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Wednesday, July 02, 2008
Thomas Sowell :: Townhall.com Columnist
Does Patriotism Matter?
by Thomas Sowell
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The Fourth of July is a patriotic holiday but patriotism has long been viewed with suspicion or disdain by many of the intelligentsia. As far back as 1793, prominent British writer William Godwin called patriotism "high-sounding nonsense."

Internationalism has long been a competitor with patriotism, especially among the intelligentsia. H.G. Wells advocated replacing the idea of duty to one's country with "the idea of cosmopolitan duty."

Perhaps nowhere was patriotism so downplayed or deplored than among intellectuals in the Western democracies in the two decades after the horrors of the First World War, fought under various nations' banners of patriotism.

In France, after the First World War, the teachers' unions launched a systematic purge of textbooks, in order to promote internationalism and pacifism.

Books that depicted the courage and self-sacrifice of soldiers who had defended France against the German invaders were called "bellicose" books to be banished from the schools.

Textbook publishers caved in to the power of the teachers' unions, rather than lose a large market for their books. History books were sharply revised to conform to internationalism and pacifism.

The once epic story of the French soldiers' heroic defense against the German invaders at Verdun, despite the massive casualties suffered by the French, was now transformed into a story of horrible suffering by all soldiers at Verdun-- French and German alike.

In short, soldiers once depicted as national heroes were now depicted as victims-- and just like victims in other nations' armies.

Children were bombarded with stories on the horrors of war. In some schools, children whose fathers had been killed during the war were asked to speak to the class and many of these children-- as well as some of their classmates and teachers-- broke down in tears.

In Britain, Winston Churchill warned that a country "cannot avoid war by dilating upon its horrors." In France, Marshal Philippe Petain, the victor at Verdun, warned in 1934 that teachers were trying to "raise our sons in ignorance of or in contempt of the fatherland."

But they were voices drowned out by the pacifist and internationalist rhetoric of the 1920s and 1930s.

Did it matter? Does patriotism matter?

France, where pacifism and internationalism were strongest, became a classic example of how much it can matter.

During the First World War, France fought on against the German invaders for four long years, despite having more of its soldiers killed than all the American soldiers killed in all the wars in the history of the United States, put together.

But during the Second World War, France collapsed after just six weeks of fighting and surrendered to Nazi Germany. At the bitter moment of defeat the head of the French teachers' union was told, "You are partially responsible for the defeat."

Charles de Gaulle, Francois Mauriac, and other Frenchmen blamed a lack of national will or general moral decay, for the sudden and humiliating collapse of France in 1940.

At the outset of the invasion, both German and French generals assessed French military forces as more likely to gain victory, and virtually no one expected France to collapse like a house of cards -- except Adolf Hitler, who had studied French society instead of French military forces.

Did patriotism matter? It mattered more than superior French tanks and planes.

Most Americans today are unaware of how much our schools have followed in the footsteps of the French schools of the 1920s and 1930s, or how much our intellectuals have become citizens of the world instead of American patriots.

Our media are busy verbally transforming American combat troops from heroes into victims, just as the French intelligentsia did-- with the added twist of calling this "supporting the troops."

Will that matter? Time will tell.

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About The Author
Thomas Sowell is a senior fellow at the Hoover Institute and author of The Housing Boom and Bust.
 
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When you
don't resist evil, be prepared to assimilate. By following intellectual pacifists who will not stand up to anything, be prepared to watch the rape of your daughters, the conscription of your sons, the burning of your books, and hard labor for "those barbarians." If there are any educated folks left from Mao's purges, ask them.

Excellent lesson
Recently I have been pondering a question. That question is; Are there any patriots in the public eye?

All Dem. politicians are out, they are in it for the power.

Most Rep. pols seem the same, see McCain.

Leaders in industry are more interested in profits than they are the continuation of the Republic. (last year Buick sold 240,000 cars in the US, 360,000 in China) Where do their loyalties lie?

Members of the news media are more interested in promoting international socialism than a strong USA. (See John Stossel's column for an example.)

John Bolton seems to be a patriot, any others?

Moral decay is transforming America
To a nation of wimps, and the home of a moral deficient society, ripe for a fall.

quote:

Charles de Gaulle, Francois Mauriac, and other Frenchmen blamed a lack of national will or general moral decay, for the sudden and humiliating collapse of France in 1940.


He who is void of virtuous attachments in private life is, or very soon will be, void of all regard for his country. There is seldom an instance of a man guilty of betraying his country, who had not before lost the feeling of moral obligations in his private connections.
Samuel Adams

Our laws and our "entertainment" are sowing the seeds for decay.

Beginning in the 1960's it has now produced a crop of Americans that are every bit as pacifist as the French were in 1940.

The enemies of America have understood this was the only method this country could be overthrown, from with-in.

"At what point shall we expect the approach of danger? By what means shall we fortify against it? Shall we expect some transatlantic military giant, to step the Ocean, and crush us at a blow?

Never!

All the armies of Europe, Asia and Africa combined, with all the treasure of the earth (our own excepted) in their military chest; with a Buonaparte for a commander, could not by force, take a drink from the Ohio, or make a track on the Blue Ridge, in a trial of a thousand years.

At what point, then, is the approach of danger to be expected?

I answer, if it ever reach us it must spring up amongst us.

It cannot come from abroad. If destruction be our lot, we must ourselves be its author and finisher. As a nation of freemen, we must live through all time, or die by suicide. The Collected Works of Abraham Lincoln edited by Roy P. Basler, Volume I, "Address Before the Young Men's Lyceum of Springfield, Illinois (January 27, 1838), p. 109.

One mans liberty
Can be another man's bondage.

I never tire of reading the wisdom of Great Americans.

"We all declare for liberty; but in using the same word we do not all mean the same thing.

With some the word liberty may mean for each man to do as he pleases with himself, and the product of his labor; while with others, the same word may mean for some men to do as they please with other men, and the product of other men's labor.

Here are two, not only different, but incompatible things, called by the same name - liberty.

And it follows that each of the things is, by the respective parties, called by two different and incompatible names - liberty and tyranny." The Collected Works of Abraham Lincoln edited by Roy P. Basler, Volume VII, "Address at Sanitary Fair, Baltimore, Maryland" (April 18, 1864), p. 301-302.

Mr. Sowell is on target again.
How amazing it is that people can repeat famous lines such as 'those who fail to learn from history are doomed to repeat it' - and yet those same people fail to learn from history, and because the statement is so true, they are doomed to repeat it.

How is it that only those most recently relieved of the buden of facism, socialism and communism seem to recognize the dangers of fascism, socialism and communism?

Are we destined to repeat history? It seems likely, though this time it will likely be much worse on everyone.

Does patriotism matter? Yes. It most certainly does... and eventually many, if not most Americans will come to realize that it does.

Read and Learn, Barack
Breathes there the man with soul so dead
Who never to himself hath said,
This is my own, my native land! ...
If such there breathe, go, mark him well;
For him no minstrel raptures swell;
High though his titles, proud his name,
Boundless his wealth as wish can claim
Despite those titles, power, and pelf,
The wretch, concentred all in self,
Living, shall forfeit fair renown,
And, doubly dying, shall go down
To the vile dust from whence he sprung,
Unwept, unhonored , and unsung.
--Sir Walter Scott (1805)


FOWG-
Ollie North, Sean Hannity, Rush and David Limbaugh, Newt Gingrich, Bob Dole, my father and uncles, everyone in my family, including me. There are millions and millions of patriots out there. We are the Silent Majority.

Since Obama knows a great many of Americans question his trustworthiness and loyalty, he now drapes himself in the American flag and suddenly "proudly" wears a flag lapel pin. CSPAN showed him recently reciting the Pledge of Allegience in Washington, D.C. with his hand over his heart (this time). Americans aren't that gullable! Obama tries to define patriotism as whatever he is. He hangs around anti-Americans, yet we are to give him the benefit of the doubt and call him a patriot?

Gimme a break!

Americans Who Risked It All
Everyone, please go to my blog today and read the column by Rush Limbaugh(from his website) about the signers of the Declaration of Independence, and what happened to them as a result of pledging THEIR LIVES, THEIR FORTUNES, AND THEIR SACRED HONOR, to establish for us the nation and the freedoms we hold dear today.

Semper Fi,
GOD BLESS AMERICA

FOWG, OPEN your eyes
There are MILLIONS of Patriots out there if you'd only look for them.
They ARE NOT the politicians, especially the Democrats/Liberals, who spend every waking minute looking for something to criticize about this country and/or it's leaders.

THEY ARE NOT the people who stand on street corner crying about what's wrong with this country, or who REFUSE TO SUPPORT THEMSELVES and sit at home whining because others(Democrats) aren't GIVING them enough to get by on.

THEY ARE the men and women who VOLUNTARILY join our Armed Forces, and if necessary go off to foreign lands to fight, and sometimes die, to protect us here at home from people who hate us, simply because we exist and ARE FREE.

THEY ARE the hard working men and women who get up every day and go to work and/or about their daily lives trying to raise and take care of their families.

THEY ARE the people who go to church on Sunday(or whatever there "Sabbath Day" is) and strive to live MORAL LIVES in spite of the immorality being spewed at them from every conceivable source.

THEY ARE almost everyone you see in your daily life who's trying to make this the great country that God intended it to be.

So DON'T tell us that you can't see American Patriots. They're all around you.

Patriotism
Mine is the generation that believed in our country; were proud of the flag; and we sang the Star Spangled Banner at all public gatherings, not just ball games. Our immigrant parents imbued us with a fierce love and loyalty for our country. We appreciated the right to pursue whatever goals we set for ourselves. And..... we did not expect the government to provide the basic necessities which are the resonsibility of each individual. When our country called we responded. I still well-up with pride when I see my flag flying free in the wind - when I gather with like-minded friends to pledge allegience to that flag and one nation under God. What is missing among the youth of today is patriotic celebrations - marching bands playing the resounding Sousa melodies - civic sponsored picnics and fireworks (where safe). Prominent men and women telling the young people how lucky they are and proud they should be to claim the name of American. We need more Thomas Sowells.

Patriotism and the world
Sadly, Dr. Sowell is correct. I hope it will be a lesson learned. That is, if history is not rewritten.

DOES PATRIOTISM MATTER
T. Sowell is always correct. Well said Grammshart in CA (of all places). J. A. Johnson in Mo.

Hey, Grammshart
You concluded:

"We need more Thomas Sowells."

That may be true, but I bet we'd be equally well off with more Grammsharts.

Thank you for what you wrote.

Marine's Dad: Thank you for what you wrote too. If I may try to find some common ground with you and FOWG, I got the impression that he was evaluating the patriotism of those who are in the public eye--supposed leaders. That said, you are correct that he (and all of us) should look for the John and Jane Patriots who surround us everyday.

FOWG
"All Dem. politicians are out, they are in it for the power."

I'd make an exception for Joe Lieberman. He seems like a "globalist," but he's been a lonely voice of reason in the Democrat camp (last I heard he still caucuses with them) on the War on Terrorists. He even jeopardized his Senate seat when he refused to abandon his pro-war stance and got booted out of the Dem party in the primary. That has to count for something.

Dr. Sowell is right- again
It never ceases to amaze me how this brilliant man hits the mark again and again.

These people he speaks about have always been with us and they are evil. But never before have they been handed the power they have now- over the media and the schools. They have nothing short of the destruction of the United States in mind. This country is the pinnacle of the best of Western civilization and if they can destroy us, the rest of the developed nations will not stand a chance.

Orwell's 1984 was just a story for most of us, and a blueprint for the worst of us. What the left has that makes it all possible is that part of our population that is so stupid as to believe what they are taught in public schools and what they are told by the mainstream press.

Profblog
Profblog: I agree with all except we SHOULS conscript our sons NOW before it's too late. We need to rid ourselves of a plaguing apathy. Every able bodied man should serve, if he is not able, let him serve elsewhere in the gov't for one year tours. As much as I hate gov't intervention in any form, I make one exception. Draft em' all, freedom is not free for the 1 million on active duty. Apparently it is for the other 299 million.

-None of my fellow Marines are pacifists (duh!) and would gladly die for this nation- I know we may be in the minority, but frankly, most military folks I know are right leaning-- conservatives are ready for war, liberals are not. Sowell hit the nail on the head- they treat us like victims, unfortunately when this country gets attacked, libs make the best target/victims. Everyone knows they won't shoot back!

Semper Fi

hooray for patriotism
although i dont believe im a menber of the group the author seems so anxious to rail against, i do have some ideas (surprise). i know of nobody,except right wing bloggers, columnists threaders and radio talk show hosts who have ever proved that the intelligensia is short on patriotism. they are afrid of ultra patriotism, excesive ethnocentric emotions and neurotuc patriotism. and rightfully so but unless your patritisn rums in one of these categopries, we are just as patriotic as you are and we deeply resent any implication that we are not. just because we know more and have the intelligence to do morw with what we know about the deltetious effects of excesive patriotism (and there is such a thing, look at germany in 1939) and are not afraid to broadcast what we do know doesnt mean that our love of country is one iota (thats a very small amount for those of you who dont know) less then yours. you have no evdence wxcept what is going on in some of your brains and that is suspect.because it is quite often befuddled with neurotic patriotism

U.S, History Books not like French
All of those stories on the French and how their schools changed everything in their textbooks regarding WWI remind me of how it is here in the U.S. since the 70s.

We didn’t just change the way the textbooks described the wars, we totally removed the wars from the textbooks. Our history books are now nothing more than illustrated magazines reflecting the joys of diversity through the achievements of blacks and womyn despite the adversity heaped on them by the white male oppressors.

War coverage is left to Hollywood and we all know how that goes.

MRCMRC
I'll settle for having my mind befuddled with patriotism but from your brief, meandering note I'm am afraid that industrial strength misspelling is only the surface of your problems. Your obvious neuroses should be of such concern that you ought consider seeking professional help. You could become a danger to someone that might actually care about you.

DOES PATRIOTISM MATTER?

Yes, with a little Patriotism...many Wars and battles have been WON !!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BZBtVBh9Ok0

Marshal Petain
What did Marshal Petain wind up doing, Dr. Sowell?

MRCMRC's post should be read by all.
It is listed July 2, 4:05 am EST. It's a perfect example of what we are up against. Someone who makes so many errors in his or her post that it's almost unreadable, and has the nerve to claim to be smarter than others.

MRCMRC is exactly what the liberals want.

Thank you for another ,great column.
I found it interesting that Obama was a "Polital Operative" on his way up to being a Senator.
Most interesting was to find out that they cconvince others to do what they want them to do.
I am sure it was a different Political Operative who convinced the People of the inner ccity of Wash. D.C. to burn down ttheir homes and stores.
Most were never re-built.

MRCMRC
states "although i dont believe im a menber of the group the author seems so anxious to rail against,"

Let me clear that up for you...Yes you are! In fact I can smell the "yellow" all the way down here in Virginia. Take yankees1068's advice and get a spell checker.

PEACE IN OUR TIME
If patriots has listened to the "anti-war" faction in the Revolutionary War,The War of 1812, and WWII, there would have been no USA for them to rail about. When the pacifists lost Vietnam, millions of innocents were slaughtered in Indochina. If their view prevails in the war against Islamic terrorist-murderers, we are one step closer to the Indochinese nightmare, but it won't be in some faraway land that they can ignore.

God bless President Bush and our troops for keeping American soil safe from Islamo-nazi attack since 9/11.




Patriotism
When the Flag passes by and and the Anthem is sung I still tear up.
This is my country and I love it.
My father was in WW1, My husband in WW11, my sons had draft cards for Viet Nam, My Gramndson-in law flies Planes off the deck of a carrier and has a wife and 2 children who are of course stateside.
I guess Patriotism runs in our family.
We are voting for McCain

Patriotism Matters?
The nebbish and the Copperheads. I hope these are merely warts and blemishes on my America, not uncontrollable malignancy.

How to develop patriotism in children?
Thomas Sowell shows us the way.

The Black history curriculum has a halfway plan. We tell our children who they are by telling them where they came from. Black history tells the American side but fails to tell the African side. For example, I recently met a girl who obviously came from Maasai stock but had no idea who they are, or what about the Zulu and the story goes continues.

The better we know who we are, the better we can chart our course through life.

I am retired, with a marginal pension. I must rely on Medicare. Do I support increasing health care benefits? No! Why, I don't think it will be beneficial to the country as a whole. This is part of my supporting my social group. Social animals hold their group higher than self interest or even self preservation.

The point is that we are part of a collective whole. That is part of patriotism. Without it, we begin to disintegrate as a strong, unified society.

All social animals live for the benefit of their community. When we begin to accept the principals of a liberal philosophy, we begin to lose sight of what is the basic strength that makes all social groups successful. As individuals social animals cease to exist but as a group, they cannot be defeated. Compare the lion, the Baboon, the Mercat and the lowly ant to non-social animals. Social animals have an easy life compared to solitary animals like the Cheetah (that is on a path to extinction).

Our country is being attacked from within by a cancer that is growing in our educational institutions. We are repeating the history of France and we will eventually collapse just as they did. We humans are unique; we are the only life form that is capable of self-destruction.

Can we learn from history before it is too late? I ask Dr. Sowell for his opinion.

Thanks for the history lesson and God bless.


Patriotism is in !!!!
I am surrounded by Patriots and once in a while an idiot.
There is a great story making the rounds.
A mam went back to France to visit his buddies graves and see the places he helped save.
The Inspector asked for Passport and he dug it out.
He was then asked if he had been to France before and answered yes.
The Inspector said then you shoul know you need to have your Passport ready.He answered "The last time I was here I landed on the beach and it was 3 days before I saw a French person.

FOWG
There are a lot of patriots out here. Many of us report daily here on Townhall. I am prepared for the potential of a civil war with the libs and I am prepared to give my life in defense of this country from the liberal/PC vermin.

Talent scout
Words of someone that loves his country and way of life.

Complimentary Article by Bill Bennett
Dr Sowell,
You are SO right. I think Bill Bennett's article will drive this point home on how AMERICA is being affected by this cancer.
http://article.nationalreview.com/print/?q=NmY5NzFkZDdiMDM1 NzNjM2IzNTcyODY4OWIzNjVhYzg

FLOWG-John Bolton
Yes Mr. Bolton is a patriot he like Mr. Sowells gives you informaton and you can see the truth. The first order of business when the dems took congress was to get rid of Bolton from the UN, this is because he stood up for America whenthe other countries pewed hate while benefiting from America. We need more people like Bolton in the UN, the new US ambassador you never hear from him and thats what they want to keep us in the dark. To be honest we are losing our patriotism when we illegal immingraton of millions and do not have the will to stop it, you would think JROTC in the schools would be good for the soon to be adults because it gives confidence and guidance to kids who parents are to busy to teach them. Military service does not make you the best man for the job as president, but to say a man who has not seen hardship in his like to put him above someone who had to show courage in the face of death is crazy and shows how stupid we have become. I do not like either candidate but we have to vote this time we cannot aford to throw away four years this time. The people who hate us have know problem with patriotism, death too America is song everyday.


Americans aren't that gullable!
Sorry to disagree but way too many Americans are led around by the nose by the academia and media.
If a teacher says it then it must be true. After all they are the educated! Even if they have never ventured into the real world where everything is not defined in a textbook.
If the media says it must be true. After all, they only report the facts! Even if they have selected the facts they want you to hear and then massaged them to present the message they want you to hear.
Dr. Sowell is dead right.

Patriotism Matters
There are millions of people who see charity as part of patriotism -- because our fellow Americans are not only human beings when they are fighting for us and with us, but when they need a hand up in a difficult time. The patriots among us are those who light up the phone lines when an abandoned baby is found, who rush to the scene of a house fire with comfort and assistance for the family sitting stunned on the fire truck -- are the people who fight the fires and who help rebuild after the fires, and the people who laboured after 9/11 regardless of their political affiliation, and the people who brought the workers food, water, comfort and thanks, including all the children who handed them hand-made thank you cards and drawings.

The patriots are those mothers who do not cling to their Baby Alex and shriek *You Cannot Have Him!* but who bravely kiss Alex goodbye at the foot of the ship, the plane, or the transport truck and pray for Alex and his comerades to come home safe and sound and to do good work until that day comes.

The patriots are not those who spit on soldiers and call them names, but are those who listen to them and thank them every time they get a chance.

There is a difference between a patriot and someone who plays a patriot on teevee.

Who will save us?
Who will save us in this world of terror and normal human behavior; i.e., to impose one's beliefs and opinions on others or simply greed, power hunger, and creaziness.

It surely will not be those who do not support patriotism! Perhaps all that will save us, as the Marines say, are a few good men!

I give thanks every day to those brave and patriotic military personnel who preserve our freedoms and lives!

New office
Since Dr Sowell has declined our pleas for him to run for President, Maybe we can create a new cabinet position for him.....
Secretary of Common Sense and Patriotisim.....

The American Patriot
The American Patriot to me is one who loves their Country and wish America no harm for any reason.

The American Patriot is male, female and children of every nationality, race, ethnic background and religion who wish America no harm for any reason.

The American Patriot are not a particular people from a particular place. They are the embodiment of the human spirit of freedom who wish America no harm.

The American Patriot ia proud of their flag and the Statue of Liberty which "welcomes your tired and your poor, the wretched refuse of your teeming shores, the homeless, tempest tossed" and wishes America no harm.

The American Patriot takes pride in the greatest Warriors in the history of man - the American Soldier and wish America no harm.

The American Patriot lives in the most prosperous land in the history of the world.
The root of that prosperity can be found in the Declaration of Independence, which recognizes the God given right of each person to the pursuit of happiness and the right to self determination and wish America no harm.

God Bless America and its' Patriots!


AudiR10

Patriotism is patriotism and charity is charity.

Patriotism is love of country.

Charity is lovingkindness toward your fellow man (refusing to use a politically correct term).

Patriotism is demonstrated by things like national service, and like rooting for your own side. Patriotic expressions can include waving the flag, and teaching your children how lucky they are to live in the best country that ever existed.

Charity is expressed by giving to the poor without expectation of return, overlooking minor transgressions and slights, and speaking kind words toward your neighbor.

When we confuse two different concepts to make ourselves feel better, we distort the language.

But of course, that would take us down the road of total deconstruction, a Leftie ideal.

So why do I even bother?

UncleB et al
UncleB wrote: "...I am prepared for the potential of a civil war with the libs and I am prepared to give my life in defense of this country from the liberal/PC vermin..."

God Bless you sir! I join with you.

Pappy et al
You Sir are an American Patriot and I salute you.

Marine's Dad and Son
I know for a fact that you and your son are living examples of the Great American Patriot!

Sir, may God richly Bless You and yours.


Dr. Sowell keep shining your light!
Dr. Sowell, you are indeed Sir, an American Patriot who wishes America no harm for any reason.

I pray that you live a long, healthy and prosperous life - you have earned it!

Thank you Dr. Sowell
We now know that Barack Hussein Obama has successfully confused "patiotism" with "internationalism" and is now now trying to indoctrinate the American elotorate.

Thank you for exposing this "marxist" commie-crat.

eddie...spring hill...fl

Thank You
MRCMRC is yet another example of the quality of a liberal education. His composition skills are equal to his rhetoric.

In response to FOWG, I think that the political class is the wrong place to look for patriotism. I seems to me that most of the problems currently plaguing the nation are directly attributable to this sorry lot. Maybe it is time that we had all elected officials sign an oath of loyalty to the United States since it is seems that some of them have loyalties that lie beyond the borders of this nation. Instead, the true great Americans are those who are wearing or have worn the uniform of this great nation. Included in this equation are the families of those brave men and women who defend us all. The American military personnel are those who do not whine and snivel, who place the good of the nation above their own creature comforts, and who are brave enough and tough enough to endure hardship. Thank God for our military and our military families. Thank you for your service.

BTW, I am signing on with UncleB and Retired Geek for the fight that is coming!

Americans who wish America harm
What are Americans who wish America harm for whatever reason? Those who want Obama elected to weaken this great Country and teach Americans a lesson?

America is in one of the most dangerous times in our history, a time when crazed glassy eyed extremists are creating nuclear weapons and have stated America will be destroyed.

Many Americans have stated that after 4 or 8 years of Obama maybe Americans will learn a political lesson.

John McCain will defend America until we can change politically. After Obama there may not be an America - this is 2008 not pre Reagan times.

What are Americans that wish America harm - you decide - I have.

God Bless America and its' Patriots!


Patriotic Americans
If not for Americans who love God and country,we would already have succumbed to the evil aimed at us from abroad,but even more so,right here in our own beloved country.

It is an eyeopener to read comments on these threads from American citizens who have no love for God or country.Some actually hate both.

Maybe this group could put their hatred on hold for the next few days,especially, and let the rest of us not have to be subjected to the vitriol.


My Country Tis of Thee
My country, 'tis of thee,
Sweet land of liberty,
Of thee I sing;
Land where my fathers died,
Land of the Pilgrims' pride,
From every mountain-side
Let Freedom ring.

My native country, thee,
Land of the noble free,
Thy name I love;
I love thy rocks and rills,
Thy woods and templed hills;
My heart with rapture thrills
Like that above.

Let music swell the breeze,
And ring from all the trees
Sweet freedom's song;
Let mortal tongues awake,
Let all that breathe partake,
Let rocks their silence break,
The sound prolong.

Our fathers' God, to Thee,
Author of liberty,
To Thee we sing;
Long may our land be bright
With Freedom's holy light,
Protect us by Thy might,
Great God, our King.

Thanks RG
I'll be sure to pass that on.

As usual Dr. Sowell nailed it!
When you stand for everything you stand for nothing. This internationalism BS is essentially a lazy and easy capitulation of principles. I am sorry to say but all cultures are not equal. If you can't recognize that our culture is superior - no nation ever accomplished so much in such a small time frame as the US did - then of course you will not want to defend it. If you play on a team but do not care about winning then you should get out of the way, sit on the bench and watch the game - life is a constant battle and winning is not only important it is all that matters. The greater the competition - free market - the greater the win - advances in technology & science - the greater the rewards - long prosperous interesting lives for as many as possible. That beats any big government schemes ever attempted.
Of course Obama doesn’t much understand any of this since he is comfortably numb all wrapped up in his Marxist Utopian blanket. In his world relentlessly talking about change and hope passes for action. And his wife who refuses to cheer for the USA until her Marxist hubby gets in charge can lead the cheers for him; Give me a B, give me an O, what does that smell; BO

Marines Dad
Damm&t Dad, I'm not supposed to cry at work here. Someone sent me an e-mail here at work the other day that had Lee Greenwoods song as the audio. That brought the tears as well. I am not overly prone to emotion. But, lately given the backdrop of what is happening to our country and as I read some of the anti American trash from the robertas and Hal's here the emotions seem closer to the surface. I am afraid for our way of life.

Geek and Katz
I am proud to stand with you. I include others who are proud of this country.........
Mechelle Obama notwithstanding.

Does Patriotism Matter?
Not to Marxists.

Sowell
Perfect Article. Those times in France do parallel our country and you did a great job enlightening us to it. The brainwashing education children are getting these days are ruining our country. Fortunately the libs are smart enough to stay away from this article as it pertains exactly to them and there is no rebuttal.

Great posts all the way down! It gives me hope that when that time comes for liberty or death in the future fight against socialism, we will choose liberty.

Typo
That should be Michelle Obama. Not Mechille.

Patriotism...
The inner conviction that we are blessed with freedom and that love of that freedom and the willingness to die for it has kept us free.

Patriotism is the honor of that sacrifice by all those who came before us, laying down a blueprint for us to use in keeping us strong.

The outward symbols of those sacrifices like the Flag and singing the National Anthem with hand over heart bring us back to what makes us America and causes tears of gratefulness for the opportunity to continue living in and sacrificing for our Freedom.

When I heard Barack Obama's words about these symbols I knew that he was no patriot and that he would never be heard saying, "Give me liberty or give me death".

Here are HIS words...

'As I've said about the flag pin, I don't want to be perceived as taking sides,' Obama said. 'There are a lot of people in the world to whom the American flag is a symbol of oppression. And the anthem itself conveys a war-like message. You know, the bomb s bursting in air and all. It should be swapped for something less parochial and less bellicose. I like the song 'I'd Like to Teach the World to Sing.' If that were our anthem, then I might salute it.'

BTW, he now wears a flag pin.

Patriotism & The Un-Fairness Doctrine
I just read on the Drudge report that Rush had signed an eight year deal worth $400 million. I hope the 'unfairness' doctrine never passes to oppose Rush and his pro American broadcasts.

I am of the Steven Decatur
school of patriotism. " Our country, right or wrong" sums it up nicely.

We do not need anyone to advise us on how to run our country, it is and always has been the model for the world to emulate.

What saddens and angers me is how people like obama and his crowd have been able to denigrate the values we were taught as children, values that were defended in blood by our forefathers who founded this country and those that followed.

Then this marxist takes a week to polish his image as a patriot while his surrogates attempt to paint John McCain as less than the American hero and inspiration to the nation that he is. If he really loved his country, he wouldn't have to do that.

Americans value their heros and they are serving today all over the world in defense of the greatest nation ever conceived by the mind of man.

God bless our troops and the USA!


SHOUTING
A WORD TO THE WISE FOR NANCY PELOSI, ET AL, HARRY REID, ET AL, AND SCOTUS: REMEMBER

WHEN KING GEORGE III AND PARLIAMENT CAUSED THE FIRST AMERICAN REVOLUTION, THEY HAD 3000 MILES OF OCEAN AND A LARGE ARMY AND NAVY BETWEEN THEM AND THE VICTIMS OF THEIR TYRANNY. THAT IS WHY THE AMERICAN PATRIOTS DIRECTED THEIR DISPLEASURE AT A SHIPLOAD OF TEA.

NOW, WHEN U. S. CONGRESS MEMBERS ARE CAUSING THE SECOND AMERICAN REVOLUTION, THEY ARE WITHIN WALKING DISTANCE OF THE PATRIOTS THEY ARE BETRAYING, AS WERE THE FRENCH ROYALS. CONSIDERING THE NUMBER OF THESE TRAITORS, AND THE SEVERITY OF THEIR OFFENSES, AMERICAN PATRIOTS WILL NOT SHOW THEIR DISPLEASURE BY THROWING TEA OVERBOARD TO SINK OR FLOAT OUT TO SEA.

Military personnel and Vets
If you can't hug them then thank them. Fly your flag. I, too, tear up as I stand as the flags go by and a Souza march is played. In fact, I tear up thinking about it. Yakov Smirnoff, "What a Country" let's keep it that way.

TALENT SCOUT
You're on a roll today. Impressive comments!

Patriotism
This is such a great point. I am reading Barack Obama's first book "Dreams...Father" and seeing his lack of American influences and am so very concerned about his lack of understanding of patriotism toward America. It's interesting you mention the teachers' unions as I remember reading years ago about John Dewey, an avowed humanist, who founded the NEA and his master plan for secular humanism they devised and have been successful at implementing in the American schools. I wish someone would enlighten on the subjects of:Barack Obama's real influences: his secular humanist mother, his real father who abandoned him and his Indonesian step-father who taught him to live according to a lack of ethics AS WELL AS the second subject I've mentioned the master plan for secular humanism in the American schools by John Dewey. Thank you for your wonderful article.

Reread my post
To those who truthfully cite your colleagues and kin as examples of patriots, I ask you to note the dependent clause "in the public eye".

How many entertainers, journalists(?) politicians or captains of industry?

There aren't many.

One of the comforting facts
is that when push comes to shove, it is the self-reliant, personally responsible people of action who determine the course of a nation. People who make decisions bsed on gritty reality. These people are rarely in the majority, but they don't have to be. As has been noted, the greatest danger to this country is collapse from within. If this possibility should become dangerously likely, due for example to stupid mob rule, or stupid pronouncemnts from a few black-robed idiots who can't read, self-reliant men will not easily give up their freedom. One young man who walks into a recruiting office has more impact on the positive future of this country than 100 standing around on street corners listening to boom boxes and bragging about how many chicks they got pregnant. One man who picks up a horse whip and walks out his front door has more effect than 100 sitting home saying the govt ought to do something.

Pistol
That is the one thing that really gives me hope for our future. The large majority is silent most of the time. If times get tough, the silent average American will come out and dictate where we are headed. America is right of center and when the liberals try and force socialism on us, I hope we wake up and take our country back. The silent must be silent no more.

Ron
It occurs to me that throwing something other than tea into the Potomac River could well be the worst case of waterway pollution since the zebra mussel made it into the Great Lakes.

Not all teachers
I am one teacher that stands up for those who have given their time and lives for their country. As I tell my students when they walk in, "I am sorry but you got me". I was told of most things about my country by my parents, and the teachers just confirmed it. Today's students are unaware of the great things our country did because no one told them. I tell them and try to make them proud of what we did. Did we do things that were always great, NO, and I tell them about that but in context of the day it was done.
Curt

Dr Sowell's columns mandatory reading
Dr Sowell's column should be front page news and mandatory reading for everyone in this country this Jul 4th.

With the liberals in charge of every school from kindergarten through university this country has become a laboratory for cooking up the idea of every culture is morally equivalent and no one should ever get the idea that their country is in any way superior to anyone else's. Liberals teach and preach that the only truly evil people, as exemplified by Bush, in this world currently and in the past are white european males.

Native Americans, black Americans, women, and all non europeans have been greatly harmed by the white founders of this country. The very idea of patriotic feelings for this disgusting hellhole is something that any member of BO's church of 20 years, Trinity UCC, would find abhorrent!

The shouts for joy and leaps of ecstasy by the assembled congregation at Trinity when Rev Wrong goes on one of his "God D@mn the USofKKK" rants tells me far more about what fellow members, Sen and Mrs BO, really believe about this country than all of him teleprompter read speeches put together.


As in art, the ending starts early

In Washington during WWII, in nursery
school, I remember singing the four major service anthems, regularly,by heart, at play, during recess, with my classmates. How many children today even know what a service anthem is, by any name, let alone how to sing it? Indeed,how many adults know? We're more 'enlightened' now.

Hitler attackd Poland
because he thought Britain and France would not have the guts to oppose him. Japan attacked us at Pearl Harbor, not because theythought they werewere stronger militarily, but because they thought we did not have the will to fight. These dictators came to these false conclusions (forgetting even a rat will fight when trapped, except in France) because they believed what they read in French British and American newspapers. Phrases like "all the Chinese in China are not worth one drop of American blood" and "who cares if those crazy nuts in Europe want to fight another war" were very popular here. No wonder Tojo figured America would accept peace on his terms and let Japan take over the Pacific rim.

There are a few Patriots still
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gN8t2NJH3Fs

Barack needs to read the final verse of
Our National Anthem: I'd like to teach the world to sing??? What a FOOL.

Here's the final verse of the Star Spangled Banner.

Oh! thus be it ever, when freemen shall stand
Between their loved home and the war's desolation!
Blest with victory and peace, may the heav'n rescued land
Praise the Power that hath made and preserved us a nation.
Then conquer we must, when our cause it is just,
And this be our motto: "In God is our trust."
And the star-spangled banner in triumph shall wave
O'er the land of the free and the home of the brave!

Curt
God Bless you Curt. Instill a little pride inthese youngsters and they will be better off for it. The fact that the NEA is CHANGING American history in the textbooks to fit their socialist agenda should be broadcast on ALL tv. I don't think a lot of folks really realize what is going on in our public schools.

France Fell
despite having an excellent battle tank, a cadre of battle hardened veterens, and excellent artillery.

Twenty two years of viscious partisan in-fighting between Communists, Socialists, and Conservatives sapped the national will.

Mrs Paddy
Have you (or anyone here) ever heard anyone sing the entire version of the National Anthem.
I don't recall ever hearing it.

Patriotism
Thanks Dr Sowell and all of the other patriots here today.

May I return the compliment to all
MD/MG 10:14 AM EST


TALENT SCOUT
You're on a roll today. Impressive comments!
---
Who have posted on this thread.
(except one)

What we have here is precious, worth defending, values that surpass human frailty.
Spiritual Truths that are Eternal, and do not die with any man.

True riches of this life are not in a bank or on Wall Street, they are Free and with-in the power of every living person to enjoy by a simple desire to learn about nature and Natures God.

The very Authority the Founders all turned to in daily prayer, seeking the Liberty that is only Found in Him and His Will.
I wonder how many of todays youth will take any of their free time to learn of the Founding Spirit of America?
And not be led by seeking some pleasure that passes away and is only sought again and again, never bringing the contentment of life the God of Nature gives freely.
But only to those who seek it.
Contentment in life is of more value than all the world's gold, and its free for the taking.
The path to it is being booby trapped by IED's of words of no value.
And the sad thing to watch is how it is swallowed up today by a thirsty and drought bringing emptiness of political detentions to the bondage of the human heart and soul.

God Bless America, again, with His Word is my Prayer




patriotiism
I was a teacher of U.S. History at the senior high school level for thirty-seven years. Yes, there were those who disagreed with the idea of patriotism. However, that did not describe the majority of ourstanding teachers I had the privilege of working with. Many of my students became members of our armed forces. They held positions in every branch of service of the United States of America. Several are still serving. I still am a member of the NEA. Never have I been forced to downplay patriotism by this organization. If the citizens of this greaat country have allowed any organization to have that type of unchecked power, we certainly are in deep trouble as a country. We have abdicated our individual and collective powers as citizens by not confronting or members of Congress. An overwhelming majority of the electorate do not show up at the polls, and those that do think that is all they have to do to keep our elected officials on their toes. Scapegoating one organization is only an easy way out. You are receiving this from a veteran of the United States Air Force, who is still active in veterans' affairs.

UncleB
No, I haven't ever heard all the verses sung (except a couple of times in church when it was a Patriotic Holiday of some kind).

We need to hear them all. It is a magnificent song.

BTW: I hope you had a moment to check out the Youtube link I noted. It is the Airman's Creed (I am a tad biased as my husband and Son are both in the USAF), but it is a great video that demonstrates not everyone sits around and disparages our nation like B.O.

I'm surprised
Ted Kennedy and Jean Fraud Kerry haven't petitioned to rename New England's football team

patriotiism
I was a teacher of U.S. History at the senior high school level for thirty-seven years. Yes, there were those who disagreed with the idea of patriotism. However, that did not describe the majority of ourstanding teachers I had the privilege of working with. Many of my students became members of our armed forces. They held positions in every branch of service of the United States of America. Several are still serving. I still am a member of the NEA. Never have I been forced to downplay patriotism by this organization. If the citizens of this greaat country have allowed any organization to have that type of unchecked power, we certainly are in deep trouble as a country. We have abdicated our individual and collective powers as citizens by not confronting or members of Congress. An overwhelming majority of the electorate do not show up at the polls, and those that do think that is all they have to do to keep our elected officials on their toes. Scapegoating one organization is only an easy way out. You are receiving this from a veteran of the United States Air Force, who is still active in veterans' affairs.

News ALERT



I just heard General Wesley Clark talk about John Kennedy, and Clark said,

"Well, I don't think riding in a little boat and getting sunk is a qualification to be president."

American exceptionalism
Despite the corrosive effects of left-wing influences, America is blessed with millions of patriots. Love of country runs wide and deep, but we tend to underestimate it. That's because our intelligentsia -- journalists, academics, entertainers -- are dominated by narcissistic liberals, and their voice gets heard far out of proportion to their true representation.

For every left-wing act of anti-Americanism, there are countless acts of patriotism by ordinary people. Thus, San Francisco passes a resolution declaring a military recruiting center an "unwelcome intruder" and it's reported. What's not reported are countless acts by people serving selflessly in one way or another.

Perhaps the biggest gulf between left and right is love of country. Conservatives overwhelmingly believe in American exceptionalism -- the idea that America is a unique force for good in the world. Liberals tend to think of America as the root cause of the world's problems.

You will often hear left-wingers saying things like "dissent is the highest form of patriotism." In fact, Obama made a similar comment this week in his so-called patriotism speech. What drivel! Under this perverted logic, the people who chant "Death to America" are the greatest patriots of all, for their dissent is absolute.

In a very real sense, the outcome of the election will be determined by people who love America and those who don't. For that reason alone, McCain will win.

GnuCarSmell
Wow, I'm privileged to see your comments as the most recent ones. I'm blessed and moved by your comments. Not much more I could add to that. I must agree with you, wholeheartedly. At times I'm concerned, but deep down I know you're right.

Love of country must be stronger than the opposite. John McCain will win.

Mark Twain
Mark Twain on Patriotism:

“Patriotism is supporting your country all the time, and your government when it deserves it”.


uber-acknowledgement
Uber-acknowledgement of what's shameful in our history, is dangerous and ignorant too. Move on from the shame, to step back up to honor and patriotism because of what's truly great.

Patriotism is the refuge of people who know how honorable his/her country truly is, despite its human flaws.

Sophie
Who is the right country? Saying Iraq is the wrong one implies you know which one the right one is.

MRCMRC Neurotic Yellow Belly
Your idea of patriotism is impugning the character and motives of your so-called "neurotic" patriots who give their lives to provide YOU the very freedom of speech to do so. Here is an inconvenient FACT for you MRCMRC: You exist the way you do because of what they do, not the other way around.

Your definition of patriotism is not patriotism; it's weasel-ism.

"...we are just as patriotic as you are and we deeply resent any implication that we are not"

The only thing you and the self-benighted intelligensia resent is anyone calling you on it. Then, you puff up your yellow bellies and call us Cro-Magnon men, mount your high horse and ride away from any duty to country or your countrymen.

Sunshine patriots
As Thomas Paine once said those who go around telling us they are patriots so they look good will leave when the going gets tough. Actions speak louder than words, yet our populace are confused with the words candidates speak. We should not listen to their words but watch their actions. hose who now condemn our action in Iraq fail to remember that we are trying to give freedom to those who have in their life never known. What type of people are we becoming if that is not noble.

Sophie
Well, the lift couldn't stand the All American slant here. She just HAD to do the lib thing and put America down. A TRUE loved one will overlook a few minor flaws we ALL have and embrace the overall good. Sophie I feel so sorry for you.

Patriotism and Scoundrels
Sophie writes "Patriotism is very often the last refuge of a scoundrel"

So Sophie, is that why B. Hussein has decided to wear an American flag on his lapel?

Mix up
Let's not mix up true patriotism, love of country, with fraudulant patriotism here. The people who get so defensive when you question their patriotism, are the ones who continually confuse the two.

And the people who know true patriotism have no trouble distinguishing true from counterfeit.

I'm sure Raph Waldo Emerson understood the difference.

See Sophie...
this is where we differ.

You say, "A good citizen does not say "my country right or wrong"

A good citizen loves his/her country when it's right and, because they love it, try to right it when it's wrong."

I would say, a good citizen does say "my country right or wrong". A good citizen, because they do love their country even when it is wrong, like they love their own child even when they are wrong, works to right what is wrong because of an abiding and unconditional love.

I am not an overindulgent parent or citizen of America. My love of family and of country is unconditional all of the time. When my children were wrong, they were firmly corrected not made to grovel for forgiveness, they remained able to hold their heads up and move forward with a better understanding of right and wrong.

America is not perfect because we are a nation of human beings but what America stands for has always been and I pray always will be, individual liberty.


Patriotism & Nationalism
When I compare this country to the rest of the world...the rest of the worlds fails in comparison. Greatly.

Ha!
I love it.

It figures that Sophie would get her definition of patriotism from a frenchman.

Sophie, patriotism is not the love of a people.

It is the love of your country and what it stands for.

American patriotism is a love of liberty and freedom and everything America stands for, and a willingness to stand up and fight for those ideals.

LOL What a maroon!

Sophie...Are you prepared?
Sophie we see you are very prepared in whipping out quotes from Emerson and Charles de Gaulle, thanks...but are you prepared to give your life in defense of America country when duty calls?

Or is that just a duty left to the "blind"?

And, we are still waiting for you to answer the question that was posted out here earlier about which country is "right" to invade. Because as CKHustler rightly concluded, you seem to know the answer. Inquiring minds want to know.


Clarence Darrow's wrong
True patriotism recognizes imperfections, but forgives them and moves on to national honor, dignity, and pride.

Any other people you can quote with misconceived ideas???

A patriot I knew
Someone earlier supported return to the draft. I oppose that. I joined the Air Force in 1970 and served with draftees and people threatened by the draft. Believe me you don’t want them serving with you. What you want are patriot volunteers—like my friend from basic training, Asbury. He was from Georgia. He was offered a chunk of money by his mother to run away to Canada. He was also offered a commission by the Air Force because he had a degree in psychology. He turned them both down. Politically, he was an anti-war liberal; but he had a sense of duty and a sense of honor, plus he was a Southerner. He spent his four years at Charleston AFB as an aircraft mechanic. He was a Patriot.

Hmmm...
"That is not often the case with the "my country right or wrong crowd". They will support immoral policies in the name of 'nationalism'. They refuse to listen to criticism of their beloved fatherland. They label reasonable dissent as treason."

Right or wrong, it does happen to be my country. Do we make mistakes? Of course, we are human. Immoral policies? Name one...

And what's your definition of "reasonable dissent"? Is it vandalizing recruiting centers? Spitting on soldiers returning from war?


Sophie
It is apparant I don't need to beat you up any more. My fellow patriots have done a fine job.

Sophie
If you want to fix what's wrong with our country, start by repairing the damage caused by your spiritual forbears, and the damage that their "descendants" would wreak upon our nation.

If you truly cared, you would not let a complete idiot like Obama jump in and do everything he can to destroy everything that makes America great so that he can try to rebuild it according to his wishes.

If you truly loved America, you would quit disparaging those who are true patriots.

But what is there to expect?

You are just as much a soulless, immoral, hateful, and disrespectul freak as any America-hater. And yes, I do say you hate America. If you loved her, you would not try to tear her down and sully her with your dirt-filled hands.

Sophie...I see
So you're prepared to die for your country only if, say, Washington D.C. or New York are smoldering holes in the ground (or maybe you and your family don't live in those areas, so not quite yet)? And only if George W. Bush is not president? Or both? One, not the other? What?

Protecting the country from the evils in the global neighborhood transcend George W. Bush, Sophie. You're not suffering from BDS are you?

Sophie
I forgot to mention the observation that your BDS is likely you biggest problem. Get over it he will be gone soon. McCain will keep us there for 100years. So you won't be around to see the end.

Addition to my 1:15 post
Sophie, by spiritual forbears, I mean the hippies and yippies and freaks from the sixties and seventies, who did nothing more than tear down the culture around them and they replaced it with nothing, NOTHING, of value.

I live in a nation of cowards
Conservatives talk a lot about patriotism, but when push comes to shove, its all hot air.

I come from the school of "personal responsibility". You know, the "put up or shut up type". I was a Sgt of Marines in Viet Nam. The peace movement of that time was filled with yellow bellied cowards. Once they were no longer subject to the draft, their commitment to peace went out the door.

The war mongering right was just as bad. Their attitude was "let's you and him fight". Actually going down and enlisting came far behind "other responsibilities", like getting a hair cut, etc.

Once, when I started counting noses amongst my friends and coworkers, I realized what a small minority patriots really are. The opportunity to be a patriot is always present, but love of country is not. Most of you would rather be an "ism".

Patriot or patriotism. Please don't confuse the two or think the "ism" is the same as the fact.

Sophie writes:
Patriotism is very often the last refuge of a scoundrel (see the majority of Republicans).

-----
With little hope for understanding will breach the wall between Sophie and me, and have ignored her for the most part, as one who comes to mock everything I hold sacred.
She seems to have settled down into expressing a view point she holds without the normal mocking she is filled with most of the time.

But instead uses a scandalous accusation at her fellow Americans who are republicans.
As if a party alone makes one a Patriot or a Traitor.

Patriotism is always Honorable for an American, be he democrat or republican.
This Honor is the refuge a person who has NO HONOR seeks to find refuge in.

Barack Hussien Obama, the scoundrel who is the one now seeking refuge in that Honor.

And cannot find any hiding place with-in the Positive atmosphere only a True American Patriot can find.
And is not a refuge for him at all, but the place he lives.

I do not stop loving America simply because we have a phony like this Marxist running for President.
My country allows fools to speak up and all the people can judge them to reject or accept.

Many people buy into false ideas, and BO generates lie after lie and you are welcome to follow that moron to hell as far as I am concerned.
And will support you getting there with him.
Simply because as republican(formerly, now independent)I am a Patriot that still believes in the ideas that made America the best nation on the earth.
We are very tolerant of morons, and complainers, false accusers, even liars like you, Sophie.
Who has no respect or tolerance but for your own selfish little world.

I find joy and happiness in following the biblical command to allow the ignorant to be ignorant, still.

Its the perfection of the Law of Liberty from the Creator who gives all men freedom of will, to choose their own poison.
And you are full of it

Sophie, Operation Chaos...
never crossed my mind, and somehow I doubt that Corporate America and/or Wall Street would be involved because of the effect it might have on the bottom line.

On the other hand I do think that Corporations would have a pretty good reason to want to cultivate political allies on the left in light of the way their are demonized by the Left and because BHO says he will raise taxes on them.

I don't think you will find many conservatives who are not interested in keeping this country on the right path. The problems arise when we see different paths as the right one.

I prefer to err on the side of American exceptionalism.

Twain, bah
I'm sure Mark Twain's being sarcastic. And even if not, even an American giant can have moments of delusion.

No true patriot here would seriously doubt Twain's patriotism, love of America, nor that he'd be voting for John McCain.

Are we indulging ...
In argument by cliche? "My country, right or wrong", "Patriotism is the the last refuge of a scoundrel?" These are catchy, over-used phrases being thrown out in lieu of actual arguments.

Could you try to make your argument without them? Could you try to understand what they mean before you throw them out there? Have you ever stopped to think that "patriotism is the last refuge of a scoundrel," might be intended to tell us something of the nature of scoundrels rather than the nature of patriotism? Or had you ever gone further and wondered whether this was a perceptive observation or merely a famous quote mistakenly, and uncritically, being accepted as received wisdom merely because it was a famous quote?

I get tired of these arguments from authority as well. An idea is strong or weak based on its own merits, not because some famous person said it. Quotes are fine; back them up with arguments.

Liberals & Patriotism
These anti-American,Bush-hating liberals come here to spew their hatred and many get into debates with them. That only gives them more chances to get their points across.

It then goes from the sublime to the ridiculous. They should be cut down to size and then ignored. They have a mental block caused by BDS and only a lobotomy will help them.

PATRIOTISM
Our men and women who wear and who have worn our country's military uniforms and their families are truly PATRIOTS of our country.

These PATRIOTS have taken the 'oath of allegiance to serve and defend our country against all enemies foreign and domestic'. They have sworn to support and defend the US Constitution of the United States of America.

We have been infiltrated by enemies of our country. They are well entrenched in all departments of government. Some are even in National Security positions.

Apparently there are many in the biased, liberal news media. ALL of these people continue to undermine the security of our country.

On July 4th, 2008, 232 years ago the Declaration of Independence was created and signed by our fore fathers. Americans became free citizens of the United States of America and free of tyranny from leaders of foreign countries.

I know there are strong PATRIOTS who have not worn our military uniforms. When you PATRIOTS decide you have had enough from these Marxists and Muslims who want to kill us and destroy our country...THE WORLD WILL BLOODY WELL KNOW WE ARE NOT TAKING ANYMORE. WE WILL FREE OUR COUNTRY OF OUR DOMESTIC ENEMIES NOW AND FOREVER.


"A nation can survive its fools and even the ambitious, but it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is formidable, for he is known and carries his banners openly against the city, but the traitor moves among those within the gates freely, his sly whispers rustling through the alley and heard in the very halls of government itself. He rots the soul of a nation; he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of the city; he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist."
Cicero


good ole Mr Twain
Context is everything when you're referring to historical Americans' quotes - and Mark Twain lived right in the heart of the Civil War era -- a deeply conflicted time in American history, even for true patriots. Considering the context Twain lived in, his quotes have nothing to do with justifying liberal animosity towards the U.S. today.

Nice try. Plus, he'd love Fox News and the GOP today. No doubt about it.

The French Salute
I pray that I am dead by the time most Americans will do the French salute (hands in the air) and patriotism is completely dead in this country.

Talent Scout
*applause*

Sophie, you referred to...
acknowledging what is shameful and forgive me if I assume wrong but I think you were referring to slavery perhaps.

I would just say this, if I were a descendant of American slaves and knowing of their hardships, I think that I would still be able to find a blessing in it, by being raised in America and not back in Africa somewhere starving or dying from Malaria or AIDS without much hope.

Maybe that is why America does offer more hope to the sick and starving in Africa than any other nation. Could that be an effort to right a wrong? America as a nation, through government, the military and individuals is always among the first to reach out in times of disaster all around the world.

Does Patriotism Matter?
"In the real world, pacifism kills, and the mere pose of pacifism is just another front for cowardice." James Lewis

Who is free and I am not free?
Having the perfect liberty to criticize America for ANY wrong, that is common to mankind all across the world, I prefer to promote the IDEAS America is Founded in.

There really are people in the world who hate those IDEAS.

Yet they have been given the freedom to come here, and work against these ideas.

The insincerity of socialists among us cannot be hidden from view, as real American Patriots have the EYESIGHT of the Eagle.

The Divine Judgment is taking place NOW, and all men are being Judged from the BOOK OF LIFE, today.

The True Judgment of God is working in every living human being, RIGHT NOW.
As all men stand before the Judgment Seat of Jesus Christ, right now, today, now.

Now is the day of Salvation
Now is the Day of Judgment.
Every man decides his own judgment from the two choices the Laws of Nature has provided all living humans with.
Truth or lies
Good or evil
Happiness or complaints
Fear or courage
Love or hate
Life OR DEATH is in the hand of every man to decide his own fate.
This is the the ONLY predestination of God Almighty.
Divine Justice will not be denied by any man.
We reap what we sow, and its divine justice to let the fools be fools, and the socialists reap what they sow.
Their deceitful ways will fill their own hearts and minds and take them all to their place of promise.
Heaven or hell, both are promised lands.




Sophie - ancient history
No, Sophie, what we are celebrating Friday is not ancient history; it is the celebration of continuing history.

The Dems (Kennedy and Johnson) got us into Viet Nam. Clinton got us into Bosnia. At least the continuum of history will report it that way. Therefore, I will assume your blame is bi-partisan and Dems cannot claim to be patriots. Call Obama and tell him to cancel the rest of his 'patriotism tour'. I'm tired of it.

OK
"It is trying to hold the administration accountable for its incompetency and deception."

Did you hold the Clinton administration accountable for selling secrets to the Chinese? For their incompetence in dealing with Bin Laden when they had the opportunity?

No, you didn't, you screeched and whined about how people were attacking him because of a BJ...You only get on that self-righteous high horse when it comes to conservatives. You are a bigot...

"Immoral policies? Slavery, Japanese-American Concentration Camps, support of aphartheid (sp?), support of dictators throughout the third world, Iraq war, etc..."

This is all hysterical nonsense!! Salvery IS ancient history, it's over. Been over for almost 150 years. It was wrong, and Americans died defeating it. Why not celebrate it's defeat? Because you really don't like your country.

Japanese internment camps (not concentration, get your hysteria under control please) were wrong. They were also discontinued...

And I love how liberals constantly call Iraq "immoral". I suppose Saddam was real sweetheart, huh? He was the epitomy of immoral, but that doesn't matter.

"Let me remind you that we are celebrating something on Friday that is also 'ancient history'. When are you gonna get over it?"

This is by far the dumbest thing you've posted. Get over our independence?? It should be celebrated everyday because it's NOT over, like everything else you screech about.

sorry, you lose...

To the Majority of Posters
I have family members buried in Arlington Cemetery. Those who died in wars buried in our family cemetery have "He gave his life for love of country" on their markers. I have enjoyed reading your posts.

Also
Just wait til Obama announces Jimmy Swaggert as his veep. They will make histroy and over turn Roe v. Wade within the first week!

Gotta love those evangelicals!!

Wow....
"A man can be a Christian or a patriot, but he can't legally be a Christian and a patriot--"

I guess since Obama is now an evangelical christian, he's not a patriot...I guess he doesn't have to feel bad about not wearing the flag pin.

I guess he'll go with a cross pin instead....

BDS Sufferers
BDS sufferers have such a need to been seen and read,they will stoop to using numerous monikers to avoid getting deleted by th.

It is sad to see how low they will go.They even bring up Slick Willie.Bill Clinton is a traitor,a liar,a molester of women and best of all an IMPEACHED EX-PRESIDENT.

Hey Sophie
Remember that poster from a few months ago, Jude the Obscure?

Sophie
I aint NEVER gettin over what we will HONOR on this coming Friday. Y ou have up untill that statement been a mere annoyance. You have NOW shown y our true colors as someone who does not love this country. If you cannot honor this coming Friday you are a TRAITOR. And you have NO RESPERCT for this country and what the people who founded it had to go thru to give you your rights today. You are UNpatriotic. No matter how you rationalize your disdain.
You are also a FOOL.

Max Power
Barack Hussein Obama is a changling. He changes who he is for each audience he is speaking to. Of course,they hear nothing he is saying,anyway. Just sit like trained seals and clap and guffaw.

He is also like a chameleon. Changes color when it is convenient. White when he needs it and black when he needs that.

Everyone loves Sophie
Sophie, where in the world did you get your interpretation about that Twain comment?

He is not talking about the incompatibility of Christianity and patriotism, he is saying that patriotism comes more easily than practicing Christianity. Did you just Google the key words "Christianity," "Patriotism," and "Mark Twain," and think you got a defense of your argument merely because you got a hit?

And are you going to continue with these arguments from authority, as if you can make a case merely by quoting someone? Everyone can be wrong -- the strength is in their ideas, not in their name.

Sophie
Really? Clinton never led us into a costly misadventure?

Do you not remember Bosnia?

Where our troops still are and won't be leaving anytime soon?

Oh, but you and the other libfreaks don't like to talk about that, do you?

Oh, yeah, and what about Somalia? Have you forgotten that as well?

What a maroon!

yeah
But that's not how you meant it, c'mon, don't play semantics now...

Clinton had a few opportunities to get Bin Laden but blew, or rather, got blown instead of doing his job.

I wonder if 9/11 would've happened had he done something when he should've? Anyway, we'll never know now.

As for your assertion that there was "manipulated" intelligence, who manipulated it? How was it manipulated to fool nations into going to Iraq? Do you have proof that it was some sinister plot as opposed to just bad intel?

BTW, I wouldn't have gone into Iraq, I thought it was a bad idea and a mistake especially with Afghanistan still unfinished. I have been pretty forth-right with that assertion. So I am not a lock-step Bush follower.

PATRIOTS
I heard a great story on Glen Beck this morning.It was about the chances ordinary american citizens took in our early history.Everyone knows Paul Revere,but very few know about the people that helped him.

Huh?
"there are many americans today who remember being beaten in order to have the right to vote.

Having dogs and hoses turned on them.

The family and friends of those who were murdered in lynchings and bombings still remember this "ancient history"..."

This was back in the sixties, it hasn't happened since. Besides, what's your point??

"Those who fought for these basic rights are also patriots."

No argument here...

"But you don't like when we bring up that kind of history do you? It's so unpleasant..."

Don't be so silly. We have to remember the past in order not to repeat it. But you define this country by it's mis-steps, I define it by the way we learn from these mis-steps and the steps we take to correct them.

Everything you're whining about is a non-issue. There are no more lynchings or dogs or hoses turned on black people.

You're coming a little unglued, maybe you should take a break...

Whoa
Now all Americans, everyone born in the U.S., is getting implicated as responsible for lynchings and bombings - also turning dogs and hoses on innocent people.

No justification for patriotism, when every American is responsible for this stuff.

Sophie, about Jude
it's a real pity he did not rub off on you any more than what he did.

You could have learned a great deal from him in how to converse with others in a respectful, reasonable manner.

What a pity.

But there's something you don't know about Jude.

Curtal Friar
If Clinton had retaliated against the terrorists for all their bombings,Bush wouldn't have needed to do it.Old Slick was,is,and always will be a coward.


majic johnson....woo woo.

Peace, Sophie
Everyone loves Sophie who loves lies writes:

2:03 PM EST
Subject: Blah blah blah Talent Scout
save your religious goobledeegook for another column. This one ain't about christianity or are you going to claim that God is an american?
---
ts:
You trying to boss me around again Sophie?
I posted just for you my dear, knowing how hot the torment of my posts are for you.

Is God an American?
Good question.
Although its from a petty mind, filled with the mocking of a fool you prove to be.


Ben has a good thought on this.
He is a Friend for sure

In the beginning of the contest with Britain, when we were sensible of danger, we had daily prayers in this room for divine protection. Our prayers, Sir, were heard and they were graciously answered.


… And have we now forgotten this powerful Friend? Or do we imagine we no longer need His assistance?

I have lived, Sir, a long time and the longer I live the more convincing proofs I see of this truth: "That God governs in the affairs of man." And if a sparrow cannot fall to the ground without His notice is it probable that an empire can rise without his aid?

We have been assured, Sir, in the Sacred Writings that except the Lord build the house, they labor in vain that build it. I firmly believe this.

I also believe without His concurring aid we shall succeed in the political building no better than the builders of Babel; ...

I therefore beg leave to move that henceforth prayers imploring the assistance of heaven and its blessing on our deliberation be held in this assembly every morning before we proceed to business.



ModMark writes:
Subject: Picking on those Frenchies
"I pray that I am dead by the time most Americans will do the French salute (hands in the air) and patriotism is completely dead in this country"

I minor point to all..

The Nazis at the start off WW2 kick the crap out of everyone. They swept thru Poland and eastern Europe. They turn to France and rolled to the coast and watch the Brits scurry back to their Island.

The only thing that save Britain was a stretch of water.

They then charged thru the USSR, only the vastness of the country saved them.

Even the US got beat during the initial battles in Africa.

Sorry, France was no different in WW2 than other nations.

Actually it was. It was the only occupied country where the government actively collaborated with the Germans, and ordered its troops fight the Allies.

The Majority Does Not Love Sophie writes
Uncle B
You're not paying attention.

I never said I'm not honoring the 4th of July.

I just don't pick and choose only the pretty parts of american history like some so called 'patriots' do.

All you do pick is the ugly parts. You must really hate this nation.

Sophie
If you are a citizen of this country, then you are just as guilty of the dogs and water hoses as ANY of us are or aren't. You are just grasping at straws. You have no standing here. You are an America hater. Go somewhere where you are "apprreciated". From my perspective you are just as worthless as robert that you have apparantly called in to help you.

The Majority Does Not Love Sophie writes
Subject: Ta Ta patriots!
In conclusion, I'll reiterate:

If your patriotism cannot withstand a bit of honest criticism and self reflection, it ain't worth much

Like all your posts.

Reality Against Patriotism
Sowell once again confuses abstractions with real life.

Real life is complex and unpredictable and has a way of demolishing abstractions.

As Obama said, we have a country composed of diverse people, races, religions, geographical areas; these are the hard facts that demolish abstractions such as "Patriotism."

It is "Patriotism" which must be malleable to the hard facts and not the other way.

Sowell will never understand this, being cursed with a narrow economic Ph.D. point of view.

Patriots
The most fortunate thing for America is our nearly physical isolation from all but two nations. In the event of a perceived threat from one of these neighbors, we might have time to recover our senses and become Americans again. If not, most of us know some Spanish.

Proud Liberals writes:
Sowell will never understand this, being cursed with a narrow economic Ph.D. point of view.

Uh, what's your PhD. in?

Gratitude
Regardless, every American has lots to be grateful for and lots to be proud of - we acknowledge our flaws, then move on to freeing the next entire nation of oppressed people.

Patriotism causes it to work heroically like this - and it'll continue no matter what how much the liberals and Pres Bush-haters fight it.

Sophie
A QUOTE from her lowness Sophie


Let me remind you that we are celebrating something on Friday that is also 'ancient history'. When are you gonna get over it?

Are you going to deny this you FOOL!

The Majority Does Not Love Sophie writes
Well Curtal Honey, Did Jude
give you the unflatttering line about me performing oral sex on Clinton?

Sorry Honey! Criticism from hypocrites only makes me laugh.

You want to see a hypocrite, look in a mirror.

ModMark
"And how is that done, by kissing your *ss"

No, by NOT saying stupid things like this:

"Let me remind you that we are celebrating something on Friday that is also 'ancient history'. When are you gonna get over it?"

This is just plain dumb, don't you agree? Or are you gonna waffle because your bestest buddy sophie belched it out?

Roberta disguise
Roberta aka Lumberjack@%* has stopped signing his stealth postings at the bottom of his drool.

ModMark
Go re-read Farmer's Wife's comments on this thread. Get a clue, won't you?

UncleB
Subject: Roberta disguise
Roberta aka Lumberjack@%* has stopped signing his stealth postings at the bottom of his drool

I am not, nor have I ever been Robert

Sophie
No, Jude did not give me that line, or any line for that matter.

Jude couldn't give me anything, because Jude was not real.

He was fictitious, a creation.

I was posting as Jude for a while, and proved that you're about as sharp as a lump of clay.

Further, what you may not be aware of, is that you have two other individuals in and around TH whom you view as buddies or comrades, but in truth are just as fictitious as was Jude.


Roberta
Does Hal D know you are/were going down on slick willie? We''ll make sure he gets the info.

The Majority Does Not Love Sophie writes
Subject: How many people died in Bosnia?
How much did it cost?

And Somolia was a tragic embarrassment, but in terms of cost, it's a minor blip.

That led to 9/11

Patriotism
I used to think that both of my army officer parents were overly patriot. Dad fought in Germany WWII Mom a nurse in the South Pacific.(3 silver stars) and she wasn't quiet sure why she got them. She was doing her job.
Don't know Dad's war record.
Patriotism matters. But I didn't realize until 2 years ago when mom died how much. She came into the 21st century computer literate and fighting tooth and nail for the principles she was reared with. What is lacking in this country today are principles like some things are right, some are wrong. Some things you should be ashamed of. (It took me 5o years to believe that one.) You are not an accident. Life is precious. Traveling the world I know without a doubt there is no place like the USA.
Happy Joyous 4th of July!

UncleB
LumberJack is not Robert.

Read this back to yourself a couple times...

JA
AMEN!!! to your post.

The Majority Does Not Love Sophie writes
Subject: Oh I see the "america hater" accusations
are flying.

Quite predictable.

Let's see if you can guess the author of the following quote.

Why of course the people don't want war. Why should some poor slob on a farm want to risk his life in a war when the best he can get out of it is to come back to his farm in one piece? Naturally the common people don't want war neither in Russia, nor in England, nor for that matter in Germany. That is understood. But, after all, it is the leaders of the country who determine the policy and it is always a simple matter to drag the people along, whether it is a democracy, or a fascist dictatorship, or a parliament, or a communist dictatorship. Voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked, and denounce the peacemakers for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same in any country.

Since I have never seen you say one thing positive about this country, I can only assume you hate it.

Funny...
....but I noticed in that Hermann Goering quote, no mention of a "republic".....

My Favorite JFK Quote: What happened to
Dems?

Let every nation know, whether it wishes us well or ill, that we shall pay any price, bear any burden, meet any hardship, support any friend, oppose any foe to assure the survival and the success of liberty.

ModMark
Not one of her best, but typical of her posts.

Have a great Independence Day...

"intellectuals"?
our intellectuals have become citizens of the world instead of American patriots.
*****
our "intellectuals" have become anti-American citizens of the world instead of American patriots.



Sophie
LOL

You calling me a hypocrite is like Monica Lewinsky calling anyone else a sl*t.

And for the record, you were drooling over Jude when he was on the scene.

And you would be advised to not forget about the other two that are out there.

So, did JFK
mean what he said? Or was he just saying a bunch of high-sounding rhetoric like B.O.???

Sophie
For instance, you might ask yourself why it is that ModMark only shows up after I have been on TH for at least an hour, and how we never post at the same time.

Of course I'm not saying he's fictitious, but you just never know.

Two of the posters in your little world are not all they're cracked up to be.

To be fair, though, from now until Friday, there will be an occasional post where I will leave you a clue. They will be hidden clues, but if you have any brains at all, you could possibly spot them and figure it out.

Mrs. Paddy
JFK is probably about as close to conservative as he is democrat(the democrats of today). His most famous quote.

"My fellow Americans, ask not what your country can do for you, ask what you can do for your country. "

That is conservative ideology. Democrats today read

Ask not what you can do for your country, ask what your country can do for you.

The overall ideology of democrats that far back were closer to Republican beliefs today than democrats today.

Sophie
You only became rude till "Jude" turned on you.

Till then, you had a lot of advice and pointers and words of comradeship for old Jude.

Then again, I could be lying about the whole thing. Or not.

Could be I am just trying to discredit a milquetoast lib. Wouldn't you feel foolish if that were the case and you found that you were criticizing someone who you normally would agree with?

You'll never know......

Sophie
Did the Indians kill each other? Did those tribes ever war with each other? What happened during one of those wars? Did they ever take land from each other? Please...enlighten me...because if they did, then how are we any different from them doing it to themselves?

CKHustler
Trust you to see the truth in the question posed.

Ugh...
More absolutely worthless statements from sophie.

Indians?? Really?? The indians?? Is that all you have??

Well rest assured, Obama with convert those Godless heathens to christianity regardless if he wins the election or not. He will be a fine christian, and the the Indians will be truly blessed....

ck hustler
the indians also made slaves of their defeated enemies. They raided other tribes to steal women for wives. The indians also tortured and brutally murdered others they defeated in battle.

But to the the left, all indians were just ignorant victims only doing the things taught them by the euros. That it went on for centuries before the euro's ever arrived doesn't mean anything.

My experience living out west and traveling about shows huge parts of the states out here that are reservations controlled by the indians. In fact if you commit crimes on a reservation you are suject to tribal law

btw did you get ylg's message

Sophie
In any case, it tells a great deal about you that Jude the Obscure is one of your favorite books.

From a literary perspective, it was awful and pretty much Hardy's worst work. It stands as a great example of how not to write.

From a social or moral perspective, it reeks as well. Shallow characters with no morals, no real beliefs, yet who do everything they can to try to shock others with how "outrageous "they are, little realizing just how pathetic their lives really are, never realizing the joy they could have had if their lives had meant something, if they had stood for something more than just their impulses.

In a nutshell, Jude the Obscure is all about you, in a manner of speaking, "full of sound and fury and signifying nothing."

Question for sophie
What have you done for the Indians? Contributed money, volunteered time....

My guess is ZERO.

So here you are flopping around bashing America for taking the land away from the Indians but still enjoying everything America has to offer.

Now THAT is a hypocrite...

It's more than a feeling
It's not about tingles and tears.
It's knowing that this country stands for man's ability to govern himself. It's about what liberty and justice and truth really mean. It's about a love for our Constitution and it's non-progressive interpretation. It's a deep thankfulness for all those who worked and died for our freedom. It's about believing that all men are created by God and equal. It's about hoping that every person would one day be free from tyranny and terror. It's about worshipping God without government intervention. It's about private property rights and making your own choices with your own money. It's about every citizen pulling his own weight. It's about protecting and caring for the weak. It's about the dignity and right to life of every human being. Pride in family, community, state and country.
Anyone who feels we need to be more cosmopolitan and don't measure up to socialist/communist/and dictatorships are free to leave. Which is a part of our freedom and a very good reason to be a patriot.
We can hold on to and cherish what has been so generously given to us or we can show disdain for our forefathers beliefs, neglect and squander it all. A true American Patriot hates Secular Humanism, the destructive religion of socialism, communism, the ACLU and Pastor Wright/Obama, and must be willing to give their life to fighting it.

ModMark
A plasma??

Good luck replacing it after 2500 hours...

Cynical quotes
Oh, this is funny:

"Why of course the people don't want war. Why should some poor slob on a farm want to risk his life in a war when the best he can get out of it is to come back to his farm in one piece? ..."

The obvious answer is if his alternative is to lose the farm his enemy started the war to take away from him. This reminds me of the Roman general Cincinnatus who left his farm to defend Rome from a dire threat and returned to his farm after the enemy was defeated.

What's missing in this equation is the concept of liberty. Liberty is either absent or taken utterly for granted in the quoted individual's formulation.

cactushead
Yes, I did...tonight Ill head on and check it out. Can't at the moment. Thanks as well.


On Indians: Exactly, they were not innocent people in this affair. Actually this is probably the first time a nation has taken over land and not forced the previous owners to live under the invaders law. They don't pay taxes on the reservation as well as having a whole new set of laws. They have a monopoly on casinos too. They get protection from our military and don't pay a thing for it.

Another Question for sophie
What's your favorite Bible passage from Jude?

When a brave American
commits an act of heroism in defense of home and country, an act which defines all that we find good and noble, those many of us who value honor rejoice. It was on our village greens that these courageous brothers and sisters were formed.
Each Independence Day reminds us once again of our immeasurable debt to these greatest of all Americans, our eternal patriots.

ModMark
New plasmas are quite nice. Though TVs are starting to turn into computers, in a sense that as soon as you buy one, its out dated. I get popular science and every 6 months or so they talk about a new TV hitting the market that dwarfs the rest. Most any of the TV's that are up to date at all are very clear. Clear enough for me that is.

Hmmm...
The Sony Bravia LCD is probably the best picture I've ever seen, like looking out of a window.

Then the salesmen made me leave the showroom....

This "Sophie" character
... has demonstrated nicely that to denigrate patriotism you have to misunderstand (or misrepresent) what it is. The laughable suggestion that patriotism consists in looking for reasons to be offended or alarmed about other nations is just one of her many nonsensical assertions.

Sowell never takes an emotive approach, and he doesn't here, which is why he is so effective. He has merely pointed out that the great Western nation that most denounced the ideas of patriotism and national defense in the "entre deux guerres" period was the one that collapsed the fastest under attack from the Third Reich.

He's right.

Sophie, say Uncle already!!
I have noticed that the bloodier and bloodier Sophie has become out here as a result of the "Patriot Beatings" she has endured the more she has resorted to getting on her high horse and riding away from duty and honor to her country.

Taking jabs at the 4th of July and all that it represents? How much lower can a poseur patriot go?

The last thing that comes to my mind on 4th of July is slavery, unless I am simultaneoulsy thinking about the days leading to Tax Freedom Day.

Sophie you might want to go easy on hating yourself for the sins of slavery, because the Founding Fathers' geniousness in thought and creation of this country led directly to its eradication...another proof that America is a force for good.

Or do you know of another country before America was created that recognized the inherent wrongness of slavery, passionately debated it, and then finally righted it?

And please don't tell us it was invented here, practiced here exclusively, that blacks were the only slaves in history, and that African tribal kings didn't sell their own people into slavery. Slavery is more a part of human history than American history. Ongoing too, just ask women in the Middle East...you know, like the ones in Iraq that according to you we should leave in chains.

The Majority Does Not Love Sophie writes
This is internet Cuddly, we are all fictitious.

The most fictitious thing here, is your "erudition."

A New Level
You could say that as the blog progressed she took it to 'A New Level' haha. Sorry, the pun just fit.

OLED
oh for sure. I just plan on waiting a bit longer so the TV's that are now a couple thousand will be down in the hundreds when I start looking. Im holding onto my tube TV for now lol

SemperVigilans
Of course, Sowell is right.

Unfortunately, that is not a deterrent to folks on this thread that are stuck on stupid.

Sophie
The women and children stolen from their towns by the Indians were not really innocent either right?

Oh Boy...
"Moral relativism always seems to be the answer of conservatives...

And now it comes full circle with the mexican illegals. How ironic."

Moral relativism?? You're joking, right? I mean this is meant to be funny, right?? How much a bigot are you?

Full circle with illegal aliens?? You're rambling now, please, take a break. Go have some tofu or something.


ModMark
That has nothing to do with saying it is different than any Indian tribe warring another tribe. We didn't war in the name of God so religion is not in that specific conversation.

In the bible you notice the Jews invaded many tribes and not only took their land but killed every man, woman, child, animal, everything. So to say that thou shall not kill...well, I can assure you, this was not a one sided conflict.

Sophie
Sure they were...

So again, how are we any different than another Indian tribe warring them?

Christians and Patriots...
Christians ought to be the best citizens and the finest patriots. Certainly they have a prior allegiance to God Almighty. But this can only make them better Americans.

They need not gloss over the nation's defects or sweep its failures under the rug. They need not claim that their country is always right. When it is right, they will support it; and when it is wrong, they will love it and work to correct it.

Even as the Apostle Paul could speak proudly of his Roman citizenship, so should every American Christian speak proudly of his. The day that patriotism ceases, that day we will have ceased to be a people.

Patriotism is not dead; our nation is not finished. Let us rally behind our flag; let us love our country with all its faults; let us work to improve it with all our strength; let us defend it with all our resources; let us hand it on to generations unborn better