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Monday, March 23, 2009
Mike Adams :: Townhall.com Columnist
Jeffrey Maxwell’s Silver Hammer
by Mike Adams
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I like teaching police officers because it virtually assures that no one will ever go on a shooting spree in my building at UNC-Wilmington. The officers I teach are, of course, allowed to carry guns – and many do as they go on duty directly after attending classes. Because criminals a) are aware of this, and b) are generally rational, the next shooting rampage will not be happening in my general vicinity.

The fact that most academics are generally ignorant of the benefits of guns on campus is readily apparent to those following a recent case at Western Oregon University located in Monmouth, Oregon. The case involves a former Marine named Jeffrey Maxwell who used to carry a derringer to school along with a small knife. He carried both concealed.

Maxwell carries his gun because, like many former Marines, he has a license to do so. His permit allows him to carry although not in federal buildings or in courthouses. He was studying in the student union when Monmouth Police officers approached him to ask whether he was armed.

Maxwell admitted he had a gun and knife in his pocket and an unloaded rifle in his truck. He was arrested and cited for possessing a firearm in public. Of course, he was let go by a district attorney who recognized that Maxwell simply had not committed any crime. But the fact of his complete innocence didn’t stop the university from going after Maxwell.

The university should have apologized to Maxwell. Instead, a student judicial panel suspended him from school for violating a student conduct rule banning the possession of weapons on campus.

The Oregon legislature could try to pass a law banning firearms possession - even for those with concealed carry permits - in places other than courthouses or federally owned buildings. If they tried to pass such a law they could well succeed.

But, in this case, Maxwell’s decision to carry was not challenged by any change in state law. It was challenged by yet another lawless university trying to trump state law with its own handbook. (For those who have not noticed, universities also try frequently to trump federal law with their handbooks. Often, they try to do both at once. It’s an old trick that often succeeds without challenge).

But the Maxwell case involves a more novel trick. It involves having this falsely accused man (who, remember, served his country in the Marines) get a mental health evaluation before returning to school. This may be worse than Hamline University’s decision to suspend a student simply for advocating concealed weapons permits on campus. That student was also ordered to submit to a psychological evaluation before returning to school.

To make matters in this case even worse, Maxwell is being told to write a 10-page paper on following the law and accepting responsibility for his actions. This requirement is coming from a university that did not follow the law and, in fact, is trying to trump it. And the university seems unwilling to take responsibility for doing so.

Speaking for the Oregon university system, Di Saunders correctly asserts that the question of allowing concealed weapons on campus is one of student safety. But she incorrectly asserts that allowing permit holders to carry on campus will make the campus more dangerous. No peer-reviewed publication has ever come to that conclusion based on actual evidence. And many have come to a contrary conclusion.

But university administrators rarely make decisions based on evidence. Instead, they make decisions based upon feelings. How will they feel when the next Jeffrey Maxwell is unable to stop the next Seung-Hui Cho?

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About The Author
Mike Adams is a criminology professor at the University of North Carolina Wilmington and author of Feminists Say the Darndest Things: A Politically Incorrect Professor Confronts "Womyn" On Campus.
 
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ORS statutes make CC holder = to police
As a former Oregon resident I'm familiar with the concealed carry requirements. The ORS statute that covers concealed carry gives a holder the exact same rights as Police with a few exceptions of Federal buildings and courts. The treatment of this individual is a violation of Oregon statutes and I would think open the school to a defamation suit. How about also suing for unlawful imprisonment for having to sit and take this BS.

Mike Adams writes:
But, in this case, Maxwell’s decision to carry was not challenged by any change in state law. It was challenged by yet another lawless university trying to trump state law with its own handbook.
========================

I hope this Marine will do the right thing and SUE the University for breech of his Civil Rights.

WOW.........................




.........almost 150 posts and the original Oregon Idiot hasn't weighed in on this? Gee, I hope nothing bad has happened to Dr. Dougie.


Ditto Mr Difar - Guns are good. Going a step farther, concealed carry is good - it has likely saved more lives than we will actually ever know.

Good column Dr. Adams - I hope this ex-Marine sues the Oregon unversity system. Nothing worse than educated, but ignorant, academics.

All historical evidence points to
the fact that guns and violence are GOOD.

Without violence there would be no sun, no internal combustion, no construction (do you think nails drive themselves without violent force?)and no United States of America!

Guns make the otherwise weak strong. They repel the evil and comfort the good.

There is no evidence that guns are bad in all of the history of mankind. Liberals are evil. That's why they fear guns.


GOP Becoming a Third Tier Protest Party
Sit over behind the Green Party ladies.

Will
You're so gay.

Nothing would please me more...
... than marching onto the campus of someplace like Western Oregon with a thousand armed and angry NRA members at my back, and giving the lefty faculty a taste of what it's like to share space with an occupying army for one day.

But such behavior would be childish and immature, and I don't believe Miss Manners would approve.

Just joking...

a paper
I would write a 20 page paper of how the U did not follow the law, and how I was punished for it. And they would be too afraid to say anything about it.

CLAIRIFICATION OF CONCEALED CARRY IN WA
THE STATE OF WASHINGTON IS A SHALL ISSUE STATE AND OPEN CARRY IS LEGAL BUT DRAWS THE ATTENTION OF LAW ENFORCEMENT AS THEY ARE NOT UP ON ALL THE GUN LAWS.
TO GET MY PERMIT TO CARRY CONCEALED I WENT TO THE COP STORE AND FILLED OUT THE PAPERWORK FOR A FBI BACKGROUND CHECK.I THEN GOT FINGER PRINTED, PAID $60. THEY GAVE ME MY PERMIT ON THE SPOT AND I LEFT.NO CCW CLASS OR CERTIFICATION OF ANY KIND REQUIRED.MUST RENEW EVERY 5 YEARS.THAT'S IT.
MOST OF THE "LIBERAL PROGRESSIVES" LIVE IN KING COUNTY,SEATTLE. ITS A LOT LIKE SAN FRANCISCO,GREAT PLACE TO VISIT BUT I WOULD NOT LIVE THERE.IN THE PRIMARIES RON PAUL GOT 85% OF THE VOTE IN MY COUNTY.IT'S POLITICAL SUICIDE TO MESS WITH THE SECOND AMENDMENT HERE.WASHINGTON IS MUCH FREER THAN PEOPLE THINK.

To Don
I am gay........abusive parents make people gay/lesbian? Not all gays are Democrats. Some, such as myself, are Republicans and conservative on many, many issues. I have a number of women friends that aren't gay, who I would encourage to carry a firearm.....and, know how to use it.

My plan sounds similiar
to Maxwell's. Enlist and then go back to school, and I plan to do it with a concealed carry and knife as well.

Then I'll sue the crap out of them until I own the campus. Even if I have to represent myself.

Detroit Police vs Pit Bulls

I wonder if the owner of these Bulldogs will receive a 'Psychological' examination?


(not overly graphic, but 4 dogs are shot dead)

http://www.myfoxdetroit.com/dpp/news/local/Police_Shoot_Pit _Bulls_after_Attack

n
One of the real problems with todays colleges and universities is that those who run them consider themselves as the customers instead of the students. They think they provide a service that the students MUST have and therefore they own it. This is one reason they vote themselves big paychecks and run up the costs so much. They typically go up about 15% a year in costs.

It will require two things to stop. First, the students need to realize that college does NOT garantee a million dollar salary (at least over a lifetime) and that you can make as much by going into something else such as plumbing or electrical work. Second, the students and companies hiring them need to look at more than a glamourous degree to qualify them for work. Then they can take a serious look at the college and decide whether it is really the right one.

Right now it is expected that ALL students who plan to do anything with their lives must go to college. When I was going through school, we thought a 10-20% rate of graduates to college was a great ratio; now they expect about 90% to go. Most college graduates don't make as much as those who don't go but do get into some field. Many end up as clerks in a store at minimum wage. Only half the engineer graduates ever get engineering jobs despite what the colleges tell the students before they go.

What this boils down to is that the students and businesses that hire them must simply hit them in the pocket book. They will wise up then because they will have no other choice.

Rudolf -2nd post after Wee Will
"Odd?
Seems to me as an immigrant that Americans' - mainly male ones - obsession with firearms is rather odd. The ones that I know who have firearms have rather paranoid personalities, not sure if these men are the ones who should have guns. This concealed carry business is scary, how do we know that these peope will use their guns in appropriate ways? It's one thing to have it at home, but to carry it around?


What a load of b.s
I dont carry or own but give me one reason (other than your Feelings) that if i decide to own why i shouldnt be able to go and buy a gun. Of course i would get trained and have my family trained in gun safety. One reason?

Ray and Parker:
Ray: Many don't care. The point was that the anti-gun people wanted to use the names to cause them trouble. That's why it was decided to keep the names secret.

Parker: "Some animals are more equal to others" ... but Samuel Colt makes them all equal. That's why some "animals" wants to ban the guns.

roy:
Thirty years ago, as I mentioned, this figure was right. It is still probably right since most federal housing requires that you sign an agreement that allows the police to search your apartment without a search warrant whenever they wish, hunting for guns and drugs. Either can get you kicked out. That is one reason they have so much crime. The criminals who ignore (break) the law and rules prey upon those they know are helpless.

Mike:
The gunman at the UT campus was actually shot by a civilian who had his own gun. He and a single cop climbed to the top of the tower and went opposite directions. The civilian shot him as he tried to shoot at the cop.

John:
The college presently does not have to allow military recruiters on campus. But they lose ALL federal funds for grants, etc. if they do this. It wasn't long ago that one of the Ivy League colleges ran into this. I think it was Princeton. They tried to argue that as a major university the government could not stop the funding but they lost. So they decided to continue letting the military on campus.

As far as enrollment is concerned, they can choose to allow or disallow anyone they want. Because Maxwell is not officially a Marine on campus, they can kick him out. Their reasoning sucks, however, and I hope they find some troubles with enrollment, at least. You won't get the feds involved. They LIKE it when someone is disciplined for having a gun anywhere.

Will - Ad Hominem is so small of you
In your #131 post, you go into an ad hominem attack that does not address any of the points of the post. If you have a valid point please make it.

If you want to do ad hominem and then switch subjects you will only tarnish the opinion people have of you. Then when you actually do address issues people will dismiss your post without giving it any thought.

Idiocy
How many examples of academic liberal lunacy do we need before we stand up to these idiots? People should not have to surrender their rights to attend school. These loons will be the ruin of us as a country.

Guns on campus
On the University of Texas Campus in 1966, the students went back to their dorms and apartmenets and brought oout their deer rifles in a short period of time, pinned down charles Whitman, and probably saved another 30 lives. Shoooting unimpeded, he was mowing them down. Law Enforcvemtn officers had only short carbines and shotguns. which weren't reaching the top of the Texas tower. Look at any of the Life photos. The ones with the long guns were students, not po9lice.

What idiot would subject himself........
to psychological examination for following the law? Countersue them and ask the LGBT faculty to take them as well. I love dealing with LGBT individuals with a distorted perspective of reality.

I have a new law!
I think there should be a non-protection clause that deems your institution as exempted from protection from the United States military should there be a land invasion if you are disregarding state or federal law (or decide to bar military or law enforcement representation from campus.) And the next time there's a crazy running around campus shooting people I think all the police should show up without their side-arms and say, "Sorry, we just wanted to respect the student code."

Not at the University of Utah
The Bow-tie bozo who is president of the U of U tried to get guns off the campus there but he got proper marching orders from the state legislature. If he had any manhood he would have resigned in protest but no one would accuse him of manhood.

Demosthenes 12:43
Please don't judge all Californians by will. Not everyone, in this state, was raised by abusive parents and became self-sexers (I won't use the word gay since that denotes joy). Actually, if you get rid of L.A. and San Francisco (please, please, please!), this is a conservative state.

Hey 45Caliber...you should know by now
"When asked if they would give up their guns if they passed a law banning them, all have stated they wouldn't since they really needed them, not like the rest of the people."

"Some animals are more equal than others," here on the big 'animal farm'.

Tools
Guns are just another tool. And all tools can be misused.

Hypocrisy University
If there is anyone who should be evaluated for mental competency,it should be the powers-that-be at the university.I hope Mr.Maxwell told them to go pound Iraqi sand.

One further word
If you have made the conscious decision not to carry a gun that is fine, and I respect your decision. Concealed carry is not for everyone. You should not carry if you know you are not the type who could shoot another person, and a gun should NEVER be used merely as a bluff. I made up my mind a long time ago that I would drop the hammer if it ever became necessary and deal with the consequences, including psychological, later. You can't work in law enforcement and not be able to do that.

So, if you have made the decision not to carry (or even own a gun) based on your knowledge of yourself, you have my respect. But, please, do not try to take my right to carry a gun or own a gun away from me. You will do neither.

.45 cal.
Read above where you mentioned some folks in Texas, I'm guessing you were refering to Texas, had attempted to make public the names of us with a CHL.

Doesn't matter to me, nothing I'm ashamed of but you would think the people who would be concerned are the ones who are Not on the list. Talk about advertising the lambs to the wolves.

45caliber-#101
Typical of the "do as I say, not as I do" democrats. Global Warming is killing us they say. Yet, they use more energy than just about any group of people. But Al Gore and Kennedy have to burn all that energy. They are doing it all for a good cause-warning us about global warming. Oh, and by the way, I own a phony baloney carbon credit company so you cas ease your guit. Wow, liberals are gullible.

Just like Animal Farm, some of us are more equal than others.

.45 caliber
are you kidding me? the housing projects in the inner cities don't have any guns? take a stroll through there sometime. i guarantee you there are plenty of firearms.

Proof from the past
many years ago (sometime in the 70's, I think) the Orlando Police Department launched a very well-publicized program to teach women how to use guns. The number of rapes and sexual assaults in that city dropped like a rock after that.

Shortly after the city of Morton Grove, IL instituted its gun ban the town of Kennesaw, GA passed a law requiring all citizens to own guns (with exceptions for those who had sincere beliefs against owning guns). The result? Kennesaw's crime rate dropped whereas Morton Grove's crime rate rose.

I have a concealed carry permit and I carry whenever I go out, except for the legally prohibited places such as schools, courthouses, etc. I am not paranoid, nor am I some gun-crazed maniac. I am a former Marine and police officer, who carried my off-duty weapon to class when I was working toward my Bachelor's degree, and have used guns all my life. I refuse to be a victim like the unfortunate souls at all of the shooting incidents around the country, which could have been stopped if those who were licensed to carry firearms were present. I made sure my children were able to use guns, whether they wanted to own any or not, so they would know how to use one if the need ever arose.

To those who don't like guns or who don't see the need to carry one, I hope that you are never in the middle of a mall shooting incident, cowering behind a planter and wishing that someone with a gun would come along and save your butt.

45caliber
The hypocrisy I was referring to in my 10:58 am post, which was exhibited by such luminaries that I mentioned in that post as Carl T. Rowan and Rosie O'Donnell, is the very same one that the members of Congress you cited in your 1:13 pm post share: that these people who are so vocal against allowing private citizens who presumably are not part of regular law-enforcement departments or the military to have guns either carry guns THEMSELVES for protection or have no reservations whatsoever about allowing others to carry the gun for them in self-protection.

Both you and Eric Blair are totally right about the reason: they are both paranoid and want to have absolute control over the citizenry.

However, I still feel confident that if the Democrats try to disarm the citizenry along the road to instituting totalitarian rule over us, the U.S. military will fight them. Several conservative posters who come here to this board have apprised us of a movement which has sprung up within, although not strictly confined to, the military called Oath Keepers, which I'm sure you must have seen by now (if not, Google http://www.oath-keepers.blogspot.com); the presence of such a group of service people gives me cheer that if the Democrats intend on turning America during the Obama Administration into an Soviet Socialist Republic of America, they'll pay dearly in blood for the attempt.

criminals
My husband and I took a concealed carry class last December. The instructor, a sergeant with the sheriff's department, told us that no police officer he has met worries about permit holders, mainly because the crime rate by permit holders is so very low. In fact, he told us, in the year 2000 in the state of Florida, concealed carry permit holders were less likely to commit crimes than the police!


Standshisground
I'm not sure what you are referring to as hypocracy. Actually, I seem to be in the same place you are. I dislike the gun grabber's arguments that they have the right to be armed by the rest of us don't. Actually, I think the reason they want to disarm us is because they are paranoid.

Fair is fair.
Do I think that Mr. Maxwell was wrong for carrying the gun onto campus? Yes, because it is a written policy in the student code of conduct. Mr. Maxwell should have challenged the rule, not just ignored it. We can't become a society of people who feel they don't have to obey the rules.

I agree that Jeffrey Maxwell should not have been taken into custody, suspended from the university, or just about anything else that happened to him because of the incident.

It comes down to how the university addresses other similar infractions. I suspect that if a student had a candle burning in their dorm room they would get a slap on the wrist or a small fine. Even having an un-lite candle in a dorm room is an infraction of the student code of conduct at many universities. More student deaths occur due to fires then handguns.

The university decided to make a political statement instead of a policy statement. Maybe it is because their customers, the students, tend to be anti-gun. What ever the reason, if the university truly cared about the students the would act differently.

Swampfox
You need not worry about MADD's attempts to reinstate prohibition.

Given that even liberals like their hooch too much, this is ONE issue where which we can rest assured that the lifestyle Nazis of the left are going to encounter fierce opposition EVEN FROM THEIR OWN SIDE!

Haven't you ever noticed that with all the things liberals are trying to infringe the American people's right to enjoy - cigarettes, fatty foods, etc. - alcohol is ONE item they shy away from in this campaign like it was the plague? Even though a lot of their arguments against OTHER things they want to ban from our midst because they're supposedly the source of all kinds of evils are just as applicable, if not more so, to alcohol.

Of course, maybe Teddy Kennedy would go along with MADD on this. Hey, his family already made ONE fortune because of prohibition, so maybe he'd see a chance for a SECOND windfall, ya think?

Number
We all know that a number of our elected officials would not qualify for a concealed handgun license due to their own past law breaking history. Some won't even qualify for a Department of Defense security clearance. And those are the very ones who want to deny that Civil Right to us. It's all about control.

Molon Labe!

Joel De Oppresso Libre...
...appears to be more of a libertarian than anything else--and he does have a point about parolees released after serving their sentences and being forbidden to own guns.

The way I see it is anyone who chooses to own a gun or any other weapon for self-defense should be able to do so without any restrictions, which may be what Joel was trying to get at. The corollary is that violation of the right to life, liberty & the pursuit of happiness for anyone else should carry the death penalty, executed on the spot.

Yes, that's extreme, but it is the logical conclusion of the KYFHO Libertarian worldview. This is why "an armed society is a polite society."

Ideally, our entire criminal justice system would be scrapped and replaced by a dispute reconciliation process that encourages all parties to the dispute to be reconciled with each other in life, lest they be reconciled in death by the sword, wielded in self-defense by a designated executioner in a public ceremony. I can just about guarantee 99.99% of disputants will decide the dispute isn't worth dying for.

For more about how this concept would work, check out my Starfield Valley Tales at the following url:

http://www.phoenixladysnest.com/Phoenix_Rising_Presents/Sta rfield_Valley_Tales/index.html

Don't feel I need to carry.
I don't feel that I need to carry a conceal weapon. I might change my mind. Some people do feel that they have the need for a conceal weapon permit. The anti-weapon people are about as bad as the Mother's Against Drunk Driving, who had a good cause but who are now trying to reinstate prohibition.

45caliber
Regarding the hypocrisy you mention in your 1:13 pm post: see my 10:58 am post.

What our esteemed DEMOCRATIC members of Congress are telling the American people in allowing THEMSELVES to either carry or in some other way be privately protected by firearms while wanting to deny the rest of the citizenry the same right is, "YOUR lives aren't of much value to our society, and therefore are totally dispensible. MY life, on the other hand, is VERY valuable to society - and as a result, my life is INDISPENSIBLE."

WestTexan:
I raised my kids with a respect for guns and a willingness to look for both sides of an argument. When they went to college I made a point that they should take everything they were told with a grain of salt - and demand the other side of what they were taught. Several professors didn't like them for some odd reason.

Standshisground
You are probably right. But a sex offender surely can't do as much damage as a honest citizen with a concealed carry license! Right?

About thirty five years ago Readers Digest was strongly anti-gun. They hired a think tank to prove that the places with the most guns had the most crime. The think tank came back with the opposite view and RD refused to pay for the study. So they sold the story to the newpaper. RD tried to sue but a judge ruled that since they didn't pay for the study the think tank to sell it to whomever they wished.

The places with the fewest guns (and the most crime)? Any inner city area, particularly in government housing. The place with most guns (and the least crime)? The Ozark Mountains in Arkansas where I grew up.

Hazel:
Wasn't the Appalachian School of Law the one where a gunman started a rampage but gave up the moment he was confronted by three armed students?

Just So You Know:
Of the gun grabbers in Congress - I know that all except perhaps Shummer carry - or have guards that do.

Feinstein carries a gun herself. She says she has to because there are crazy people out there who hate her. Kennedy does not go anywhere without two guards, each of whom carry two Uzis, two pistols, and two knives, in case something happens to one. Hillary and Bill have Secret Service Guards all the time. So does Obama. Shummer MAY have a gun or guard, but I don't know for sure.

When asked if they would give up their guns if they passed a law banning them, all have stated they wouldn't since they really needed them, not like the rest of the people.

45caliber
What do you want to bet that the very same people who want to publicly disseminate lists of those approved to carry concealed weapons OPPOSED, or currently oppose, attempts to allow people to find out the identities of convicted sex offenders who have now taken up residence in their neighborhoods?

Oregon Lady:
I know the problems you are talking about. They tried to get the right-to-carry list of people here too. Their intention was to print the list as "Do you know your neighbors?". It was to frighten people in the neighborhoods of these people and either force them to give up their guns or move. The state voted against it. They don't get the list. They have moved on to another state they hope will start their movement - yours. I hope and pray that you are successful in stopping them too.

Rudolf:
I don't know who you know but you are in NY. In Texas, nearly everyone has a gun and there are a fair number of concealed carry people as well.

If you will check the number of crimes committed by concealed carry people that includes use of guns, it is so small that it is hard to even find. Many try to point to speed tickets, etc. but that does not include use of a gun - even though they might have had one at the time.

Further, if you feel uncomfortable with others having guns, you can always go back to your home country. We were born with the knowledge that guns are used for hunting and defense - and that we had the right to do that. Sure, there are crazy people who use them, but about 99.99% of the gun owners use them as they were meant to be used. If you are uncomfortable with that, I would suggest you return to whatever country you come from.

Odd how they disappear!
"Rudolph" was probably a nom de spew for one of our resident moonbats. Of course he could be one of those immigrants that Bob Grant used to say came from Lower Slobovia. Like that one named "Joe" who used to call up and rant incoherently about the "evils" of republicans and conservatives and basically kiss Clinton's hind end on WABC radio.
He used to sound like a cross between Stalin and Boris Badanov.

-Ray
NRA Life Member
Soli Deo Gloria!!

will in CA: Really?
“It's anemic, Mike. It's bloodless. We've grown accustomed to the prospect of limited imagination.”

Really? What a charmingly gratuitous assertion. From my perspective as a minimally-franchised & thoroughly disposable white male when I see a progressive who has the gall of mischaracterizing themselves as being capable of “liberal” or imaginative thought all I see is another occupant of same small tent containing a cloister of like-minded organisms: Marxist gays, Marxist minorities, Marxist poor people, Marxist uneducated people (an oxymoron if there ever was one), etc.- every one of them fully ensconced in the “to each according to her needs” column of that great socialist equation. A lack of diversity of thought does not make a “big tent.” There is nothing nuanced or imaginative about the continued application of the same old victim/oppressor Marxist canard in its various repackaged forms: Feminism, hyphenated-American victimhood in perpetuity, etc.



Nora Charles
"Date: Mar 23, 2009 - 2:34 AM EST Wee Willy
Is that a concealed weapon in your pocket Will, or are you just happy to see us?"

Nora, if I might judge on the basis of your first name, Will would never be happy to see you.

Indeed, it could be a weapon of death.

Gibson Girl
I'm with you. They only way they will know I have it is if I need it. Then I'll be very glad to have it.

JOEL
You claim you are not a liberal, but judging from your posts, you seem to share with liberals one of their major attributes: the utter inability to use common sense.

Where I carry

As the Great Dr. Adams points out, and as Ann Coulter has stated, crazed gunmen are CRAZED, not stupid. They don't open fire in police stations - they pick spots they know are unprotected.

Thus, I go out of my way to carry my Glock the very places people most want to stop me - universities, state fairs, amusement parks, high schools, malls, hospitals.

JOEL
"If we yell fire when there is none, and someone is hurt, then we have abrogated our Right of Free Speech by misusing it."

You just contradicted yourself with this statement. So we should feel sorry for people who prey on others because now they can't protect themselves but not a loud mouth. So we should incarcerate this person for life or put them to death or cut out their tongue since they can't control their mouth impulses and somebody broke their arm rushing the exits?

I see the point you are trying to make but again nothing is absolute. Even God protected some but not others who displeased him.

RW
Police officers are exempt from carry limitations placed on civilian concealed permits. They can carry concealed most anywhere and thus can carry on campus.

I think the marine though would be under the civilian guidelines like those of us not in law enforcemnt, and restricted in certain places based on the individual state laws. I think him being a marine is coincidental to the story.

I wonder though if Oregon has only those two limits placed as Adams mentions. I know Michigan state law has a long list. Schools, casinos, hospitals, college dorms and campus, day dare centers...on and on. All the places where you want an armed civilian to intervene if a crazed killer enters the facility. If a gunman came into my kids elementary school, an armed teacher is going to be a better defense than an unarmed one. I seldom see the logic behind all the restrictions placed.

Parker
I don't know what O'Reilly's stand on gun ownership is, but even if I take your word that his position is what you stated it is: okay, instead of O'Reilly, how about Sean Hannity? Or maybe Laura Ingraham or Michelle Malkin can do such an expose on the nights they're filling in for O'Reilly, like when he goes on vacation; THEY could send Jesse Waters after the liberal hypocrites.

"Universities"
I'm all for denying civil rights to leftist pefessers and universities. I'm tired of leftists and their complete and terminal idiocy. I have much more faith in my armed fellow citizens than I do the majority party in the Federal Gummint, or nearly any university to be truthful, intelligent, honest and constitutional. I'm glad I left Oregon years ago, the Kalifornication crowd has completely ruined that state, like they did Washington and are trying to do to other states.

Not a gun person , but..
I've never hunted, fired a real gun or owned any firearm beyond a BB gun in my teens. Yet I fully understand Dr. Adams concern that the rigid campus PC which would prevent law-abiding individuals from possessing lawful, registered guns on campus makes it that much more likely that the next deranged killer will pile up a huge body count with no one able to stop him (or her) with a well-aimed return shot. Dr. Adams endures the chaotic, intolerant environment of campus liberal Political Correctness on a daily basis; and thus his columns emphasize its various expressions. Plenty of other TH columns deal with other issues, and I always appreciate Dr. Adams' perspective. And I don't drink anyone's kool-aid, or smoke cigars either.

Rowly
Regarding you 11:38 am post: maybe Obama himself will make this argument as justification for the creation of his Civilian National Security Force.

To Mike reply #48 10:06 EST
Just to pick a nit, examples of revolvers which use clips are the Colt Model 1917 and the S&W Model 625, both in .45 ACP, the S&W Model 610 in 10mm/.40 S&W, and the S&W Model 940 Centennial in 9 X 19mm. Admittedly it would be highly unlikely for any LEO to be carrying any one of these.

For a brief overview that I wish all fictition writers and newsferrets (I know it is redundant)see:
http://www.thegunzone.com/clips-mags.html

WILL vs DR. MIKE
Will, there you go again, Since you have nothing of substance to refute DR.ADAMS observations you, as usual, resort to defaming the messenger rather than countering his message with rational objections. Its par for the course and you are boring. God Help America!

Va Tech Versus Appalachian School of law
Va Tech 30 dead

Appalachian school of law 3 dead

How can people not see and understand.

The next 30 dead are the fault of all who protest carrying on campus. YOU will be guilty of murder.

Hey Standshisground...
Don't hold your breath waiting for Bill O'Reilly to cover a story exposing gun control hypocrisy. He'd have to cover his very own gated community, complete with armed security.

Bill O'Reilly is a gun-grabbing phony who believes in gun control.


StandingHisGround
How soon will it be until it will be impossible to hire a policeman? Who would want the job? They put their lives on the line every day,especially when a white policeman goes into predominately black areas.

However,even a black policeman is not safe in those areas. Life means nothing to some of these criminals, even their own,if they think they have been a victim of someone. Retribution is all they care about.If they are on drugs or alcohol,that is a powder keg.

Joel-De Oppresso Liber
"If a parolee, or a felon is forbidden from being armed, he has then been rendered legally unable to defend his life, liberty, or property. Anyone can rob, kidnap, or kill him at will. If a person is so dangerous that they cannot be trusted with arms, then that person needs to be given the death penalty."

Joel, this is a disingenuous arguement. There are always exceptions to every rule. Many non-violent felons could probably carry such as bad check writers and such but the bureauracy to police this would be unsustainable.

Don't make the mistake of putting violent felons/parolees into the status of victims. They are/were predators so by making them the prey to others really isn't cruel and unusual punishment but justice brought onto themselves based on their own actions.

Another thing is what constitutes "so dangerous?" What about people who are too dangerous to themselves and the public to carry a weapon because they are suicidal, clumsy, mentally challenged (liberal) etc...?

Arguing absolutes usually gets you in trouble.

Joel-De Oppresso Lieber
Regarding your 10:47 am post, it's hard to know where to begin.

The parolee in question in Oakland, Louvelle Mixon, served time in prison for assault with a firearm in the commission of a felony. If YOU want to make the argument on this board that such a man should be entrusted with a gun once released, be my guest; a lot of us on this board would enjoy watching you try to make such an argument. My attitude is, if this guy didn't want to face a future in which he could not be armed to defend himself, he should have thought about that BEFORE he committed his crime, not AFTER. This is the assumption-of-risk doctrine at work: if you're going to be engaging in ill-advised activities, you assume the consequences for whatever happens as a result of those activities, even if those consequences are clearly considerably greater than you intended.

Regarding the fact that he's considered so dangerous that he shouldn't be entrusted with a firearm: you suggested he should face the death penalty. A lot of us conservatives argue that violent offenders SHOULD be paying much more harshly for their offenses, especially with considerably longer jail sentences, than they already are. It's LIBERALS who are responsible for why this isn't happening.

And who's likely to be preying on disarmed felons? All but certainly, OTHER felons, which in effect is what you've admitted, since you said that "Anyone can rob, kidnap, or kill him at will" - all three activities being FELONIES.
You speak as though you think that armed law-abiding citizens are just as likely to be victimizers of disarmed felons as other felons. Is this what you're trying to say?

Good column, except....
... for the analogies Adams uses. Apparently, it's OK for cop students and former Marines to carry on campus, but as for the rest of us.... So who says that being a current or former government employee should be the rationale for allowing us to be armed without legal molestation?


Standinghisground
"Lolo1, Bagaman & Wrestling Coach
Lolo1:

Yes, I saw that half-hearted apology that the family of the shooter gave to the police. How touching, huh?

As Rowly suggested at 10:16 am, so, how long before we see Oakland's "community leaders" and other self-appointed activists staging protests over the police department's "execution" of this shooter - and try to paint him as another Abner Louima, a hapless victim shot for no other reason than that he was black? Or even better yet, another Mumia?"



What can I say? There is a reason Oakland is a giant sewer, and don't get caught on the streets after dark. Wanna talk racism? There are huge swaths of Oakland that unless you are black, you don't dare venture into. Is it just me or does the Mayor, Ron Dellums, look like he should be in the original movie Planet of the Apes?

Standshisground
I think that two seconds of liberal thought might be getting to me I mean, I think er, uhh, umm, er, you know, cause ahhh he!! where's the teleprompter. Oh no, I'm turning into a liberal.

That's it no more liberal thinking for me today!

Lolo1, Bagaman & Wrestling Coach
Lolo1:

Yes, I saw that half-hearted apology that the family of the shooter gave to the police. How touching, huh?

As Rowly suggested at 10:16 am, so, how long before we see Oakland's "community leaders" and other self-appointed activists staging protests over the police department's "execution" of this shooter - and try to paint him as another Abner Louima, a hapless victim shot for no other reason than that he was black? Or even better yet, another Mumia?


Bagaman & Wrestling Coach:

Remember when former Washington Post columnist Carl T. Rowan, an outspoken anti-gun liberal, shot two intruders in his home years ago with an unregistered firearm? Does anyone remember his fellow libs openly criticizing his hypocrisy? For that matter, remember when we learned that Rosie O'Donnell, another outspoken anti-gun liberal, was revealed to be employing an ARMED bodyguard? Anyone remember any of her fellow Hollyweird kith openly taking her to task for that?

One thing I'd love to see - maybe Bill O'Reilly Fox can send his producer Jesse Waters on THIS assignment - is for someone to find out where the most ardent anti-gun liberals we hear on TV live, and then find out how many of these people's neighborhoods are patrolled by private ARMED security. And then confront them about that hypocrisy.

By the way, regarding the AIG executives getting death threats: how many of you want to bet the farm that those threats, almost without exception, aren't coming from supposedly "right-wing nutters" but from those who voted for Obama?

Mental Evaluation
Mr. Maxwell has already been through at least one mental evaluation in order to join the US Military. As I recall, no mental evaluation is needed to become a university professor.

Molon Labe!

Georgetwin
The sixties radicals were a nasty bunch and now their spawn who learned from the best of the worst,are picking up where they left off.

The problem now is they are running our government. In the sixties,the government tried to stem the tide. Now the government is it.

ADLoggy
Yup, sounds like you're learning how to think like a liberal, all right!

Scary, isn't it?

Wrestling Coach
You're absolutely right sir - but the left doesn't believe that law abiding citizens who carry firearms will go on such a rampage. The left wing wants control. They can't get that absolute control if people have a means to fight back. If they are able to counter sentiments that it is OK for law abiding citizens to own firearms, it furthers their agenda and increases their ability to control the populace. I never thought I would be proposing crazy theories like that, and don't want to sound like some "gun nut" but you can't analyze the media coverage and the actions of the current administration without seeing this...

Standinghisground
"I presume you're referring to the incident the other day in which a parolee wanted for parole violations killed several Oakland police officers who were trying to arrest him before being shot dead himself.

If this is the incident, since this guy WAS a parolee, then he couldn't legally have had a gun in the first place, in which case he was already in violation of the law, regardless of what kind of weapon he had used in the shooting spree, so presumably his firearm was illegally obtained. But of course, don't expect the anti-gun zealots to even be talking about that.

There's actually ANOTHER story in this incident, if we are talking about the same one, that deserves a lot more attention than it's likely to get: neighbors of the person with whom he was staying knew he was there, yet did not want to inform the police because of the "no-snitch" ethos that has taken hold of their community. This to me is the REAL story of this incident: the fact that a perverted ethos that has taken hold of inner-city communities resulted in the deaths of several police officers. But don't expect the liberal media to be giving any mention to THIS aspect of this incident."


You are correct. Perhaps the families of these officers should get a large mob and march through that neighborhood and destroy it the way they went through downtown Oakland and destroyed it over a shooting incident, and maybe they should shut down the mayor's office and city council meetings as well.

Sometimes you gotta fight fire with fire. BTW the family of the shooter gave a half hearted apology last night on the news. How nice...I'm sure the families of those officers feel soooo much better...

Standshisground
So after reading your post I tried thinking like a liberal (my brain still hurts) and have concluded that we need more laws since the ones on the books obviously weren't enough to deter this crime.

How'd I do???

The media is circling...
I'm worried that all this talk will be for nothing, as I feel the media is circling right now for their next big campaign against firearms. Sturmfuhrer Holder has spoken, and the propaganda wing of the Demokrat (misp. intentional) party is looking for any way to undermine the Constitution and especially the Second Amendment. Join the NRA, give a membership as a gift, do whatever you can. If something like a semiauto or concealed carry ban can't be done directly, then they'll place a special tax on semiauto's or on concealed pistol licenses.

Mike Adams
WHAT A SURPRISE that this happened in Oregon! If ANYONE needs proof of Oregon’s Fascism, I suggest they read ANY of Dr. Dingleberry’s Posts. BTW, I thought Liberals were pacifists?!?!?! What was all this talk of LIBERALS HUNTING DOWN AIG Bonus Recipients? What will they use for weapons on this hunt? Maybe the will be like the Liberals at the 1968 Liberal convention in Chicago that threw bags of SHITE at the police. This leads me to the question of HOW did they store the bags of SHITE? WHERE did they store the bags of SHITE? Did they SHITE in the bags of SHITE or did they transfer the SHITE from somewhere else? Libtards, saving the SHITE of today while spewing the BULLSHITE of tomorrow! LMAO!

Mike
I noted the same anomaly, but let it go. Given the odds nowadays, the "service revolver" was almost certainly a semi-automatic pistol, and the "clip" was a magazine. Typical mildly irritating nomenclature errors of one unfamiliar with actual firearms. who gets his "data" fropm uninformed journalists. But there is about a 1 in 50 chance it really WAS a revolver and most LE personnel armed with revolvers carry re-loads in speed-loaders that hold 6 rounds which can be loaded all at once. Strictly speaking, these can fit the definition of an ammo clip. Now i find myself in the uncomfortable position of cutting slack for a rube, and going pedantic towards someone who is familiar with firearms.

Exhausting (Gun Control and Will)
Siiiiggggghhhhhhh.........

It just absolutely amazes me that the left continues to believe that people who have gone through the trouble to get a background check and paid money to get a license (to do something the Constitiuion establishes as a right, by the way) would be willing to just up and go on a rampage in the middle of a college/mall/insert your gun-free zone here. How is it dangerous? If the holders of CCLs make things so much more dangerous, then how come we don't hear about shootings every day or every other day? With the number of people that carry legally each day and the danger that inherently comes with these folks, according to the left, we should be seeing shoot-em-ups on the evening news on a daily basis.

And Will, we have indeed grown accustomed to the prospect of limited imagination - and I remember it every time I read one of your posts.

JD's Handsome Son & mike in NC
JD's Handsome Son:

I presume you're referring to the incident the other day in which a parolee wanted for parole violations killed several Oakland police officers who were trying to arrest him before being shot dead himself.

If this is the incident, since this guy WAS a parolee, then he couldn't legally have had a gun in the first place, in which case he was already in violation of the law, regardless of what kind of weapon he had used in the shooting spree, so presumably his firearm was illegally obtained. But of course, don't expect the anti-gun zealots to even be talking about that.

There's actually ANOTHER story in this incident, if we are talking about the same one, that deserves a lot more attention than it's likely to get: neighbors of the person with whom he was staying knew he was there, yet did not want to inform the police because of the "no-snitch" ethos that has taken hold of their community. This to me is the REAL story of this incident: the fact that a perverted ethos that has taken hold of inner-city communities resulted in the deaths of several police officers. But don't expect the liberal media to be giving any mention to THIS aspect of this incident.

mike in NC:

The poster you referred to is Don in CT at 7:08 am. Thanks for pointing him out. You're right, this is why liberals fabricate stories to further their attempt to disarm the American people, because they're utterly ignorant in this realm and can't make rational arguments based on facts.

What a great gun show
Check out the link below. Women and guns can have more fun than drinking coffee and watching crap like "The View." (don't worry its PG Rated)

http://g4tv.com/attackoftheshow/exclusives/64615/OFASTS-Gun -Apocalypse.html

Will and limited imagination
Will
Your comment about Mike's so-called limited imagination fails for one huge reason: he writes about REAL events. He lives in the real world, not in liberal fantasy land. You, however, continue to show that you live in La-La land, and your comments are certainly predictable. Mike is more entertaining.

J.D.' S 'Handsomest' Son
How long before the streets will be filled with friends and families protesting because the poor perpetrator was killed by the police? Racist pigs.

If indeed this was an assault weapon,it was surely registered. Such a fine upstanding citizen would not have an unregistered one. Would he?


Prof Mike....
Please put in a future column a list of the studies showing that holders of concealed carry permits do not use their weapons except in a defensive manner in bona fide threatening situations. Then even Willie Wonka and Rudolf Hesse can see that liscensed and armed adults can and do use their concealed weapons appropriately.

For Willie and Rudolf, picture this. You (or your wife, daughter, friend) are walking down the street and are accosted by a person armed with a (insert the weapon of your choice) who demands money and threatens your/their life. Since muggers don't usually do their thing in the presence of a poilceman, your/their shouts of, "Help!" and "Police!" attract only the attention of a CCW permit holder who is packing. The CCW guy shows his (enter here the manufacturer, caliber and type handgun) and the attacker boogies forthwith. Now tell me, would you still hold the opinion that concealed carry is a bad idea?

For further retraining, check out the NRA mag and read the feature that reports recent incidents where armed lawabiding persons have used their firearms to stop robbery, burglary and more serious crimes. If you still refuse to recognize the truth you must be over 40 and still a liberal; "If you are not a liberal at age 20, you have no heart. If you are still a liberal at age 40, you have no brain." If the hobnail jack boot fits, wear it!

Why you should own a gun..
When seconds count, the police are just minutes away.

Females and firearms
are symbiotic allies. They learn faster and shoot better than men with the same level of experience. Some of them have an emotional barrier, but it doesn't show up until the teens, and then is easily overcome just by being in the presence of other females having fun banging away at tin cans with a .22. Guys, one of the most effective ways to protect the 2nd is to teach as many females as you can to shoot. Be advised you may quickly find yourself hard-pressed to shoot as well.

revolver with a clip
Previously, someone posted a story of a cop who passed his revolver around in class followed by his clip. He then said someone took a bullet from the clip.

A revolver doesn't have a clip. And anti-gun people don't have arguments.

That is why they fabricate stories.

Be a Victim ?
The average police response time is 4 minutes.
The average 9mm response time is 1100 feet per second.

Gun free Zones are the really scary part..Police response at Virginia Tech was poor at best.

Another Hoax
There is a story going around the MSM and the Internet about some police in Oakland, California being killed while on duty by someone with an assault rifle. Surely, this is a hoax. It can't possible have happened.

I am guided by logic and facts. I know that California banned the ownership of assault weapons. On file in California's state law libraries is a law, written on paper, that forbids those weapons. On these pieces of paper are words written by legal experts that warn of the dire consequences of owning and using such weapons in crimes. No one would dare violate this law.

Oakland California further outlaws ownership of guns within its city limits. In the municipal offices of Oakland are more pieces of paper that also threaten violators with harsh punishment.

Like all states, California has a justice system that employs judges with black robes that sit atop high chairs in courtrooms. These judges view criminals with jaundice eyes and will absolutely not tolerate criminal behavior. Criminals can expect strict sentencing from these wise men and womn in black robes.

California is a progressive state. It has parole officers, intervention specialists, and rehabilitation experts that can reshape the behavior of miscreants and make them law abidding citizens again. It has generous safety nets to relieve poverty, the biggest inducement to crime.

Because of all of these facts, I cannot believe the obviously false reports of a criminal using an assault weapon to kill police.

I trust no one else has fallen prey to this hoax.

Brother Can You Spare A Dime?
They used to tell me
I was building a dream.
And so I followed the mob
When there was earth to plow
Or guns to bear
I was always there
Right on the job.
They used to tell me
I was building a dream
With peace and glory ahead.
Why should I be standing in line
Just waiting for bread?
Once I built a railroad
I made it run
Made it race against time.
Once I built a railroad
Now it's done
Brother, can you spare a dime?

What part

of "infringed" don't they understand? IMHO, repeatedly paying for instruction and a fee for the license is infringing. Someone agrees with me because the Texas lege has a bill initiated that would permit open carry. What with the criminality spilling over the border with our southern neighbor, this is reasonable and necessary.


roy,
The basis for considering spree killers rational in that sense is that not one of them has ever chosen a Friends of the NRA dinner, a gun show, an Appleseed event, and IPSC or SASS match, or any similar event where they know many of the participants will be armed as their target.

Wannabe mass killers pick "gun free" zones where they don't have to worry that their targets will shoot back -- the guy who tried Appalachian Law School goofed. He probably thought ALL colleges were victim disarmament zones and didn't realize that there are a few places where sanity and common sense still hold ground.

JOL #21...
You point out the most obvious correctly.

A firearm is a tool and has many uses. Be well advised that I am the weapon not the tool of choice.

An armed society is a polite society. If you can not understand this YOU have a real problem.
I was trained to use hands and feet to do great bodily harm if need be, in the absence of a firearm. Now, somewhat older, I am less likely to engage an assailant hand to hand.

Paraphrasing Thomas Jefferson, he was not big on games with the ball, his pass time was walks about his home and his constant companion was his gun.

Professor Adams, a question please, when could we expect our state to adopt a "Castle Doctrine" much like other states? The laws currently give criminals more protection than the individual defending themselves.


Rebutting All Arguments,
All arguments against restraining the free citizens of a free republic from exercising their Constitutional right to go armed on campus can be found competently rebutted here:

http://concealedcampus.org/common_arguments.php

Concealled Carry Critical for Women,
"Gun control: The theory that a woman found dead in an alley, raped and strangled with her panty hose, is somehow morally superior to a woman explaining to police how her attacker got that fatal bullet wound."

I'm small, weak, clumbsy, middle-aged, and frequently encumbered by small children. Pretty much any healthy male over about 14 would be capable of doing to me anything he chose to do.

Yet a small, 5-shot, .38sp revolver is all I need to become equal to a 6'6", 300lb, gym rat bent on assaulting me.

My husband's S&W M&P, with 17 in the magazine and one in the chamber, would be even better, but its too big to conceal on my small frame.

Campus feminists continual decry the number of rapes, especially "date rapes" that occur on college campuses. Imagine how few there would be if college women were encouraged to strengthen the force behind their "No!" with 158 grains of jacketed, hollowpoint lead.

Concealled Carry Critical for Women,
"Gun control: The theory that a woman found dead in an alley, raped and strangled with her panty hose, is somehow morally superior to a woman explaining to police how her attacker got that fatal bullet wound."

I'm small, weak, clumbsy, middle-aged, and frequently encumbered by small children. Pretty much any healthy male over about 14 would be capable of doing to me anything he chose to do.

Yet a small, 5-shot, .38sp revolver is all I need to become equal to a 6'6", 300lb, gym rat bent on assaulting me.

My husband's S&W M&P, with 17 in the magazine and one in the chamber, would be even better, but its too big to conceal on my small frame.

Campus feminists continual decry the number of rapes, especially "date rapes" that occur on college campuses. Imagine how few there would be if college women were encouraged to strengthen the force behind their "No!" with 158 grains of jacketed, hollowpoint lead.

No will
we live and work in the real world. Will I have never comment on your posts, as I have found them borring, and uninformed. But to call Mr. Adams anemic shows your own depth to be lacking. The Second amendment is the most important one. You see the founders understood that a armed population could never be subjected to tyranny. This is tyranny plan and simple.
Kirk

foggytrucker
Amen to that.

Rudolf who spells his name like they do in Europe is probably a transplanted euro-male (read girly man). That gun ban in Germany did a good job keeping those poor kids in Stuttgart safe didn't it Rudolf? Should we talk about Sweden, Norway, England and Russia. If just one or two teachers in those schools had a concealed permit they may have been able to stop the death toll or even prevented the cowardly perps from coming to the school altogether.

As Jim stated in reply #30, CWP holders have not been involved in criminal shootings but have saved many lives from those criminals bent on harming others.

adams
regarding your statement that most criminals are rational. while i agree that the term " criminals" would refer to a great number of people who are also rational, what would be the basis to include spree killers in that group?

The psychological eval...
This is a ploy by the university liberals to ensure the concealed weapons permit is taken away from this individual. If they can get a liberal shrink (98% guaranteed) to show anything wrong with Mr. Maxwell then he'll lose his permit.

Remember that psychology is not an empirical science and is subjective at best. The liberal (probably Dr Douglas) will say he is suffering from some complex, doesn't really matter, which can't be proven or disproven and that he should not be allowed to own a CWP.

If Mr. Maxwell is smart he will refuse this provision and threaten the school with a lawsuit for false arrest, emotional distress and embarrassment and degradation of his personal character.

to the idiots!
YOU think guns kill people,they don't! people kill people.Concealed weapons permit holders are required to go to a classroom for training in their state laws,their required to show their competent in shooting skills then go for a background check.After all that they get their CWP card!You site case after case on NUT JOBS & CRIMINALS shooting people but show me 1 case where a CWP holder shot someone when he wasn't defending his or YOUR life!If your father was beat to death for $200,your house was set ablaze at 2AM by some criminal,Your wife was car jacked & raped. I'll bet your idealistic mind would make a definite change or then again you might say that wasn't the criminals fault he came from a broken home or wasn't afforded a good education. Maybe he just needs to be counciled then he'll be okay.

Tyrants
are created in such ways. Mike is it possable for this man to sue the U for voilating his rights? Oregon Lady, thanks for the heads up. The only way for them to take over is to take the guns. All tyrants find a way to take the guns first. Yep folks on the left you got your tyrant. Now will folks on the right, and in the right, sit down and take it? That is the big question.
Kirk
PS Mike great column. Keep up the good work, and keep us informed.

Sorry, Joel
Monday mornings are (obviously) not my best time...

Why do we carry a gun?
Because cops are too heavy - too many donuts!

I have and do carry a weapon every day, every where other than federal buildings. I have never had to draw it, point it at anyone, or discharge it to defend myself. However, I work in a downtown setting, in an area known for instances of violent crime. I refuse to be a victim, so I have the means to defend myself if it ever becomes necessary, and I pray it never does. If the time came that I needed a weapon and did not have it available, what do you think the chances of my surviving would be? I would much rather have it and not need it, than need it and not have it.

Rudolf
The Second Amendment is in our Constitution. If you have a problem with our basic legal framework, leave. Go screw up some other country.

Great example Prof. Adams
Now the rest of the story....

Since here in liberal Oregon, no lefty policy is too extreme! Instead of recognizing how criminally intrusive it is for a university to require psychological testing of a man who only chooses to exercise his legal rights, Oregonians are clamoring for more. The current push is for the state to publish the names of every person who has been approved to carry a concealed handgun. When the occasional rational objection is raised that this could lead to those individuals being targeted, it's drowned out by the leftist press and lobbyists.

Folks, this is the next step in weakening the US. We allowed the lib propaganda to be pushed in our schools, watched it take control of the media and then elected it into office. Now the sheeple can be conned into ceding the personal liberties that will be needed to retake our country. This type of change/cancer tends to start on the left coast but it spreads. I think it's too late for Oregon, California and Washington but you have the chance to slow it/stop it in your state. Please don't let your state turn into another Oregon!

The Brownshirts Are Coming!
Click my name and go to my blog and read about Obama's new brownshirt force.

The time to take action against the founding of this force is now, people.

Make sure to let your elected officials know you're against this new development on Obama's part.

Juan
"To what are you referring..."

Sorry, that was garbage left over from copying Rudolf's post down to start the reply. That's the last sentence of HIS post that I neglected to clear.

Certainly, it is at odds with the rest of my response.

They have guns?
I recall a teaching police officer who, thinking he would cut off interest in owning a gun, took out his service revolver and sent it around the class and did the same with his bullet clip, starting the other way around - never thinking that they must pass each other somewhere. When he was through, one bullet was missing. The girl who took it, has since been arrested about five times. I hope he learned his lesson. Handing elementary school kids a revolver doesn't stop them from becoming criminals in the least.

Anger ...

This should be the "feeling" we get when we read about this academic tripe. I can picture this one ... Unkempt nerdy student body president, with t shirt and scraggly beard, berates 6'7" tall USMC vet about respondsibility. You have to admire the Corps .. They trained this young man well, for he showed great restraint in not tearing mr. pencilneck's head off. I don't have that level of calm courage.

will and Rudolf
Thanks, will, we can always count on you to make peurile comments that have nothing to do with the content of the article and do nothing more than demonstrate that the liberalism you embrace eschews reason for emotion and insults.

Rudolf, thanks for demonstrating a similar ailment. You could simply have said, "This concealed carry business is scary" and been done with it but chose to channel an (unqualified) psychologist projecting your own paranoia on those exercising their rights and demonstrating an inability to grasp the obvious:

"how do we know that these peope will use their guns in appropriate ways?"

Gee, how about the ample evidence that, for as long as such permits have been available, that's EXACTLY what they have demonstrated? Who's to say that liberals will use their computers in appropriate ways? There's FAR more evidence of deviation from acceptable standards in that case than in the case of CCW permit holders. Should your First Amendment rights be curtailed as a result?

Of course not. But, then, that's the inescapable logic of your position. Me, I prefer freedom.


It's one thing to have it at home, but to carry it around?

James
In answer to your question, it's because most conservatives have jobs.

Rudolf
Concealed carry permits are only issued to those with no criminal history. People with concealed carry permits do not commit crimes with their guns. They use them to prevent crimes. I know a woman who pulled her gun out of her purse and pointed it at a man who clearly intended to harm her. He changed his mind and fled. Gun crimes are usually committed by people who have previously committed other crimes, and therefore are already forbidden by law to even have a gun. But they get one anyway. Concealed carry makes everyone safer, even those not carrying, because it makes muggers reluctant to attack. They don't know who might be carrying. In areas where concealed carry is forbidden, muggers know it, and are far more bold.

Trolls
Why does Adams, and townhall have so many trolls? You don't see conservative trolls on the Daily Kos. The internet is a very big place if you don't enjoy the content--GO TO A LIBERAL WEBSITE.

Rudolf, Switzerland REQUIRES that every male serve a term in their military and keep an AUTOMATIC ASSAULT RIFLE IN THEIR HOME. Yet you don't hear of the Swiss as being a "gun culture".

As an immigrant, maybe you should try to assimilate and enjoy American culture instead of ridiculing it. Or you could just leave, and go to a country more to your liking.

State law is what should be the 'trump'
card in this issue. Mr Maxwell should just bring a lawsuit because he IS licensed by the state of Oregon to carry a concealed weapon. THAT is all the university should need to know.

And that "psychological testing" has GOT TO STOP

Will
No, it wasn't the same conservative hero. It was Jeffrey Maxwell, a specific, real person. Do you think he posed a threat to the other students, given that he had extensive training in firearm safety, and a long history of safely handling weapons far more dangerous than the one he was carrying?

will
No Adams' column would be complete without your inane ramblings.

Just imagine the outcry if the university demanded psychological evaluations for any student espousing homosexual views.

Although....between licensed gun carrying individuals and homosexual AIDS carrying individuals, which group has killed more?

I'll try to explain, Rudolf
It's a cultural thing in a way. We have historically been an armed society from the beginning. Over all, it has served us well. We have never endured the tragedies of government sanctioned murders of thousands or even millions of our citizens as so many more "enlightened" nations have.

Concealed Carry Permit holders have been through extensive background checks, fingerprinted, and photographed. Gone to one or more classes. You will find few , if any, CCW permit holders engaging in criminal or insane acts.

We carry weapons and hope we NEVER have to use them. And mostly we don't, but it is better to have a gun and not need it than to need one and not have it.

I see you're in New York. Ask yourself, would your muggers, burglers, etc, be as much of a problem if they thought there was even half a chance they could be shot by their intended victims ?

As for the paranoia you see, it's not paranoia. There are national organizations, politicians, the mass media and George Soros types that want to disarm us.

We can read history, see what to other peoples who were disarmed by their goverments. It is often not pretty.

Just happy to see y'all!
haha!

Seriously, Mike's columns need more energy and dynamism. He's stuck in a rut (a mid-life crisis?). There's nothing to react to here. The same conservative hero, the same liberal oppressors.

Mike keeps serving up the prefabricated reconstituted Kool-Aid - and all you knuckleheads stand in line to gulp it down, no questions asked.

Will
Did you even read the column? If you did, please point out for us where Mr. Adams mentioned liberals in his column. Or was this your assumption for the 'archetypal (sic) American Liberal"? Maybe you would now like to comment on the points of the column.

Will, and liberals feelings on guns
Will, he is a conservative activist concerning higher education and gun control; "lesbian feminists," and "militant atheists" are often the enemies in his realm. If you don't like his on going crusade then stop reading the columns, I for one enjoy them, and support Dr. Adams agenda, even if communist pink bunnies were the enemy, and thus, the subject of every one of his columns for the next 100 years.

"But university administrators rarely make decisions based on evidence. Instead, they make decisions based upon feelings. How will they feel when the next Jeffrey Maxwell is unable to stop the next Seung-Hui Cho? " - Dr. Adams

I know how they'll feel: they won't. They won't care that guns could have stopped the killing. They'll just use it as more ammunition in their crusade against the 2nd ammendment.
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