"Funny, the immigration rallies we had here they were waiving American flags... as well as a few Polish and Philippine flags."
I've seen that as well. Their handlers learned from the disaster that occured the first time they held these rallies using mainly Mexican flag and no US flags.
"I served in the military with a lot of Mexican-Americans, most of whom spoke English."
The ones who don't speak English have no business being in the US military. These are foreigners recruited by the Bush regime. There is a term for such people. They are called mercenaries.
"I've noticed that the worst of the haters always seem to be from the Southwest, afraid that Mexico might do to them what they've done to Mexico... "
Yep, and not just the southwest. As more and more people here are exposed to the joys of "diversity" they discover that it isn't all that it is claimed to be. Those of us you deem "haters" don't wish to see America turned into the same sort of hell hole that Mexico and a good bit of Latin America is.
By the way, how many illegals do you employ or are you one of those multicultists?
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Who are you kidding. Even TownHall here ran picture after picture of a sea of nothing but Mexican flags. On the second march someone pointed out that it might be a good idea if they had a few American flags so they wouldn't upset the natives. Bottom line, importing dirt poor people only grows government and empowers Democrats. California used to be Reagan Country. Now it's bankrupt due to illegal aliens. |
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Funny, the immigration rallies we had here they were waiving American flags... as well as a few Polish and Philippine flags.
I served in the military with a lot of Mexican-Americans, most of whom spoke English.
I've noticed that the worst of the haters always seem to be from the Southwest, afraid that Mexico might do to them what they've done to Mexico... |
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Yes in the past immigrants came here to be Americans. They learned the language and were very patriotic. This was pushed along because during the last great immigrant wave we didn't have a welfae state. Today we've got millions of Mexicans coming here with the idea that the SW United States belongs to Mexico and there's no need for them to become Americans or assimilate. All anyone had to do is watch the immigration marches in the spring of 2007 when millions of illegals across the country were waving Mexican flags. |
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For Pimpernel, Phil and VAPat
Every wave of immigration works like this.
1) A group of people come from country X to find a better life in America.
2) Small minded bigots like you run around screaming how they are destroying the American way of life.
3) Sometimes, they get stupid politicians to pass laws to make life harder on the immigrants.
4) Immigrants assimilate, learn English, and contribute to society.
5) Boneheaded laws are revoked.
6) Fifty years later, school kids read about it in their history books, and wonder how people could be such jerks.
Just so you know which slope you're on. |
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Both want Open Borders. Both want full Amnesty. Both will not build the fence. Both will wotk to continue to give America away to Immigration Law Breakers.
Thats why I am-Writing A Name In-in November and this is from an Elected Delegate to the Republician State Convention. I do not expect to be elected to the National Convention because I will not bow down to the McCain Doctrine of Amnesty, No Drilling in ANWAR...
Writing A Name In in November |
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Hawkins dumping McCain in that way is huge. I can feel the ground moving beneath my feet. I have a feeling McCain may have a hard time surviving the GOP convention (assuming the NRC has found the money to stage one). Dump McCain! |
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"JoeB, you ARE the biggest Dummy"
You are not a con and not even a Republican so quit the pretense. You're a Dem/lib.
The GOP voted FOR Civil Rights, dumdum.
Strom Thurmond was a Dem until 1964 and switched TO the GOP which voted FOR Civil Rights. The Dem party BLOCKED efforts to pass it. Moron.
Jesse Helms? How about Robert Byrd? silly.
And which party has passed the legislation that destroys families? And mostly black families? fool.
And as for asking an African American which party is for them and which has tried to ruin them, I'll ask my wife. Tool.
btw- we are neither of us Repubs anymore. We are conservatives.
please don't type anymore..."
Yeah, Newsmax, that's a reliable source, bucko...
I don't disagree with you that Liberal social policy has been a disaster for poor communities. It doesn't take away from the fact that when Democrats finally got out of the way in the schoolhouse door, SOME republicans foolishly took their place.
Oh, I'm still waiting for you to explain to me how your brand of conservatism can't seem to win the nomination. No doubt, you will enlighten me with your brilliance... NOT!
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I think you should introduce a new series for your blog: "Great Moments in the History of Keeping Quiet!" Who better than a librarian. I recommend the Get Smart episode: "The Cone of Silence". Maybe JoeB will get the message. |
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Ryan writes:He certainly understands the modern GOP's three main priorities- Israel, Mexico and Wall Street. As for serving the US interest he couldn't care less"
No kidding. Cheap subsidized labor--ie---corporate welfare for the big campaign donations. Endless wars for Israel. Iraq has been such a huge success the NeoCons now want to attack Iran. Chuck Baldwin and Bob Barr are looking better every day. Hell, Obama might be better than Juan Insane.
" |
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You are not a con and not even a Republican so quit the pretense. You're a Dem/lib.
The GOP voted FOR Civil Rights, dumdum.
http://archive.newsmax.com/archives/articles/2002/12/13/194 350.shtml
Strom Thurmond was a Dem until 1964 and switched TO the GOP which voted FOR Civil Rights. The Dem party BLOCKED efforts to pass it. Moron.
Jesse Helms? How about Robert Byrd? silly.
And which party has passed the legislation that destroys families? And mostly black families? fool.
And as for asking an African American which party is for them and which has tried to ruin them, I'll ask my wife. Tool.
btw- we are neither of us Repubs anymore. We are conservatives.
please don't type anymore... |
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“Senator Kennedy and I tried very hard to get immigration reform, a comprehensive plan, through the Congress of the United States,” he said.
On this one point I absolutely believe McCain. In other things he is a congenital liar. He certainly understands the modern GOP's three main priorities- Israel, Mexico and Wall Street. As for serving the US interest he couldn't care less.
The states need to follow the lead of GA, AZ and OK. The illegals will self deport if enough pressure is placed upon them. |
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John McCain has not changed his mind about "Comprehensive Immigration Reform", amnesty, at all.
http://townhall.com/columnists/AmandaCarpenter/2008/03/28/b loggers_press_mccain_adviser_on_immigration
“John McCain’s position on immigration is very clear and this a question that gets asked at townhall appearances everyday in media appearances and has answered the question at least a thousand times before the New Hampshire primary,” Schmidt said.
He explained, “Any person who supports John McCain’s campaigns is a subscriber to John McCain’s views"
A vote for McCain is a vote for surrender of your country.
Your vote for McCain will be used as proof that you want amnesty.
Many of us see another amnesty as the end of the Republic, the stampede it will set off will be overwhelming. If we don't stop the inundation none of the rest matters. We'll be a banana republic before the jihadis can get us. There will never be another GOP president or Congressional majority. Importing voters for the socialists is as stupid as it gets.
McCain keeps saying "Secure the border first". We know that he means amnesty next. The plan is to get the border state Gov's to declare the border secure. Conveniently, they are all on board the cheap labor express. Then his good friend Ted Kennedy will bring back McCain/Kennedy and McCain can provide his good friends across the aisle with their new permanent majority.
I will not vote for amnesty.
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We the People of the United States of America have the right to have our borders and our laws respected and enforced.
Citizens of other countries illegally in our country have no right to demand anything from our government. They most certainly have the right to petition the governments of their home countries for change if they are unhappy with their home country. If they want to be Americans, we have a path to citizenship, more generous than any other nation, and it starts in their home country.
We need to insist on the equal protection, application and enforcement of the law or devolve into anarchy. Our Republic only functions if everyone follows the same rules. We should not change the laws to accomodate those breaking them.
If America annouces to the world "We can't stop you, so come on in" with another amnesty, the deluge will be overwhelming. If 3,000 a day didn't get your attention, then wait until it's 10,000 a day. We cannot sustain this influx and survive as a nation. We must speak up and speak to each other about this and not let false claims of racism or bigotry be used to intimidate us into silent assent. America is not Congress' to give away. America belongs to We the People. Speak to your neighbors, speak to your coworkers, but please speak up to your Congressmen and Senators. It's O.K. for us to enforce our laws, no really, it is.
Someone please tell Sen. McCain. |
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Two words
Strom Thrumond. A GOP Senator who tried to block every civil rights law while hiding the fact he had fathered a daughter on a black woman.
Two more words
Jesse Helms- Kept getting re-elected by race-baiting.
Two more words-
Southern Strategy - When the Democrats had a split between Conservative southerners who opposed civil rights and nothern liberals who supported them, Nixon and other GOP leaders exploited the breach.
Ask an African AMerican which party is for them, and which party opposed them. Maybe you can cite something from the library that supports your position, but the record of the above is far louder in their ears. We've blown it, and you want to blow it again. |
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JoeB, you're ignorant. GOP and Civil Rights? Are you retarded? Have you attended school at all? Public libraries are free if you want to learn history.
And cons love people who come here to be Americans. It is true we don't want this country to become Mexico but we also don't want it to become France or Sweden either. And, if you'll notice, illegals who come here from Mexico obviously feel the same way.
From now on, I can ignore your posts since you're stuck on stupid.
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"...we can completely give that constituency to the Democrats."
We? Come on Joe, we know you are an agent provocateur and not one of us. And that "Klansman" line, right out of Apparatchik's Guide to Discourse and AgitProp. You are as obvious as Comrade Kimberly, but not nearly as entertaining. lol"
Right, because clearly, everyone who doesn't cling to your xenophobic hatred of Mexicans is obviously a Democrat. Oh, maybe you can explain to me, if all Conservatives agree with you, how the top two winners in the GOP primaries where McCain and Huckabee, who actually support sensible immigration reform? (It's a rhetorical question, I know you can't.)
Seriously, I worry. The GOP blew its chances with African Americans by not getting on the right side of civil rights issues, even though nearly every Republican will tell you they were on the wrong side of history on that one. Now it seems we have people like VA Pat and Phil and yourself who want to repeat the same mistake with hispanics. They are going to become citizens, eventually. They are an increasing percentage of our population. And people like you want to alienate them (no pun intended.) |
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You lose credibility calling cons Nazis and Klansmen for wanting criminals to obey the law. |
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"...we can completely give that constituency to the Democrats."
We? Come on Joe, we know you are an agent provocateur and not one of us. And that "Klansman" line, right out of Apparatchik's Guide to Discourse and AgitProp. You are as obvious as Comrade Kimberly, but not nearly as entertaining. lol |
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Okay, you've sold me. Let's make them all legal. Then they'll go home, right? |
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...are NO LONGER illegal- they WILL demand a fair living wage.
THIS MAKES THEM NO LONGER VALUABLE TO BUSINESS.
Only ILLEGAL slave labor works for business- there MUST ALWAYS BE ILLEGAL labor to hold down American wages. |
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Sam writes: "Reagan granted amnesty to 1.7 million in 1986. How can we hold McCain to a standard that even The Great One did not meet?"
The thing is, Sam, SOME OF US LEARN FROM OUR MISTAKES. |
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Face it, it's time for conservatives to dump McCain and focus on helping the GOP maintain at least 45 Senators to stop Obama and the Democrats in 2009-10. The defeat of McCain will breath new life into the GOP and we can storm back in Nov of 2010. McCain doesn't care about conservatives or the Republican party. |
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If you gave them green cards, then the "abuses" you cry crocadile tears for would end.
I simply love this. "Oh, you poor illegals, I don't want you to be slaves, so I am going to forcefully ship you back to your impoverished home country."
Actually, I'm only willing to go along with a 13 1/2 year wait because that's fair to the legal immigrants who followed the rules and immigrated the right way. No jumping in line. But once you bring them out of the shadows, the abuses you complain about will end. Providing the government actually does its job. |
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It IS the illegality that is causing the problem you dope! Thank you for FINALLY waking up! If the scheme you described was enforced, these immigrants would no longer be cheap and vulnerable to being abused. What makes them so desirable to employers is that they can be treated like slaves knowing the government will only enforce the employers' end of the deal while these immigrants will have no one to complain to while they are under constant threat of being deported at the say so of the employer if they complain. Living like that on the 13 1/2-year "pathway to citizenship" is an insult to anyone who has any sense of right and wrong. We "needed" the black slaves too but people back then found their moral compass and walked away from it spilling a lot of blood in the process.
Why just don't you just stick to your anti-Mormon bigotry. For you to call anyone of being a Nazi for wanting borders enforced is absurd. |
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Reagan granted amnesty to 1.7 million in 1986. How can we hold McCain to a standard that even The Great One did not meet? |
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"Listen up McCainiacs
Here in CA, our budget deficit has climbed past $20 billion. The cost to accommodate illegals last year was over $30 billion. The state itself is forecasting that that amount will TRIPLE in the next six years. Arnold is talking about securitizing the state lottery (selling to private interests who will pay out some of the future take but give the state a huge up-front payment). Pensions for state workers are two years away from collapsing and it is INEVITABLE (that is not an exaggeration). Meanwhile, these people are taking their pensions and moving out of state. These are real problems and CANNOT be solved. Yet we are subsidizing importing third-world poverty to compete not only against our poorest people, but eventually against YOU!
So go ahead and call those of us who want the government to enforce the law bigots. You guys are too stupid and determinedly ignorant to take seriously."
Well, it seems to me that if you legalize them, they can demand that their employers provide health insurance, which they should be doing, anyway. And they'd be paying their fair share in income taxes if they were above board.
It's their legality that is causing the problem, not the fact that they are here. Maybe they cost your state 30 Billion in benefits, but I bet the generate far more than that in revenue and sales taxes.
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"Put very simply: John McCain is a liar. He's a man without honor, without integrity, who could not have captured the Republican nomination had he run on making comprehensive immigration a top priority of his administration. Quite frankly, this is little different from George Bush, Sr. breaking his "Read my lips, no new taxes pledge," except that Bush's father was at least smart enough to wait until he got elected before letting all of his supporters know that he was lying to them.
Under these circumstances, I simply cannot continue to support a man like John McCain for the presidency. Since that is the case, I have already written the campaign and asked them to take me off of their mailing list and to no longer send me invitations to their teleconferences. I see no point in asking questions to a man who has no compunction about lying through his teeth on one of the most crucial election issues and then changing his position the first time he believes he can get away with it." John Hawkins, Right Wing News
http://www.rightwingnews.com/mt331/2008/05/why_i_will_no_lo nger_support_j.php
John- I could not agree more. I'm votin' Lou Dobbs.
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People from "everywhere" might be coming here, but the vast majority of them are coming from Mexico. We can only complain about reality. Just because it is politically incorrect doesn't lessen the problem. This is OUR country and many of us, including myself, are LEGAL immigrants or children of LEGAL immigrants. Are you a professional criminal or something? How can you be so willfully ignorant? If we were being flooded by 40 million Eskimos, do you thing that would be better? Or 40 million Russian mafioso? It's not about race. It's about numbers and crushing poverty and YOU are going to pay for it. |
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Here in CA, our budget deficit has climbed past $20 billion. The cost to accommodate illegals last year was over $30 billion. The state itself is forecasting that that amount will TRIPLE in the next six years. Arnold is talking about securitizing the state lottery (selling to private interests who will pay out some of the future take but give the state a huge up-front payment). Pensions for state workers are two years away from collapsing and it is INEVITABLE (that is not an exaggeration). Meanwhile, these people are taking their pensions and moving out of state. These are real problems and CANNOT be solved. Yet we are subsidizing importing third-world poverty to compete not only against our poorest people, but eventually against YOU!
So go ahead and call those of us who want the government to enforce the law bigots. You guys are too stupid and determinedly ignorant to take seriously. |
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Since you seem to be able to discuss this issue rationally, as opposed to VA Klansman, I will engage...
I agree, before any discussion of amnesty occurs, we need to secure the border. We also need to establish a national ID program where employers can immediately determine if a worker has the right to work in this country.
Any Path to citizenship should stop "chain migration". We need to clarify the law to stop anchor babies.
Nor do I think it should be a blanket Amensty. We should review each person on a case-by-case basis. If you have a good recommendation from your employer and people in your community speak well of you, then you should be considered for citizenship. If you've been commiting crimes and sopping off the dole since you got here, you're going home. It should be merit based.
That said, realistically, we aren't going to round up 12-20 million people, and they aren't going to self-deport. We simply don't have the jail space, or the infrastructure to do that. We also have to understand exactly what caused this problem to start with, restrictive immigration laws that only admitted highly skilled labor, not the unskilled labor the economy actually needs and most Americans don't really want to work. |
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Absolutely correct. There are currently over 35,000 Chinese nationals with deportation orders that the Chinese gov't. refuses take back. There are many illegal aliens from terrorist countries. We made citizens of some of those responsible for the WTC bombing in 1993 with the 1986 amnesty. How many terrorists do YOU want to make U.S. citizens? |
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why is it illigal immigrant is applied only to Mexicans-hispanics. Wake up people they are fom everywhere. Diseases and viruses we have not had are brought in affecting the health of us all. Legal entrance requires SHOTS!
Do you think they all come to work? Be realistic.
If they can't work, don't recieve welfare and cannot get housing they would have no choice to leave on their own. If they cannot get home on their own come in and say so. Buying a bus or plane ticket would be cheaper than supporting them and keep them from living on the streets or turning to crime. Whadda ya say to that,huh? What part of that isn't fair or inhumane. Apply to come back. It wouldn't take so long for those applications to go through if we were not dealing with illigals.
It would be better for everyone all around it is that simple. Build the fence now! Cost?that's hooey and we all know it.Congress has been on a spending spree for years why not spend on something we need?! |
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When he said he heard us. He never has had any intention of enforcing the laws, securing the border or defending the country.
We were lied to in 1965. We should not undertake any immigration reform until Ted Kennedy is gone. He is largely responsible for the 1965 legislation that led to the 1986 amnesty that led to last years amnesty. Before 1965 we allowed approx. 250,000 people in legally each year. He told us we would not have a million each year, we do. Legally. We also have a million a year coming in illegally which was supposed to have been fixed by the one time only amnesty of 1986. Author: Ted Kennedy. We were lied to in 1986. we are being lied to now.
JOHN MCCAIN, YOU NEED A NEW HEARING AID |
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What you don't say is that the first step for Americans is "not" comprehensive immigration reform. It's to first get control of the border and over this massive migration into the US. If we can demonstrate that, then we can then deal more realistically with those here. However, if we don't, then it's all irrelevant. I think its a shell game - to be frank. We will never put the money up to clearly control the border, and we will never put up enough money to hire enough INS officials to process 12 million to 20 million people. Do you have any idea of what kind of bureaucracy that would create? We couldn't even get enough passports issued to "US Citizens" so they could travel into Canada and Mexico.
Not a single proposal in Congress remotely deals with these realities. INS is backed up already by three to five years in some areas - and that's for people with green cards wanting to become US Citizens.
Congress can't remotely deal with this. If it doesn't find a way to get those numbers down - meaning end employment opportunities, and deny medical care, welfare and education, which will cause this number to shrink voluntarily to some manageable size - then it will simply be a massive uneforceable joke. |
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But what is fair? We have people living here who are unregistered, have no paperwork and are not in compliance with our laws. Further, we have no real idea how many their are, nor even where many of them come from. We know that as many as 40%, and perhaps more, don't come from Mexico - for example. We also know that some 300,000 women cross the border each year to have a child - which makes the child a US citizen and gives the immediate family a fast track into the US. And, we know, that as in all groups, some % commit crimes, but since criminals use the border to shield themselves by committing crimes here and then immediately go back to Mexico, we don't know the real extent of the problem. Indeed, how could we? We can't even identify them. And, since hospitals cannot ask for proof of citizenship, we also don't know just what the cost of emergency and follow up care is for those who are not citizens.
And, how do you realistically sort out those that have "been here awhile", from those that haven't? What we do know is that if we extend citizenship to this amorphous mass of 12 million to 20 million (pick a number), then that group, as happened before, can use our laws to continue to bring in other family members over time. At the same time, we also know that if we don't secure the border, then the world's population combined with poverty will continue to drive the same number of illegals into the US, year after year. In another 10 years, there will be another 10 million illegals.
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Get used to it, man, pretty soon white folks are going to be a minority group in this country...
Which no doubt gives you screaming fits every night...
Me, I dont really care, people are people. |
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Some should stay, provided they learn English, work, and have not been criminals, and are willing to assimilate on a path to citizenship. Claiming that merely coming here illegally makes them criminals is wrong when we have had a de facto system that encourages them to come for the last twenty years. We should have more legal immigration with the goal of assimilation.
The issue here is stopping more illegal immigration in the future. It is easy to say just step up enforcement and demand everyone illegal should go. But there is insufficient political will for the later position because it will end up causing more harm than good. Comprehensive immigration reform should include comprehensive enforcement (and that is the critical component of all of this) but poltically will involve some illegals getting to stay. |
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JoeB131 writes: Wednesday, May, 14, 2008 12:52 PM
Viva Atzlan, baby!
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Your hysterical mutterings about illegal immigrants aren't selling. The majority WANT immigration reform and they want people who've been here a while to have a path to citizenship. Poll after poll has shown this.
I would rather have Hispanics see that we were the ones being fair then the ones stopping them. Otherwise, we can completely give that constituency to the Democrats. |
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With all due respect. If the GOP thinks they can continue to import cheap labor for their donors at the expense of the citizens, they will. I will not vote for that again. If we continue to play the game of "the other guy is worse", we will lose our country. Sorry, but I will not participate in that game any longer. The GOP power brokers think we will vote for "anybody but a Democrat" so they can continue to ignore securing the borders and enforcing the laws. I was hoping GOP primary voters would give the party elites some surprises in the primaries. We never really got the chance. First choice Hunter, second choice Thompson, third choice Romney were all out before VA voted. I wanted to vote for a GOP candidate in Nov.'08, I will not vote for any amnesty supporter. If it takes crushing the GOP so a new party representing American citizens can arise, so be it.
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We need Comprehensive Immigration Enforcement, not reform. We need to restore respect for the law and the faith of the American people that their government is not selling them out. Amnesty for the illegal aliens is also amnesty for the corrupt companies who have been employing them. Money trumps everything, including love of country. Multi-nationals have no loyalty to country by definition, they see us as a market, not a nation. They see people as workers, documented or undocumented, no difference. If they can't send the work to where the labor is cheaper, then they want to bring the cheap labor here. If citizenship becomes meaningless, this is no longer The United States of America.
If we love our Constitution and our representative Republic and we intend to keep it we must not surrender our sovereignty or abandon the rule of law. Profits must not supercede security. We should not create a new path to citizenship. We have a path to citizenship, more generous than any other country, illegal aliens have ignored it and bad choices do have consequences. |
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