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Friday, June 15, 2007
Losing the Future
Posted by: Michael Medved at 10:00 PM

Friday’s Wall Street Journal reported more alarming news for the Republican Party: according to the new WSJ/NBC Poll, Hispanics now identify themselves as Democrats rather than Republicans by a horrifyingly lopsided margin of 51% to 21%.

 

This reflects a collapse of Hispanic support for Republicans since 2004, when Bush nearly matched John Kerry in the Latino community, 45% to 55%.

 

Senator Mel Martinez, an ardent advocate of comprehensive immigration reform and Chairman of the Republican National Committee, tried to put the best possible spin on the new figures. He told the Journal that “a skillful 2008 Republican candidate can recover ground because ‘Hispanics tend to personalize politics’ rather than identify with parties.”

 

One can only hope that he’s right, and the Republicans avoid the obvious disaster of nominating anyone who has flirted with the anti-immigrant rhetoric so popular at the moment among conservatives. But even if the Presidential nominee can win back some of the lost ground among Latinos, that doesn’t necessarily mean progress for candidates on the rest of the ballot or on national efforts to recapture the House and the Senate.

 

The new poll should come as a sobering reminder that the current hysteria against “illegal aliens” (and even opposition to further legal immigration by Tom Tancredo and his followers) is helping to alienate the most rapidly growing ethnic segment of the American electorate.

 

Hispanics now represent at least 14% of the US population and the strong majority of these people have immigrated legally, or else they’re native born. Even if all the illegals went home in the next few years (fat chance), and even if we stopped all future immigration from Hispanic countries (both legal and illegal), Latinos would still rapidly increase their political influence and power. For one thing, their high marriage and birth rates means a growing population and, for another, every year more legal immigrants manage to complete the naturalization process to become citizens (and voters).  

 

In recent years, Republicans have managed to remain a competitive party in most states of the union in part because they have successfully competed for Latino support. If, on the other hand, we ever reached the situation where 80% of Hispanics automatically, unthinkingly, voted for Democrats (in addition to the more than 80% of African-Americans who automatically, unthinkingly vote for Democrats), then we will never again see a GOP president, or a Republican majority in either House of Congress.

 

Sure, Republicans might still win occasional local fights in Utah or Nebraska or Alabama, but they would become just as irrelevant in national terms as they are today in the State of California. The anti-immigrant posturing of former Governor Pete Wilson in 1994 helped transform the nation’s largest state from a battleground that Republicans often won (with strong Hispanic support) into an-all-but uncontested Democratic fiefdom where only a GOP anomaly like Arnold the Governator (with his outspoken record of sympathy and support for his fellow immigrants) can secure enough Latino backing to prevail.

 

Despite the courageous reform efforts of far-sighted Republican Senators and of President Bush, the loudest voices in the GOP currently speak in strident, angry, desperate, uncompromising and unmistakably anti-immigrant tones. In the midst of our ongoing debates, all those who care at all about the party’s future ought to keep in mind that the nation’s more than 40 million Latinos are avidly listening.   



View in ascending order View in descending order
nomi writes: Friday, June, 29, 2007 12:15 AM
The Truth
Who is it that said the truth shall set you free?
Roy writes: Thursday, June, 28, 2007 10:05 AM
Do you read the comments Michael?
Michael -
I wonder if you or one of your staffers actually read the replies to your blogs. I know that you are an extremely busy person, however, I think that your listeners are overwhelmingly against you. I think that Dennis Prager is wrong for calling you brave, I think you are being stupid on this bill. You stated there is no guarantee that the bill will be good, well that is unacceptable to me, and to the hundreds of million "LEGAL" Americans who oppose the bill. You made the analogy how 8 of the 10 Seattle Mariners were immigrants, and how we cheer for these people. The Cuban national is not given maps or a motor boat to get to this country, so I can empathize with his arrival, much as I could with any individual trying to escape from a country, where you can be shot for trying to leave, that I can forgive, however when other governments are getting rid of their trash, I take exception. You and Dennis both FAILED to address, the amendment that was voted down that said if you are a felon and here illegally you need to go away. You both FAILED to discuss how congress has even stated that it will only slow illegals by 25%, once again an unacceptable number. You say 15 years to become legal, what a bunch of crap, I can't believe that you believe that would happen. Sorry, I am that cynical, and I have lost faith in our crappy government. Tell me why we should believe. I so desperately loath the left that I would rather our nation rip itself apart and rebuild, than continue on this current path awaiting Jihad, or being overrun by Mexicans.

Roy
nomi writes: Wednesday, June, 27, 2007 8:46 PM
Clarification
I apologize the lumping data was in regards to prison statistics. Also, what Michael Medved said is that most illegals are in prison for just immigration infractions and maybe some drugs. What? I thought the police didn't arrest for immigration status and are not allowed to ask if someone is a citizen.
nomi writes: Wednesday, June, 27, 2007 4:01 PM
Erroneous or Purposely Misleading
He fails to address how future illegal immigration will stop. The incentive of people to come foward and go through the rigorous 24 hour test. The administrative costs of the lengthy background checks for 12-20 million people. The administrative cost of the "fines" and schooling verification. The deportation of those who don't come foward. He does address that there is a goody that attract illegals, jobs. Doesn't adequately describe how this bill would stop an employer from hiring ilegally this crop of illegals or subsequent crops. Does not address the true honey or even broach the true honey that attracts to the tune of 3.5 times their employment income, medical of all sorts, automatic citizenship for childred, SSI for each child, foodstamps... This is how he adddressed prison statistics One of the clever things Medved did was lump illegal and legal together as a group. True immigrants for sure would be under represented they have gone through the process. They don't get in without following the law and being checked out. Why did Medved include legal immigrants. This is the point all newcomers should pass the vigorous screen of immigrants, this is normally more than 24 hours. I agree with Pragers caller and do say the selling the amnesty is a character defect.

Nice try with the fairness doctrine, however I am not distracted. Also, would love to listen to MMs reaction to the question of whether MM is getting anything from selling this bill like a cabinet position. Could just see the face.
Brianbnc writes: Wednesday, June, 27, 2007 12:05 PM
Amnesty
I find it ironically entertaining that folks like MM are trying to get us to embrace illegals for the vote factor. Excuse me. If they are not in this country in the first place, why do we care?

Borders can be secured. Illegals can be removed. Period.

I live in Tucson. Or should I say lil Meheeco. You have no clue as to the devastating affect of illegals until you try to live here.

For those that don't understand why our borders are open, here it is:
Business owners do not care about cheap labor. That's a ruse. A distraction. What they want is people to buy cheap products. They DO NOT CARE where the money comes from, as long as cheap junk-items sells. These Government officials already have large stakes in these corporations. All of them. They will make a ton of money from 20million more buyers of cheap crap. Who cares if they have a job? Welfare money is just as good as a paycheck when illegal-legals are spending it to buy worthless stuff.

The scam is: The Gov takes YOUR money Via taxes. They will give that money to newly legalized unemployable 3rd world rejects in the form of welfare. They will market ever plastic piece worthless widget know to man to the illegal-legals. Then they collect the money Via corporate revenues.

PS - My wife and I changed our party affiliation yesterday. We are now independents. Under no circumstance will we donate money or vote for any of our current representatives. We are no longer represented in this form of government.
nomi writes: Saturday, June, 23, 2007 1:52 AM
Phony
The spelling is phony as in phony balogna bill.
nomi writes: Friday, June, 22, 2007 10:19 PM
Many Are Shocked by Medveds Stance
It is Medved who would probably use as proof of something being wrong by the people that agree with it. Liberal groups of all sorts La Raza and communist party USA and all the other lefty groups, Ted Kennedy, and Republicans who are normally charecterized as Rhinos. All the sudden though all these groups and people are "brave" according to Medved and the listeners he has been courting are as agreed to by Medved loud. Why else would he be fatigued because we are silent. Maybe he will join Hilary and Boxer and lobby for a "legislative solution" as he does for the amnesty. Is Michael Medved a phonie? Or do you spell it foney?
GOPsaver writes: Thursday, June, 21, 2007 2:07 AM
GenXdad
Instead of doing Brain Damage over a simple problem. Here is a simple solution for you.

Here is a single page Law to solve the Illegal Alien Issue once and for all. Any elected Office holder is welcome to steal it and use it as their own. Yes we can move twelve million illegal aliens back to Mexico by making them want to go back on their own.

1st. Any Corporation or Company who hires and Illegal Alien (notice I left out the word knowingly) shall face a fine of $250,000.00 per Illegal Alien hired and the CEO, CFO, Owner, and person who hired the Illegal Alien shall spend no less then three months in Jail. Time to be served in the County where the offence against the Legal Citizens of the USA occurred.

No person, Corporation, or non-profit group shall hire, rent or lease to, sell an automobile to, or pay money owed to any Illegal Alien. Each offence shall incur a penalty of no less then $250,000.00 dollars and three months in jail levied against the CEO, CFO, Owner, and or persons in the County where the offence against the Citizens of the USA occurred.

Should a CEO, CFO, Owner, or persons be in violation of the Solving the Illegal Alien Law have no ability to pay fines. Jail time will be extended accordingly and property sized. Bankrupt Laws shall not apply to any guilty party or entity due to failure to pay fines.

The USA is a Super Power and Mexico is a sh;t hole.

A law should be passed to protect American Citizens living in the United States of America stating that each time an American is killed by an Illegal Alien from Mexico. 100 square miles of Land will be taken from Mexico along the Mexican boarder with the United States and used as a buffer zone to enforce and protect the Boarder of the United States of America and it's Citizens from the dangerous Illegal Aliens from Mexico

And there goes 20 million Illegal Aliens back to their home.
GOPsaver writes: Thursday, June, 21, 2007 2:01 AM
GenXdad
Have you taken the time to read any of my posts?

I have written the solution and it is not very hard to do.

Why all of the Brain Damage over simple problems?
nomi writes: Wednesday, June, 20, 2007 8:33 PM
Who Is Part of The Deport Them All Crowd
Where is the hatred towards fellow man? I see disrespect and disregard for ones neighbor by Mexico. I also see Americans who are selling this bill doing so without caring about the quality of life for all Americans future and present. Being a dad you should care about the America you leave your son. You know how they say Hitler was able to get so far? Because "good" people said nothing and didn't bother to get educated about what was really in Hitler's regime bills of its time and government. Inform yourself dad. And respect people who respect others. Don't fall into the "hate" propoganda. Its sad if you fall for the Linsey Graham and those who mimic him disengenuous calling of others bigots.
GenXDad writes: Wednesday, June, 20, 2007 6:38 PM
Good post, scary replies
I'm not in favor of the current bill because it doesn't so enough about the fence. But as far as the "deport them all" crowd - count me OUT!

Do you know what it would take to find, process and deport 12 million people, if it were even possible? Do you really think Hispanics are such terrible people deserving of comparisons to Al Qaida?

It's one thing to oppose a bad bill, but quite another to show so much hatred toward your fellow man.
fedup writes: Wednesday, June, 20, 2007 11:39 AM
He's out of it.
So, the Republicans lose support from Latino's...they really never had much to start with. Legal immigrants are against this S1348, and almost all American citizens are against it.
Which is better, lose your base or lose illegal, lawbreakers votes!

This Country is made up of more people, than Latino's, yet this is the only group they talk about!

Mexico and other countries should be told to start taking care of their own, they have rich elite that refuse to be responsible, yet they send them here for Americans to "fund"!

Well I'm sick of it. We need to demand Mexico take on their own responsibility.

It is not up to American tax payers to "fund" the entire world!
nomi writes: Tuesday, June, 19, 2007 9:11 PM
Behind the Fraudulent Bill
Is it our fault that most illegals are Mexican and are encouraged by Mexico like no other country to abuse our system? Yes by numbers and because of the Mexican government and all those agents of the Mexican government and United Nations over US Sovereignty people(whether disguised or openly so)most illegals are from Mexico. But not all Mexicans are illegal and there are a lot of illegals from all countries, but to deny that MS-13 exists and hospitals are going bankrupt from people speaking only Spanish using the emergency rooms and maternity healthcare... is absurd. This is occuring and those immigrants from Mexico that came here legally are just as pissed. I would never lump any Hispanic with those who are here illegaly. There are all types on both sides. But there is an absolute truth of the matter. If you don't care for the US, or you care more about creating your own dynasty at the expense of others who work an honest days work support this bill. It is wrong for Mexico to do this, it is an attempt to reconquer with the help of greedy Americans in power. It is a hostile tresspass. It is not wrong for people to note what they see with their own eyes and hard earned money. So chill Flaming one.
57parrothead writes: Tuesday, June, 19, 2007 8:08 PM
I've Got News For You Michael...
Poor people don't vote for Republicans, no matter how much they believe in God or love their children.

Now then, Medved seems more concerned about the future of the GOP than, oh let's say, the future of the country. Well, don't sweat it Mike. As you've said many times, we have a two party system, and that's not changing anytime soon. The problem is that 20 years from now, we'll have a GOP that basically a socialist party, and a Democratic party that is essentially communist. The conservatives are going to be left out in the cold.
Flaming Liberal Multiculturalist writes: Tuesday, June, 19, 2007 8:04 PM
It's Not Just About The Law
Wayfarer:
"I'm certain that no reasonable American citizen (in the true sense of the term "citizen") wants to see 12 million criminals get a free pass from the federal government"

Yes, I'm responding to something Wayfarer wrote, even after I said it was a waste of time. Perhaps it's because so many other people say this kind of thing. It seems like every set of responses to any TH column on the Immigration Reform Bill has roughly the same pattern of rhetoric, where two or three posters inveigh against those lazy beaner furriners who are going to come over here and all go on welfare and drop
their babies on American soil so they're citizens
just in time for them to all join gangs, and then there is another poster who says something like "This isn't an issue of RACISM or PREJUDICE or HATRED! Oh no, we're simply outraged at the lack of respect shown to our laws!..."

Sorry, but that "respect for our laws" stuff doesn't pass the smell test. What if I told you that every day I see a huge population of criminals who blatantly, fragrantly, DISRESPECT OUR LAWS with IMPUNITY, and are NEVER punished? I'm there in the righthand lane, staying as close to 55 as I can w/o some tractor-trailer crawling up my butt, and they're all out there just ZIPPING by at 70, 80, sometimes even 90!! In a year they KILL FAR more Americans than all the undocumented workers... What? You don't care?? You aren't going to post minutemen with radar guns?? But, but---they're DISRESPECTING OUR LAWS!!?!?!?!

Well, OK, let's go higher profile than that. The Boland amendment was a Federal Act of Congress, and a man named Ollie North basically dropped his pants and took a big, stinky dump all over it, so of course you all hate and vilify him as someone who DISRESPECTS OUR LAWS, right... Wait a minute! Why are you all fighting to be first in line to kiss his Rear End every time he makes a public appearance!!?!?!?!?!! He had to run to the ACLU to stay out of jail, even!!

Well, you'll pardon me if I smell B.S. in that claim that "it's all about respecting our laws".
Right in Seattle writes: Tuesday, June, 19, 2007 7:49 PM
Illegal Aliens in scare quotes
I see that Michael is now putting Illegal Aliens in scare quotes. Oh, brother.

I want proof that the federal government will actually enforce the immigration laws it passes. I gess that makes me one of the racists Sen. Lindsay Graham described, when he said that opposing this bill is equivalent to posting a sign in your business reading, "Irish, Catholic or blacks need not apply".
Right in Seattle writes: Tuesday, June, 19, 2007 7:44 PM
Mexican immigrants will vote big gov't
When the Republicans & Democrats pass, then enforce everything BUT the punitive measures in the so-called Comprehensive Immigration Reform Bill, who will the newly minted Americans (who also happen to be those most likely to be using gov't funded social services in the Border States) vote for? Democrats, who want to increase gov't funded programs? Or Republicans, who want to cut those programs?

Go ahead and take your time. I know that's a tough question.
Right in Seattle writes: Tuesday, June, 19, 2007 7:34 PM
Look at California
If you think being soft on ILLEGAL immigration is good for Republicans, then why do Republicans do so poorly in California?
Flaming Liberal Multiculturalist writes: Tuesday, June, 19, 2007 7:15 PM
Wayfinder Has Lost His Way
Wayfinder writes:
"When the going gets rough, I suppose it's time to take the easy route and quit. The War on Terror is too hard, so let's call it a quagmire and quit."

I'm not even go to try to reason with anybody who still thinks the Iraq debacle ever had anything to do with the War on Terror.
nomi writes: Tuesday, June, 19, 2007 6:56 PM
Where Did All the Lobby Funds Go?
Michael, correct me if I am wrong. Combined the Chamber of Commerce and La Raza in the year 2006 spent over $200 million lobbying for what they call "immigration reform." I call it the faux immigration reform. Where did all those funds go, politicians? I think not, most definitely all agressive campaigns include the media. By the way San Diego had it own poll that Medved can use. The questions were blatantly leading and selective informaton was used to hit the same media that campaigned against the war in an unfair way. Lets see if Medved uses this poll and see for yourself the actual questions. This was a poll sponsored by the Chamber of Commerce. Some of the questions were asked to only half of the 600 people that participated. This bill will in no way shape or form deter any future illegal aliens but only encourage illegal entry for immediate legalization.
GOPsaver writes: Tuesday, June, 19, 2007 4:02 PM
Mr. President, tear down that fence!
http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=56236


And Mike, you just lost!
GOPsaver writes: Tuesday, June, 19, 2007 1:44 PM
Another Thing About California Mike.
Sense 1976 in California

Socialist (d) tell us we do not have enough water to wash our cars and water our lawns in California.

We are told we do not have enough energy and we have to out bid the people of other States to buy their energy driving the price up for them.

They tell us our schools are broke and we have Bond after Bond along with Tax hike after Tax Hike.

Our Hospitals are going broke.

Socialist (d) here tell us we do not have enough affordable housing and must have rent control in many places.

But when the subject of Illegal Aliens comes up we in California are the land of plenty?

I have never had a person with a .08 alcohol blood level hit my car. But we have been hit twice by Illegal Aliens. One who came from the opposite direction across three lanes hitting my wife who was sitting still spinning her 180 degrees. He could not speak a lick of English for damage of well over $9,000.00 and a lesser car my wife would have been killed.

You do not want California as your model for the USA Mike.

The only question I see at this time is will Mexico be happy with California, Arizona, New Mexico, and Texas or will the Mexicans want the entire Burrito?




jpmn writes: Tuesday, June, 19, 2007 1:16 PM
Love your Program Michael
But you are 100% wrong on this issue. Illegals will continue to support those that hand them cash.
GOPsaver writes: Tuesday, June, 19, 2007 12:58 PM
Mike Medved.
I have lived in California sense 1964. Moved here when I was 2 years old.

Many places in California are Americas version of Tijuana. Where we have high Illegal Alien numbers we have the high crime numbers. Want you car stolen? Park in Stockton, Bakerfield, Fresno, San Diego, or East L.A. Funny how those areas are also the highest numbers of Illegal Aliens in California.

What part of American Law are you unable to understand? I do not agree with .08 being a DWI but I live by that Law. I do not agree that a 80cc mottocross bike is a gross polluter, as Algore fly's around burning 30,000 gallons of jet fuel in a single day. California passes 1200 new laws per year. I can not name ten of them but, you can bet I will have to live by them.

Where is Amnesty for American Citizens? How about Tax Amnesty? Illegal Aliens crash our Boarders which is a Felony. Why should I not get to break the Laws of the USA?

We do not call Illegal Aliens what they are, (Illegal Aliens). Now we find names more appealing like Undocumented Americans? And what are we going to call a Pedophile? Talent Scout?

Republicans lost the 06 election because the President did not make his case to the American people.
Can you name for us the mandate the democrats ran on? Democrats were elected for the simple reason they were not Republicans and that was it. Did one democrat run for Office saying they were going to gift 20 million Illegal Aliens with Amnesty?

In the polling that you use. Have you ever wondered how many of those polled are Illegal Aliens themselves? If you go South of Sacramento California you can poll Illegal Aliens all day long.

So what laws do I get to break Mike?

Yes we can send 20 million Illegal Aliens back and it would not be that hard to do. We could then bring in Legal Immigrants who show respect for our Laws as an American has to do.
religiouslib writes: Tuesday, June, 19, 2007 11:36 AM
mr. medved
i know my support will probably not help you but after living in southern california from 25 years i know from from personal experience you have it right.

what many people don't understand is that most American born of mexican descent have at least one family member who is illegal and when the discussion turns angry and bitter about illegals, the native born hispanics are insulted as well.
i work around many mexican-americans and they are extremely offended by the rhetoric found on this page. they will not vote republican for many years and many of them were republican when this debate started because they do share similar values with the republican party.
they are family oriented, church going, and hard working people.

i rarely agree with you or the President but in this case you have the rational approach and those opposed are simply out of touch with most americans and the hispanic community.
religiouslib writes: Tuesday, June, 19, 2007 11:19 AM
nomi
nomi

no that isn't what other polls do.
you can go to rasmussen or gallup or ap and they will have all the questions laid out and who they interviewed.

my major point is you can't trust either left or right media. you have to do your own research to find out if in fact they have it right.

for example, instead of relying on one poll you must try to get 4 or 5 and then see how they stack up.

as far as my nickname being an oxymoron, just what the heck are you talking about?

there are millions of Christians who are liberal or are you one of those who believes you have the only truth when it comes to God and he has told you personally that liberals can't be Christian.

sheesh
nomi writes: Tuesday, June, 19, 2007 11:07 AM
Mr. Medved
The Republican party is already destroyed. You have not answered the true social costs of this bill. Addressed the 24 hour background check and how it would be possible to do if everyone or even 1% of the people apply at once. You have quoted two bogus polls for the basis of your conclusion. These are two arguments (about which side of the debate is truly marginalized) that the election process can-- and will- settle. La Raza and Chamber of Commerce have spent over 200 million for lobbying on immigration in 2006. Did this all go to politicians alone?
Michael Medved writes: Tuesday, June, 19, 2007 10:09 AM
The One Obvious Question
I hope everyone with even a slightly open mind about this debate reads the comments posted above about my original column.

The one consistent theme appears to be that it doesn't matter if Republicans lose all chance of welcoming Hispanics to our party, since we'll more than make up for any losses among Latinos with stronger support among "anti-amnesty" white-Anglo people.

And where, precisely, do we see the evidence of that?

Can anyone name a single politician in the country-- even one -- whose career has begun to soar due to anti-illegal rage?

How's that Tom Tancredo Presidential juggernaut coming along? Duncan Hunter -- now there's a candidacy that's supercharged!

And look at California: pro-immigrant Arnold "going down in flames" while all the anti-immigrant tough guys ride public indignation straight to the top--- right? Can you identify a single "send 'em home" poser who's a viable statewide figure in the state with the largest, most troublesome, illegal population?

And last time, in 2006, all the "what-is-it-about-illegal-that-you-don't-understand?" anti-reform chest-thumpers cruised to reelection, powered by the righteous wrath of an indignant electorate? That's why all those who emphasized the immigration issue (Randy Graf, JD Hayworth, Don Goldwater, Rick Santorum, John Hostetler, many more)did so well in November (they all lost --despite the support of loyal Republicans like me -- and they lost big time, by the way).

If, despite all polls to the contrary, there really is a huge majority waiting to coalesce around any candidate who talks tough and mean on immigration (one of the posters above suggests a $250,000 federal fine for any American who sells a used car to an illegal), why hasn't it come together so far -- since the President has been talking openly and insistently about comprehensive reform (including earned legalization) since he first ran for the office in 1999?

And if that big majority doesn't really exist (I am very sure that it doesn't) and if the Republican Party proceeds to destroy itself over internal bitterness while making no progress on real reform, handing the Democrats the chance to control the process in ways that we will truly and appropriately despise, then when do the impassioned activists on the other side begin to recognize that they've alienated not just the growing Latino population but the American mainstream?

This is one argument (about which side of the debate is truly marginalized) that the election process can-- and will-- settle.

nomi writes: Monday, June, 18, 2007 10:23 PM
Religiouslib
What in the heck are you talking about? Isn't that what the Ap and all the publication do take from this and that for that. Why don't you complain about CBS? They do more than take from this and that to say that. We had to document falsehoods with CBS. Anyways, still what is your point? Do we have a list of the questions asked verbatim on the polls that Michael Medved uses? No, but we do have his admission that they asked about immigrants when they were going to use the answers for people apinions of illegal aliens. What is your opinion of a living wage Religiouslib and isn't what you call yourself an oxymoran?
religiouslib writes: Monday, June, 18, 2007 9:23 PM
gabby
first all that article is from 2001, and second of all none of the links provided work except for the one for barone.
in other words, it is conviently impossible to check on the statistics.

but here is my overriding point.
v-dare does no research on their own, they simply take articles from sources that support a certain point of view and then re-print them.

now it says 1000 spanish speakers were interviewed for the article.

what questions were asked?
how were these people chosen?
how were the questions phrased?
was there a control group of other spanish speakers used to confirm the reliability of the questions and the answers?

in other words no one can determine if this study was objective or biased which is true of all of v-dares articles.

this is not the proper way to research and determine factual information and you know it because you are smart and intelligent.

we only have a synopsis of what the author claims we have no specifics.
i could make up a study and do the same thing.
think about it.

Pasadena Phil writes: Monday, June, 18, 2007 7:41 PM
GOP never gets credit
Republicans freed slaves and pushed through Civil Rights Bill yet blacks still vote 93% Democrat. Same will happen even if Repubs get credit for the amnesty bill (assuming Medved's dubious assumptions are correct about the popularity of amnesty among legal Mexicans). Very cynical politics and another reason why Medved should stick to reviewing movies.
GOPsaver writes: Monday, June, 18, 2007 7:25 PM
Numbers from Gov. of California.
For some reason our Federal Government does not keep numbers on crime by Mexicans in America. I do know here in California that the Auto-Theft rates are high in Counties that have the most Illegal Aliens such as Fresno, Stockton, San Deigo, East L.A.

The Gov. sent me this much.

I have also encouraged federal legislation to criminalize border tunnels that are used for smuggling. Since the September 11, 2001, terror attacks, 40 transitional tunnels have been found along the U.S. border, 21 of which were on the California-Mexico border. At this year's Border Governors Conference, I continued to lead the charge in support of bills by Senator Dianne Feinstein and Congressman David Dreier that would criminalize
these dangerous access points to our nation.

The cost of incarcerating illegal aliens who commit crimes is estimated at $750 million each year, an expense California taxpayers continue to bear. I have urged, and will continue to seek, more federal funding from President Bush and the United States Congress to reimburse our state for the cost of incarcerating criminal aliens. My efforts last year led to a $100 million increase for the federal State Criminal Alien Assistance Program.

In addition, I have committed nearly 1,000 California National Guard troops to help secure our southern border. This unprecedented deployment of troops - the largest commitment of any state in the nation - has already resulted in a substantial decrease in the number of individuals who are entering California illegally and demonstrates my commitment to being part of the solution to the problem of illegal immigration.

Arnold Schwarzenegger

I would love to get a total costs to California State, Local, Insurance Loss, Property Damage, Health Care, and what ever else for the Bazillions of Illegal Aliens here.

As Socialist (d) tell us we do not have enough water to wash our cars and water our lawns in California. We seem to have enough to make anyplace south of Sacramento look like America's version of Tijuana. In the mean time EVERYONE gets a Water Meter! Who bought and paid for that Law? The water Company? Those in our Government who hold stock in that Company?

We are told we do not have enough energy and we pay $400.00 to $500.00 a month for our electric bills but yet we seem to have enough to absorb millions of Illegal Aliens?

As Socialist (d) like Al Gore, The Clintons, and Nancy Palousy jet set all over burning 20,000 and 30,000 gallons of Jet Fuel in a single day, those very Socialist (d) tell us about Global Warming and make Laws saying that my 11 years olds motocross bike is a gross polluter? And he can not ride it five months out of the year do to the Ozone?
I tried to find a 4 stroke to ride in those five months per year and it is ALSO a red tag bike which is a gross polluter? Huh?
In the California world run by modern-day Nazi's with their double standards and Gestapo Tactics a 11 year old must have a Green Tag to ride in State SUV Parks which the Socialist (d) say they are not going to fund next year? If I did not pay the Federal Government so much tax money for Socialist (d) to buy votes from Illegal Aliens I could buy enough land for my kid to ride his nasty gross polluting 80cc motorbike.

Note: Yet we seem to have plenty of gas available to sell to the millions Illegal Aliens here in California.

They tell us our schools are broke yet we have plenty of money for Illegal Immigrants to go to our schools? We spend $8,800 per pupil but it is not enough!

Our Hospitals are going broke yet they can take in Illegal Aliens and treat them for free?

Socialist (d) tell us Peons we do not have enough affordable housing and MUST have Rent Control. Yet we have plenty of space for millions of Illegal Aliens?
nomi writes: Monday, June, 18, 2007 4:50 PM
Religiouslib
Those figures are bad nonetheless for the Hispanics as a whole, but they are only so because the numbers are dragged down by the illegal population of which Puerto Ricans and Cubans don't tend to be for the most part. Will you please point out a substantive fact that is incorrect on VDare? You just played a Medvedian twist on the stats brilliantly. Since you are so good at research will you look up the tax savings of having to provide ESL teachers in all public schools. Oh thats right its a burden which schools can't handle. This is making all children suffer. Thank you Mexico.
religiouslib writes: Monday, June, 18, 2007 2:28 PM
gabby
please quit using v-dare as a source.
it is simply not credible.
it is in the business of giving conservatives what they want to hear, not objective reporting.
they don't even do any research, they just compile statistics that their market wants to have to confirm conservative points of view.you completely lose crediblilty when you use a sham research article from v-dare.
for example here are some stats on english speaking by immigrants, both legal and illegal.

"Bilingualism is common among second-generation children. Most children who grow up in immigrant households speak an immigrant language at home, but almost all are proficient in English.

Among second-generation Hispanics, 92 percent speak English well or very well, even though 85 percent speak at least some Spanish at home. Eleven percent of Mexican second-generation children speak only English at home, compared to five percent in the first generation. However, for Puerto Ricans and Cubans, two other large Hispanic groups, over one-fourth of the second-generation are English monolinguals at 29 and 27 percent, respectively. "


here is the website this information came from.
http://www.migrationinformation.org/Feature/display.cfm?id=282
progressive conservative writes: Monday, June, 18, 2007 2:05 PM
TWO WORDS: Fence First!
I'm receptive to many of the principles in the new bill. I just can't take it seriously until I see the border fence (already MANDATED by a previous bill) completed along our southern border.

Any politician who promotes reform needs to be shouted down with these words:

FENCE FIRST!! FENCE FIRST!! FENCE FIRST!!
GOPsaver writes: Monday, June, 18, 2007 1:15 PM
Medved, Harry Reid Logic.
Remember, No more using the word Pedophile to discribe rape by Illegal Alien of a Child. The new word to be used is Talent Scout.
orlandocajun writes: Monday, June, 18, 2007 11:45 AM
Courageous Reform Efforts?
So that's what the pro-amnesty is doing. What about some courageous enforcement efforts Michael? The pro-amnesty crowd have permanently surrendered their right to lecture us on the need for reform. They're ignored their duty for 20+ years and now they want us to allow them to legalize an invasion of foreigners so they can increase a voting base and appease their corporate donors. No thanks.

Do you really think that taking 14% of our population and turning it into 40% in 25 years is going to increase the Republican voting base? Nobody can be that dumb. I suggest we keep the 14% at 14% and not have to worry about a voting base. Then, when I at least can tell my children and grandchildren that I did my best to preserve the country, and its culture, that I inherited from my ancestors.
Jeff H writes: Monday, June, 18, 2007 9:31 AM
Good God Almighty, Michael
Can you be so blind? The ONLY reason Hispanics are "the most rapidly growing ethnic segment of the American electorate" is BECAUSE OF ILLEGAL ALIENS!!! The only way to stop the Democrats from reaping the ill-gotten gains of a new subclass of victims/wards-of-the-welfare-state is to STOP ILLEGAL ALIENS FROM COMING ACROSS THE BORDER and becoming legalized via the moronic shamnest bill being put forth in the Senate.
bc3 writes: Monday, June, 18, 2007 8:19 AM
Dream World
Like George Bush, Michael Medved lives in a parallel universe.

Explain to me how poor people seeking government assistance are going to vote for the party that wants to cut government waste (except for the President and Goober Graham).
Ron writes: Monday, June, 18, 2007 7:59 AM
Oh, one more thing lib
You want guest workers? Really, it's the one part of the bill that the liberals are against! Guest worker programs are nothing more than indentured servants working at below standard wages, with not bargaining power performing the function of scabs for the capitalist employer. What I love about liberals is their uncanny ability to look at a picture and have no idea what they're seeing.
Ron writes: Monday, June, 18, 2007 7:51 AM
Response to Flaming Lib
Check the Bureau of Labor statistics...
Unemployment rates only count the 8 million or so who are out of work and actively seeking work
BLS says in addition, there are 14 million who are underemployed working part-time but who would prefer full-time. And, add to to that, BLS says there are 75 million who are of working age who are not working or actively seeking work.
Mexico's rate of unemployment is lower that the United States... how is it their economomy doesn't collapse with so many workers leaving?

BTW, most of those looking for work are without skills and would quickly fill vacancies left by repatriating illegals

Anyway, I don't think having a few less restaurants or landscaper is going to affect our economy or lifestyle adversely. On the contrary, 21 billion dollars in foreign remittances kept in circulation in our economy would be a boost.
Ron writes: Monday, June, 18, 2007 7:36 AM
Medved Distorts
The term "anti-Immigrant" is a dead giveway.
Pete wilson was against illegal aliens availing themsleves of services paid for by citizens and legal residents. It's no surprise that he was supported in those efforts by every segment of the population including legal Latino immigrants.
This dishonest trick of blurring the bright-line distinction between legal and illegal immigration is getting old. The two are not comparable and to make any comparison is an insult to legal immigrants.
Ali writes: Monday, June, 18, 2007 7:24 AM
"Latinos"
Sounds like the pro-illegal alien lobby is trying to have it both ways. On the one hand, we're told that Latinos will assimilate, learn English, and become American. On the other, people such as Mr. Medved view them as a monolithic identity group who will wield political clout based on "race". The fact is, Latino or Hispanic are ethnic identifications, and as such, can and do change as Latinos or Hispanics assimilate. My "Hispanic" niece and nephews are all married to nonHispanics. None of them speaks Spanish, and yes, one even votes Republican, largely out of economic interest. What will ensure that Hispanics do not assimilate and do appeal to Democrats is to not only amnesty the large numbers already here, but to continue family preferences and "guest worker" programs favoring them. This will ensure heavy competition for low-skilled jobs, the maintenance of the Spanish language as a primary means of communication, and pretty much lock Latinos out of higher paying professional jobs.
Jerry writes: Monday, June, 18, 2007 5:41 AM
Medved reverts
To understand Mr. Medved, you have to look at his past.

He used to be an up front leftist thirty years ago when he was working for Ron Dellums.

It seems that he decided the best way he personally could be effective in achieving a "progressie" America would be to pretend to be a conservative, and wait for the best time to sabotage conservatives.

Well, he has apparently decided that amnesty is his chance, and he is engaged in a malicious wrecking operation.
nomi writes: Monday, June, 18, 2007 2:18 AM
Gabby
Doe Michael really call himself a cultural crusader?! LOL. Thats almost as funny as Nancy Palosi's promise for the least dirtiest house ever.
john v writes: Monday, June, 18, 2007 12:03 AM
God Bless Michael Medved
Thank God for one sane columnist on TH.
Sammy writes: Sunday, June, 17, 2007 11:18 PM
The Company You Keep
Earth to Medved and other pseudo conservatives -- Do you need any more evidence that amensty is wrongheaded and dangerous than by looking at the people that support this National Suicide Pact. Of course it is easy to start with a loony leftie like Ted Kennedy; but now we can add some guy with the handle of "Flaming Liberal Multiculturalist"? I mean really, doesn't it make perfect sense that a flaming liberal multiculturalist would love the idea of amnesty and a 3rd world invasion of our evil white male dominated empire. Yes, even a broken clock is right twice a day, but this ain't one of them.
nomi writes: Sunday, June, 17, 2007 10:59 PM
Flaming Liberal
I too am against the war in Iraq.

Lets see what would happen if we lost the 5% labor force. One, property taxes wouldn't constantly go up for hospitals, schools, and other infrastructure, including law enforcement. Middle America of what ever race could have more disposable income. Employers would have to raise there labor wages to a point to entice people on welfare and others like my sister who don't have a full time job to join the work force because it is not worth it. However, at $10 more an hour for all these jobs, I know Americans and legal residents could fill the jobs. These increased wages would add to the payroll taxes. Less social security wages would be depleted by the anchorbabies whose parents truly qualify because of low wages or because they don't document income. There is a reason that this is a net $80billion loss to the taxpayers annually,they take more social services than the taxes they pay. You are probably one of the elite flaming liberals who does not have to worry but this is actually affecting the majority of us. If those people hiring the illegals don't want to follow the laws let them go out of business. It is not like Americans will lose their jobs. In agriculture 75% of workers are legal. The companies can afford to pay more. The profits are subsidized at this point by me and you. So what would happen is we would have higher wages, honest companies rewarded with more business, and less taxes for all the welfare costs these illegals demand. Have you ever seen the pamphlet from the Mexican Consular on how to apply and get all sort of social services.

The solution is to build a fence with the current climate of only enforcement for the media stories. However, truly it would be to fine employers. The fines would pay for the extra enforcement but so would saving on social services and the additional revenue from payroll taxes and less people qualifying for or wanting welfare with a true living wage. As a liberal isn't that what you want? A living wage. Some other ideas is school vouchers,so that illegals can't TAKE ADVANTAGE of our schools, requiring i.d. for medical care, no food stamps or S.S.I. Mexico has much stricter standards than the above. I don't hear anybody complaining about that. You see flaming liberal, Mexico must go through reform and we are not being a good neighbor enabling and emulating their corruption.
Wayfinder writes: Sunday, June, 17, 2007 10:57 PM
To the Quitters out there...
...like Michael Medved and the Flaming Liberal Multiculturalist.

When the going gets rough, I suppose it's time to take the easy route and quit. The War on Terror is too hard, so let's call it a quagmire and quit. We can't beat these terrorists, according to what we see on the boob tube each day, let's quit. There are too many illegal immigrants that we can't deport them all. Fine! Let's legalize them and give them a ticket to citizenship. Never mind that it might be unfair to those who worked damn hard to come here and assimilate legally, because we have to have immediate resolution to every crisis, just like they do on Television!

Frankly, most of the people who talk like this end up in the ash-heap of history, ignorant fools and simpletons who have no idea what it takes to accomplish ANYTHING worthwhile in the whole miserable lives! They watch way too much television and believe life is just like it is shown, with problems resolved within hours rather than days, months, years, decades or even centuries, with less than a tenth of the real effort it would really take. That's Hollywood! What's sad is that Michael Medved himself has commentated on this precise thing!

If you look at the YAF (Young American's Foundation) website, there is a recording of his own speech to the young conservatives about how television and films make people impatient, shiftless and moody, in such a way that it's no wonder we have relationship problems that lead to divorce in America, because real problems in the real world are not fixed with symbology, slogans or sound bites. They're fixed with effort and hard work, and the commitment to see that results happen.

I'm certain that no reasonable American citizen (in the true sense of the term "citizen") wants to see 12 million criminals get a free pass from the federal government, and I'm also certain that they would like to see those that want to be citizens of this country do so legally, in such a way that they assimilate into our unique culture, one that stresses personal responsibility and destiny on one's own terms, free from dependance on Government to solve their problems. This is not racist. This is part of what citizenship is all about.

And it takes effort, and that means it takes work. If you're afraid of work, you should step aside and let the responsible people handle things instead of screaming at the rest of us to quit like you already did.
Flaming Liberal Multiculturalist writes: Sunday, June, 17, 2007 10:18 PM
Three Cheers For Medved

I'll argue till I'm blue in the face with his positions on Abortion, Iraq, and Gay Rights, but Michael is the only columnist here on TH who does not let his common sense get shut down by his virulent rightwing ideology when considering the immigration issue.

You would think that Iraq Abortion would have taught the Right Wing something about the folly of ignoring all evidence and facts and basing your policy solely upon your ideology, but we are talking about Rightwing Republicans here, I guess I shouldn't be surprised.

Having learned nothing from Iraq, you now turn you attention to the one aspect of the ship of state that, at least by contrast with everything else screwed up by this Godforsaken administration, is sailing along fairly nicely; The domestic economy. Now you want to screw THAT up. How? Deport all the illegals!

There are slightly more than 300 Million Americans. Less kids, the elderly, and non-working spouses, there's probably less than 200 Million of us working. There are between ten and twenty million undocumented workers. WHAT the HELL do you think would happen to our economy if 5%-10% of the jobs in it suddenly stopped being done? Do you know?? Me neither, but I have a strong felling it would not be a good thing!

All we need is a well-designed, well-run guest worker program.
Sammy writes: Sunday, June, 17, 2007 10:08 PM
Parallel to GWOT
Medved's arguement that we can't enforce our immigration laws so as not to anger the growing Hispanic population sounds eerily similar to the libs that say we can't fight back against Islamic extremism because we might anger the otherwise moderate Islamic population of the world. Now whether or not you believe in the War in Iraq, the idea that America cannot defend itself for fear of inciting further Muslim hatred is just plain ridiculous and suicidal. The same goes for the idea that we can't enforce our laws for fear of losing the Hispanic vote.
John Konop writes: Sunday, June, 17, 2007 9:12 PM
Bush thinks he is above the law?

Lawmakers on both sides have been very concerned about the issues of truck drivers from Mexico transporting terrorists and illegal immigrants, and their compliance with basic safety standards like being able to read English. Now President Bush has blown off the will of Congress and, like our immigration laws, Bush is giving our country a half-hearted effort on enforcement! Why should anyone trust Bush on immigration?

LL-With the ink barely dry on President Bush’s signature on supplemental war funding legislation that included restrictions on a Mexican cross-border trucking program, the U.S. DOT published a Federal Register notice that largely blows off the issues and directives outlined by Congress, OOIDA officials said.

The Federal Motor Carrier Safety Administration published a notice in the Federal Register Friday, June 8, that outlines responses to a laundry list of directives Congress included as part of the supplemental war spending legislation.

Section 6901 directed the agency, among other things, to publish Federal Register notices on a variety of regulatory and safety concerns. Rather than publish individual, detailed notices on each issue, FMCSA rolled the information into one notice.
And, it’s only giving the public 20 days to comment on the information.

“It’s apparent the Bush administration is thumbing its nose at the will of the American people and Congress,” said Todd Spencer, executive vice president of the Owner-Operator Independent Drivers Association.

“Lawmakers crafted a very well-thought-out piece of legislation that – had the DOT took it to heart and followed it – would have injected some sanity into a program that still has too many safety and security issues that have yet to be resolved.”

“This administration is not above the law,” Spencer said.

READ MORE

http://controlcongress.com/uncategorized/bush-thinks-he-is-above-the-law
Russ writes: Sunday, June, 17, 2007 8:47 PM
immigrarion lies
Michel
You have it wrong we are not against legal immigration we are against illegal immigrants regardless of who you are. I'm tired of hearing this is racist or bigots thats just BS. Enforce the laws on the books now, it has not been done in over 20 years and I have zero confidence it will ever be done.
Russ
nomi writes: Sunday, June, 17, 2007 7:14 PM
Common Sense
Isn't a pardon part of the law. And who is all of us? Are these the non-arguments that you guys are going to use to pass a sweeping bill. Lets see Medved uses font sizes and name calling,kings x makes a point through a grammatical error, wanda gag uses facts that don't lead to her conclusions as fact as the bases to her conclusions, and you my friend say that "you guys want Scooter Libby pardonned" and this is why none of our points should be discussed. I don't think you can say that all of us or a majority of us that see through this bill really give a rats behind about Scooter Libby, whether right or wrong.
yankee writes: Sunday, June, 17, 2007 6:23 PM
Common Sense
Michael, good article. It's based on common sense and reality, but I don't think you got your point across to you base. Nice try, though. To all those complaining about the rule of law, I have one question: why then are you all trying to get Scooter a pardon?
HadEnough37 writes: Sunday, June, 17, 2007 1:43 PM
MEDVED is awake
That is the problem. He know exactly what he is doing. And Townhall conservatives should just ignore him like we do others on the radical left who are so radical and working on their own agenda.

I won't bother reading his columns again. I can go to liberal sites where at least they are honest about what they are if I want to see what they are promoting today. And I do. It's usually good for a laugh. Laughing beats crying over what they are trying to do to my country!
OMEGA DAYS writes: Sunday, June, 17, 2007 1:32 PM
Love is blind
Well, I did it. Last week Mr. Medved was visiting one of his affiliates and a woman called into his show asking him to ask Rudy Giuliani a question on the subject of CFR, SPP and open borders (sorry I cannot be more specific about content, I was in the middle of something). Mr. Medved fired his usual venom on the patriot citizens whose calling was to uncover the shadow government (indirectly referring to WND or someone who has read "The Shadows of Power" by James Perloff or others involved in 'conspiracy theory'). He called them some words I would never use to describe a fellow citizen, with a very demeaning attitude, and that was the last straw. In the past, I thought it was my duty to listen to someone who, in the past, had good insight into many subjects including US history.

But, I can no longer put up with his ignorance on the NWO, a powerful puppetmaster that pulls the strings on all politicians since J.P. Morgan Jr. who was helped by Mr. Warburg at Jekyll Island to establish a shadow government that President Woodrow Wilson had previously described in 1913:

"Since I entered politics, I have chiefly had men's views confided to me privately. Some of the biggest men in the United States, in the Field of commerce and manufacture, are afraid of something. They know that there is a power somewhere so organized, so subtle, so watchful, so interlocked, so complete, so pervasive, that they better not speak above their breath when they speak in condemnation of it."

Woodrow Wilson,The New Freedom (1913)

Add to that the thousands of quotes from many other well known politicians, and you could fill a library with the convergence of evil associated with the shadow government. Add to that the Executive Orders from presidents past that undermine our constitution, and although it was not an EO, include the latest SPP and Transatlantic Economic Integration framework (double-speak code for EU-NAU globalization), and you uncover the grand plan that is the NWO, which is in its final stages of completion.

Mr. Medved's insult caused me to stop listening to his show. His love for globalism (code for NWO), GWB, GOP moderates, liberalism has turned off many listeners, such as myself, who consider the preponderance of evidence over the last 100+ years that points to NWO.

Sorry Michael, you're toast...
Bill writes: Sunday, June, 17, 2007 1:24 PM
Medved-like shills
The debate is simple; allowing large numbers of uneducated and poor into our country, in the 21st century, is anathema to rational sensibilities desiring to keep America American.

We like the "rule of law" where everyone is treated equally. When we find deviations from this rule we strive to fix it, not live with it as Mr. Medved would suggest (note the prosecutor of the Duke Lacrosse players false arrest case). That is our legacy, fairness and equal treatment.

Allowing 12-20 million lawbreakers forgiveness is God's work, not society's; and it is defined as "amnesty" in spite of what Mr. Medved says. Just read Thomas Sowell's articles, who is far more educated in these matters than Mr. Medved, for clarity on the bogus arguments of the amnesty shills. Read Ed Meese on his analysis of the similarities of this monstrous bill to the 1986 Simpson-Mazzoli Immigration Act. We know if it takes 700 pages, has support of Sen Kennedy and racist KKK-like groups like "La Raza", the Mexican gov't trying to export their unemployment then it's a bad bill, bad politics, and bad for America.

We should all take some time to read up on the "pathologies" of massive illegal immigration to understand the complete restructuring of our American society that is underway. Take a look at the fertility rate, illegitimate birth rates, crime, income mobility, medical care system, insurance, taxpayer costs, etc, etc, etc. Take a look at the consequences of polarizing citizens based on balkanized political policies. Society can't hold together when competing interests are allowed to succeed by suppressing their opponents and taking any property they please (see many books by Dr. Thomas Sowell).

Turning American into a "socialist" haven (a postulate based on the fact that a majority of illegals are "socialist" and will vote Democratic) isn't an improvement. Republicans who try to garner the "socialist" vote aren't any better than the politically supported businesses who take advantage of illegals for "short-term" shareholder benefit.

Do we try to protect the American experiment, that has been a beacon of light in the long history of human misery, or do we simply let it disintegrate into the ever-present human proclivity to further parochial interests and suppress any dissent by whatever means necessary? It appears Mr. Medved would prefer the latter.

Wake up Mr. Medved!
nomi writes: Sunday, June, 17, 2007 1:16 PM
Increased Illegal Immigration the Goal
I say that this bill will make illegal immigration much worse. The "24 hour clause to check backgrounds or they are in" is an advertisement to have them swarm in the country. It will not decrease the problem it will increase by lord knows how much. They will storm the border and the border patrol agents. Why are they holding off on building the fence? Michael Medved and his Council on Foreign Relations Friends do know this. As you notice his arguments are not debate but desperate attempts to intimidate into silence. With the free social services, relatively better schools, not a part of the "comprehensive" plan and a striking down of the misinterpretation ot th14th amendment not discussed at all, you know that these senators and friends of the bill do in fact want illegal immigration to increase and drown out our loud voices. Since when has the congressional budget office been accurate. This bill is much worse than amnesty. It is a welcome mat to all future illegal behavior, being legalized. This includes corruption in our government mirroring and expanding that of Mexico. Very creepy Medved.
HadEnough37 writes: Sunday, June, 17, 2007 12:54 PM
Not just conservatives
I am amazed at all of the pro immigration posters who don't have a clue about exactly who is opposing this immigration bill.

I have been reading posts on Congress.org and letter are going to ALL members of the Senate, by ALL different races, colors, creeds and party affiliations, opposing this ridiculous attempt to justify legalzing millions who violated our laws, jumped ahead of and prevented millions of legal immigrants waiting in line (and welcome by the way by most Americans through a legal process) and marched in our streets demanding rights, anmesty and benefits.

Keep listening to all the hyperbole about this being a conservative issue and let the Media tell you that over and over. Be a fool. IF the republicans stand against this, I agree they will get a tremendous amount of support from moderate liberals and independents who are mad as hell too. About the failure of our elected leaders to listen to the voice of the people and
deciding in their normal elitist fashion that the people of this country are too stupid and uninformed to make such decisions on our own.

I welcome legal immigrants FROM ALL OVER THE WORLD, and will continue to do so. This is not about Hispanics and recent VALID polls show legal Hispanics like this no better for the most part than legal non Hispanics. The whole thing is unfair to legal immigration and trying to make it a racist issue serves no purpose and makes those using it look foolish and defensive.
At best.
wanda gag writes: Sunday, June, 17, 2007 12:22 PM
60 million legal ones, many vote!
Almost 60 million people – more than one-fifth of the total population of the United States – are immigrants or the children of immigrants. For most of these people, the immigration debate and immigration policies are not an abstract ideology but a means of family reunification and an affirmation that they are part of the "American dream". These people vote. If Republicans want them to vote for them they will need to tone down the anti-Hispanic nativism. I would also point out that with a growing economy, an unemployment rate hovering around 5% and a birth rate that is less than 2.5, we need these people.
Winston829 writes: Sunday, June, 17, 2007 12:05 PM
Michael
When this country ceases to exist as a great Democracy, I will hold you personally responsible.

When a ruthless dictator comes to power, elected by a block of Hispanics lead by the nationalists/communists, I will hold you personally responsible.

And when small minorities are dealt with accordingly (you know, the final solution), you will be no longer available to take the blame.

I know the reason you want illegals to be legalized: you believe they area good Christians as compared to the general American public going atheist. Along with the Catholic Church you need more conservative religious people in this country.

But here is your error in judgment: nothing good has ever come out of the national socialist movement in the past, except death. Unfortunately, the masses of illegal aliens are tightly controlled by such an organization exactly.

So by your effort to make bad look good you are playing their trump card.

As far as the Republican Party is concerned, the major political party cannot be made hostage to one ethnic group against all others. If, according to you, 13-14% of the population already dictates their racial preferences to major parties, imagine another 40-60 million Hispanics allowed into this country. Accordingly, 30% of the population can much easier blackmail politicians to vote their way.

With every vicious Immigration reform cycle you so enthusiastically support, this dependency will increase and eventually lead to the beginning of my comments.

All other ethnic groups, such as blacks, Jews, Asians, etc., will become insignificant and eventually disappear. Or start a civil war?

So you, Michael, is on the wrong side of the Immigration war. You put your selfish considerations ahead of the common good. Instead, you should think what's best for America, for all of us -- and then and only then you will see the truth: when Hispanics are at 13-14% and all other minorities at 25% or higher, it gives the latter a chance to stand united against political monopoly if so desired by the former. Besides, the Republican Party should not low itself to appease to any ethnic group. Instead, it should offer an effective conservative political, economic and social reforms that benefit America, including minority groups.
pointguard writes: Sunday, June, 17, 2007 11:49 AM
and what about the white vote Michael??

Michael,

You are absolutely wrong about this.

Let's say this amnesty goes through. Sure we may keep some of the Hispanic vote, but most of the poor will still vote to the left, especially the illegals.

So for every Hispanic we keep, we lose two more previously illegal voters.

Worse for every Hispanic voter we keep (because we accept this amnesty), we lose 5 or 10 or even 50 white voters, who ARE the biggest bloc of the Republican party.

I am all for reaching out to minority groups, but you don't do that by BUYING their vote. That's what Democrats do!!
bama writes: Sunday, June, 17, 2007 11:33 AM
please, gop, keep it up
damn, i'm so happy to read these posts ... as a life long democrat i can only hope your part of the gop wins control. please keep up the good fight! LMAO
deedee writes: Sunday, June, 17, 2007 11:31 AM
I'll join the chorus
The Congressional Budget Office estimated that the Senate bill will only reduce illegal immigration by 25%. Now, tell me how it makes any sense to say that this bill is good for the American people. That one fact alone should tank the bill.

I'm through with the Republican Party. It's time for a viable third party to arise out of the ashes Bush has made of the Republican Party.
Ex-tex writes: Sunday, June, 17, 2007 11:27 AM
Dang it! We're losin' the ILLEGAL vote!
I guess we'll just have to deport'em all then!

And you can go with em Michael.
Roy writes: Sunday, June, 17, 2007 10:38 AM
What I read....
Michael -
From what I am reading in response to your blog, your sales pitch just is not working. The "Angry" people who are driving Latino's to the democrat side, have had enough of the broken empty promises. We depended on and thought we could rely on conservative values from the Republican party (silly things like upholding the law), instead we got the business as usual. The Republicans and Democrats seeing eye to eye on an issue, that conservatives wanted the Republicans to actually show a backbone on. President Bush and the Republicans in office have broken my spirit to champion for them anymore, they have lost my faith. They refuse to stand up and fight, they take the "High" road. What a bunch of crap, I want them stepping on Chuck Schumer's throat and spitting on the likes of Harry Reid. But they are far too civil, I don't want civility I want a bare knuckle no holds barr, winner take all fight. Show me other than on this piece of crap amnesty bill where democrats have given an inch on anything, in the last seven years (leave 9/11 and voting for and then against the war out). You know Michael if you repeated on a daily basis how disingenuous the democrats are I'd listen with a little more enthusiasm. But in the meantime, it's just business as usual, and this reform amnesty bill is just more empty rhetoric.

Roy
SteveL writes: Sunday, June, 17, 2007 4:46 AM
fewer Hispanics, more Anglos
Michael Medved ignores one factor: Anger among white Anglo Americans toward illegal Hispanic immigrants is so high that the GOP could actually GAIN a lot of white votes by fighting illegal immigration, which will compensate for the loss of Hispanic votes. That will help in the short term. In the longer term, the GOP's opposition to this immigration bill can be eased if the GOP adopts other pro-Hispanic stances elsewhere.

That is why the major Democratic candidates like Hillary and Obama are NOT coming out foursquare for increased Hispanic immigration. They know very well how unpopular that is with anyone who's not Hispanic. In fact, it's even unpopular with one of THEIR key minority constituencies: African-Americans. Black people hate the fact that in the fight for affirmative-action favors, blacks are being surpassed by Hispanics.
kingsXrulz writes: Sunday, June, 17, 2007 3:05 AM
Gabby
Thanks for being cool about my comment; I strongly believe in discussing and debating the ideas, not the people who express them. Why do so many Latin voters in (nominally) free elections vote for left wing or outright Socialist candidates? I think it's because these people live in countries where the quality of life is low and their prospects for the future are bleak; they turn to the party that assures them they will have jobs and be taken care of. Similarly, minority groups tend to vote Democratic in this country. The difference is, things are much better here than in those countries the immigrants come from. Left wing ideals aren't necessarily the only option for survival here. The conservatives have an opportunity to get their message across to people who may be willing to listen; but, if they come across as hostile or uncaring it's doubtful that their message will even be listened to, let alone considered.
kingsXrulz writes: Sunday, June, 17, 2007 2:40 AM
nomi
I don't think my writing was "vanity". I included one sentence (half a sentence really) about my personal experience as background information for just one of the opinions I was expressing (Hispanics appreciate genuine displays of respect); other than that I thought everything I wrote was about my opinions, not me personally. Also, I only mentioned the Hispanics I have known in the context of stating my opinion of why fewer of them are voting conservative, not as justification for making them legal. I disagree with Medved more often than not; in this case I agree, and the main intent of my post was to state why I agree with him this time. Re: my comment about Gabby's mistake -- Gabby seemed to be cool about it, and there certainly was no intention of malice on my part.
Hawkeye writes: Saturday, June, 16, 2007 11:32 PM
Political expediency vs. principles
Michael, the point that you are failing to see is that if we allow the illegals to come in with amnesty nothing has changed from 1986 and that failure of a bill.

Once in a while it's ok to actually stand up for principles because it's right. Your whole blog is an argument for political expediency (we must give them amnesty or they won't vote for us! is what you are saying).
nomi writes: Saturday, June, 16, 2007 10:05 PM
And Another Thing
I suspect Medved is trying to sell this amnesty with these histrionic posts entitled "Losing the Future" ,large fonts, and dismissal of arguments versus review the issue with intellectual integrity. Notice he does not ask the question "if the R party lost all the Hispanic votes because it is not selling the amnesty then why didn't the D party gain them all but in fact not gain any?" Maybe it is because racist Medved doesn't think an American of Hispanic ancestry could believe in self reliance, waiting in line, and learning English without being told you have to. Maybe their neighborhoods are most affected by the refusal of the Bush administration to enforce our laws. Maybe they live in neighborhoods far removed from Seattle were if they needed emergency care they would be screwed. Maybe like Caesar Chavez, they believe that illegals and the tolerance thereof will only set there legal hard earned gains backwards. This is the reality of that article's data. Hispanic Americans are just like you and I and as they see the party they indentified with become a party of demoralization what reason is there to identify with it?!
nomi writes: Saturday, June, 16, 2007 9:44 PM
Kingxrulz
Your writing is vanity, you speak of legal and American born Mexicans that you know as an example of why illegals should be mad legal. I fail to see the strength of your argument. Gabby was speaking of those that are illegal and they could also be Asian, Arab.... illegal aliens and no they are not going to tend to vote Republican, unless we seriously compromize any ideals and at that point what makes that party one that shouldn't be superceded by one with uplifting principles of respect for others and all that entails and self reliance. Picking apart Gabby for a grammatical or obvious error she didn't mean to make will not make your argument that I fail to grasp stronger. Bush won in '04 because of patriotic Hispanic-Americans who wanted security as much as you and I despite differing skin colors. These patriotic Hispanics are leaving in droves like all the other former Republicans because the Republican party's leadership has ceased to stand for anything.
Frigglesnitz writes: Saturday, June, 16, 2007 8:21 PM
MEDVED, nt250 AND LAME, LIMPING COLUMNS

It was only recently I began reading Medved. It's sort of fun, really, because he's so easy to be picked apart. Lame's the word, nt250.

Maybe we should be glad he writes. He does seem to have a way of galvanizing opposite thought.
nt250 writes: Saturday, June, 16, 2007 6:12 PM
Losing arguments.
What's really telling in this whole debate is that the pro-amnesty faction like Medved can't argue the issue on it's merits so is forced to demonize the other side. They have no other argument to make because they are not arguing on principle like the conservatives are. They are arguing against the other side, and not for their own, because they can't even say what their side wants to accomplish with this bill. They've now thrown everything at the other side and nothing has stuck. This column by Medved is one of the lamest I've read yet.
Frigglesnitz writes: Saturday, June, 16, 2007 4:35 PM
STUPID, HYSTERICAL ANTI-ILLEGALS

The Senate recently learned that mainstream Americans are not, after all, as stupid as they were believed to be.

They "got it." They finally got it through their thickened skulls that Americans do not want any part of their "amnesty" for illegal aliens, no matter what other name they may apply to that process.

They learned that mainstream Americans are definitely hysterical -- hysterical at the idea of giving away the farm. And, as Georgie Anne Geyer said in a recent column, "mad as hell" about the idea of having to just give up.

Anti-illegal? Yes, indeedy. We are anti-illegal. We believe that playing by the rules counts. We believe that "illegals" are, by their very names, not playing by the rules.

The Congress can get ready for another groundswell of angry Americans -- those same Americans who put them in office and can take them out as well.

In their hearts (if there be hearts), they know it is not lovey-dovey money-dripping lobbyists or money-honey-dripping corporations who put them in office. Rather, it's the working stiffs who get up very, very early on voting day so that they will miss neither voting nor work, and it's retirees who have time to watch their every writhing move -- and comment like crazy.

The American people are fed up, do you hear? Congress heard, last week, as they will in days to come.

There is an answer to breaking-and-entering illegals and to illegals already here: no benefits. None, except perhaps in the most drastic of medical emergencies. No Social Security Cards. No automatic American-at-birth babies. No food stamps. In other words, no free lunch. Make it just like Mexico is, and illegals from that country or coming here through that country may be somewhat discouraged at the prospect of just more of the same old thing.

They may as well stay home. They might like the weather there better, too.
kingsXrulz writes: Saturday, June, 16, 2007 2:00 PM
Hey, Gabby
Thanks for making me chuckle. "Out of wedlock marriage"; that's great (may I assume that you meant "out of wedlock pregnancy"?). I don't know what the statistics are for Hispanics when it comes to illiteracy (as a country Mexico has a 92% literacy rate, compared to 97% in the U.S.; of course this does not necessarily equate to English literacy among Hispanics in the U.S.), or the statistics for dropouts and alcoholism (and I'm not sure that you really know either) but it is true that they have a relatively high rate of abortions (and gang membership).

So, what's your point? That as a group they aren't the sort of people Republicans want to be associated with? That there aren't enough good people among them for the GOP to waste time courting their support? As Michael mentioned in his post, Bush courted the Latin vote in '04 and received 45% of it. That's a significant number, if true (the veracity of this number has been questioned, but it's probably safe to say that at least a third of Hispanic voters voted for Bush; remember all of the "Viva Bush" stickers?).

Regarding a Hispanic "love of Socialism", it is true that most of the countries in Central and South America have liberal -- and in several cases outright Socialist -- governments. What is also true is that many (dare I say "most"?) of the people coming here are fleeing those oppressive and oftentimes corrupt regimes due to high crime rates and low economic opportunity. In other words: They Are Looking For Something Better! They Are Receptive To A Different Way Of Looking At The World!

The Bush campaign knew this, the governator knew this. Calling for all illegals to be convicted for the crime of illegally crossing the border, or labeling the problem as an "invasion", or hinting that a disproportionately high number of illegals are here for the purpose of committing crimes (when there is absolutely no data that backs up that assertion). . . When members of the far right, especially those who spout these ideas to the masses through the airwaves, harp on this issue day after day in this manner, they may be displaying the courage of their convictions but they are also pushing the Hispanic community in America to the left. The message that comes across, whether it is what was intended or not, is: We Don't Want You, We Don't Need You, You Aren't Good Enough To Be One Of Us, Go Back Where You Came From And Suffer.

Does immigration need to be controlled, and limited? Absolutely. Should we build a wall and enlarge the Border Patrol in an effort to stem the tide of illegal immigration? If those methods are truly effective, then Yes. In dealing with the millions of illegals already here, should we: a) Take the steps realistically necessary to make them legal (including fines and sending them to the back of the line, which is not the same as a criminal conviction but IS punishment), or b) Strengthen border security only, which does absolutely NOTHING to deal with those already here, and then make a completely futile effort to round up and deport 12 million people?

Wishful thinking isn't going to make these people go away; allowing them to stay here AS ILLEGALS might prevent an increase of new citizens registering as Democrats but it prevents an increase of new Republican voters as well, and it does nothing to solve the real problem.

As a resident of a border state and a hiring manager with 20 years of experience interacting with Hispanic employees (both U.S. born and legal immigrants) I can tell you at least one thing I know for sure: Hispanic people -- and all minority groups in general -- crave, desire, wish for, and respond to genuine displays of RESPECT from other people (and from the Caucasian majority in this country especially) more than anything else. Not special treatment, not government handouts; equal treatment and RESPECT.

Statements like yours, Gabby, and those of certain members of the far right don't come across to the Hispanic community as being mere disagreements with their position on immigration; they come across as blatant statements of disrespect for them as people. That's why they won't vote conservative.
GOPsaver writes: Saturday, June, 16, 2007 12:18 PM
Dear GOP.
Dear GOP,

I am looking forward to seeing how many votes you get from those listed above in the 08 election cycle. Bet it is not enough and you will be begging for my vote in 2010.

Have fun because WE will be calling the shots in 2010 and not immigrant-rights advocates, those few religious institutions who have been juked by the President, or the business interests that we will be boycotting.

I will be waiting for your phone calls begging for my donations. I will be happy to tell you those donations went to Grass Roots.org and the Minute men.
nomi writes: Saturday, June, 16, 2007 11:40 AM
A Conspiracy
Medved is part of the plan. Last year the White House had invited talk show hosts to join them and feel them out. The White House was looking for a certain something from these celebrities with an audience and credibility. I guess Mike Medved fit the bill.

"..the immigration reform bill must be more than we know because of the importance they are putting on it...and that there must be something in the shadows.........listening to the paul Mcquire show (KBRT am san francisco) and he had a document from the coucil on foreign relations concerning the formation of the north american union..(a copy of the european union charter) joining canada, united states, and mexico and the passage of this immigration (amnesty) bill was a crucial first step to this end"

...no need for debate when you flood the country with an uneducated mass. Its not going as planned is it though. We either stop it and politicians lose jobs and power or the administration and senators reveal a totalitarian state. What will their supporters and the true people waiting in the shadows do if the amnesty doesn't go through and billions of dollars in contracts that have already been slated and campaign promises can't be executed? The desperation of trying to sell the amnesty is just very chilling. They don't want to have to show force and true colors to pass this through.

I really wonder who those camps that Haliburton's spinoff is contracted to build in the US are meant for. They (the people Medved praises) seem agitated/fatigued by us loud people, but not the illegals who they lump in with all Latinos. They even seem to welcome those who are criminals per our standards. Tommorrow the loud people may be the new definition of criminals. Trent Lott is working on this.
Ken writes: Saturday, June, 16, 2007 11:25 AM
Gosh, What A Surprise
Those that are most likely to receive government benefits/handouts are most likely identifying with democrats. Gee, has that ever happened before? So the Republicans should pander to them to get their votes. Oh, but we already do if think about George Bush and it is not working!
Dr J writes: Saturday, June, 16, 2007 10:15 AM
Immigration
I don't think pandering to illegal aliens for political purposes is the right thing to do at this point. If Mitt or Rudy lose a close election to Hillary and it is shown that Hispanics voted disproportionately for her, then the pandering will begin. But chill out Michael, it's not time yet to push the panic button. And if Mitt or Rudy win the election, we will have border security and other programs in place that will help us get over the illegal immigration problem. Let's try to do the right thing now, there is plenty of time to sell ourselves out later.
roho writes: Saturday, June, 16, 2007 9:43 AM
There are 2 kinds of hispanics Michael!
President Kennedy signed legislation that made every Cuban that could swim ashore a citizen.(No way to be an illegal)Many are republicans because they work the illegal Nicarauguans,Columbians,Costa Ricans,Panamanians,etc,etc, under the table with the threat of deportation like slave masters! On the other side of the country, the Gringo business owners do the same thing with the southwest illegals!.............Yet you give the impression that they have never heard the name "CHE", and the statement "Long live the Revolution!"...........The bulk is third world socialist and will NEVER,NEVER,NEVER, vote Republican!.................And TED KENNEDY knows this!...........However, they will vote for George P. Bush the hispanic nephew of the President in 2016 when he runs on the Democratic ticket, thus merging the Kennedy/Bush alliance for power!...................People don't fly foreign flags in the streets of the U.S.A. in the thousands, inorder to send a signal of loyalty to the U.S. !.......................Duh.
nomi writes: Saturday, June, 16, 2007 3:24 AM
Down To The Gold Teeth
What has changed since 2004. The prevalence of Amnesty Republicans standing for liberal ACLU type policy, Trent Lott, Kyl, BUSH.... I suspect that the Hispanics that are leaving the party are just like me and respect law and order. It is not a race or genetic thing to disrespect the laws of a country. These are the Hispanics that have left. I am sure of it. What does the party stand for anymore, just a club for those who want more power than the Democrats to give government contracts. More like a sports team with the sport of who can grow the government bigger. Not me, I am not going to be a part of that. The only way to support the welfare state that will be created and the extra burdensome agencies post this shamnesty is to create new laws to tax regular people out of home and any wealth, eventually down to the gold teeth. The evil behind this plan and those that are selling it that have the foresight to see the end results of this bill is heartbreaking. We are not races but as proud Americans just that proud Americans yearning to be free of oppressive government policies.
We don't want to be a part of helping our neighbors to the South maintain and grow corruption without accountability, but instead many rewards.
nomi writes: Saturday, June, 16, 2007 1:45 AM
Atleast The Font Is Smaller
I see nothing American about this amnesty bill. It has all the attributes of through and through corruption.

Who is being racist, throwing away the meaning of Republican to pander to a certain racial voting block. If we were to try to solicit a certain voting block by race for the purpose of saving the Republican party, it would be the black vote. But I don't look at people by race. I look at saving the best example of a country who had rules to respect and no impediments due to elitism. It is getting harder to do with arrogant CreatingNorth American Community Lowering Living Standard of most people in three continents for the good of the top politicians, corporate interests, lobbying relatives, and media friends. Lets face it the illegals you speak of are just pawns to dilute our vote.

The fatigue you spoke of in a previous post is the fatigue of realizing the exposure to millions who respected you and your intellect to your current role as a salesman to the anything but patriotic bill. It must weigh heavily on your being. The call about your stated beliefs on the homeless was pretty illuminating.
Cal writes: Saturday, June, 16, 2007 12:52 AM
Medved is a Demagogue
If you truly want you're show to be a "daily dose of debate," here's a list of guests you could have on, instead of John Kyl for the 5,000th time:

http://rightcal.blogspot.com/2007/06/open-letter-to-michael-medved.html
GOPsaver writes: Saturday, June, 16, 2007 12:09 AM
If we Only!
Oh Medved,

All you are saying is if the Conservative Voter would only behave like a socialist (d) voter the Republicans could spin off some of the Hispanic vote and live happy.

I have been a long time listener of your on KTKZ for years Mike and I do not know when you sold out or for what?

The same guy who has been writing these Bills (Ted Kennedy) sense 1965 wrote this last mess and you are going to buy into it?

Any Conservative who goes for this Bill is a fool.

The person who would REALLY like to be elected as our next President should say this.
Fellow American If 12 to 20 million or more Americans claimed the maximum deductions on their income taxes and did not pay ANY property tax to State and Local Governments. This would be a statement our elected office holders could hear loud and clear and I would endorse?
Maybe if some kind of amnesty coasted them as it costs us?

We have one million Homes going into foreclosure. Could the State and local Governments take on 12 to 20 million more? Who would they get to buy them? Once more, If elected to the Office of the President of the United States of America. I would offer Tax Amnesty. Just pay your taxes from some day in the future when the Wall is complete, Boarders are secure, and current Laws are enforced. All taxes owed before will be waived with Amnesty.
We DEMAND the wall be built and Laws enforced or changed to make current laws enforceable before we pay any more taxes!

Our Elected Government has spent years screwing up the Immigration Issue so I thought I would help them out.

Here is a single page Law to solve the Illegal Alien Issue once and for all. Any elected Office holder is welcome to steal it and use it as their own. Yes we can move twelve million illegal aliens back to Mexico by making them want to go back on their own.

1st. Any Corporation or Company who hires and Illegal Alien (notice I left out the word knowingly) shall face a fine of $250,000.00 per Illegal Alien hired and the CEO, CFO, Owner, and person who hired the Illegal Alien shall spend no less then three months in Jail. Time to be served in the County where the offence against the Legal Citizens of the USA occurred.

No person, Corporation, or non-profit group shall hire, rent or lease to, sell an automobile to, or pay money owed to any Illegal Alien. Each offence shall incur a penalty of no less then $250,000.00 dollars and three months in jail levied against the CEO, CFO, Owner, and or persons in the County where the offence against the Citizens of the USA occurred.

Should a CEO, CFO, Owner, or persons be in violation of the Solving the Illegal Alien Law have no ability to pay fines. Jail time will be extended accordingly and property sized. Bankrupt Laws shall not apply to any guilty party or entity due to failure to pay fines.

The USA is a Super Power and Mexico is a sh;t hole.

A law should be passed to protect American Citizens living in the United States of America stating that each time an American is killed by an Illegal Alien from Mexico. 100 square miles of Land will be taken from Mexico along the Mexican boarder with the United States and used as a buffer zone to enforce and protect the Boarder of the United States of America and it's Citizens from the dangerous Illegal Aliens from Mexico

And there goes 20 million Illegal Aliens back to their home.
Virginia Patriot writes: Friday, June, 15, 2007 10:15 PM
More Propaganda
So we should abandon the rule of law so we can get lawbreakers to vote for our side? You are 180 degrees out of phase. The Republicans will cease to exist if they surrender the country. The Republicans can win in a landslide by standing up for American citizens. Independents and many Democrats would vote for the candidate that would secure the border and enforce the law. Trying to out pander the Democrats for what is now 10% of the vote while alienating most of their own voters is just plain stupid.
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