do not want to have a discussion with anyone. What is your point for taking part in a forum? You will clearly not win anyone to your side by being a jerk. One must conclude that you are simply trying to get off by saying as many vile and controversal things as you can come up with. I am done with you. |
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Patrick hates Unions and Gays - thanks for the news.
*big deal* - the unevolved rise again! |
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...slowly the bad news eeks out brining BO's supporters into reality and out of the fog of swoon they've been indulging in for the past 2 years like the crack addict who can't get enough.
How pathetic! |
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REAGAN HAD THE OPPORTUNITY TO PUT ALL UNIONS IN THEIR PLACE, WHEN HE BROKE UP THE AIR TRAFFIC CONTROLLERS IN THE BEST INTEREST OF THE COUNTRY. REAGAN ALSO HAD ALL HOMOSEXUALS CHARGED WITH FRAUD AGAINST THE UNITED STATES FOR RECEIVING AN EDUCATION THEN ANNOUNCING THEIR SEXUALITY TO BE KICKED OUT THE MILITARY REAGAN RESPONDED WITH PRISON AND REPAYMENTS OF ALL MONIES SPENT ON TRAINING UNIFORMS AND SECURITY CLEARANCES. DECERTIFIED UNIONS AND HOLD HOMOSEXUALS IN THE MILITARY LIABLE FOR DEFRAUDING THE COUNTRY. |
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Rather than where he is from, better to consider where he is going.
He is just another troll, so scroll on by his posts.
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Jan: Perfectly rational arguments, but don't expect Ivan to concede any of your points. He has to stand behind abortion as supported by the far left -- his ideological vision isn't based on reason (as leftists prefer to believe of themselves), since reason dictates that a consistent lack of scientific consensus on where life begins (although the technical definition of life has been creeping ever closer to conception) makes fetal destruction wantonly nonsensical (cf. Ronald Reagan's analogy about the paper bag with something inside it). He's actually arguing from the stance of anti-religion (specifically, anti-Christianity, since that is the religion that most affects public opinion and therefore legislation), since religion tends to place limits on choice for philosophical reasons rather than scientific reasons (the latter of which is the modern leftist's gold standard). |
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...And you DID compare babies to tumors and warts. But as I shouldn't have to point out, tumors and warts don't have beating hearts (4 weeks gestation), and I don't think many women regret having tumors removed--but many, many women regret aborting their babies. There are countless web sites and organizations which try to offer women who regret abortions some solace.
It seems reasonable to carry a fetus to term once you are past the 1st trimester, and give him or her up for adoption, rather than destroy him/her for your own selfish reasons. And they are nearly ALWAYS selfish reasons. Please don't bring up "to save the life of the mother," because while it can be an issue, it is rare. Most abortions are for inconvenience resulting from stupidity. If one is pregnant in spite of the birth control method employed (also rare if bc is used properly) then either go to PP early or SUCK IT UP, GROW UP, and make some lovely childless couple deliriously happy. |
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Ivan, now you are just being silly. Of course I did not say a thirteen week old fetus is capable of living outside the womb. What I said is that a thirteen week old fetus has all its parts and organ systems, and all are functional. Of course, we are able to save younger and younger babies who are born prematurely. I remember when an 8 month fetus was at risk, and now it is possible to save babies at 24-28 weeks gestation. Regardless, you are simply engaging in your little semantic circus, wherein words substitute for actual thought. Thus, because semantics failed you, you cannot respond to the FACT that 12 week old fetuses are NOT blobs of undifferentiated cells. They are babies, in every sense EXCEPT that they have not come out to breathe the air yet. Fetus. Baby. Semantics.
A woman has a right not to become pregnant if she does not wish to have a child. If she should become pregnant through her own carelessness or a failure of whatever birth control method she employs, she is legally able to abort the baby, and if she does it before the end of the first trimester, I think that will have to remain an option, simply because I know there will always be people for whom this seems the only way out. If, however, she cannot make up her mind before that, tough luck--the baby is now sensate and should not be killed because he or she has suddenly become inconvenient. A woman can find out she is pregnant as soon as she misses a period. Fine. Go to Planned Non-Parenthood and scrape it out. But once it is past a certain point, you are just SOL lady, or you should be. Killing babies is just not an attractive part of any society that calls itself civilized...
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Do we really care where he's from? The far left infiltrated America over forty years ago, and we've been hearing his arguments from self-professed intellectuals and would-be revolutionaries ever since that time. He could hail from America as well as any place in Europe (though it must be written that several of Europe's most prominent nations have seen the light, and begun a move toward conservatism, e.g. France, Germany, and Italy).
Besides, the way information moves nowadays, anyone with a cable TV subscription or an Internet connection can put himself on the fast track of natural progression from default, uncritical thinking to far left adherency. How do you think Obama got elected? |
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I do want to apologize for the above flame post. I have to admit that Adolf has gotten under my skin.
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Don't understand, Ivan, is that most people are honest. While you can say that someone can say that they are going to do one thing, then do another behind closed doors, such dishonesty is simply not the way that most Americans see as a way to live. Not sure how they do that where you come from (Belgium?, some other place where they make a bunch of pantie-wastes that want to tell the country that they move to how to run things?), but we are raised to say what we do, and do what we say. You ask a working man what his intentions are, and he will tell you. The union asks, most folks will be honest. Is it better to be a man about your beliefs, or know for the rest of your life that you are a low-life too afraid to live like a man? We know how a euro-socialist goes about it... just lie, and tell yourself you are smart.
I am interested in where you are from, cause you got some sick ideas. Can we just assume it is France... no they are too polite. German... ah they know how to do things. I bet you are German. That would explain the ego, the socialism, and the lack of respect for the value of life. I think that from now on, I will refer to you as Adolf. He was a German socialist that had no respect for human life. I bet he was a big hero of yours. |
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Ivan, you are a piece of work.
My sister in law was a union teacher who spoke against the union's endorsement for Obama, and requested a refund for the dues that she paid that were then give to the Obama campaign. In Iowa, the law allows this.
After the school year ended, the union advocated a person with less tenure and less education to replace her in her full time position, and she was moved to a part time one at another school.
Would you like another example? I have many. |
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describing you though, Ivan. Anyone who thinks that abortion does not destroy life is a heartless, soul-less, creature from the black lagoon of despair and hopelessness; and you fit that bill to a 'T'.
Now, as far as there being more abortions under Obama - are you freaking nuts!? Of course there will be more you raving maniac!! He's gonna make doctors perform them whether they want to or not, and fine their asss if they don't!! He's gonna make partial birth abortion a top priority again you clueless pile of steaming sewage!
And if that's raving - screw you! I will rave about such a hideous, act of premeditated murder of the innocent until hell freezes over if I like...whatcha gonna do about it, Mr. piece of scum? |
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Ivan-
You obviously have no idea what you are talking about. While it is true that a union can not follow their members into a voting booth, they regularly do everything they can to influence thier members to vote democrat, including intimidation.
I assume that you are a citizen of the US, but it is clear that you are from somewhere else that speaks the UK version of English. You clearly have a continental ego, and a belief in socialism, so I imagine you may not have a grasp of how things work here. Our unions make it hard for person to lose their jobs for anything, save going against the union. If one is found to vote against the union, their life can change quite a bit. There has always been a tie between the mob and the union movement in this country, and the mob attitude has remained the same.
BTW, truth needs no source. I can advise you that people outside of acedemia will accept what is obvious without footnotes, and withe the exception of the intelectually lazy, people will not believe BS no matter how well it is documented. |
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This country has yet to see a black president, Obama is a mulatto plain and simple, he is a chocolate milk shake. nothing more nothing less |
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...will make abortion legal up until, oh, say, the 120th trimester or beyond.
I hope no one who voted for this monstrosity will be able to sleep. Ever again. |
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"I hope he does not make a fool out of that nice Doug Kmiec, who led the pro-life charge on his behalf. I hope he does not spit on the rest of us"
IMO she is so stupid that she and other Catholics who voted for Obama probably deserve to be spit on while Obama runs to sign the FOCA.
What part of his support for abortion did they not hear? They drank the KoolAid and now they can try and figure out some way to justify it - knowing that he cared nothing about their beliefs - he just wanted their votes. |
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...policy is the coming birth dearth. For example, Russia's popluation will be cut in 1/2 by 2050. ("www.demographic-research.org/volumes/vol4/9/4-9.pdf" pg.302 & following.) Similar projections apply to much of Europe & Japan. The same birthrate trends are evident thruout the world, including the USA. Spare us the accusations of motivations; the babies aren't being born. Do your own homework on demographic projections. Or, see "www.demographicwinter.com" for a documentary on this subject.
When the control freak political class finally stops focusing on the convenience of abortion & wakes up the the arithmetic of its consequences, we'll see some startling new policies, I think.
Perhaps by mid-century, a new category of Selective Service will be created: 18 yr old women will be forced to register with a National Fertility Board, to do their part to save the world, by cranking out babies. Don't have a boyfriend? No problem, the Public Sperm Banks will fix you right up. (There'll be scandal about how politicians' genes wound up so over-represented in the Banks, of course.) And, Obama's Civilian Defense Force will need recreation - so young women will be able to serve their country 2 ways at 1 time! Perhaps a new generation of protestors, instead of burning their bras, will burn their Breeder Cards?
Human societies are as subject to natural law as say, airplanes. If we try to build & fly an airplane while ignoring those laws, & we will crash & burn. The same is true with society & the "-isms" of politics. How badly we want it, or how much political power we gather, makes no difference at all.
Regards, |
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"Despite what many of you childish, religion-wracked delusionaries imagine, a fetus inside the womb is not a baby eagerly waiting to meet its mommy"
My granddaughter is 9 months old and I know she was a live human being before she was born. I felt her move. The idea that she transformed from a blob, and in a few seconds became a person at the moment of birth is just stupid from a scientific point of view.
I am sorry that you are not capable of recognizing a living human being, but I suppose that is something you have not ever been able to do in your life.
May God forgive me for saying this to you, but you are an evil little animal. You may be legally a human being in terms of black ink on white paper, but if you don't act like a human being, then you are not one.
Go live in a hole with the rats.
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my2cents-
Why would I need to walk a mile in your shoes to understand universal truth? You have no idea what walking a mile in my shoes was like, so why do you assume that it is so different? Half of the whites of my generation were born to broken homes, myself included. I know what poverty and welfare does to a family because I lived it. I understand what it is like to be expected to fail. I understand what it is like to have a homosexual brother. I know what it is like to try to feed a family on next to no money. I have suffered through social bigotry, and have been told no more times than you can believe just because of the family I came from. I think that the greatest bigotry that happens in the US is when people say that white guys simply do not understand.
I have learned the following: Poverty is almost always a self-inflicted wound. No amount of effort to keep a person down that is willing to do what it takes to be successful will be fruitful. If you do three things - work very hard, improve yourself every day, and play by the rules, you will need no help from the government. If you omit even one of these three things, no amount of help from the government will change your life. The founders agreeded with these things, and our country created more prosperity because of it. Obama does not believe these things. |
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my2cents-
first, we kill about 4000 children a day. WAY more than before Row v. Wade. Not even close.
While I hope that I am wrong about Obama, I am not often. I did my research, and he is not what any conservative could possibly support. He is a Marxist who has spent his life trying to bring "economic justice". This is code for socialism, as he believes that the cause of poverty is the rich. He is exactly what Hamilton warned of in Federalist Paper #1. Read it, you will see.
Obama has stated that the first thing that he wants to pass is the Freedom of Choice Act. Read it, it will scare the heck out of you. He has called for creating an internal security force that is equal to the current military. Why do you think he feels the need for that? Regardless of what he has said on the campaign trail, he is one of the most anti first and second ammendment people I have ever seen. He has tried to get managers of a radio station arrested for having a guest on a show that simply wanted to talk about Obama's past jobs. Are you familiar with Obama's resume? Did you know that he spent most of his career working for socialist organizations?
I would suggest that conservatism today in the US is an ideology that believes in smaller government, traditional values, and strong defense. Obama is for large socialistic government, redefining devient behavior as good, and a weak national defense. What about him is there for a conservative to like?
BTW - While Obama seems to be a good family man, isn't that sort of what we should want as a starting point? I have been happily married to the same woman for about 15 years, have two wonderful children, and have never considered straying. Does that qualify me for the White House? |
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for teenagers, it is not love, but lust. Which often imitates love. If it was 'love' why is there not rings yet? Waiting for the ring bearer to be born?
you BETCHA. |
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I'll find the stats later, but I have heard, and I do believe it, that Abortion numbers are way down since abortion became legal. I'm not a pro abortion fan at all. I think it is wrong. But I also feel it is a personal choice. One that should never be made without ALL information. I support abortion in the first trimester for rape and incest.
And please, Hospital beds will NOT be taken over by wholesale abortions. We are not that kind of people. To instill fear that every woman who gets pregnant will automatically think abortion first, is so wrong headed. We have seen a decrease in abortions. Not an increase. |
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I did not screw up YOUR country. I made mine a better place. As a mother of African American children (and some Hispanic children) I am happy to have a FAMILY man in the white house who happens to be black. If nothing else, it sets an excellent example to our youth that being married is not a bad thing. And having your children conceived and born within the bounds of marriage, is also good. Especially to the black community (FYI - I'm white). In addition, the Obama family stresses education for not only themselves, but for their family. I doubt we'll see any of the Obama daughters marrying dropouts. Half my battle is won. Now, if we can just get past the religious bigotroy, my hope will be complete. Maybe Thrul Baily will run for President? A black LDS man? Yeupp. That's the ticket. You ought to try walking in shoes like ours for a few steps. You might have your eyes opened.
I have never said he would govern great, but so far, so good. Of course, he's not taken office yet. But he's got a realistic team in place. Although most are clinton retreads, I think for the first year, it will help him a lot. McCain did not want to become president. That was evidenced by several things. First, his crappy campaign. Second, his pick for veep. I have never voted democrate before. But sites such as ConservativesforObama.com helped me find other's who like me, used the brain cells when picking the next president.
If you think I screwed up your country you are close enough to Candada to jump the border. Knock yourself out. Me? I'm going to stick around and do my best to help my country grow up. |
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"Let you voice be heard
Sign the petition!! before such things are illegal!!
http://www.wnd.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=81550 "
I signed this, it is important to be heard especially when no news media is reporting anything near truth! |
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"There are no babies in the womb. There are zygotes, embryos, fetuses, but no babies. A baby is a very young PERSON, and a person is a human who was born alive."
Nice pedantic baloney. Use the dictionary definitions in place of any substantive point.
"And why do you say that babies are "innocent?" Aren't you a Christian? Don't you believe in original sin, visited on all humans by Adam's transgression? According to your own religion, there is no such thing as an "innocent" human (until they accept Jesus as their personal saviour, "repent" and are "saved"), and that also applies to a fetus in the womb."
Also according to our religion we aren't supposed to take another life except when they have done something deserving of it. So in that sense unborn babies are completely innocent. I love when atheists use these clever ploys of turning Christian theology against Christians.
"Besides, if God was opposed to abortion, couldn't He simply blast the clinics with vengeful, holy fire? Perhaps you should consider that God has no problem with abortion at all."
There is a judgment for what people did in this life. It comes after they die.
"What's wrong with abortion, anyway? Abortion is just a means of preventing the birth of unwanted children, of which the world has far too many already."
It's murder. Like killing someone who has already been born and is unwanted is murder.
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my2centsplus-
So you voted for the devil because the republicans were not saints? Good call. |
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Tell me about Ivan the Troll --
Where did you find that clod? I took a look back and found that almost none of his posts were worth reading. It is all a game to him.
Unresponsive one liners – not a single one was funny or even interesting
Fake intellectual – he’s a cut-and-paster with no understanding of what he cuts and pastes
Refuses to learn anything - poor attitude
Nasty manners - needs a spanking
He is just a waste of time. I think that’s what he was trying to achieve, to waste other people's time.
If he returns, I plan to comprehensively ignore him.
He is now a scrollby
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beds pretty soon, since the nuts voted Obama the baby killing advocate into office. Fools!! All I can hope for, since they're gonna be killing babies right and left, is that they abort more LIBERAL babies than Conservatives. |
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Ha! I know other Catholics who voted for obama because their UNION made them. Abortion, smortion--didn't matter on Nov 4th. I don't believe in that wide-eyed, "oh my, what have I done?" crap.
Sheeple following their hormones, their entertainment-journalists, their tamborine clanging hippie wannabes, and their corrupt union bosses have handed this country to a clinton-style weakling who will sign anything put before him.
fools |
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I'm glad your blobs made it out of the womb and into the world. However, as I told you, fetuses (which is simply the term for BABIES who haven't come out yet, DO all the things I mentioned and more, and if you had ever seen an ultrasound, you would know that. My second granddaughter yawned twice on the ultrasound video at 18 weeks. I have seen babies sucking their thumbs as well. At thirteen weeks, this is a fully formed human with all the parts there and in working order. Seems like a lot would have to happen in one week if, as you tried to assert, at twelve weeks it is just a mass of unformed cells. Really, if you are trying to make a point, it doesn't look good for you to spout garbage like that. Perhaps a trip to WebMD is in order. You can find out exactly how a human baby is formed, which organ system appears in which week, etc. Educate yourself. I am a Labor and Delivery Nurse. Are you? I have seen babies BORN holding their cords, so the fact that they hold onto them at times in utero is not that mysterious. They have hands and fingers and a grasp reflex which is still there when they are born, so when the cord floats by, they often grab it, temporarily we hope. And anyway, Ivan, I don't see why you are so hell-bent on proving that babies are just tumors. Guilt? In some deep, dark recess of your psyche do you know what a blob of slime YOU are? We shall never know. But what we DO know is how and when BABIES are formed and what they are capable of even before they breathe the air. Like Obama, you see yourself as far more witty and clever than you actually are. Entertaining at times, vitriolic always, but not much there, there. "You must be on drugs." Quite the comeback. |
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All of you, who think, that abortion of any kind is ok, makes all of you non viable pieces of Dung! You will one day regret your choice of taking life away! Wait until Obammi takes non-viable adults and puts them in mass graves like you have done an innocent life you have aborted!
How many of you have children old enough to be enlisted into Obammi's Militia, you gonna love him then?
You have a rude awakening coming to you!
You have a lack of morals!
You are a bunch of Losers!
Once a loser always a loser!
Liberalism is the philosophy of the Stupid! |
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Your obammi is a loser! He will always be a loser! You are a loser! Your obammi is already spitting in the faces of the libs! Look at who he is putting into his cabinet, not quite what the libs wanted eh?
Just remember you are what you vote for.
A loser!
LOL, all you libs will be jilted by your new groom.
LOL |
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If you're going to make fun of Governor Palin, could you please get the phrase right? It's "You Betcha", not "ya betcha".
And, just because a 17-year old engages in sexual activity, that doesn't mean they consider it "recreational". Love is complicated. Some couples who get together at that age actually stay married for life.
You do have a point--lots of kids think sex is just fun. But let's not ignore the ones who have values. |
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Ivan, Hope you have a nice weekend. Your response to me Thursday @ 2:04 AM said:
"Wrong. I AM evil. I am the devil incarnate, as are all people who refuse to credit fantasies about ghosties in the sky and cute li'l babies in the womb just waiting to meet their mommies."
I'm assuming you were being sarcastic about being evil. As for the rest of it...what? Hate to break it to you, but babies, mommies, and daddies ARE waiting for each other. When I was pregnant with my son, I dreamed about him. I was not trying to get pregnant at the time, because his sister was only a few months old. The drugstore test was negative, but I did not believe it. A week later, my doctor confirmed that my "blob" (as you say) was about 2 months along. |
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check it out for yourself. |
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And I voted for Obama. I voted for him for 3 reasons.
1. McCain
2. Palin
3. Get the GOP back on track and right the ship. Get the bigots out of the party and put of good people, regardless of their religion.
I've accomplished some of 3 by not voting for 1 and 2. Many other Christians (and who are YOU to judge who is a christian and who is not by whom they vote for?) voted for Obama. for the very same 3 reasons I did.
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if sex is not recreational. Better yet, go to alaska and poll any high school. They'll tell ya, ya betcha. |
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Don't stay gone to long. Waiting with baited breath for your thick german accent. |
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I will infer from your comments that you don't believe there is a God and you might infer that I do.
I don't expect to change your mind just because I can't logically explain what I believe is true.
But here is a riddle for you Ivan.
If I gave you a cup of salt and a cup of sugar and let you taste them both, could you tell the salt from the sugar?
The obvious answer would be yes.It is an everyday experience—you know it as well as you know anything.
Assuming that I have never tasted salt, explain to me just what it tastes like.
Words alone will not explain the taste of salt.It must be experienced.
Spiritually speaking, I have tasted salt.I am no more able to convey to you in words how this knowledge has come than you are to tell me what salt tastes like.
Hope you had a great Thanksgiving. |
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signifying nothing. An apt description of Ivan's blather. I don't believe Ivan has any children. If he did, he might have educated himself a bit better and would realize that unborn babies have quite an active life, unlike tumors and warts. They hear, feel, suck their thumbs, yawn, sleep, wake, pee, hiccup and hold onto their umbilical cords, which at times gives us L & D nurses and docs fits. I have yet to see a tumor or wart do any of that. Calling the unborn blobs of protoplasm or whatever clever, witty term Ivan used up there--I've read a lot of comments, and I have forgotten--does not make it so. They are babies outside, and they are babies inside. Taking one breath of oxygenated air does not change anything except to inflate those dear little lungs. If you are a father, I weep for your little blobs. If they are proud of you, I weep harder. Here's the thing: women DO have a choice without killing babies. If you don't WANT babies, don't have sex. THAT is your choice. It isn't recreational, though Planned Non-Parenthood says it is. It is an adult action that has consequences, and those should be paid by the participants, not by the innocent baby who is the result. And by the way, we Christians believe babies are born INNOCENT, but not GOOD. We know all humans are sinners, but babies are too young to sin. I am not a Catholic, so don't go there. Ivan, I would never presume to pray for you. You will make a clever, witty addition to Hell, I'm sure. |
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At least 90% of the babies conceived in the US who have down syndrome are aborted. That IS eugenics.
You do not speak for me. |
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Sorry your mother did not love you or make you feel wanted but turning that sense of abandonment toward featus' makes me think - your mother should have exercised her choice to either abort you or give you up for adoption. How old were you when she abandoned you? Are you the guy who was Barak in the limousine? |
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"I take that as your admission that you could not, in fact, prove that I said what you claimed I said -- and proof that you are not man enough to admit you were wrong, or honorable enough to concede that you lied."
You are mistaken, as before. Repeatedly and monotonously.
"I accept your unconditional surrender."
Ha, ha, at last you post something that shows a sense of humor.
I hope you don't eat turkey today; for you it will be cannibalism.
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Adios, buddy.
Sorry to see the end of your progress toward doing the right thing.
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NOW people are concerned about Mr. Infanticide???? Too late! It's beyond me how anyone who calls themselves a Christian could have voted for this animal.
You have the blood on your hands now people....LIVE WITH IT! |
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If a majority of my neighbors chose to hold a summary executive of you at noon, I would gladly accept that. Then we would be free of your blather. |
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You now acknowledge that life begins at conception. Yesterday, you did not. So I infer that you can learn. Congratulations!
This "S" person declared you an intellectual, perhaps because he does not recognize a sophist and provocateur -- both proper labels for you.
You should disabuse "S" of this delusion. This will be the next demonstration of your ability to learn.
Then you can work on learning what the Church is about. For the moment, it suffices to say that you claim to know more than you know.
Puppy; but this puppy can learn. Good start!
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I took a minute to sign in to congratulate Ivan on his superior intellectual ability and social awareness in the face of the usual onslaught of infantile gibberish and bile. Reminds me a little of that popular biblical myth David and Goliath. I find especially amusing and ironic the hypocracy of those who are crying in their beer about abortion while expressing the wish you had been terminated. Keep the logic coming, Ivan. |
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First, let it suffice to say the Church has plenty to teach you about the value of human life. You just don't want to learn it.
Just like embryology has plenty to teach you about when life begins (my posts Wed. 12:20 PM, 3:03 PM). You don't want to learn that, either.
Do some reading. Then we'll talk.
Now, come on Ivan, let's be optimistic here. If you refuse to do your reading, then you will have to wait. But when you account for what you have done here, you will learn everything you need to know. That includes the meaning of life as a whole.
Now, thank your daddy, you puppy.
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choice is a euphasim for death ,the unborn are the only ones given a death sentence for the crime of being inconveinant. there has to be a better way for a compassionite society to deal with this issue,treating all life with respect would be a good start. |
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Shut up! Your ignorance is showing and really it is better to keep your mouth shut and have people think you are a fool. Then to open it up and prove that you are.
If you don't believe in God. That's fine. Don't bully those of us who do.
If you don't believe in Evil in the world. Fine. Go tell a Muslin that you don't believe in God or Allah and see how they embrace you.
If you don't agree with Bush that's fine. It's a free country. You are allowed to speak up against the government. I don't agree with Bush 100% of the time either. However if you are going to argue a point --- try taking apart the topic not the person who is making the opposite point. You might be taken more seriously.
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Shame on all the Catholics who voted for Obama. They were WARNED not once, not twice BUT MANY TIMES OVER that voting for Obama was a vote against the morals and beliefs of the Catholic Church.
Now they are starting to wonder if they made a mistake... NOW they wonder what will happen to Catholic Hospitals who won't perform abortions. NOW they worry that President-Elect Obama might spit in their face. All they had to do was look at his record in the Illinois State Senate AND FIND THE ANSWERS.
For all the Catholics who voted for Obama --- go to confession, ask God for forgiveness and Pray that we can fight the move of the left wing agenda of abortion on demand and save innocent lives. This election I am afraid is like taking 3 giant steps back for the Pro-Life Movement.
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Happy Thanksgiving everyone. We have so much to be thankful for it's ridiculous and we should remember to help those that do have less. I'm living my dream and thank God every day.
I'm heading into NYC today - one of my favorite places even with the terror alerts of the last 24 hours. Seeing the empty spot in the skyline where the Towers used to be always makes me realize that there are evil people in the world who don't want us to be free.
And Ivan - an extra prayer for you and your children. I can't imagine what it would have been like to have my late father write comments on internet BB's like yours. I would have been just plain terrible to live with that.
Abortion should be a States decision - if the majority of people in that state feel it isn't a procedure that should be available in their state - then it should be deemed illegal. And it always amazes me that we have young women using abortion as a form of birth control. With condoms available for FREE - what's the problem? I'm also surprised any man that doesn't want to be a father is using un-protected sex - pregnancy aside - what about aids and STD's (which are at record levels). Though STD do affect future fertility - it doesn't seem to be a concern. |
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A stalkinghorse is:
1. a horse, or a figure of a horse, behind which a hunter hides in a stalking game.
2. anything put forward to mask plans or efforts; pretext.
3. a political candidate used to conceal the candidacy of a more important figure or to draw votes from and cause the defeat of a rival.
example; Mike Huckabee was stalkinghorse for John McCain to take Mitt Romney out of the game.
I came accross the word about 10 years ago and liked it. Hope you like it to. |
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Yes, we do! Do you mind if I ask about your moniker? I have a background in horses. |
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Charity begins at home. Have a great and wonderful Thanksgiving. We have much to be grateful for.
Even Ivan. |
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You don't have a reason to apologize! Ivan would have polluted this thread regardless of what you said.
Happy Thanksgiving! |
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You are so right about the charity thing. Conservatives like to know where their charitable dollars are going. Liberals would rather just tax the rich and let the government decide where it goes...which is usually down the drain.
Abortion is a very divisive issue. I hope that we can educate people on why it is not needed rather than continue to divide groups over this one issue. I am definitely pro-life. But sometimes when I tell people that, they refuse to listen to me about anything else. |
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I must admit, I am not very religious. But after having my children and knowing the love that comes from motherhood, I know God guides us somehow.
But I don't think people like Ivan are evil, just misguided. So I say God bless him, too. Perhaps one day he will realize that for a woman with an unplanned pregnancy to carry the child to term and give it to a loving home is actually less of a burden on the woman than an abortion.
How did we come to this, you ask? Ultra-feminists, starting in the 1960's. No regard for human rights, only women's rights.
And I'm a little angry about that. I feel that I was completely misguided by a "movement" that insisted on platitudes such as "don't want an abortion, don't have one!" (As Ivan likes to say.)
"Life, Liberty, and the Pursuit of Happiness." Those are our basic rights. Period.
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NOVEMBER 4 '08 WAS A SAD DAY IN AMERICA FOR THOUSANDS OF BABIES....kindda reminds me of the day Hitler came into power. Hitler dehumanized Jews, essentially viewing them as less than humans and without any real rights or power - just like Obama and/or his left wing extremist friends have been doing for decades. It's ironic how you have a party who claims to speak for the underprivileged are so vocal in their support for abortion (aka infanticide). It's cloaked under the guise that they support "women's right to choose." Well, guess, what? Hitler was also pro-choice! He believed he had that choice to exterminate anyone he wanted.
These next few years will likely be an uphill battle for pro-lifers. But it could also be a time of opportunity - to get our message out via public protests, educational forums or simple one-on-one conversations. The battle has not ended; it has evolved and will succeed in the future! |
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Ivan, your life started as a 'blob' and now you are a fungus. I know why you believe in abortion, your mother said to you she should have aborted you but lacked the funds to do so. Sorry little blob turned Ivan - nobody loves you. I get you are angry that your mother did not want you, but that does not mean you have a right to insult other featuses and fund for them to be killed. It is my business if you ask me to pay for others' to kill babies then ask me to accept it as a 'choice'.
>quality of life?
Quality of life is crucial. Don't you think so?
Judging by your post, maybe your mother should have aborted you instead of putting society through the misery of your thinking. Your existence and threat have now made me very very pro-choice.
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Truth is immutable and facts are stubborn things.
The assault on the family is quite evident in the inner city ghettos of chicago that barry claimed he was helping. He was no bulwark against social decay and by the way he promotes abortion and its off the charts there you know.
Many things are weakening the social fabric, abortion being one of them.
If social programs are the end all be all for the elevation of a society then new orleans should have been a paradise.
You'll note it wasn't, as so many people there were on the dole and didn't know how to fend for themselves.
Socialism breeds mediocrity; a sad state of affairs. I suspect abortion rates were pretty high in new orleans as well. Who's to blame for the promotion of abortion? Why its liberalism with the courts as an enabler
And regarding the promotion of welfare I am better able to manage my money and promote welfare where and when I decide thank you.
As a point of fact rightoids give far and away more money for charitable causes than liberals.
barry says taking money from me to give to others is neighbourliness. Not so, its socialism.
ps. your a busy little man.
Happy Thanksgiving and God Bless. |
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I addressed a post to Ivan thinking he was actually a thinking liberal, but I was mistaken. His replies both to me and to others have gone steadily downhill, and I am rather disappointed. I will not make the same mistake again. |
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I applaud you for your post and would hope more people would go back to the realization that life is precious and should not be destroyed as so much unwanted trash. It breaks my heart to see so many people clamoring for abortion-on-demand, as though the creation of life is worthless unless the woman carrying it deems it to be worth something.
I can't believe that some people are talking so nonchalantly about the heinous, premeditated, cold-blooded murder of helpless babies in the womb because they might put the mother out. How about carrying those unwnted babies to term and then adopting them out if they don't want them? How about giving them to the father if he wants them instead of denying him the right to a baby he made?
How did it come to this? How did these people stray so far from God, his teachings, his love and compassion for all mankind?
It's really unfortunate, but they're all clueless as to what will happen to them one day when Jesus comes back and judges them for their awful acts of cruelty against the precious life of a child.
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Okay, I felt compelled to post something positive to pull this thread away from the name calling.
Now that Ivan has continued his rant while I wrote my post and left the computer for a moment, I must add something.
Ivan, pre-viable humans are not "blobs of tissue", like a tumor! They are developing lives. How about women who need, for health reasons, to deliver early, and then their premature babies develop into healthy people? Are you saying that those babies are not valid because they didn't develop in the womb full term? Why is a human a "blob", but then suddenly a human when it takes a breath?
It sounds to me like maybe you have some guilt. Perhaps you once paid for a girlfriend's abortion and afterward she was so remorseful you couldn't deal with the emotion?
Or maybe it's not guilt, maybe it's pure jealousy. You DID mention wasted sperm in an earlier post.
Now that I have that out of my system, I think the USA just elected a pre-viable candidate. (Stole that one from another poster, but too good not too pass along.) |
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people who believe in the sanctity of life think of a Bast@rd Son of Satan such as yourself, and what they might LIKE to do to you for your wicked feelings toward the innocent, unborn. |
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Happy Thanksgiving, all. Here is what I am most thankful for...my children. I am happy that I realized from the beginning of my pregnancies that they were precious.
I can't say I am glad that we will soon have the most pro-abortion president in history. However, I have spoken to many young people--women and men alike--who are thrilled that the introduction of Sarah Palin to the national spotlight has raised awareness of the abortion issue.
Prior to this election cycle, many people were unaware how pervasive late-term abortion is. Many were also horrified to learn that it is actually encouraged by doctors when the baby is determined to be "defective". Even at the point when the fetus may be viable!
The Palins chose to have their son Trig, and face the challenges of raising a Down Syndrome baby. That was the courageous choice.
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IVAN...someone would likely take your vile head off. |
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Well we will have to see if Barry O is the greatest President. He's actually quit entertaining. Who else would have these signs and logs for Office of the President Elect.
Your are a stickler for details Ivan - why don't you break it to him that he isn't the President Elect until the Electoral College votes on December 15th!
And we can thank the Radical Gals on the left for turning our Trophy Generation young women into the female versions of John Belushi as far as being disgusting and available. I rallied in the 60's for EQUAL OPPORTUNITY. That applied to an education and career - not to be the next gal sticking my tongue in another gals mouth on Face Book.
But you can rest assured Ivan - Republican Women are ready to roll. And we won't have much to roll over in the next few years. Barry O will absolutely positively CHOKE and his handlers will have to prop him up for the next 4 years. He is ...as they say in Texas - All hat and NO Cattle. Great speaker, tons of buzz words and phrases that sound so ooo ooo good to the mindless masses. But when the masses don't get that free gas money and their mortgage payments taken care of - well it will be a hot time in the old town tonight.
And lighten up on the spelling issue. I haven't seen a single winner of the big Spelling Bee contest written up years later as being the leader of the free world!
And your graphic comments about women makes me truly believe you spend a lot of nights alone. |
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Yes I do. However, I feel much better by telling you to go FUCHYOURSELF, you self righteous son of a beech. |
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We haven't really seen equality. Women are still protected.
Women stand by their right to have an abortion when they want it, or not. Yet, if they choose to keep it, then they demand child support from the father (and in some cases, from others).
However, the biological father has no choice in the matter. To take that one step further, now women want the biological father to pay child support, even when the biological father was an anonymous sperm donor.
People want freedom of actions, not freedom of consequences. |
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Your assessment of the sorry situation facing our nation was well articulated to blame babies who are born while they should have been aborted because their prospects of living a 'good' life is low. How do we decide what quality of life is worth saving? Maybe kids of people earning above 60K , or blue eyed blondes? What if a kid's parents die before age 10? Now, the kid is considered a big burden or should we say 'punishment' to the society. What about when parent dies in the process of birthing a kid? At this rate am thinking only well educated, rich,people whose IQ is above 100 should be allowed to have children - if they are blue eyed blondes of course! And when do we decide a person's life has stopped being useful?Age 75? or after using up to 1 Million dollars of medicaid? unless of course if they are rich and can pay taxes and employ nurses and doctors then they are acceptable to society and the euthanasia argument does not hold water.
The idea that children whose probability of a 'good life' is limited should be aborted is self deceptive. Why? We hold these truths to be self evident, all men are created equal and endowed..' As long as there is a heartbeat, the person is worthy of life and it is our duty to ensure he or she lives. Even if that means limiting abortion on demand. Now what role does safe sex play in this 'unwanted children' equation. You teach kids about safe sex which turns out to be stupid sex that encourages kids to have sex and babies when they are too young. Then you say, just abort the babies and nobody will know it happened. Only she does know it happened, and her life is forever changed. But who cares? because it's just one less life to support in our very sophisticated world view of choice and quality of life. WTH is wrong with you progressive types? How about you put your lives up for death row first before asking others to kill their babies in the name of choice, progress and quality of life? |
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"And shame on you men who comment on when life begins.
-People know when life begins because of advances in medical technology and common sense. People includes men. The sperm is alive, the egg is alive, when they get together, BLAMMO!, a new life is created. Yeah. Real tough to understand.
"How the hell would you know? Nothing grows inside your body and evolves into a human being."
-Oh don't play martyr. Women have been squeezing out babies since there've been women.
"And casting your seed anywhere it's pleasurable without concern that it might become a person - makes you little more than a street dog."
-Yep. Sounds like you've got men down pat. If some woman is going to spread her legs, you can bet Tom, Dick, and Harry are going to be there to join the fun. Traditionally, women stifled the base instincts of men. Now, thanks to the women's movement, women are celebrated for being as equally crass and base as men.
liberalism = lowest common denominator equality. |
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Please allow your fellow bloggers to handle their business as they see fit, and perhaps they will gladly allow you to have your viewpoints. Your commentary just on this blog alone tell what kind of person you really are (to show a few):
1. Please, please shut up...
2. you are 'way (sic) too illiterate...
3. that would make you a liar, or a hysteric, or a delusional nutbar with dreck for brains -- or all of the above
4. you will continue to be a heavily armed, superstition-wracked ding-a-ling steeped in bitterness and disappointment
Perhaps you should consider using tact and diplomacy, instead of drive-by insults. You make cogent points, yet you ruin your commentary with insults.
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Now regarding conservatives. You paint conservatives with a wide brush, yet become dismayed when conservatives do the same to liberals.
You say conservatives create conditions that make victims, but hate to see government do anything for anyone "(but yourselves, of course)."
As a conservative (more libertarian), I believe people are entitled to make any decision they want, in their best interests. If they want abortion, please feel free. Smoke marijuana? Have at it. Sexual freedom? When you wish, with whom you wish.
However, I also believe that the decisions people make may also include adverse effects. For example, a person's desire to have sexual congress is their business, but I should not be responsible for the off-spring associated with such activity. If a women gets pregnant, she should be able to get an abortion, but not on my dime. If she has the baby, she should have to support it or give it up for adoption. I should not have to support her through social services.
The problem with many liberals is that they believe that the federal government should take care of other people. It's not the government's duty to do so. That is society's duty, through charitable organizations desiring to help those in need.
The big difference...government taxes my money for those things it is not constitutionally bound to do. Charitable organizations take my money when I freely give it, to whatever cause I want to support. So, if a woman wants an abortion, then those who support abortion are free to give money to planned parenthood. If i choose to give to Catholic Charities for those things that CC does, then I should be entitled to.
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Must you be so tactless? People come to Townhall to have an open and honest discussion about many issues, including abortion. Yet, you shout down anyone who writes anything which is counter to your own stance, as if your viewpoint is the only one worth reading.
You continually berate any writer for any and all minor grammatical errors, an affectation of haughtiness, to say the least. I can see why you would hide behind your nickname. If you were in a public forum, and said one half the things you write, I believe someone would have punched you in the nose.
Now, for a small spoonful of your own medicine, which you dispense in huge quantities:
"Uh, I hate to break it to you, Sue, baby, but hospitals, adoptions agencies and the like are INANIMATE ENTITIES and thus have no religion. People may have religion. Inanimate entities other than specifically religious institutions), do not."
"Being supported by public funds, hospitals and adoption agencies must serve the public -- ALL MEMBERS of the public. Since abortion is legal, public institutions may not deny them to anyone."
Based on your former paragraph, you should amend you latter paragraph.
In your mean-spirited vernacular: Uh, I hate to break it to you, Ivan, baby, but hospitals, adoption agencies and the like are INANIMATE ENTITIES and thus cannot serve the public. The hospital staff may serve the public, but the hospital itself cannot.
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By having no boundaries we have gone too far. I have been pro-choice my entire adult life. But I see now that the term "pro-choice" has been defined as anything goes. I simply disagree with that tenent.
If a woman finds herself pregnant and doesn't want to be pregnant - she should have the right to terminate with 2 months of conception. If she's too stupid to fail to use birth control I would hope she can at least read a home pregnancy test and go to the doctor.
After that - no. Minors should NOT be able to get abortions without parental concent. This is their child - they should know a surgical procedure is being performed on their child.
Late term abortions should not be allowed. And anyone who feels allowing a live aborted child to die a slow death without medical intervention should consider themselves barbaric. I get sick just thinking we can as humans attempt to rationalize this horror.
Sadly many people have forfeited their souls for their own personal comfort levels. Women I know who have had abortions have not been spared lifelong guilt about it. Women who don't feel some lifelong soul searching make me wonder where we are going with out society.
We profess to be forging forward with civilization but in reality our day to day lives are becoming more like a third world country.
I used to support Planned Parenthood because I stood firm that women should have access to medical care and contraception. I wouldn't give them a penny now - they have taken on abortion on demand as their only focus.
And shame on you men who comment on when life begins. How the hell would you know? Nothing grows inside your body and evolves into a human being. And casting your seed anywhere it's pleasurable without concern that it might become a person - makes you little more than a street dog. |
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DOMESTIC TERRORIST GROUPS, SUCH AS ACLU, HUMAN RIGHTS CAMPAIGN, NAACP, LULAC AND OTHERS BELIEVE IN PROTECTING ILLEGAL ALIENS INCLUDE THEM RECEIVING DUE PROCESS IN COURT. THEY PREVENT JUSTICE AND DUE PROCESS WHEN THEY COMMIT CRIMINAL ACTIVITY AND DENY THE VICTIM ANY DAY IN COURT. EMBARASSMENT THAT CONGRESSWOMAN SHELIA JACKSON-LEE AND SENATOR JOHN CORNYN HELPS PROTECT DOMESTIC TERRORIST KEEP COURTS CLOSED TO PROMOTE RACISM, SEXUAL PREJUDICE OF ABSTAINERS AND VIRGINS, AND POLITICAL BIAS OF CHRISTIAN CONSERVATIVES. |
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DOMESTIC TERRORIST GROUPS, SUCH AS ACLU, HUMAN RIGHTS CAMPAIGN, NAACP, LULAC AND OTHERS BELIEVE IN PROTECTING ILLEGAL ALIENS INCLUDE THEM RECEIVING DUE PROCESS IN COURT. THEY PREVENT JUSTICE AND DUE PROCESS WHEN THEY COMMIT CRIMINAL ACTIVITY AND DENY THE VICTIM ANY DAY IN COURT. EMBARASSMENT THAT CONGRESSWOMAN SHELIA JACKSON-LEE AND SENATOR JOHN CORNYN HELPS PROTECT DOMESTIC TERRORIST KEEP COURTS CLOSED TO PROMOTE RACISM, SEXUAL PREJUDICE OF ABSTAINERS AND VIRGINS, AND POLITICAL BIAS OF CHRISTIAN CONSERVATIVES. |
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I have a two part blog up on Abortion and the second part cover's Obama's record. There is a link to the transcript of his voting down the Born Alive Act and him twisting around the meaning of being "born alive."
It's disgraceful! |
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Yes, intercede for him. He will need it when he has to account for his attitude.
Notice, he did none of the reading I suggested. He is still making up his own version of biology and embryology as he goes.
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concept. Philosphers can argue about its meaning.
Human being is a biological fact.
Poor deluded Ivan :( He actually believes he makes sense and is rational and logical.
Pray for him!!!! |
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You're still a little man and wrong again. Life is sacred and precious.
You write;
"The proposed Act is aimed at protecting women's natural right to exercise sovereignty over their own bodies, not to "promote" abortion, as you must know".
What I know is we can't pick and choose what we have and don't have as rights regarding our bodies.
Abortion happens to be legal, yes, but you ignore the real argument regarding abortion. It is part and parcel of the assault on the family which is the fundamental unit of society.
The disintegration of the family will bring upon individuals, communities and nations certain destruction.
Happy Thanksgiving. |
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Good points about libtrolls. Sooooooooo,,,.....
Ivan, forget it. I don't need a response.
Happy Thanksgiving to all.
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If a conservative wants to engage in a thoughtful debate with a lib, find one with whom thoughtful debate can occur.
Brevity keeps the blogosphere lively, but engaging the glib is casting pearls before swine. |
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Lets not forget dems troll our websites in order to engage our thinking minds. They live off their notions based on nothing, whereas ours are based on facts. It is best to ignore them so they can feed off themselves, and fade away. Remember what happened to their radio station? |
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Why in the hell is abortion legal anyway? Abortion kills one life and ruins the rest. The only one who "makes out" in the whole abortion thing is the sick freaks who do them- many of them make over $1,000,000 per year. It's all about the money. Obama's record speaks for itself.
A little over half the people in this country put their brain on a shelf and decided to vote for Obama. They followed the silver tongued "messiah" like dimwitted lemmings. Now, the rest of us get to suffer for it. All the work, all the tiny victories for life over the last 30 years will be wiped away with a pen stroke from the "great Obama." God have mercy on our country.
Mike
SoCal |
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"I hope he does not make a fool out of that nice Doug Kmiec, who led the pro-life charge on his behalf."
It has been painful to watch Doug Kmiec twist himself into a defense of the indefensible. As a lawyer he knows many words, mostly silly these days.
And this "Ivan" person makes two. Wrong on the scientific facts. Ivan, the embryology is precisely against you. The new life is a new human being from the moment of fertilization. Thus the baby living in her mother deserves protection under the law.
But don't take my word for it - do some reading. Not talking, reading.
Then we'll talk.
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Wow! A rare post for me (If not a first), as a member of TH and all I want to do is comment on "Ivan" ! What a petty, bitter, little person. I am often too busy reading and educating myself, here in TH, through the columns and as is the case with other sites, the comments section. I appreciate ALL thoughts, even yours, but I can't abide your lack of "Class", and "Vitriolic" stance toward people, who given everyday pressures and obligations, stop what they are doing to give voice to the "Voiceless". Shame on you! Please save your petty proofreading for your cynical writing sessions for SNL or Bill Maher and let REAL dialogue occur here! |
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Another typical hanoman supporter.
If you love wealth more than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, depart from us in peace. We ask not your counsel nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains rest lightly upon you and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.
When you cease to be a castrated form of life, you may begin to see the truth. |
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....less than intelligent Obama voter. What did these folks think he was going to do? A brain is a terrible thing to waste. |
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WELL........what did you expect. Look at his record....the only one he has...............he would rather kill unborn babies that have our troops support Freedom in Iraq. You elected him now we all have to suffer..............As for going to church after supporting him you are just as bad as he was saying I didn't know about Rev. Wright |
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She writes, "At the very moment when Obama and his party have won the trust of so many Catholics...I hope he does not prove them wrong."
Oh, please. You have to be kidding lady. He didn't care about winning your trust; just winning your votes. His positions could not have been clearer or more articulated. You all just feel in love with an anti-Bush, media-messiah-made liberal democrat. You knew he was anti-life, pro-kill-the baby-in-the-womb-at any-cost pro-abortionist from the start. You cast your vote willingly--and that, if I understand my Catholic doctrine of guilt and punishment, is an unforgiveable sin. Thousands of Catholics, really hundreds of thousand find themself in a divine dilemma, on this side of their vote, not the other when they could have chosen life. They did not--and that is an unforgiveable sin. (PS Of course I don't believe that myself, but as good catholics they should--but wait, they aren't good catholics with that vote for Obama).
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I wish an individual woman's choice or lack thereof was all there was to this issue. Unfortunately it has become wrapped up in the Progressive's campaign for legalized eugenics and in the face of socialist eugenicists, though I favor individual freedom in most cases, I must side with those that favor restricting the ending of innocent lives and thus place an obstacle in the path of those that march too boldly toward enslavement by the leaders of the the state.
Molly and God can sort out their differences without my help. |
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it TRULY is a shame YOUR mother didn't feel the same about abortion as you do........
then again, maybe the child is alive and well somewhere......
and you're the afterbirth....... |
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Barry will betray you. You have been misled you just don't know it yet. You will in time though.
Correcting grammar and syntax is a predictable endeavor for a man of limited intellect and imagination.
That still leaves the abortion issue; The Freedom of Choice Act is a curious name for a law that will effectivly promote the deaths of those least able to choose life. The unborn.
Ms. Hennenberger, Barry voted for infanticide three times. What ever gave you 'hope' he would do otherwise as president. Facts are stubborn things.
ivan, try and find the misspelt word. Hint, its not 'misspelt'. |
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Form over substance ... it does speak to the essence of the individual.
And yet, you'll avoid your 'spello.' Situational editor complex no doubt.
As to the etymology and the verb "tenir" and tenant and tennents, well we understand that the lingo and the origins are 'foreign' to you.
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These two have SO much in common. Hmmm...two groups that the Supreme Court has ruled have no rights before the court--one was slaves and the other is the pre-born. Of course, we know the Constitution was amended to give rights to those who had been held in bondage (any other African-Americans who had not been slaves), and the pro-abortion advocates worry endlessly that abortion will return to a state issue.
Slavery was and Abortion is a great moral issue. That is where the problem lies. The pro-abortion side does not want it to be a moral issue, but I ask--how can it not be? If they have an answer for that, I am interested in hearing it. They may say that a woman has a right to choose, but I think we need to be clear on what that choice is--the intentional killing of another human being.
The south did not want limits placed on slavery. Abraham Lincoln wanted to stop the spread of slavery (that was what he ran on--look it up). He did not advocate for its immediate abolition. Yet, southerners did not trust him because he wanted to stop the spread of an institution they felt was necessary. The pro-abortion folks seem to be the same way--any limits on abortion are a moral judgement and an unwarranted attack on our beloved "right."
We know what it took to finally end slavery. I do not think it will take a Civil War to end abortion, but if Obama's vision of complete and total abortion rights is realized, I pray that God will have mercy on us. |
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on my question as to whether or not you would jam the scissors into the baby's skull. Whatsamatta? I thought I'd be getting lots of "Yeah, I'll do it's" from you people, (and I use that term lightly.) Talk is cheap isn't it? |
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I take exception to your last statement of "...and don't be such a Bush." Actually, the statment should read...."don't be such a lib."
It is the liberals who have blamed and blamed and blamed. New Orleans is under water--our lib governor did NOTHING, our lib mayor did NOTHING, we citizens cannot be expected to take care of ourselves--this MUST be Bush's fault. The world "hates" us because we finally took the terrorists seriously and responded to their declaration of war on us--if only Bush hadn't decided to do something, the world would "love" us, it is all his fault! The polar bears are dying--their ice floes are getting smaller even as we read this post--that is Bush's fault too! If he would just make us all ride in buggies all would be well! You name any ill, and the left has blamed it on Bush. I don't recall him ever trying to weasel out of taking responsibility and being a girly-man like the libs! |
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"dishonourable" ... facinating ...
'Je tien, Tu tiens, Nous tenons, Vous tenez, Ils tiennent.'
Catch-up when the chemistry allows. |
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The blood of more aborted human babies is on the hands of all who so gleefully voted for the most pro-abortion politician in the USA: Barack Abortion. The ONLY time Barack ever stood apart from his party is for voting for more extreme abortion activities. He is a maverick in only one category, an abortion maverick. It is a joke to hear about "Christians" who voted for Barack Abortion, claiming they did not realize how pro-abortion is. It truly is an Obama Nation. |
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about Obama's choice of Tom Daschle as Secretary of Health and Human Services.........
Wouldn't Dr. George Tiller, The Baby Killer, have been a much better choice for Comrade Obama's infanticide agenda??????
Tiller is the world-renowned abortionist in Wichita, Kansas.......
When a reporter asked Democrat Party superstar Kathleen Sebelius, Governor of Kansas, how she felt about Tiller performing so many abortions in Kansas........
she replied that he was "a health care provider"........
in that case, I guess Ted Kennedy is "a safe driving instructor".......
LMAO!!!!
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person, Obama would lose this election. You must have me mixed up with someone else. But that isn't surprising is it? Liberals are a plague on the face of mother earth, and I'm praying for a cure in my life time. |
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WKIY.
Thank you for the 'spello.' So gratifying to have the editorial presence for blog comments.
Your gripe is better directed at Bill Gates and his WORD spell check that attacks and corrects with zeal rivaled only by little minds that treasure form over substance.
More problematic for you of course is the etymology of the French verb "Tenir", to hold as the word origin of "Tennents," as in belief.
I send you my next graduation announcement ...
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You, dude do not have a conscience, or a heart, or a soul, or any morality about you. You, as well as anyone else who can believe that it is alright to rip the innocent life of a HELPLESS BABY from the womb of a mother is a low-life, scum sucking animal...PERIOD! Perhaps YOUR mother should have had a Dr. rip you from her womb before you were born, eh?? |
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Just how the hell do you figure Obama automatically has the next Presidential election in the bag? Oh, I see......you're one of those ignorant, Liberal braindead sheep who follows instead of leads. Well, why don't you follow the SOB right off the highest cliff in these United States? He WILL NOT MAKE IT FOR TWO TERMS, GUARANTEED! |
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they were handed the scissors and told to ~jam them into~ the brains of the innocent little "life" themselves. Could they do It?
I personally feel that anyone who could do it is a heartless animal, not worthy of life themselves. |
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I was thinking what would be the one most important thing Obama would want to do. The answer would be make the Executive branch the only branch and get rid of the Judicial and Legislative branch. That would be difficult. It would also be difficult for him to knock out the conservative justices somehow and put in liberals. But that would be the one main thing he would want to do. After that, probably the freedom of choice act would be the most blood for his bucket he could get with one swipe of his pen. How do we stop them and him? I don't know. My gut feel about him is we are dealing with a satanically cold person who will sign the freedom of choice act if he can. I will be happy if I am wrong. |
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I'll tell you why, because those who support and have abortions know that they are wrong-deep down in there somewhere-thus, they feel guilty. Having others around them point out the wrongness of these actions, even by simply refusing to take part, makes them even more guilty and then it makes them desperate. Many guilty people believe that getting others to commit sin or having their sin sanctioned by society at large will ameliorate that guilt. So, some fight to the death to make sure that happens. All the while, mistaken believing that it will make them feel better to have others in their sinking boat going down with them. |
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Sign the petition!! before such things are illegal!!
http://www.wnd.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=81550
Make him produce a real birth cert (if he can) if not well... |
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Choice changes everything voters hoped for in 2008. Read Deutronomy 'I give you this day, life and death, choose life that you may live'. God not only gave us the choice, he gave us a hint which one was better - and Henneberger should know this at a minimum if she can call herself a 'prolifer'. Obama won't be spitting, he'll be smiling and giving speeches that require catholic hospitals to close their door. But then again, we don't need religious organizations to offer healthcare because we have Obamacare to kill babies at home and abroad through the Freedom of Choice Act. Choice is a strange thing, it changes everything voters had hoped for in 2008. I miss palin - oevey! |
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I saw a car with a 'respect life' license plate, meaning the owner paid extra to the state of CO to get this plate, and an Obama-Biden sticker next to it. Reading this article makes me realize 'hope' can be a four letter word. What part of 'I don't want my children punished with a baby' or 'it's above my paygrade to figure out when life begins' didn't these 'pro-life' voters understand. When Obama made it clear he did not know when life begins at Saddleback Church - nobody had any reason to 'hope' for a pro-life democrat in his cabinet. But then again, the titanic travellers belived their ship was unsinkable. The USSA will sink slowly and deliberately because the man navigating the waters convinced his followers - the ship was unsinkable and he does not realize his frenemies or should i say comrades who worked for Clinton have no investment in his survival. But who cares, pro-lifers who are for obamacide can now realize the ice berg is getting bigger and bigger as they plead to a deaf messiah that 'life is sacred' and he says 'that's above my pay grade now tow the line!' |
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No one can make a Muslim cab driver do anything. But the govt plans to force catholic hospitals to perform abortions? All the Catholics have to do is the same thing that muslims do, refuse to do it on religious grounds. If that doesn't work, close the hospitals. If that doesn't work, close the catholic schools. Then catholics can demonstrate for religious freedom. Muslims might join them. |
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Henneberger blogged that Obama "won" the Saddleback Civil Forum, and she contributed side-by-side profiles of Cindy McCain (hit piece) and Michelle Obama (puff piece) in the October Reader's Digest, which now leans left, by the way. She love, loves, LOVES the Obamas and has lost any journalistic objectivity she had, if any, somewhere along the way. |
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"I hope he does not make a fool out of that nice Doug Kmiec, who led the pro-life charge on his behalf."
Obama said that one of the first things he wanted to do is sign the freedom of choice act. This act will undo all of the pro-life gains of the last thirty years, and go even further. The way it is written, it will REQUIRE tax money to be spent on providing abortions. It will also REQUIRE all health providers to provide abortion on demand, even for late term pregancies. Catholic, Mormon, and other pro-life churches will be forced to abandon their charitable hospitals.
Now, we're told the pro-life Obama supporters are worried that Obama might not be pro-life? Ya think?
With voters like these, who needs dead Chicagoans?
We truly live in the time of the Obama-nation and Desolation... |
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The Catholic Church was crystal clear what a vote for Obama meant. As an Evangelical pro life Christian I greatly admired the Catholic Church’s unambiguous defense of life prior to the election. Obama’s unfettered support of abortion was one of the few issues he had a clear and measurable record on. Catholics who voted for Obama certainly cannot use ignorance of his position on abortion to feign surprise when signs the Freedom of Choice Act. |
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Sorry - these obsolete concepts are going out the window as I write. You will be forced at gunpoint to serve anyone THE CHOSEN ONE wants you to serve. You have no more freedom. RESISTANCE IS FUTILE. All of you chant the praises of the dear leader together now. YES WE CAN. YES WE CAN. YES WE CAN. (YES, WE CAN force you to do anything we want you to... you surrendered your soul when you voted for the evil one).
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Any Catholic who voted for Obama (and there were many left wing useful idiots who did), can now contemplate spending eternity burning in the pit for enabling this brutal baby-killer loose on what will surely be millions and millions of babies yet to die at the hands of his minions. Good job. Really thought that one through, didn't you? |
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Where is freedom in this country when a hospital or adoption agency is not allowed to choose who they serve? Why can't they decline abortions, which is against their religion? Why can't they refuse adoptions to gays? The individual has the freedom to choose where they go for the abortion. The courts should not FORCE any non-profit agency into giving up their beliefs! |
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Are supporters of Obama having buyers remorse already? Of course he is the most EXTREME BABY KILLER on record. The info was out there for all eyes and ears to see and hear. They were just too damn lazy to pay attention, and now millions will pay the price for their ignorance.
Hope all you Obambi supporters enjoy the next four years of hell. I will be busily clinging to my guns and my religion. |
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Ms. Hennenberger is a political schizophrenic.
She supported Sen. Clinton’s run in the primaries and was subjected daily to the hissing vitriol of the ragers on the pages of HuffPo and Daily KOS.
She then published against Sen. Clinton in the latter stages of the last primaries when the fight got tough and personal.
Now, she anguishes over a tenant of the Democrat Party, (abortion on demand) and ‘hopes’ for a unification of spirit moment.
This sort of angst reveals an unsophisticated world view by one unashamed to tout it. Too little, too late.
Just embarassing.
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